The Bottom Line

Heather Vernon never expected to become an entrepreneur. Her goal after university was to become a teacher, through the Teach First graduate programme - two years of intense learning on the job, schooling disadvantaged children in low income communities. It taught her resilience and prompted a move into politics, initially at a local level, then a job with the Labour party, advising members of the then shadow cabinet. She tells Evan Davis why working at Westminster was initially terrifying and what encouraged her to set up a PR business with a friend.

(Image: Heather Vernon Credit: Woburn Partners)

Three business leaders tackle fictional dilemmas that test their instincts, experience and nerves. To make it more realistic, none of the guests have any idea what the scenarios are in advance.

Guests:

Production team:

Productivity drives prosperity, yet the UK continues to lag behind countries like the US, France and Germany. We work harder, yet produce less than our peers. In this episode, Evan Davis and guests discuss what productivity really looks like in practice – from offices and factories to call centres and operating theatres. And ask whether AI could be the boost Britain's economy needs.

Guests:

Production team:

Do you ever feel the world is stacked in favour of the extrovert people – the most gregarious, the most outwardly confident, the perhaps sometimes sharp-elbowed, the loudest? What can natural introverts do to try and level the playing field and create a positive impression? Evan Davis asks Richard Etienne from the Introvert Space, Clare Farthing from South Somerset meet ups and Heather Vernon, co-founder of Woburn Partners.

Once known as “personnel”, Human Resources seems to have become a real centre of power in modern business. No longer just handing out payslips or organising the Christmas party, HR now shapes company culture, influences major decisions and – some say – acts as a kind of corporate police force and judiciary. The profession has doubled in size over the past two decades and grown in authority. How did it rise so fast and what does its growing influence mean for the workplace? Evan Davis and guests discuss how HR seemingly took control of the corporate agenda and ask whether company bosses have delegated too much power to a profession that comes with its own code of values and priorities.

Guests:

Production team:

Can chaos ever be good for business? From Donald Trump’s unpredictable tariff policies to Elon Musk’s disruptive leadership style, some of the world’s most high-profile figures seem to thrive on disorder. But does chaos drive innovation – or just confusion? In a world where start-ups often celebrate mess and speed over tidy management, we ask if “getting things done” sometimes means throwing out the rulebook. Evan Davis and guests discuss whether the best results really come from a bit of chaos.

Guests:

Production team:

What happens when university research becomes a business? It’s called a spin-out and it’s built Silicon Valley, with Stanford University at the centre. In the UK, Oxford alone has launched more than 200 in the last 15 years.

Whether it’s a new drug, software or material, brilliant university research can create huge rewards – for founders, universities and the economy. But also battles over who really owns the idea and should get a share of the equity.

Does the spin-out system deliver or does it stall? Evan Davis and a panel of guests discuss.

Guests:

Production team:

It's easier than ever to create a website for your business and talk directly with customers, but what are the pitfalls to avoid? Three business leaders discuss the pros and cons of selling 'D2C' with Evan Davis.

Sellers no longer need to convince bigger retailers to carry their products or invest in inventory just to fill the shelves. Selling direct to consumers online also means businesses know exactly what their best sellers are, and who is buying what. These businesses can make improvements quickly and market only to those people most likely to buy.

But as online selling becomes more competitive and targeted advertising gets more expensive, how can 'direct to consumer' businesses grow? Does the answer lie in bricks and mortar?

Panel:

Alexandra Thurstan, co-founder Different Dog, fresh dog food company

Born in Halifax, West Yorkshire, Greg Jackson left school at 16 to write computer games, later joining Greenpeace before returning to study economics at Cambridge. Growing up in a family so stretched that the energy supply was cut off, he channelled that experience into a drive to make energy fairer and more affordable. By his twenties he was running a mirror business, before moving into tech start-up investing. In 2016 he founded Octopus Energy. Less than a decade on, it serves more than 7 million customers in 18 countries, manages a £6 billion renewable portfolio, and licenses its Kraken technology to utilities worldwide — with the company now valued at close to $9 billion.

Producer: Georgiana Tudor

In 2019, Charlie Bowes-Lyon co-founded Wild with childhood friend Freddy Ward, frustrated by the lack of sustainable options in personal care. Their first product — a refillable deodorant in compostable packaging — struck a chord with consumers looking to cut down on plastic. From a standing start, Wild became one of the UK’s fastest-growing consumer brands, selling millions of units, building a loyal online following and moving rapidly into high-street stores. The company has already replaced hundreds of tonnes of single-use plastic. In 2025, Wild was acquired by Unilever in a deal worth hundreds of millions. Charlie speaks to Evan Davis about building a disruptive eco-brand, and what it takes to scale a start-up into a global business.

Producer: Osman Iqbal