The Art and Science of Difficult Conversations

What's the difference when a leader has healthy boundaries vs when they don't?

Join us for the second part of our interview with Angela Barnes, where we will roleplay and discuss the complexities of setting boundaries in leadership roles, particularly within the nonprofit sector.

We explore the challenges of people-pleasing tendencies, the importance of having a strategic plan, and the role of professional development in establishing effective boundaries.

Through role-playing scenarios, we illustrate how to navigate difficult conversations and highlight the need for accountability and clarity in leadership.

Missed the first part of the interview? Check it out here. 

Key Takeaways:

Contact Angela: 

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In this insightful episode, hosts Chris Wong and Lucie Tesarova welcome Angela Barnes, MBA, CFRE, to explore one of the most challenging aspects of workplace communication: setting and maintaining boundaries. Angela brings over a decade of fundraising expertise and shares hard-won lessons about navigating boundaries in nonprofit organizations.

Angela D Barnes, MBA, CFRE

Angela introduces her holistic framework for understanding boundaries across seven key life areas and explains why we often fail to bring our personal boundaries into the workplace.

When boundaries aren't set proactively, you're forced into "emergency boundary" mode, which turns into crisis communications and difficult conversations.

✅ Start with organizational boundaries: Understand what boundaries exist (or don't exist) in your workplace before setting personal ones

✅ Communicate boundaries proactively: Don't wait until you're frustrated or angry to express your limits

✅ Boundaries don't require confrontation: Simple changes like email signatures can set expectations without drama

✅ Whining signals readiness (or unreadiness): If you're complaining repeatedly without action, ask yourself if you're truly ready to change

✅ Own your destiny: Your boundaries and the enforcement of them are your responsibility, not other people's

Contact Angela: 

Connect with us: 

Want a guide to follow while listening? Or notes for future reference? Download the free Power Dynamics Playbook here. 

Ever freeze in a meeting when the stakes are high? This episode demystifies power dynamics. We talk about what they are, how they hijack your nervous system, and exactly what to say when you need to push back, manage up, lead from the middle, or invite real feedback as a leader. You’ll learn the six types of power (beyond “positional”), why the same words land differently depending on who says them, and practical, word-for-word moves you can use today (yes-and framing, power-leveling questions, structural safety, and more).

Who it’s for

ICs & new managers who need to speak up to senior leaders

Leaders who suspect they’re not getting the real story

Peers navigating conflict without formal authority

What you’ll learn

The 6 power types: positional, expert, relational, resource, informational, and cultural/identity

How power triggers fight/flight/freeze/fawn—and how to keep your prefrontal cortex online

Why “impact over intent” defuses defensiveness and creates traction

Concrete scripts: managing up, managing down, and managing across

Key Takeaways

Power isn’t the problem; invisible power is. Name it to tame it.

Scripts that calm defenses beat “bravery speeches.” Try: “I love where this is headed and I want to flag one implementation risk.”

Questions that level the field: “What would need to be true for this to work?” “How does this fit the priority we set last week?”

Leaders: Don’t trust your gut on psychological safety—design for it (rotate facilitation, invite the quiet, respond to anonymous signals).

For peers: Stop competing for the same power—trade it on purpose.

Resources Mentioned

Free “Be Free” Saboteur Assessment (find your survival-brain patterns): https://mindfittery.com/befree 

Chris’s newsletter + connect with him on LinkedIn too and check out his online courses

Episodes on cultural/identity dynamics (see channel playlist)

Summary: 

In part 2 of their conversation, Matt Brown shares his insights on building credibility and trust within teams, overcoming skepticism in leadership roles, and navigating board dynamics. He emphasizes the importance of humility, active listening, and the willingness to learn from others. Matt discusses the responsibilities of leadership, particularly in maintaining the integrity of an organization while fostering growth.

Key Takeaways

-        It's tough to gain credibility, but humility helps.

-        Creating a learning environment is essential for team dynamics.

-        Overcoming skepticism requires demonstrating value through action.

-        Respecting and valuing each team member's expertise is crucial.

-        Building trust takes time and consistent effort.

-        Acknowledging others' contributions can build trust

-        Mistakes in leadership can be learning opportunities.

About Matt

Matt joined OARS as Executive Director in 2024. Prior to OARS, he was Chief Operating Officer at Lowell House, Inc., an addiction treatment non-profit serving Merrimack Valley. Matt served on the Randolph Conservation Commission and Community Preservation Committee before moving to Westford, MA. He served on the Westford Affordable Housing Committee and coached youth baseball and basketball in Westford. Matt holds an MS in Non-Profit Management from Worcester State University and an MA in English from Clark University.

Contact Matt

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matthew-brown-0b9b21145/

Check out OARS: https://oars3rivers.org/   

Interested in the difficult conversations course? Check it out here: https://www.myleadershippotential.com/trust

Want to learn what kind of mind traps are sabotaging your communication and relationships with others? Go to https://www.mindfittery.com/befree to learn more. 

Contact Chris: [email protected]

Contact Lucie: [email protected] or https://www.mindfittery.com      

In this episode, Chris Wong and Lucie Tesarova interview Matt Brown, an Executive Director of a Watershed nonprofit, to discuss the intricacies of difficult conversations in leadership. They explore Matt's journey in the nonprofit sector, the challenges of navigating resistance from employees and board members, and the importance of understanding motivations behind resistance. Matt shares personal stories of hard lessons he’s learned over the years.

Takeaways

-        Practicing difficult conversations can lead to better outcomes.

-        Understanding motivations behind resistance makes a huge difference

-        Building trust requires open and honest communication.

About Matt

Matt joined OARS (Organization for the Assabet, Sudbury, and Concord Rivers) as Executive Director in 2024. Prior to OARS, he was Chief Operating Officer at Lowell House, Inc., an addiction treatment non-profit serving Merrimack Valley. Matt served on the Randolph Conservation Commission and Community Preservation Committee before moving to Westford, MA. He served on the Westford Affordable Housing Committee and coached youth baseball and basketball in Westford. Matt holds an MS in Non-Profit Management from Worcester State University and an MA in English from Clark University.

Interested in the difficult conversations course? Check it out here: https://www.myleadershippotential.com/trust

Want to learn what kind of mind traps are sabotaging your communication and relationships with others? Go to https://www.mindfittery.com/befree to learn more. 

Contact Chris: [email protected]

Contact Lucie: [email protected] or www.mindfittery.com  

What does it take to build an international community?

In part 2 of the conversation with Tasha Van Vlack, Chris and Lucie explore the intricacies of building and maintaining community within organizations, especially as they grow. Tasha shares her insights on navigating cultural differences in community engagement, emphasizing the importance of connection and flexibility. They also discuss the transition from management to leadership, highlighting the need for emotional intelligence, vulnerability, and the ability to celebrate team wins. Tasha's experiences provide valuable lessons for leaders looking to foster a sense of belonging and engagement in their teams. 

Takeaways

-        Maintaining connection in a growing community requires intentionality.

-        Cultural differences can impact engagement and communication.

-        Flexibility in participation is crucial for community members.

-        Celebrating team wins boosts morale and fosters connection.

-        Emotional intelligence is essential for effective leadership.

-        Vulnerability helps leaders connect with their teams.

-        Listening to community members is key to understanding their needs.

-        Consistency in communication builds trust and engagement.

-        Leaders should focus on visibility and value for their team members.

-        Community is an organic ecosystem that requires shared control.

About Tasha 

Tasha Van Vlack is a community-builder disguised as a marketer. With a background in nonprofit engagement, digital strategy, and making things happen with tiny teams, she’s the founder of The Nonprofit Hive—a global nonprofit peer-connection platform—and the brains behind Community Hives, which helps organizations spark one-on-one conversations that actually go somewhere. Right now, she’s diving headfirst into scaling relational tech and dreaming up what’s next for human-first connection tools. When she’s not matchmaking nonprofit pros or geeking out on systems change, you’ll find her hiking with her kids, reading a good fiction book, or talking community like it’s a love language. 

Contact Tasha:

Email: [email protected]

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tasha-van-vlack/

Join the Nonprofit Hive: www.thenonprofithive.com

Interested in the difficult conversations course? Check it out here: https://www.myleadershippotential.com/trust

Want to learn what kind of mind traps are sabotaging your communication and relationships with others? Go to https://www.mindfittery.com/befree to learn more. 

Contact Chris: [email protected]

Contact Lucie: [email protected] or www.mindfittery.com    

How do you get the confidence to build something in public 

In part 1, Chris Wong and Lucie Tesarova interview Tasha Van Vlack, the founder of the Nonprofit Hive, discussing the challenges and triumphs of building an international community. Tasha shares her journey of personal growth, the importance of vulnerability in leadership, and the necessity of transparency in fostering a supportive environment. The discussion highlights the evolution of community building, especially in the wake of COVID-19, and emphasizes the significance of peer-led learning and emotional intelligence in leadership roles.

What were our big takeaways?

-        Building confidence is essential for creating international communities.

-        Community building has become increasingly important post-COVID.

-        Personal growth often accompanies the journey of community leadership.

-        Vulnerability in leadership fosters trust and connection.

-        Transparency helps in managing community expectations and feedback.

-        Real connections are more valuable than perfect presentations.

-        Embracing imperfection can lead to more authentic community engagement.

About Tasha 

Tasha Van Vlack is a community-builder disguised as a marketer. With a background in nonprofit engagement, digital strategy, and making things happen with tiny teams, she’s the founder of The Nonprofit Hive—a global nonprofit peer-connection platform—and the brains behind Community Hives, which helps organizations spark one-on-one conversations that actually go somewhere. Right now, she’s diving headfirst into scaling relational tech and dreaming up what’s next for human-first connection tools. When she’s not matchmaking nonprofit pros or geeking out on systems change, you’ll find her hiking with her kids, reading a good fiction book, or talking community like it’s a love language. 

Contact Tasha:

Email: [email protected]

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tasha-van-vlack/

Contact Chris: [email protected]

Contact Lucie: https://www.mindfittery.com/site/contact 

Join us for the second part of our conversation with Jevon Gondwe, who is a Leadership Transformation Architect and the founder of Influential Skills Company.

If you haven't heard the first part of our conversation on how to create high performing teams, or as Jevon says "Culture of Champions", make sure to listen it here.

Key Takeaways:

• Building a team requires clear communication and accountability.
• Role-playing can help illustrate effective conversation techniques.
• Creating a culture of candor is essential for team success.
• Leaders should set expectations early in the relationship.
• Feedback should be specific and objective to be effective.
• Personal growth is crucial for leaders to support their teams.
• Mistakes should be viewed as learning opportunities, not failures.
• Leaders must be aware of their team's challenges and pressures.
• Open dialogue can prevent misunderstandings and disengagement.
• Building trust takes time and consistent effort.

About Jevon:

Jevon Gondwe is a dynamic Leadership Transformation Architect and the founder of Influential Skills. His leadership insights have been featured in major media companies like Inc. Magazine and Training Industry, Inc. Through Jevon’s proprietary leadership framework Building a Culture of Champions is preparing team leaders for the new economy. Fighting against corporate disengagement, high turnover, and average work environments, Jevon is transforming leaders into catalysts for growth by helping them develop the mindset for personal growth, while building the crucial communication and relationship building skills to connect, inspire, and lead a championship team. His unique approach to leadership communication is forged from over 15 years of hands on experience, and the invaluable lessons from 3 college National Championships under two of the NCAA's winningest coaches of all time. This background instilled a mindset of excellence, humility, and servant leadership, which Jevon has shared to inspire over 30,000 professionals.

His core offerings focus on the intersection of interpersonal skills, leadership, and team building, helping leaders boost engagement, retention, and performance, even through their most challenging team dynamics. Jevon doesn't teach theory, he's applied these proven methods across diverse industries. A proud husband and father, Jevon embraces his unique Malawian-American heritage to connect with diverse audiences and firmly believes success comes from consistently adding value to others, a philosophy he champions for all leaders.

• Connect with Jevon:
• https://www.influentialskills.com/
• [email protected]
• https://www.linkedin.com/in/jevon-gondwe/

Connect with us:

Email – [email protected]

Chris – www.linkedin.com/in/chriswonglmhc

Lucie – www.linkedin.com/in/lucietesarova

How do you build High-Performing Teams? What kind of skills and factors are essential for effective leadership?

Join us for a conversation with Jevon Gondwe to hear his personal anecdotes and insights that highlight the transformative power of leadership in both personal and professional contexts.

Takeaways:

• Effective communication enhances overall quality of life.
• Leadership has a ripple effect on individuals and teams.
• Servant leadership focuses on maximizing others' potential.
• Creating psychological safety is crucial for team growth.
• Personal growth is essential for effective leadership.
• Listening actively can bring out the best in others.
• Vision should inspire and engage team members.
• Real conversations are necessary for alignment and growth.
• Fear often prevents difficult conversations from happening.
• Leaders should empower individuals to take ownership of their roles.

Chapters

00:00 Building High-Performing Teams

01:25 The Ripple Effect of Leadership

05:04 Understanding Servant Leadership

10:23 Essential Skills for Effective Leadership

16:46 Aligning Team and Individual Visions

21:00 Creating a Vision for Your Team

24:00 Overcoming Fear in Difficult Conversations

27:21 Personal Growth as a Leader

About Jevon:

Jevon Gondwe is a dynamic Leadership Transformation Architect and the founder of Influential Skills. His leadership insights have been featured in major media companies like Inc. Magazine and Training Industry, Inc. Through Jevon’s proprietary leadership framework Building a Culture of Champions is preparing team leaders for the new economy. Fighting against corporate disengagement, high turnover, and average work environments, Jevon is transforming leaders into catalysts for growth by helping them develop the mindset for personal growth, while building the crucial communication and relationship building skills to connect, inspire, and lead a championship team. His unique approach to leadership communication is forged from over 15 years of hands on experience, and the invaluable lessons from 3 college National Championships under two of the NCAA's winningest coaches of all time. This background instilled a mindset of excellence, humility, and servant leadership, which Jevon has shared to inspire over 30,000 professionals.

His core offerings focus on the intersection of interpersonal skills, leadership, and team building, helping leaders boost engagement, retention, and performance, even through their most challenging team dynamics. Jevon doesn't teach theory, he's applied these proven methods across diverse industries. A proud husband and father, Jevon embraces his unique Malawian-American heritage to connect with diverse audiences and firmly believes success comes from consistently adding value to others, a philosophy he champions for all leaders.

Connect with Jevon:

• https://www.influentialskills.com/
• [email protected]
• https://www.linkedin.com/in/jevon-gondwe/

Connect with us:

Email – [email protected]

Chris – www.linkedin.com/in/chriswonglmhc

Lucie – www.linkedin.com/in/lucietesarova

How can you turn a crisis into an opportunity and rebuild trust?

Join us for another episode of the Art & Science of Difficult Conversations, where we had a conversation with Scott Harvey, who has 20 years of experience in law enforcement as a Hostage Negotiator.

This is part 2 of the episode, where we role-play a difficult conversation that many leaders face - talking with an employee who "survived" a wave of layoffs and is now demotivated, anxious, resentful, and scared about the future.

How do you have that conversation?

Tune in to find out.

About Scott:

With 20 years of experience in law enforcement as a Hostage Negotiator and over 18 years as a business owner, Scott Harvey has a deep understanding of what drives success. His career has included roles as a sergeant supervising officers, teaching thousands of D.A.R.E. classes, and delivering keynote speeches to hundreds of thousands of people. Scott's extensive experience has refined his ability to impart leadership skills, which he shares on dozens of stages each year. In 2023, Scott distilled his decades of communication expertise into his book, Silence Kills, which has already sold thousands of copies. As a business coach, Scott engages directly with entrepreneurs and leaders, challenging them to grow their businesses while maintaining balance in their personal lives and health. His unique style of personalized motivation continues to make a significant impact both on and off stage. Scott’s wife of over 27 years and their two grown daughters keep him grounded and inspired, providing real-life insights as he navigates the roles of husband, father, and entrepreneur.

Contact Scott Harvey:

Contact us:

Email – [email protected]

Chris – www.linkedin.com/in/chriswonglmhc

Lucie – www.linkedin.com/in/lucietesarova