The Founders Fire

Ken Kencevski helped take his family’s car-parts business online and into international markets. Then he left to start again.

His family thought he was crazy. For six months, they barely told anyone he’d gone, just in case he changed his mind.

Ken was out knocking on doors in Wollongong, selling $900 websites and building momentum wherever he could. But one of the biggest rewards had nothing to do with his new business. Once work stopped dominating every conversation, he felt like he got his parents back.

In this episode of Founders Fire, Dan sits down with the founder of Devika to explore the decisions behind a decade of building digital products. From taking over a stalled software implementation at the family business, to landing Westpac as a client after abandoning his presentation and handing someone a VR headset.

Ken shares why he told every existing client the business was changing direction, how he held onto his team while competitors tried to poach them, and why he cares more about his business doing well than looking successful.

They also get into AI and vibe coding: where Ken sees real value in testing an idea quickly, and where founders can mistake a promising prototype for a product that’s ready for paying customers.

Along the way, there are $900 websites, kids’ coding classes, a Coachella project, a UFC Christmas party and an ambitious vision for Devika Ventures.

Through it all, Ken keeps coming back to the same question: how hard can it be?

0:00 Backing yourself and making the big calls
0:42 Meet Ken Kencevski, founder of Devika
1:09 Building and launching digital products
3:10 Ten years of Devika and the COVID pivot
5:20 Keeping the team together as competition for talent exploded
7:26 Choosing retention and profitability over rapid growth
9:56 The server outage that sparked his interest in tech
12:04 Taking the family business online
14:31 The software project that was always “one month away”
17:10 Taking ownership when the tech partner couldn’t deliver
20:17 AI, vibe coding and the gap between prototype and product
23:18 Creating one consistent way to build software
25:50 Why saying yes to everything became unsustainable
27:59 The “Jerry Maguire moment”: calling every client
29:44 Growing the family business through e-commerce
32:51 The San Francisco trip that changed his direction
34:42 Why his family didn’t want to take another big bet
36:24 Leaving the family business
37:03 “I got my parents back”
38:20 Starting again without an established reputation
39:22 Knocking on doors and selling $900 websites
40:27 Kids’ coding classes and unexpected connections
43:06 How small projects became much bigger relationships
45:00 VR experiments, education and Coachella
48:59 The Westpac presentation that changed everything
52:35 Choosing clients and building Devika Ventures
53:52 Moving from gut-feel investments to a structured process
58:19 His six-year vision for $100 million exits
59:02 Building Baseline and working with Amazon
1:00:49 Doing well versus looking successful
1:01:04 Balancing revenue, reputation and strategic opportunities
1:03:22 What gets done when nobody needs the credit

Connect with Ken at ken.au.

Explore Devika and listen to Build & Scale with Devika.

See behind the scenes over on Instagram.

Or connect with Dan on LinkedIn.

And if you need help to find the hire that will completely change your business, reach out at Thirdway Advisory.

Hit follow wherever you’re listening so you don’t miss a single episode.

James Matolich was helping other people get healthier while running himself into the ground.

Personal training in the morning. Working in his café all day. Back to the gym for evening sessions. By the weekend, he was so exhausted he’d tell his now-wife not to speak to him until he’d slept.

Later, becoming a dad made the cost of those hours even clearer. He was helping clients reach their goals while missing bedtime with his daughter.

In this episode of Founders Fire, Dan sits down with the founder of JM Peak Performance to explore the experiences behind his work with founders and business owners. From long nights in hospitality and losing 34 kilos through Muay Thai, to moving to Thailand, opening a café and pushing himself too hard preparing for a professional fight.

James shares why he walked away from the ambition of owning a gym, what burnout did to his relationships, and how a bold Instagram video helped him land Simon Beard as a client.

Dan also opens up about his own health journey as one of James’s clients. Together, they discuss the habits that slip when business gets busy, the temptation of a quick fix, and why getting back into training can mean letting go of what you used to be able to do.

At the heart of it is a question every founder needs to consider: are you building a business that supports the life you want—or leaving yourself with nothing left to enjoy it?

0:00 When pushing harder takes a toll
0:42 Meet James Matolich
1:51 Why he works with founders and business owners
3:39 Growing up in Western Sydney and moving to the Gold Coast
6:18 His first job: hard work for $100 a week
8:30 Becoming a chef and discovering the hospitality lifestyle
11:26 Finding Muay Thai
12:28 Losing 34 kilos and changing direction
14:04 Becoming a trainer and starting his first business
15:31 Selling up to become a sponsored fighter in Thailand
17:32 Coming home earlier than planned
20:28 Why he decided against owning a gym
21:55 Fatherhood and the bedtimes he was missing
23:28 Running a café alongside personal training
25:13 Exhaustion, burnout and the impact on his relationship
26:14 The fight preparation that pushed him too far
28:15 Winning a client by doing something different
30:17 The backyard video pitch to Simon Beard
32:54 The patterns he sees in founders neglecting their health
34:49 Food, coffee and getting through a busy day
36:11 Why switching off is so difficult
38:41 Looking beyond the quick fix
40:48 Starting when the journey feels overwhelming
42:21 Breaking a big goal into smaller milestones
43:21 How James approaches testing and individual coaching
47:01 Letting go of how you used to train
49:49 Discussing testosterone and lifestyle habits
51:51 His message to founders putting their health last
53:12 Taking the first step towards change

Connect with James at JM Peak Performance.

See behind the scenes over on Instagram.

Or connect with Dan on LinkedIn.

And if you need help to find the hire that will completely change your business, reach out at Thirdway Advisory.

Hit follow wherever you’re listening so you don’t miss a single episode.

Ceri Cummings was answering messages at three in the morning, coaching in the gym and working 16–17-hour days across multiple businesses.

Then severe nerve pain left him unable to work.

While he struggled with sleepless nights and the guilt of letting his team down, something happened that changed how he saw his role: his businesses kept growing.

On this episode of Founders Fire, recorded on tour in Sydney, Dan sits down with the BOLT Fitness founder and GOAT co-founder to trace the decisions that brought him here. From 11 years in the British Army and a rugby contract that took him to Perth, to opening his first gym with no money and a landlord willing to back him.

Ceri shares how that first gym grew into a wellness hub, how he and his co-founder developed GOAT — Greatest of All Tapes — and how the brand reached around $1.5 million in monthly revenue, according to Ceri at the time of recording.

Along the way, they talk about backing yourself before you feel ready, building a business with someone who works completely differently, choosing community over volume, and learning to hand over control.

For a founder whose instinct has always been to keep going, being forced to stop brought a lesson he’s now putting into practice.

0:00 Taking risks and backing yourself
0:51 Meet Ceri and the story behind GOAT
4:16 From Wales to the British Army
6:58 The phone call that brought him to Perth
8:26 Rugby injury and a new direction in fitness
10:54 Finding a business partner through Facebook
12:59 Losing his granddad and deciding to back himself
14:14 The landlord’s deal: no rent, no salary
15:08 Building the gym while working full time
15:59 Turning one gym into a wellness hub
17:21 What the Army and rugby taught him about business
20:06 Where the idea for GOAT began
22:45 The perfectionist and the founder who moves fast
25:01 Months of testing to get the product right
27:58 International ambitions and $1.5 million a month in revenue
29:38 Why community still matters to him
30:19 Working 16–17-hour days and handing over control
32:32 Selling out and the challenges of keeping stock
33:13 The health setback that forced him to stop
37:06 Pain, sleepless nights and the mental toll
39:55 Feeling guilty for being unable to work
40:30 His businesses kept growing without him
41:47 Rethinking his working week
43:04 Golf, his next business idea and life after rugby
46:42 His advice to founders: don’t burn out, and take action

Explore GOAT at The Greatest of All Tapes.

See behind the scenes over on Instagram.

Or connect with Dan on LinkedIn.

And if you need help to find the hire that will completely change your business, reach out at Thirdway Advisory.

Hit follow wherever you’re listening so you don’t miss a single episode.

He lost more than $1 million at 36, walked away from the business, and later realised he hadn't properly dealt with any of it.

Dan Copsey has built businesses across transport, marketing, recruitment, technology and investment. Today he co-runs TMSPC alongside his childhood best mate Alex, with interests spanning multiple companies, international teams and not-for-profit work.

But the part of his story that shaped him most came before all of that.

In this episode Dan is open about losing seven figures, the burnout that followed, why driving a forklift for three months became one of the best decisions he ever made, and the moment COVID brought his new business within 4% of shutting down. Along the way he talks about cash flow, co-founders, bad advice, resilience, giving back and why he's no longer trying to prove anyone else wrong. He's just trying to prove himself right.

0:00 Losing more than $1 million at 36
1:12 The portfolio of businesses he runs today
5:15 Building a company with his childhood best mate
9:15 From landscaping and civil infrastructure into business
12:00 The acquisition that eventually cost them more than $1 million
15:20 Why he didn't realise he was burnt out
17:00 The best thing he did next: drive a forklift
20:50 "I obviously wasn't coping. I just didn't know it."
24:30 Starting again in a completely different industry
29:00 Cash flow, payroll and the anxiety founders carry
33:30 The COVID moment that nearly ended everything
34:45 They would shut at 48%. They hit 44%.
36:00 The business education you can't buy
43:45 Why founders almost never celebrate the wins
47:00 Why some business partnerships work and others don't
50:05 "I'm not trying to prove anyone else wrong"
51:30 Why he believes life is always on time
53:00 From payroll to fighting a house fire in the same day
55:00 Why giving back matters
56:45 The advice he gives every founder about advisors

Connect with Daniel at https://dancopsey.com/

See behind the scenes over at https://www.instagram.com/danmoussa_thirdwayadvisory/

Or LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-moussa-thirdway/

And if you need help to find the hire that will completely change your business reach out over at https://www.thirdwayadvisory.com.au/

Hit follow wherever you're listening so you don't miss a single episode.

Success looked incredible from the outside.

Declan Kluver was building one of Australia's fastest-growing recruitment businesses. His company was growing rapidly, the media attention was building, and the future looked limitless.

Behind the scenes, however, years of relentless pressure, chronic stress and undiagnosed bipolar disorder were taking a devastating toll.

What followed changed his life forever.

In one of the most honest conversations we've ever recorded on Founders Fire, Declan shares the reality of founder burnout, the warning signs he missed, losing the business that defined his identity, surviving a suicide attempt, and why he's now dedicating his life to helping other founders protect the one asset that matters more than any business: their health.

In This Episode:

00:00 Why no business is worth sacrificing your health

02:40 The first businesses and the entrepreneurial spark

10:20 Building a recruitment agency from scratch

18:40 Creating Extra Recruiter and chasing a $100M vision

24:50 When success became overwhelming

26:30 Understanding bipolar disorder and manic episodes

31:20 Losing the company that became his identity

33:10 The warning signs before his suicide attempt

36:50 Learning to rebuild after surviving life-changing injuries

42:20 Why founder health needs to come before business success

47:50 The advice every founder needs to hear

**Content Warning**

This episode contains discussions of mental health, bipolar disorder and suicide. Please take care while listening. If this conversation raises concerns for you or someone you know, support is available.

Australia

• If you're in immediate danger or someone is at immediate risk, call 000.

• Speak with your GP or a qualified mental health professional.

• Beyond Blue: 1300 22 4636

• Suicide Call Back Service: 1300 659 467

• Black Dog Institute

• Head to Health A government service that helps connect people with the most appropriate mental health support.

Every founder dreams of building a successful business and one day selling it.

Ian Goodwin did exactly that.

After founding Cludo, scaling it rapidly and navigating an acquisition during the uncertainty of COVID, Ian achieved what many founders spend their careers chasing. But what followed wasn't the finish line he expected. The pressure of earn-out targets, leading a team through constant change, and carrying the weight of everyone else's certainty eventually led to complete burnout.

In this episode, Ian shares the reality behind selling a business, why acquisitions are far more emotionally complex than most founders realise, how COVID nearly derailed everything, and the moment he genuinely questioned whether he could keep going. It's an honest conversation about leadership, resilience, burnout and why success often comes with costs nobody prepares you for.

You'll hear:

0:00 Why selling a business isn't the finish line most founders imagine

6:40 Growing up, competitive cycling and the first signs of entrepreneurship

15:55 Building Cludo and choosing co-founders with the exit already in mind

20:10 Winning the client that changed everything

24:20 Navigating acquisition conversations during COVID

29:10 Planning for the worst-case scenario as the world shut down3

5:15 Leading a business while privately fearing it could all collapse

42:20 What due diligence is really like from a founder's perspective

49:00 Why some employees weren't happy the business was sold

54:20 The hidden pressure of earn-out targets58:30 The burnout that almost made Ian walk away from everything

1:06:10 Why selling the business changed how he thought about work

1:10:50 The biggest lesson every founder should learn before starting a business

See behind the scenes over at https://www.instagram.com/danmoussa_thirdwayadvisory/

Or LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-moussa-thirdway/

And if you need help to find the hire that will completely change your business, reach out over at https://www.thirdwayadvisory.com.au/

Hit follow wherever you're listening so you don't miss a single episode.

At 21, Peter Wolff was declared bankrupt after unknowingly signing a personal guarantee for his family's business. Years later, he walked away from Veneziano, the coffee company he co-founded, after a partnership that had turned toxic. Then, just eleven weeks after opening a new café in Brisbane, COVID hit. He’s had chefs walk out, he’s broken down in the kitchen, and spent the next nine months cooking every service himself.

Today, Peter is the founder of Wolf Coffee Roasters, one of Australia's most respected specialty coffee businesses. Alongside his wife Penny, he's built a business that has trained nearly 15,000 coffee professionals around the world and helped shape Australia's modern coffee industry.

In this episode Peter is refreshingly honest about bankruptcy, business partnerships, conflict, burnout and the fear of losing everything twice. He talks about why trust is the most valuable thing a founder can build, the role Penny has played in every chapter of the business, and why sometimes the only way through is one plate, one customer and one day at a time.

You'll hear:

0:00 Four decades in coffee and the business Peter built

6:23 How Wolf Coffee Roasters started from scratch

15:03 Why he walked away from the company he co-founded

19:18 When a business partnership became toxic

22:01 What leaving a business really feels like

29:04 Building multiple businesses at the same time

36:55 The family bankruptcy that changed everything

41:00 The $68,000 debt he never knew he'd signed for

45:15 Opening a new café just weeks before COVID

50:10 The week every chef walked out52:29 Breaking down in the kitchen

54:07 Nine months cooking every service himself

57:08 The one lesson every founder should build their business around

Connect with Peter: linkedin.com/in/peter-wolff-40475aba

See behind the scenes over at https://www.instagram.com/danmoussa_thirdwayadvisory/

Or LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-moussa-thirdway/

And if you need help to find the hire that will completely change your business, reach out over at https://www.thirdwayadvisory.com.au/

Hit follow wherever you're listening so you don't miss a single episode.

From the outside the business looked like it was booming ... but really he was $620,000 in debt and no one knew.

Jordan Gauder built Gen Physio from a one-man in-home physio service on the Gold Coast into a national allied health company, growing around 170% a year for three years to more than $10 million in revenue. He had a strong team and a model that was ahead of its market. But the climb came with a reckoning.

We talk about the bills he never knew he wasn't paying, the team that he needed around him, the $620,000 debt and why growing faster than his own skills nearly cost him everything he'd built.

If you're scaling fast and it feels like it might be getting away from you, listen to this one.

Follow so you don't miss the next.

You'll Hear:

0:00 A one-man physio service that became a national business

8:05 Telling his dad he was quitting a stable job to go it alone

17:21 How raw talent scaled the business, and why it became a trap

22:09 Too busy to cope: the fear of turning clients away

34:39 The NDIS rollout that poured rocket fuel on the business

36:38 Ordering a $200k Range Rover with money that wasn't his

38:41 The one bill he didn't know he'd never been paying

48:51 Growing 170% a year, until the year it stopped

64:25 The hard calls: cutting roles he'd hired for growth that never came

69:12 Finding a $620,000 tax debt

72:02 Why the worst point became the best thing that happened

This episode touches on burnout, bereavement and pressure at home. If it resonates, support is available in Australia through Lifeline on 13 11 14 or Beyond Blue at beyondblue.org.au.

Connect with Jordan over at https://www.linkedin.com/in/jordan-gauder-2b50016a/

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See behind the scenes over at https://www.instagram.com/danmoussa_thirdwayadvisory/

Or Linked In - https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-moussa-thirdway/

And if you need help to find the hire that will completely change your business reach out over at https://www.thirdwayadvisory.com.au/

Hit follow wherever you're listening so you don't miss a single episode.

Every founder gets tested. Most don't get tested by the first client they ever land.

David Ahearne runs Across the Ocean, a freight forwarding and customs business that moves shipments between factories and warehouses all over the world, from China, the UAE and the US into Australia, and exports Australian minerals across Southeast Asia. Eighteen years in, it's a serious operation with a team, a strong industry reputation, and the kind of blue-chip commercial accounts most forwarders spend careers chasing. He built all of it starting from nothing: no job, no contacts, and $500 he had to borrow for a website.

And the road there is a run of people coming at him from all sides. A first client who rang up threatening to sue him before they'd ever met, a call that somehow became the relationship that got the whole thing off the ground. A business partner whose $5,000 buy-in cost $120,000 to undo. A software venture where his partners sabotaged his website and abused his staff while a rival on the other side of the world spread lies about him through the industry. In this episode he's honest about the loneliness of it, the times his back was fully against the wall, and why he kept choosing to come out swinging.

If you're building something and feel like you're getting hit from every direction, this is the one.

Follow so you don't miss the next.

You’ll hear:

0:00 $500 he didn't have, borrowed for a website

16:13 One apartment, no cash, and a Google ad that started it all

19:23 His first ever client rang to threaten a lawsuit

22:42 How the man who threatened to sue him made the business

25:29 Turning up to close the deal in a $500 car that barely ran

31:17 The handshake that cost him $120,000 to undo

37:27 The one lesson he paid six figures to learn

43:21 A side venture that looked like the big one

51:15 Pitching to 250 rivals with his own reputation on the line52:31 When his own partners started sabotaging him

59:10 Attacked on two fronts at once, by people he'd helped

1:00:28 Fight or die: the moment he decided to swing back

1:08:00 The two things he'd tell any founder starting out

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Connect with David - https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-aherne-608b7153/

See behind the scenes over at https://www.instagram.com/danmoussa_thirdwayadvisory/

Or Linked In - https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-moussa-thirdway/

And if you need help to find the hire that will completely change your business reach out over at https://www.thirdwayadvisory.com.au/

Hit follow wherever you're listening so you don't miss a single episode

Don landed in Australia with $1,500 ... cleaning public toilets at 3:30am before uni and stacking shelves at night, sending money home for his brother's medical bills.

He built that into Clean Kings, a national cleaning company with 650 staff, and four more businesses under his venture studio Six Silo.

But 2020 took almost all of it at once COVID wiped out 70% of his revenue overnight, his fashion label was sinking, his marriage was falling apart across a closed border, and he lost his dog.

In this episode he's open about the times that followed, the pressure to just quit and get a job, the trip to Peru that reset his sense of purpose, and the one thing every founder does that outsiders never see. He also explains the Pablo Escobar insight that let him scale Clean Kings.

If you're building something and everything's hitting at once, this episode changes everything.

You'll hear:

0:00 Five companies, and the grind nobody sees behind them
4:04 $1,500, public toilets at 3:30am, and money sent home
7:47 The moment he understood why his dad left to work in Saudi
9:19 How a personality test at Bunnings sparked Clean Kings
13:04 The Pablo Escobar model he used to scale the business
15:28 2020: 70% of revenue gone overnight
21:53 His marriage unravelling across a closed border
27:50 The separation, the depression, and the man in the mirror
30:03 Peru, and the reset that gave him his purpose
43:00 Why he'd break the whole thing and rebuild it if he had to
53:44 Change, confidence, clarity: the three Cs he lives by

This episode discusses depression and personal loss. If it resonates, support is available in Australia through Lifeline on 13 11 14 or Beyond Blue at beyondblue.org.au.

Connect with Don - https://www.linkedin.com/in/donhettofficial/

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See behind the scenes over at https://www.instagram.com/danmoussa_thirdwayadvisory/

Or Linked In - https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-moussa-thirdway/

And if you need help to find the hire that will completely change your business reach out over at https://www.thirdwayadvisory.com.au/

Hit follow wherever you're listening so you don't miss a single episode.