Steve Pretty On The Origin of the Pieces

Two Korean string instruments, two very different ways of shaping a sound. Dal:um’s Ha Suyean and Hwang Hyeyoung join me after their concert in Finland to explore the gayageum and geomungo, from delicate silk-string sounds to surprisingly powerful, percussive playing.

We get close to the instruments: a bamboo playing stick, frets, pitch bends and movable bridges called “goose feet”. They explain how their modern instruments differ from traditional versions, and demonstrate a way of feeling Korean rhythm through breath and dance movement.

There’s music from the concert, demonstrations from both players, and a performance recorded especially for the conversation. The video edition lets you see how their hands shape the sounds.

Later, I share “Basildon Made Me Baby”, a collaboration with spoken-word artist Emy P, through a project with filmmaker and poet Aaron Shrimpton. My music takes a hip-hop direction, with a few nods to Basildon’s electropop heritage; Emy’s words explore place, identity and finding her people.

Plus: Sound / Visuals / Spoken at the Towngate Theatre on 12th November 2026, and Origin live with Beardyman at Wilton’s Music Hall on 10th March 2027.

IN THIS EPISODE

• Dal:um in concert and conversation
• Korean rhythm, breathing and dance
• Inside the geomungo and gayageum
• Silk strings, bamboo, frets and “goose feet”
• A performance by the duo
• Emy P, Basildon and a new spoken-word track
• Live dates with Steve Pretty

WATCH / EXPLORE

Origin of the Pieces — video editions, transcripts and more

https://www.originofthepieces.com/

Dal:um at Glitterbeat / tak:til

https://glitterbeat.com/artists/dalum/

Sound / Visuals / Spoken — 12th November 2026

https://towngatetheatre.co.uk/estuary-sound-visuals-spoken/

Origin live with Beardyman — 10th March 2027

https://wiltons.org.uk/whats-on/steve-pretty-and-friends-on-the-origin-of-the-pieces-3/

MUSIC FROM THIS EPISODE

Dal:um: Ha Suyean (gayageum), Hwang Hyeyoung (geomungo).

“Basildon Made Me Baby”: spoken word by Emy P; music and audio production by Steve Pretty, for a project with Aaron Shrimpton.

CLARIFICATION

Basildon is shortlisted for UK Town of Culture 2028; my tentative reference to it holding the title this year is mistaken.

MORE FROM ORIGIN OF THE PIECES

Join The Open Ear Dispatch and find the Patreon link at https://www.originofthepieces.com/

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

How much can you change a melody before it becomes something else? Palestinian-American violinist and composer Akram Abdulfattah joins me to explore a tradition in which variation is part of learning the tune from the start.

Recorded at WOMEX in Finland in 2025, this conversation comes with plenty of violin demonstrations. Akram explains why a maqam is more than a scale, introduces the expressive possibilities between familiar notes, and shows how a phrase can take a different route each time it is played.

His six-string violin extends into an unusually low register. We hear what those extra strings make possible, how they change the physical experience of playing, and why the instrument can sound so close to a human voice. There is an original solo performance along the way.

We also talk about learning musical rules and finding freedom within them, Arabic roots and wider influences, and the pleasure of hearing a familiar melody change without losing its identity.

Towards the end, Akram reflects on music, family and his Palestinian-American identity, before we discuss the challenges of making a living as a musician and helping audiences discover something unfamiliar.

IN THIS EPISODE

00:00 – Welcome to Origin

00:26 – Introducing Akram Abdulfattah

02:33 – Live at WOMEX 2025

03:11 – Meet Akram

04:28 – Arabic roots, many influences

06:33 – Maqam: more than a scale

08:19 – Tarab and musical feeling

09:07 – The notes between the notes

10:29 – Hearing microtones on violin

16:49 – Tradition and improvisation

19:18 – Never the same melody twice

22:57 – A six-string violin

27:33 – An original solo performance

30:04 – Why the violin sounds like a voice

33:28 – What is music for?

36:08 – Music and Palestinian-American identity

39:02 – Where is music heading?

42:11 – Becoming more adventurous listeners

44:11 – Tradition, innovation and what comes next

46:47 – Support the show

WATCH & EXPLORE

Akram Abdulfattah — official website

Akram's music

Akram's listening and social links

MUSIC FROM THIS EPISODE

Live excerpts from WOMEX 2025, an original solo composition and violin demonstrations by Akram Abdulfattah.

MORE FROM ORIGIN OF THE PIECES

Website — episodes, transcripts and mailing list

YouTube

Patreon

If you enjoy the show, please share it with a friend or leave a rating or review. Stay musically curious.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

How do you tell the entire history of music?

If you're director and Cosmic Shambles co-founder Trent Burton, apparently you start with the Big Bang, interview more than 100 people around the world, and emerge four-and-a-half years later with a nine-part, 10.5-hour documentary.

This week I'm joined by Trent to talk about For the Record: An Incomplete History of Music, the enormous new series presented by Charlotte Ritchie, which travels from the origins of sound and the earliest music through notation, recording, jazz, rave culture, streaming and AI.

I've been deeply embedded in the project myself as music consultant and mix engineer, so this conversation quickly expands beyond the making of the documentary into some of the questions it raises.

How do you tell music history when music doesn't evolve in a straight line? What gets lost when oral traditions become notation — or performances become definitive recordings? And what happens to music when a machine can generate it on demand?

We get into live performance, improvisation, rave culture, cultural exchange and appropriation, active listening, the economics of grassroots live music, Robert Smith's battle with ticket pricing, and why a 10.5-hour independent music documentary may make more sense on YouTube than on broadcast television.

Midway through, there's some actual music too: an excerpt from Slack Tide, my piece for violinist Harriet Mackenzie and me, premiered at First Light Festival 2026 and based on the tidal cycle of the Suffolk coast.

IN THIS EPISODE

00:00 – Welcome back and introducing For the Record

02:30 – Trent Burton, Cosmic Shambles and how the project began

06:00 – How 90 minutes became nine episodes and 614 minutes

09:00 – The impossible problem of structuring music history

14:10 – Notation, oral traditions and writing music down

21:30 – Recording and the invention of the “definitive” version

24:30 – AI, commodification and the future of live music

31:00 – Electronic music, improvisation and musical jeopardy

37:00 – Music, humanity, grief and why sound can make us cry

44:00 – Musical interlude: Harriet Mackenzie and Slack Tide

48:40 – Active listening and learning how to hear unfamiliar music

52:00 – Cultural appropriation, exchange and context

59:30 – AI, commercial music and making a living

1:01:30 – The crisis in grassroots live music

1:04:10 – Robert Smith, The Cure and affordable tickets

1:05:45 – Why For the Record is on YouTube rather than TV

1:12:55 – What is the point of music?

1:14:00 – How is music evolving?

1:18:35 – The musical moments that weren't meant to happen

WATCH & EXPLORE

For the Record: An Incomplete History of Music

https://cosmicshambles.com/fortherecord/

Cosmic Shambles

https://cosmicshambles.com/

MUSIC FROM THIS EPISODE

Slack Tide – Steve Pretty & Harriet Mackenzie

https://youtu.be/1c9Urm13Ahw

The Lark Ascending – Steve Pretty & Harriet Mackenzie

https://youtu.be/ANBH_a-MPs8

Shells & Bells – Steve Pretty & Jason Singh

https://youtu.be/qCNOWeMf6pI

MORE FROM ORIGIN OF THE PIECES

Website – episodes, transcripts and mailing list

https://www.originofthepieces.com/

YouTube

https://youtube.com/@StevePretty

Patreon

https://www.patreon.com/StevePrettyOnTheOriginofthePieces

If you enjoyed this episode, following the show, rating it or sharing it with another musically curious person makes a real difference.

Stay musically curious.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This week, I’m joined by bass Barnaby Rea for a longer-than-usual opera special I mean if we're doing opera, we've gotta go long, right?!), recorded backstage at the Royal Opera House, London.

Barnaby is a British/Irish bass who trained at the Guildhall School of Music & Drama and the National Opera Studio. He was a Harewood Artist at English National Opera and a member of the Oper Frankfurt solo ensemble. He has also appeared with companies including the Royal Opera House, Deutsche Oper Berlin, Zurich Opera, Teatro Real, Opéra de Lyon, Scottish Opera and Opera North.

We recorded this while Barnaby was performing Doctor Grenvil in Verdi’s La traviata, in Richard Eyre’s long-running Royal Opera production.

This episode was also partly inspired by a recent visit to Milan and the extraordinary Teatro alla Scala, which got me thinking about opera not just as music, but as architecture, social ritual, commerce, class, spectacle and power.

So this is partly a conversation about opera singing, partly a look at the machinery of a major opera house, and partly an attempt to understand why opera can feel both thrillingly immediate and socially intimidating.

We talk about opera vs musical theatre, why singers train for so long, how a voice can fill a huge theatre without amplification, what “placement” and resonance mean, and why vibrato is not just decorative wobbling.

We also get into opera’s social context: boxes, gods, stalls, ticket prices, access, prestige, and whether opera’s elitist reputation is entirely fair.

There’s also a wider reflection on live music now: why huge arena shows can dominate the public story of the music industry while smaller venues, grassroots promoters, festivals and independent musicians are struggling.

This is a longer episode than usual, but that feels fitting for opera: there is a lot of voice, history, scale and backstage machinery to get into.

• 00:00 – Steve introduces the opera special, Barnaby Rea, the Royal Opera House and the Milan / La Scala inspiration
• 01:35 – Barnaby’s route into opera: school swing band, musical theatre, Sweeney Todd, Guys and Dolls and early training
• 07:30 – Guildhall, opera school, learning the craft, and why opera takes so long to train for properly
• 12:30 – Singing in different languages and understanding what you are actually saying
• 15:40 – Opera vs musical theatre: amplification, stamina, acting, dancing and vocal demands
• 20:45 – Inside the Royal Opera House: backstage scale, sets, docks, ballet and multiple productions
• 24:45 – La Scala, opera boxes, social hierarchy, standing tickets and opera as mass entertainment
• 30:05 – Arena economics, struggling grassroots venues, festivals and why smaller gigs matter
• 36:50 – Is opera elitist? Ticket prices, access, class, prestige and opera culture in Europe
• 42:35 – Entertaining Noises: Barnaby demonstrates the bass voice
• 43:00 – Breath, resonance, placement, formant, range and preparing different roles
• 50:15 – Show days, double casting, vocal recovery, travel, jump-ins and the pressure of saying yes
• 55:00 – Berg, volume, singing without microphones, working with the room, and breathing with the orchestra
• 01:00:30 – Vibrato: what it is, why it exists, and why it is not just decorative wobbling
• 01:03:10 – Steve attempts a brief opera lesson
• 01:07:40 – Learning roles, memory, punctuality, preparation and what performers can control
• 01:12:45 – What is music for? Barnaby on release, escape, connection and performance
• 01:15:50 – Music as personal soundtrack, film scoring, galleries, headphones and emotional recontextualising
• 01:16:40 – Barnaby’s links, La traviata and walking into productions with decades of history
• 01:18:35 – Outro: Peter Grimes, Wilton’s Music Hall, Ocean Songs, the website and what’s coming next

Find Barnaby Rea at barnabyrea.com and on Instagram at @barnabyrea_bass.

Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/StevePrettyOnTheOriginofthePieces

Stay musically curious!

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

A collaboration with What We Did Before on the deep history of music, from prehistoric instruments and ritual to place, technology and AI. 

A slightly different episode this time. Instead of the usual format, I’m sharing an interview I did for the excellent podcast What We Did Before. This particular episode, Before Music: Cave Rituals and Ancient Instruments | Steve Pretty explores where music may have come from, what it might have looked and sounded like before recorded history, and what those origins can still tell us now. 

We get into prehistoric conch shells and bone flutes, the role of ritual, why location and environment matter to how music develops, and how some of those ancient questions suddenly loop back round when you start thinking about AI-generated music. In other words: caves, culture, creativity, and the usual big weird human questions. 

I also mention a couple of live dates at the top of the episode. Ocean Songs is at East Point Pavilion in Lowestoft on Saturday 21st March, and the album launch is at Theatreship in London on Tuesday 24th March. My next live edition of Steve Pretty On the Origin of the Pieces is at Wilton’s Music Hall on Tuesday 19th May, featuring Jim Bob. 

In this episode

• a collaboration with What We Did Before
• where music may have come from
• prehistoric instruments, including conch shells and bone flutes
• music, ritual and early human culture
• why place and environment shape musical traditions
• some thoughts on AI and what it means for music now 

Also mentioned

• Ocean Songs at East Point Pavilion, 21st March
• Ocean Songs album launch at Theatreship, 24th March
• Steve Pretty On the Origin of the Pieces live at Wilton’s Music Hall, 19th May

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode, I’m dedicating the show to Nathaniel Dye — musician, music teacher, brass band obsessive, ultramarathon runner, and one of the most quietly extraordinary people I’ve met. We begin with Nat performing his song “Public Service Announcement” (recorded live at my Wilton’s Music Hall show in November 2024) — a funny, furious, razor-sharp call to take bowel cancer symptoms seriously.

Nat sadly died recently from complications related to bowel cancer. This episode is part tribute, part replay, part attempt to hold onto the actual substance of what he stood for: making things, teaching people, and choosing music — not as escapism, but as a meaningful way to use the time you’ve got.

You’ll also hear excerpts from my “Listen like a musician” series, and then a replay of my earlier interview with Nat (from Episode 10), where he talks about his diagnosis, his fundraising, his trombone marathon plans, and what music became for him after everything changed.

• Nat’s live performance of “Public Service Announcement” 
• Why he threw himself back into teaching and music-making after treatment 
• The story behind Bowel Cancer Bucket List and the fundraising work
• A replay of our earlier chat: music, mortality, and doing the thing anyway
• The episode outro: Nat’s music, accompanied by bass/tuba greats Guy Pratt and Theon Cross 

• Bowel Cancer Bucket List (Nat’s site + donation links): bowelcancerbucketlist.com
• Matters of Life and Death (album page): Bowel Cancer Bucket List – album page 
• Matters of Life and Death (Spotify): Spotify album link
• “Public Service Announcement” (Spotify track): Spotify track link
• Donate to Macmillan Cancer Support: Macmillan donation page 
• Guy Pratt: guypratt.com
• Theon Cross who appears in Nat's closing song too: theoncross.com 

Stay musically curious.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

What actually is musical time? In this episode, Steve kicks off 2026 with the first four days of his “12 Days of Listening” mini-series — all about pulse, groove, and how our brains latch onto patterns (sometimes to our advantage, sometimes not).

Then we jump to Wilton’s Music Hall (January 2025) for a live guest spot from Aluá Nascimento — Brazilian percussionist, multi-instrumentalist, and former STOMP cast member — starting with a trumpet + pandeiro duet on “Brazil” and expanding into body percussion, Afro-Brazilian rhythm traditions, and the wonderfully low-tech joy of making music out of whatever’s around.

Along the way, Aluá talks about growing up around capoeira, how culture and history shaped these sounds, and demonstrates instruments including berimbau (musical bow), caxixi (shaker), and pandeiro — with a bit of audience participation thrown in too.

• A practical listening upgrade: pulse vs rhythm (try it while walking)
• “The pocket”: groove as micro-timing, not just the pattern
• Why your brain is basically a pattern-hunting drummer
• Shared time / entrainment: why humans sync up (and why it matters in music)
• Live at Wilton’s: trumpet + pandeiro on “Brazil”
• Aluá’s story: capoeira roots, Afro-Brazilian traditions, and the STOMP years
• Instruments you’ll hear: body percussion, pandeiro, berimbau, caxixi (and more)

• Instagram
• Beat Goes On (bio + workshops)
• Watch: Aluá Nascimento & Helene Jank – Body Music (YouTube)

• Steve mentions Episode 36 (breaking down how the My Friend Maisy theme was made)
• Wilton’s Music Hall shows: 24th January — kids/family show at 2pm, evening show at 7pm

• Explore episodes, transcripts, and more: originofthepieces.com
• Join the Patreon: patreon.com/StevePrettyOnTheOriginofthePieces
• If you enjoyed this one, share it with a musically curious human (it helps more than you’d think)

Stay musically curious!

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

From a Colombian ritual flute heard backstage at Oslo Mela to a children’s TV theme tune played on a London school playground, this episode explores why pentatonic scales turn up everywhere — and why they feel so immediately playable, memorable, and emotionally direct. Along the way, Steve unpacks the thinking behind the theme tune he wrote for My Friend Maisy (also available on NOW), based on the books by Lucy Cousins, and how five carefully chosen notes can shape an entire musical world.

The episode takes a gentle detour into Colombian traditional music with a backstage conversation recorded in 2024 with El León Pardo of Mestizo Collective, exploring the gaita — a ritual wind instrument built around paired male and female voices, deep cultural symbolism, and tightly limited pitch material. That sound becomes a useful reference point for the episode’s main thread: how scales function less like theory and more like palettes of identity.

Back in TV land, Steve breaks down the Maisy theme in detail, showing how pentatonic scales sit at the heart of children’s musical toys, playground instruments, and early musical experiences — and why avoiding semitone clashes makes music feel instantly safe, inclusive, and playable. Using live demonstrations, playground recordings, and some creative repitching in Melodyne, the episode shows how tiny changes to a scale can completely transform a melody’s emotional character.

• A backstage conversation with León Pardo about the Colombian gaita, its ritual use, construction, and sound-world.

• How male and female gaita flutes are paired, and what that reveals about musical identity.

• Why pentatonic scales appear in folk traditions, playground instruments, and children’s musical toys worldwide.

• A breakdown of the theme tune Steve wrote for My Friend Maisy, based on the books by Lucy Cousins.

• Why playground bells and boomwhackers are almost always pentatonic — and why that matters.

• A live experiment repitching the Maisy theme into an Ethiopian-inflected pentatonic.

• Why thinking of scales as identities or colour palettes can make musical listening feel less intimidating.

Also in this episode, Steve reflects on why many people drift away from music when theory becomes detached from sound — and why listening itself is a learnable, creative skill, whether or not you play an instrument.

Plus details of the upcoming Steve Pretty On the Origin of the Pieces live shows at Wilton’s Music Hall on 24th January, including the first ever Origin KIDS matinee at 2pm and the evening show at 7pm. Full details and tickets at originofthepieces.com/live.

🎧 Listen, rate and share to help more musically curious ears find the show.

💻 More episodes, transcripts, and extras at

originofthepieces.com

🪶 Patreon:

patreon.com/StevePrettyOnTheOriginofthePieces

Stay musically curious.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

From Addis to the Barbican and back again, this episode dives into the sound-world shaped by Mulatu Astatke — the father of Ethio jazz. With Mulatu having recently completed his farewell tour, Steve goes back to a long, previously-unreleased interview he recorded with him during the making of Hackney Colliery Band’s Collaborations: Volume One. What emerges is a portrait of a true pioneer: a composer trained in London and at Berklee, a collaborator with Duke Ellington, and the architect of a style heard across film soundtracks, samples and stages worldwide.

Expect discussions of Ethio jazz’s roots in traditional modes and tribal instruments; a journey through pentatonic and diminished scales; and Mulatu’s deep reflections on African musical heritage and collaboration. There’s even a live extract of Derashe from HCB’s Barbican show — the tune he discusses in the interview.

In this episode:

• How Mulatu fused Ethiopian pentatonic traditions with jazz harmony and improvisation.

• Why some Ethiopian tribes use diminished (whole–half) scales, and how that changes the emotional palette.

• The story of Duke Ellington’s Jazz Ambassadors tour — and how Ellington ended up performing one of Mulatu’s arrangements in Addis.

• The embilta, washint and other Ethiopian wind instruments that parallel trumpets, trombones and baritone sax.

• The link between African “bush” instruments, mbira/“African piano” traditions, and Western harmonic thinking.

• A rare 2018 interview captured at Livingston Studios during the HCB/Mulatu recording sessions.

• A live performance of Derashe from the Barbican, featuring Hackney Colliery Band and Mulatu Astatke.

Also in this episode, Steve welcomes listeners from the New Scientist Podcast and explores the science–music crossover behind shell acoustics, underwater sound, and the physics of musical evolution. Plus a reminder that the new Origin of the Pieces website now includes full transcripts, an interactive world-map archive of every episode, and a growing library of extras.

And don’t miss the upcoming Wilton’s Music Hall shows on 24th January 2026, including the first ever Origin KIDS matinee at 2pm and the evening performance at 7pm. TICKETS.

🎧 Listen, rate and share to help more musically curious ears find the show.

💻 More episodes and extras at originofthepieces.com

🪶 Patreon: https://patreon.com/StevePrettyOnTheOriginofthePieces

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

From the high lonesome sound of Appalachia to the flow of a Bronx cipher, this episode explores what happens when two traditions of storytelling and rhythm collide. Recorded at the WOMEX 2024 world-music gathering in Finland, Steve talks with Gangstagrass — the trailblazing American group fusing bluegrass instrumentation with hip-hop lyricism and beats.

Expect fiddles, banjo and beats; live sessions that blur the line between folk jam and freestyle; and a conversation about community, curiosity and the shared language of groove. There’s even a spontaneous rap about Origin of the Pieces and a bus-ride performance that somehow turned into a cipher on wheels.

In this episode:

• How Gangstagrass blend banjo, fiddle and MCs without losing the soul of either style.
• Why hip-hop ciphers and bluegrass picks are closer than you might think.
• The jam session as a universal language — connecting folk musicians, rappers and improvisers worldwide.
• How genre boundaries were drawn by history, and how artists can redraw them.
• A stripped-back version of Do Better plus a freestyle that plugs their UK tour entirely in rhyme.

Gangstagrass UK Tour — November 2025

Also in this episode, Steve launches the new Origin of the Pieces website — featuring full transcripts, an interactive world-map archive, the Darwin-trumpet T-shirt shop, and exclusive extras via Patreon.

And don’t miss the upcoming Wilton’s Music Hall shows on 24 January 2026, including the first ever Origin KIDS matinee and an evening performance featuring new guests and experiments in sound.

🎧 Listen, rate and share to help more musically curious ears find the show.

💻 More episodes and extras at originofthepieces.com

🪶 Patreon: patreon.com/StevePrettyOnTheOriginofthePieces

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.