Statements of Intent

Season 2 of the Statements of Intent Podcast brings bigger guests, more drones, and hilarious bloopers.

The host, David Mannheim, will be travelling around the UK to visit senior eCommerce leaders to talk with them about how we might change the perspective of eCommerce for the better. How we measure and treat our customers. How we optimise their experiences. And how we make it all a little more human.

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Resources

• Made With Intent's website → https://www.madewithintent.ai/

Social Media

• David's LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidleemannheim/
• Made With Intent's LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/company/madewithintent/?viewAsMember=true
• YouTube → http://www.youtube.com/@madewithintent

It’s the end of Season 1 already?! Well, if you happened to miss any episodes, or just didn’t have the time to watch them all, you’re in luck.

In this episode, host David Mannheim reflects on the key lessons and insights gained from the first season of the Statements of Intent podcast. He discusses the common themes that emerged across his conversations with eCommerce leaders, highlighting their shared desire to challenge the status quo and create more human-centric online experiences.

Topics Covered:

• What’s wrong with conversion rate
• The need for personalisation and genuine human connection in eCommerce
• Moving away from short-term metrics like conversion rate toward long-term customer relationships
• Practical tips for fostering customer intimacy at scale

Key Quotes:

• "We crave some kind of intimacy, we need that within our lives. A website, an online experience, feels the antithesis of that feeling."
• "No one metric can capture the health of consumer and customer relationships.”
• “You don't need to attribute everything.”
• "Conversion rate is a lagging metric. And actually, it's the worst kind of metric because customers could fight tooth and nail and still convert if they are a fan.”

Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction
01:38 What David Has Learned From This Podcast
05:21 The Journey Towards Customer Centricity
10:20 Redefining Success Metrics in eCommerce
23:09 Final Thoughts
23:57 Outro

Resources

• Made With Intent's website → https://www.madewithintent.ai/

Social Media

• David's LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidleemannheim/
• Made With Intent LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/company/madewithintent/?viewAsMember=true
• YouTube → http://www.youtube.com/@madewithintent

In this episode, David Mannheim, founder of Made With Intent, advocates for a shift away from optimising for conversion metrics and page templates. Towards truly understanding and catering to each buyer's individual journey and mindset - what he calls "stages, not pages."

Topics Covered:

• Reasons why retailers tend think in pages not stages
• Why retailers should think in buying stages over website pages.
• What is personalisation
• Why personalisation fails
• David's solution to create more appropriate and impactful experiences

Key Quotes:

• "We focus on the 2% that are going to convert and ignore the needs of the other 98%."
• "We optimize how we want to sell, not how people actually want to buy."
• "Location is not a good indication of when or how a customer will buy."
• "When you understand the buying stage, you can tailor your sales pitch. You meet users at the intersection of how they want to purchase."
• "Conversion rate is a method of selling, while buying stages reflect how people actually buy."

Episode Chapters

00:00 Templates
00:00 Introduction
01:41 David's Statement: Stages Not Pages
03:11 Why Retailers Focus on Page Templates
10:06 Why Retailers Resist Implementing Personalisation
16:12 The Solution
22:02 Outro

Resources

• Made With Intent’s website → https://www.madewithintent.ai/

Social Media

• David's LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidleemannheim/
• Made With Intent LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/company/madewithintent/?viewAsMember=true
• YouTube → www.youtube.com/@madewithintent

In this episode of Statements of Intent, host David Mannheim talks to Johnny Longden, Group Digital Director at Boohoo, about the pressures faced by eCommerce companies and how a myopic focus on metrics can undermine the customer experience. They discuss the need to balance short-term business goals with long-term customer needs and nurturing loyalty beyond just conversion rates.

Jonny has years of experience building and scaling experimentation strategies from scratch for large businesses like Visa Europe, Sky, and Journey Further. He has practiced innovation in analytics and testing/experimentation, and knows all about how to marry this with KPI performance.

Topics Covered:

• The difference in pressures between agency and client-side roles
• Short-term business pressures vs building long-term customer loyalty
• The pitfalls of over-relying on metrics like conversion rates
• Understanding and optimising for the customer's intent and experience
• Moving beyond metrics to a more holistic view of customer behaviour

Key Quotes:

• “I’m not a toilet seat addict.”
• "Conversion rate is a good example where you can do something to increase conversion rate and you would successfully increase conversion rate, but that would have a detrimental impact on your entire business and you would never know."
• "We need to move to understanding more of the total systems that govern how people behave and interact.”
• "Imagine if you try to sort of optimise your friendship with one of your friends through metrics, you know, you wouldn't do it, would you? It just would be really, really weird."

Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction
00:49 Guest Intro: Johnny Longden
03:23 The Pressure In Retail vs. Agency
05:55 Short-Term Pressures vs. Long-Term Customer Needs
08:54 Stop Over-Relying on Metrics
17:18 Customer Intent and Experience
21:35 Jonny's Statement of Intent: Data and Tech vs Customers
22:43 Outro

Social Media

• Jonny's LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonnylongden/
• Made With Intent LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/company/madewithintent/?viewAsMember=true
• YouTube → https://www.youtube.com/@madewithintent

In this episode, David Mannheim chats to Tim Ryan, Director of Digital at Seasalt, about his thoughts on how eCommerce has evolved over the past 15 years - both the good and the bad. He emphasises the importance of driving relevance over pure personalisation and making online shopping experiences as frictionless as possible for customers.

Tim has over 16 years experience working in eCommerce for brands like The Walt Disney Company, Direct Line Group, Lidl GB, Karen Millen… The list goes on! Tim has a wealth of skills from digital marketing and SEO to product strategy. If anyone knows how to maximise sales onsite, it’s him.

Topics Covered:

• How eCommerce has changed, from a lack of personalisation to assumptions based on limited data
• The balance between personalisation and allowing customer choice
• Using data to become a customer-led business
• The limitations of broad customer personas

Key Quotes:

• "Personalisation is only as good as the on-site journey the relevance that you're actually pushing through, so it can't just be personalising a bit of content or product offering.”
• "You want the customer to be able to choose things, otherwise everyone would just push all their money through PMAX driving customers to a random product.”
• "It's about making the journey as frictionless and relevant as possible. It's not just about purchase, it's about understanding the customer's drivers.”

Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction
01:09 Guest Intro: Tim Ryan
04:25 How eCommerce Has Changed Over 15 Years
09:56 Pro or Anti Personalisation?
13:24 Tim's Statement: Driving Relevance Over Personalisation
19:07 Tim's Personalisation Experience And Advice
22:37 Outro

Social Media

• Tim's LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/tryan1/
• Made With Intent LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/company/madewithintent/?viewAsMember=true
• YouTube → https://www.youtube.com/@madewithintent

In this episode, David Mannheim sits down with Martin Sheerin, Director of Digital Product at N Brown Group.

Martin explains how brands will gain more reward by prioritising decisions based on customer needs rather than lagging metrics like conversion.

After working for brands like Moneysupermarket, The Co-operative Bank, and Phones4u, Martin has over 16 years of expertise in eCommerce, user experience, and conversion rate optimisation. In this time, he has not only transformed businesses but also fostered teams to excel in creating innovative digital products and touchpoints that significantly improve customer journeys.

Topics Covered:

• Martin’s role as a Director of Digital Products at N Brown Group
• Understanding the difference between leading and lagging metrics
• The importance of customer-centric testing and optimisation
• N Brown's "Run, Grow, Transform" model for balancing short and long-term goals
• Advice for how to keep the customer at the heart of business decisions

Key Quotes:

• "If you think about customers as numbers, you'll drive the number up now, but it's very short-lived."
• "We're not only looking at the sale, but the whole loop - before you come to our websites through to how do I make you want to make a second purchase with us?"
• "If you just do conversion optimisation, you'd minimise the content and push people through. What we found was by making it a slightly longer process and helping people understand the product, we got more sign-ups and retained more customers."

Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction
01:06 Guest Introduction: Martin Sheeran
01:43 The Role of a Director of Digital Products
03:36 Understanding Leading vs. Lagging Metrics
06:41 The Importance of Customer-Centric Testing
17:15 The Three-Speed Model: Run, Grow, Transform
24:20 Martin's Advice For Other eComm Leaders
28:18 Outro

Resources

• ‘A Brief History of Netflix Personalization’ by Gibson Biddle → https://gibsonbiddle.medium.com/a-brief-history-of-netflix-personalization-1f2debf010a1

In this episode, David is joined by Matthew Gratze, Director of Customer at Signet Jewellers.

Matthew shares his perspective on the importance of being relevant to each customer's unique shopping journey and how to deliver personalised, contextual experiences.

Matthew holds experience across several sectors from baby & child to jewellery. His leadership in driving major business transformations and digital strategies for brands like Halfords, Ann Summers, and Mothercare has earned him a spot on The Retail Week Etail Power List 2016 top 50.

Topics Covered:

• The lessons Matthew learned about customer-centricity during his time at Apple
• Balancing the pressures of new customer acquisition versus retention strategies
• Making experiences relevant and appropriate to each unique customer journey and mission
• Why relevance trumps one-size-fits-all marketing

Key Quotes:

• "If you can design a journey or a product or a mission perfectly with the customer in mind, it's very difficult to go wrong from that stance."
• "How do you become more relevant for each of those shopping journeys or shopping missions? That's where retailers could really win."
• "Being relevant is about how we become more relevant for that shopping experience there and then based on signals, browsing intents, etc.”
• "We get stuck with short-term views and try to fix very small things rather than looking at the bigger picture."

Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction
01:16 Guest Introduction: Matthew Gratze
03:21 Matthew's Lessons In Selling
13:18 Balancing Acquisition vs. Retention
17:38 Matthew's Statement: Be Relevant
23:12 Matthew's Last Words
23:46 Outro

Social Media

• Matthew’s LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/matthewgratze/
• Made With Intent LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/company/madewithintent/?viewAsMember=true
• YouTube → www.youtube.com/@madewithintent

In this episode, host David Mannheim talks to Richard Chappell, Chief Growth Officer & Co-founder of The Growth Foundation, about the importance of replicating the in-store experience online. They discuss Richard's career journey from working on the shop floor to becoming a retail consultant, and why brands need to "walk the store" digitally to better connect with customers.

As former Head of Marketing at play.com, Founder & CEO at THG Ingenuity and CMO at Gymshark, Richard helped grow all three into unicorn companies. With 20 years of experience in DTC eCommerce, he is an expert at unlocking huge, profitable and sustainable growth for start-ups, scale-ups and established businesses.

Topics Covered:

• Richard's background working at major retailers like Sainsbury's Homebase, Play.com, and Gymshark
• Translating physical retail strategies to the online environment
• Using AI and personalisation to recreate two-way communication
• Overcoming barriers like living in the CMS and not "shopping the store"
• Why eCommerce brands need to stay close to their customers

Key Quotes:

• "I think often people just live in the kind of eCommerce CMS in the background and actually never shop their stores."
• "It's thinking about…testing things like arriving on homepages and saying 'are you a new or returning customer?' Almost like signposting as you would do in a physical store."
• "Actually reaching out to those top customers...getting founders, owners, and team members to talk to their customers directly...the amount of insight you can gain is phenomenal."

Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction
01:11 Introducing Richard Chappell: A Retail and eCommerce Veteran
01:26 Richard's Statement: Act Like a Physical Retailer
04:58 Richard's Career Path
06:42 Bringing Physical Retail Strategies to Online Stores
17:11 Overcoming Barriers to eCommerce Success
22:46 Richard's Final Advice
23:47 Outro

Social Media

• Richard's LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/richardchapple/
• Made With Intent LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/company/madewithintent/?viewAsMember=true
• YouTube → http://www.youtube.com/@madewithintent

In this episode, host David Mannheim sits down with Janis Thomas, Managing Director of Look Fabulous Forever.

Janis has 25 years experience in delivering multi-million pound marketing and eCommerce projects in high-growth businesses. She has grown diverse brands from The Times Educational Supplement to Playboy.

Janis discusses how eCommerce often neglects a significant portion of society—those over 50 years old, who make up 40% of the population. Janis shares her perspective on the importance of truly understanding and catering to customers, regardless of their age or demographic.

Topics Covered:

• Janis' diverse career journey, from marketing at Playboy to building eCommerce brands
• Her statement: eCommerce neglects 40% of society.
• The need for diversity in organisations to better represent and understand customers
• Why we shouldn’t assume customer preferences and behaviours
• Look Fabulous Forever's approach to building long-term relationships and trust with customers

Key Quotes:

• "If we concentrate our organisations with people in that 25 to 39 age group, how can we possibly ever hope to understand and fully represent the remaining 80% of the population?"
• "We can't just put a picture of our blusher on Google search. You are never gonna buy our product. You need to understand about it and why we exist."
• “Over time, we'll build a relationship, we'll build trust.”

Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction
01:02 Guest Introduction: Janis Thomas
05:18 Janis' Statement: eCommerce Neglects 40% of Society
12:00 Get to Know Your Customers
18:19 The Long Journey to Purchase: Building Trust and Engagement
21:47 Janis' Final Advice
22:22 Outro

Social Media

• Janis' LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/janisthomas/
• Made With Intent LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/company/madewithintent/?viewAsMember=true
• YouTube → www.youtube.com/@madewithintent

This week on Statements of Intent, we dive into how personalisation is really about supporting customers' desired intent. Our guest Tom Bailey, VP Product Analytics at Made With Intent, shares his perspective on moving beyond surface-level targeting to truly understand each individual's needs. Tom is an expert when it comes to data and isn’t afraid to ask the tough questions to find practical solutions.

Topics Covered:

• The evolution of personalisation in eCommerce - from Boots loyalty cards to real-time intent signals
• Why conversion rate alone paints an incomplete picture
• Using natural language processing to interpret customer intent through on-site language
• Creating cross-functional teams focused on the customer experience

Key Quotes:

• "Personalisation is not necessarily always about giving something away monetarily. You just need to be suiting people based on what their needs are."
• "A website is fundamentally made up of pieces of text. Underlying the website is text we can interpret to understand intent."
• "We have to start listening beyond the noise of sales data and start tuning into the real people we're trying to serve."
• "True loyalty comes from making your customers feel seen, heard, and understood as individuals."

Episode Chapters:

00:00 Introduction 01:10 Guest Introduction 06:20 Discussion on Personalisation in eCommerce 08:18 Statement of Intent: Personalisation Isn't Surfacing Content, It's Supporting Intent Effectively 14:09 Technicality of Inferring User Intent 22:17 Outro

Social Media:

• Tom’s LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/tom-bailey-a03406a2/
• Made With Intent LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/company/madewithintent/?viewAsMember=true
• YouTube → www.youtube.com/@madewithintent