Max Eisenman is a grad student at the College of New Jersey finishing his master's in counseling, and he might be the most self-aware, thoughtful therapist-in-training you've ever met. He was diagnosed autistic at a young age, and found out at age 10. Max found his people through running track, became a Survivor superfan, and showed up to a psychotherapy symposium as a first-semester intern because his site manager signed him up and he said yes.

In this episode, Max talks about what it was like to grow up knowing he was autistic, how his best friend Ryan taught him what friendship was, and how running gave him a structure for social connection that nothing else could. He reflects on what he's already learning in the therapy room, what the training programs are finally getting right about neurodivergence, and what it means to be a neurodivergent counselor working with neurodivergent clients.

We also talk about IFS, special interests (Survivor, Friends, Stranger Things... he has thoughts), the first autistic contestant on Survivor in 48 seasons, and what it looks like when a kid who was terrified of social situations becomes someone who chooses to spend his life sitting with other people in theirs.

This one will make you feel really good about the future of this field.

Find Max Eisenman:

• LinkedIn
• Interning at New Hope Center (New Jersey)
• College of New Jersey counseling program

Mentioned in this episode:

• IFS (Internal Family Systems)
• Survivor Season 48: Eva, the first openly autistic contestant
• Psychotherapy Networker Symposium
• New Hope Center internship site
• Mental Health Association (undergrad peer support)
• Object-based communication and social connection
• Monologuing

Resources:

• Learn more about high-masking, late-diagnosed autism:
• Instagram
• Unmasking Retreats
• YouTube

Rachael Stern is a trauma therapist, rule breaker, and resource aggregator who came to autism sideways, through a caseload full of queer women with religious trauma who all made her wonder the same thing: are they autistic? Spoiler: they were. Almost every single one of them.

In this episode, Rachael talks about how religion functions as a social script for autistic people, why the eating disorder field has a long way to go for neurodivergent clients, what it was like to go through eating disorder treatment herself, and why she recovered despite the treatment, not because of it.

Rachael also talks about the PDA discovery that changed everything for her family, why she's been quietly putting herself together alongside her clients, and why she will absolutely spend too much time fighting insurance companies on your behalf because they should at least follow their own rules.

We also talk about the DSM as a political document, why autism in the DSM was written for autistic trauma not autistic people, what it means to stand on the shoulders of people who chose to be human, and why the real numbers on autism and eating disorders have to be through the roof.

This conversation is sharp, funny, and completely unfiltered. Rachael is the therapist you didn't know you needed.

Find Rachael Stern:

• Instagram: @breaktheframetherapy
• Substack: Breaking the Frame Therapy
• Google her, she's widely findable
• Private practice in Maryland

Mentioned in this episode:

• Religious trauma and autism connection
• PDA profile
• Eating disorder treatment and neurodivergence
• The DSM as a political document
• Insurance parity law
• LGBTQ affirming care

Resources:

• Learn more about high-masking, late-diagnosed autism: Instagram @neurokoryous
• Unmasking Retreats: koryandreas.com
• YouTube: @ThatsMePod

Caron Starobin is a clinical social worker with nearly 25 years of experience, a group practice of eight clinicians in Maryland, and a specialty in neurodiverse couples therapy using Relational Life Therapy.

She's also a trainer for the Relational Life Institute and the person who convinced Terry Real himself that the field desperately needs training on neurodivergent brains in couples work.

In this episode, Caron breaks down what RLT actually is and why it works so well for neurodivergent couples , from the feedback wheel (the most beloved tool in her neurodiverse caseload) to doing relational trauma and inner child work in the presence of a partner. She talks about loving accountability without shame, what happens when two very different neurotypes try to build a life together, and why 50/50 in a relationship is a myth.

We also talk about neurodiverse relationship stances (social butterfly meets socially awkward, boundary-less meets walled-off), why helping a couple uncouple well is sometimes the work, what it's like to be a neurotypical-leaning therapist who gets depleted by rigid thinking, and the moment an autistic client cried in session and his partner said "I've never seen that part of you before."

And Caron's new, FABULOUS course through the Relational Life Institute on integrating RLT with neurodivergent brains is starting this week. Don't miss the free webinar. Don't miss this opportunity to learn about the intersection of RLT and Neurodiverse couples straight from Caron!

Find Caron Starobin:

• Group practice based in Maryland couples, families, teens, young adults, parent-child work, trauma specialists
• Parent support group and sibling support group available
• Caron's Website
• Newsletter
• Replay of Caron's free webinar with Terry Real
• Signup for Caron's full course with RLT that starts this week:

  No Ordinary Love: Neurodiversity, Intimacy, and Relational Life Therapy

• The course will feature the authors of Is This Autism? (Dr. Henderson, Dr. Whalen, Dr. White)

Mentioned in this episode:

• Terry Real and the Relational Life Institute
• The feedback wheel
• Relational mindfulness and inner child work
• Is This Autism? (Henderson, Whalen, White)
• Brené Brown and the "story I told myself" concept

Resources:

• Learn more about high-masking, late-diagnosed autism:
• Kory's website
• Instagram
• Unmasking Retreats: our next one starts on October 1st!
• Online courses for therapists
• That's Me! Podcast on YouTube

Kimberly Gillette is a therapist in Anne Arundel County, Maryland who specializes in neurodivergent care, ADHD and autism evaluations, and brainspotting, a trauma modality that came out of EMDR but feels completely different. About 70-80% of her caseload identifies as neurodivergent, and she came to this work the same way a lot of us do: through a family member who needed support she couldn't find anywhere else.

In this episode, Kim breaks down what brainspotting actually is, why it works so well for neurodivergent brains, and what happens when a highly autistic nervous system gets to process trauma without having to put it into words. Kory shares her own brainspotting experience: snow angels, geometry, sunshine on her face as a kid, and what it made her realize about the regulation strategies she abandoned somewhere along the way to adulthood.

We also talk about Kim's consultation groups for therapists who are missing the mark with neurodivergent clients, why GAD and MDD diagnoses are masking autism and ADHD in her caseload, how brainspotting helped a client graduate from physical therapy after being stuck for months, and why the brainspotting community is the opposite of gatekeeping.

This one is for anyone who has done years of talk therapy and still feels like something isn't moving. It might not be you. It might be the modality.

Find Kimberly Gillette:
Website: http://www.gillettepsychotherapy.com
Email: [email protected]
Free consultation calls available
Free brainspotting session for practitioners!
ADHD and autism evaluations
Brainspotting intensives: 90 minutes, 3 hours, or 6 hours
One-off sessions welcome! No ongoing commitment required
Based in Anne Arundel County, Maryland

Mentioned in this episode:
David Grand (founder of brainspotting)
Linnea Swanson
EMDR
IFS (Internal Family Systems)
WPATH training
Bilateral music
Interoception and the autistic body

Resources:
Learn more about high-masking, late-diagnosed autism:
Kory's Instagram
Unmasking Retreats
That's Me! on YouTube

Dr. Tamara Mendez is an optometrist who specializes in binocular vision dysfunction and she has been quietly transforming the lives of autistic people who had no idea their eyes were part of the problem!

Binocular vision dysfunction (BVD) is what happens when your eyes aren't working together as a team. Your brain is constantly compensating, all day long. And for autistic people already dealing with sensory overload, that compensation is exhausting in ways that show up as anxiety, headaches, neck pain, reading difficulty, feeling overwhelmed in crowds, and mood dysregulation by the end of the day.

In this episode, Dr. Mendez breaks down what BVD actually is, why standard eye exams completely miss it, and what microprisms can do that regular glasses can't.

Kory shares her own experience getting diagnosed and fitted including the daily 2pm headaches that stopped within 1 day, the nail polish aisle that looked like it was full of tiny minis, and what it felt like to give a presentation without memorizing every slide for the first time in her life.

We also talk about the VR headset that measures 12,000 data points in three minutes, why the appointment takes two to four hours, what it looks like to do this work in a way that's actually safe for autistic patients, and why so few providers are connecting the dots between BVD and the autistic experience.

This one might change your life. Or at least your prescription.

Find Dr. Tamara Mendez:

Website: chevychaseeyecare.com

Phone/Text: 301-242-3927

Located in the DMV area

Search "BVD near me" her website will pop up

Online screening available on her website to see if BVD might apply to you

Mentioned in this episode:

Binocular vision dysfunction (BVD)

Microprisms

Dr. Debbie Feinberg / NeuroVisual Medicine Institute

VR headset screening (12,000 data points in 3 minutes)

POTS and EDS connection to BVD

Dry eye / ocular surface disease

Visual field testing

Eye tracking / reading test

Resources:

Learn more about high-masking, late-diagnosed autism: Instagram.com/neurokoryous

Unmasking Retreats: koryandreas.com/retreats

YouTube: youtube.com/ThatsMePod

Dr. Ellen Joseph is a counseling health psychologist at GI Psychology, a practice dedicated entirely to the gut-brain connection. And if you're an autistic person who has ever been told your lab work is normal while feeling anything but, this episode is for you.

In this episode, Dr. Ellen explains why autistic and ADHD brains are particularly vulnerable to GI distress, from the way interoception turns the volume way up on pain and way down on hunger, to the vicious cycle that forms when your nervous system starts treating your own gut like a threat.

Dr. Ellen breaks down what ARFID is and why it's completely different from other eating disorders, why intuitive eating advice can be counterproductive for autistic people, and how clinical hypnosis is used to literally turn the dial on sensory sensations in the body.

We also talk about PDA and the gut, grief after GI diagnoses, why "you must finish your plate" is one of the most counterproductive things you can say to an autistic child, and what it looks like to be treated by providers who actually listen.

This one is for every autistic person who has spent years being told their gut issues are just anxiety, and every provider who wants to do better!

Find Dr. Ellen Joseph:

• Website: gipsychology.com
• Instagram: @gipsychusa
• LinkedIn and Facebook: GI Psychology
• Free Brain Bytes video series (6 videos) available on their website
• Team of 15+ clinicians available for matching
• Out of network provider:single case agreements and superbills available
• Contact their team to discuss provider matching and logistics

Mentioned in this episode:

• Gut-brain axis / gut-brain connection
• Clinical hypnosis (evidence-based treatment)
• ARFID (Avoidant Restrictive Food Intake Disorder)
• Disorders of gut-brain interaction (33 diagnoses for adults, 24 for kids)
• Inflammatory bowel disease, celiac disease, reflux
• Interoception and sensory processing in the gut
• PDA profile and GI distress
• Intuitive eating and why it doesn't always work for autistic people

Resources:

• Learn more about high-masking, late-diagnosed autism: Instagram @neurokoryous
• Unmasking Retreats: koryandreas.com
• YouTube: @ThatsMePod

Jess Kwerel LPC, LCPC is a psychotherapist who specializes in pet grief and she became the person she needed. When she couldn't find a therapist who truly understood the depth of losing an animal, she built that practice herself. Since 2018, she's been doing the work most therapists won't touch: sitting with people in the most untethered, disorienting, portal-walking grief there is.

In this episode, Jess explains why the brain doesn't differentiate between skin and fur, it's the same attachment system, the same oxytocin, the same neural pathways as our deepest human bonds. She talks about why "at least" is one of the most harmful things you can say to a grieving person, why "moving on" is the wrong framework entirely, and what it actually looks like to move forward with your animal instead.

We also talk about why neurodivergent people have especially deep bonds with their animals, why dogs just make sense to autistic people in a way humans often don't, and what happened when Jess had to take a step back after unexpectedly losing her own senior hound, Daisy earlier this year.

This one is for everyone who has ever loved an animal with their whole heart. Which, if you're listening to this podcast, is probably all of you. So grab your favorite furry friend, and enjoy the laughs and tears with Jess Kwerel!

• Instagram: @PetLostDC
• Website: https://petlossdc.com/
• Resources, articles, podcast recommendations, and books available on her website
  

Mentioned in this episode:

• Attachment theory and the neurobiology of bonding
• Oxytocin and pair bonding
• The difference between sympathy and empathy ("at least" vs "I'm right here")
• Buford and Daisy (Jess's dogs)
• Harvey (Herby) Pickles (The dog Kory will compare all dogs to forever)
• Senior dog adoption
  

Resources:

• Learn more about high-masking, late-diagnosed autism: IG: @neurokoryous
• Unmasking Retreats: koryandreas.com/retreat
• YouTube: @ThatsMePod

Lindsey Burd is a psychiatric nurse practitioner who specializes in neurodivergent care. About 70-80% of her caseload is neurodivergent. She came to this work the hard way: a autistic sister with high support needs, two family members lost to suicide, her own misdiagnosis with bipolar disorder, and years of navigating a psychiatric system that didn't have the language for what she was actually experiencing.

In this episode, Lindsey breaks down what it actually looks like to prescribe medication for autistic brains: why she goes low and slow, why paradoxical reactions are so common, and why she schedules 90-minute intakes when everyone else does 15. Lindsey talks about what BPD and bipolar misdiagnoses have in common (both are wildly overused with neurodivergent women), why she always asks "why" when a patient doesn't take their medication, and why the psychiatric community has a long way to go when it comes to high-masking autism.

We also talk about her own story, reading alone in kindergarten, sensory overload in overcrowded hallways, walking into the woods instead of going to class, her dad sitting on the electrical box with the "bad kids", and POTS and EDS making an already hard world harder.

This is the episode to send to anyone who has ever had a bad experience with a prescriber. And to anyone who is still carrying a diagnosis that doesn't fit.

Find Lindsey Burd:

• Website: burdmentalhealth.com/
• TikTok: @Lindseyburd
• Instagram: @Lindseybpsychnp
• Private practice in Florida and Maryland
• Meds course with Lindsey and Kory coming soon
  

Mentioned in this episode:

• Paradoxical reactions to medication
• BPD and bipolar misdiagnosis patterns
• POTS (Postural Orthostatic Tachycardia Syndrome)
• EDS (Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome)
• PDA profile
• Accommodations being denied in the current political climate
  

Resources:

• Learn more about high-masking, late-diagnosed autism: Instagram @neurokoryous
• Unmasking Retreats: koryandreas.com
• YouTube: @ThatsMePod

Dr. Emma Smith is a sex therapist, trauma specialist, and host of the Intimate Philosopher podcast. She has a PhD, a practice full of Type A++ overachievers, and a very low threshold for false pretense... which, as she says, might be autism, might be trauma, or might just be that she's from New Jersey.

In this episode, Emma breaks down what sex therapy actually looks like, why desire gets squashed in the highest-achieving people, and what happens to intimacy after military trauma. She talks about relationship agreements, why polyamory is more like AP Physics than the "easy way out," and why neurodivergent people are actually wired for designing relationships that make sense.

We also talk about the moment Emma nearly fell out of her front-row seat at one of Kory's presentations, when she realized she doesn't walk into rooms the way other people do. And what it means to live in a different reality than you thought you were in.

This conversation is funny, real, and will make you think differently about desire, intimacy, and what your relationship could look like if you actually designed it on purpose.

Find Dr. Emma Smith

• Instagram: @EmmaSmithPhD
• Podcast: The Intimate Philosopher
• Substack: The Intimate Philosopher — Things Left Unsaid
• Workshops and masterclasses coming soon

Mentioned in this episode:

• Eleanor Oliphant is Completely Fine (book)
• Relationship anarchy
• Relationship agreement intensives
• Window of tolerance

Resources:

• Learn more about high-masking, late-diagnosed autism: Instagram @neurokoryous
• Unmasking Retreats: koryandreas.com
• YouTube: @ThatsMePod

Jessica Hazard is a therapist in New York City who spent years working in public health before working for her own private practice. She worked at school-based health centers, and community health clinics. She was also the clinical director at an agency serving young people who had been commercially sexually exploited.

She got diagnosed with ADHD at 41, after spending years working with ADHD clients and thinking, "Wait, why do I relate to everything they're saying?"

In this episode, Jessica talks about the grief that came with late diagnosis ("What would my life have looked like if I had known this?"), the "lazy" narrative and executive dysfunction, ADHD piles and moral failure, the overlap between ADHD and autism, why therapy boundaries were designed to protect therapists (not clients), and how her own neurodivergence makes her a better therapist for neurodivergent clients.

We also talk about the harm of evidence-based models that weren't tested on neurodivergent people, why she tells all her teenage clients about her own ADHD, and why self-esteem is the real issue, not the way neurodivergence shows up.

Find Jessica Hazard:

• Alma profile: Jessica Hazard
• Private practice in New York City (licensed in NY)
• Works with adolescents and adults who have experienced trauma
• Insurance accepted

Mentioned in this episode:

• ADHD piles
• The "lazy" narrative
• Rejection sensitivity
• The overlap between ADHD and autism

Resources:

• Learn more about high-masking, late-diagnosed autism: Instagram @neurokoryous
• Unmasking Retreats: koryandreas.com
• YouTube: @ThatsMePod