Eric and Eliot welcome their SAIS colleague Michael Mandelbaum to talk about his recent book, The Four Ages of American Foreign Policy. Among other topics, they discuss realism and idealism in U.S. policy, the historical origins of American policymakers’ traditional reliance on the economic instruments of national power, the prospects for U.S. policy towards Russia-Ukraine, China, and Iran, baseball, and mystery fiction.

Shield of the Republic is a Bulwark podcast co-sponsored by the Miller Center of Public Affairs at the University of Virginia. Email us with your feedback at [email protected].

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