The Game & Word Podcast

Podcaster, gamer, mystic, and dream interpreter Benjamin the Dream Wizard talks to Game & Word about dream interpretation, dream magic, St. Carl Gustav Jung (z"l), and dreamy video games!

Subscribe to Game & Word for free gaming deep dives, delivered to your inbox every week, AND to enter our signed book giveaway: https://gameandword.substack.com

References:

Our Guest: Benjamin the Dream Wizard

-Socials:

Twitter: @WizardBenjamin

Instagram: @benjaminthedreamwizard

Pinterest: @benjaminthedreamwizard

Facebook: BenjaminTheDreamWizard

Reddit: /r/TheDreamWizard

Discord Server: Benjamin the Dream Wizard

Website: https://benjaminthedreamwizard.com

-Podcasts:

Dreamscapes [Audio | YouTube]

What Dreams May Come [YouTube]

Augury, Bibliomancy & Chaos [YouTube]

Incantus Phylacterium [YouTube]

Dream Wizard Plays [YouTube]

-Historical Dream Literature: Augury, Bibliomancy & Chaos [Audiobooks]

[[NOTE: Contains affiliate links]]

The Court of Curiosity [Amazon]

The Mystery of Dreams [Amazon]

Oneirochronologia: Volume I [Amazon]

Oneirochronologia: Volume II [Amazon]

Oneirochronologia: Volume III [Amazon]

Studies in Dreams [Amazon]

Tyrion’s Dreams & Visions [Amazon]

Literature & Curiosity of Dreams: Volume I [Amazon]

Literature & Curiosity of Dreams: Volume II [Amazon]

The Witches’ Dream Book [Amazon]

The Psychology of Dreams [Amazon]

The Philosophy of Sleep [Amazon]

Dream Psychology [Amazon]

Dreams in Homer & Greek Tragedy [Amazon]

The World of Dreams [Amazon]

Dreams & Their Meanings [Amazon]

--

Video Games Referenced:

The Persona series

Soma

Remember Me?

Little Nightmares

The Witcher

Dying Light

Fallout: New Vegas

Dragon’s Dogma: Darker Risen

Nier Automata

Age of Empires II: Age of Kings (Remastered)

Yume Nikki

Stray

Theme Music Attribution:

“Simply Me” by Deoxys Beats | https://soundcloud.com/deoxysbeats1Music promoted by https://www.free-stock-music.com Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 Unportedhttps://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/deed.en_US

J.V. Hilliard—author of the bestselling Warminster saga, and an avid gamer—talks to Game & Word about magic's ubiquity in the fantasy genre, tips on writing magic for budding fantasy writers, and magic's inexorable link to creativity.

Subscribe to Game & Word for free gaming deep dives, delivered to your inbox every week, AND to enter our signed book giveaway: https://gameandword.substack.com

References:

Our Guest: J.V. Hilliard, Author of the Warminster Saga (@JVHilliardBooks on Twitter)

Book 1: "The Last Keeper": https://amzn.to/3m2am69

Book 2: "Vorodin's Lair": https://amzn.to/3ZjPd5R

Tabletop Games Referenced:

Dungeons & Dragons (5th Edition)

Video Games Referenced:

D&D's Ravenloft Series

Diablo

Theme Music Attribution:

“Simply Me” by Deoxys Beats | https://soundcloud.com/deoxysbeats1Music promoted by https://www.free-stock-music.com Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 Unportedhttps://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/deed.en_US

Eric Holden—Comedian, Full-Time Game Master, and Co-Host of The Goblin's Corner Podcast—talks to Game & Word about Tabletop RPGs, storytelling in video games, and how D&D taught him the meaning of life, the universe, and everything (besides "42").

Subscribe to Game & Word for free gaming deep dives, delivered to your inbox every week: https://gameandword.substack.com

LISTEN to Game & Word's appearance on The Cure is Conversation: [LINK]

References:

Our Guest: Eric Holden, Co-Host of The Goblins Corner (https://goblinscorner.com or @GoblinsCorner on Twitter)

Tabletop Games Referenced:

Dungeons & Dragons (5th Edition)

10 Candles

World of Darkness

Deadlands

Munchkin

Fluxx

Troika

Starfinder

Forgotten Waters

King of Tokyo

Video Games Referenced:

Skyrim

Borderlands

Pistol Whip

Fallout

The Witcher

Baldur’s Gate

Neverwinter Nights

Chrono Trigger

Planescape Torment

Theme Music Attribution:

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Industry veteran Jennifer Allaway, currently a Senior Game Writer at Monolith Productions, talks to Game & Word about narrative design, what makes for good branching narratives, and how to break into the game industry.

Subscribe to Game & Word for free gaming deep dives, delivered to your inbox every week: https://gameandword.substack.com

Our Guest: Jennifer Allaway (Twitter: @allawayj)

Games Referenced:

Banner Saga

Disco Elysium

Shardlight

Unavowed

2064 Read Only Memories

Choices: Stories You Play

Wonder Woman

Theme Music Attribution:

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The Game & Word Podcast, Volume 3, Episode 3: Lost in a Good Game Study (ft. Dr. Pete Etchells)

Table of Contents

* Introduction

* Podcast References

* Transcript

* Footnotes

NOTE: Gmail users, you might see a truncated version of this message. If this happens to you, just click the “View entire message” link next to where it says “[Message clipped]” to read the rest.

Introduction

Hello again, psychonauts!

This episode of The Game & Word Podcast, is going to wrap up Volume 3, so I’ve saved the best for last, so to speak.

Our guest this week, Dr. Pete Etchells, is a video game psychology researcher, and author of Lost in a Good Game, which is a must-read for anyone wanting to dive deeper into this fascinating field.

In this episode, we talk about the challenges facing psychological research into video games, some of the psychological benefits of games that get lost in media coverage, and how to approach science news more critically—and in doing so, better arm yourself against falling for sensationalistic headlines and moral panics about video games.

Enjoy, and catch you all on the flip side!

~Jay

Scheduling Reminder!

As a reminder, Game & Word will pause publishing free content for 3-4 weeks, starting today, in order to give me more time to line up Volume 4. However, bonus subscribers will continue to receive content throughout this period. so… you might want to upgrade your subscription, if you haven’t already:

If you enjoy the newsletter but aren’t ready to commit to a paid subscription, consider buying me a cup of coffee instead. Just $5 will fuel one full night of writing. Just click the image below ☕️:

Still Seeking Playtesters!

I’m also still looking for playtesters to help test my upcoming steampunk tavern simulator. My team and I are working hard to release the game’s alpha build by Thursday. If you’d like to test the game—your feedback will greatly help us as we continue building—click the button below to join our Discord server and be the first to get access to the alpha (link expires on Thursday, so hurry!):

Nothing else to announce on my end… yet. Stay tuned for more info on Volume 4, and upcoming changes to how Game & Word’s content (both free and paid) is structured.

Podcast References

Books

* Lost in a Good Game, by Dr. Pete Etchells

Games

* Spiritfarer

* Hellblade: Senua’s Sacrifice

Extras

* Wellcome Trust

Theme Music Attribution

Simply Me by Deoxys Beats | https://soundcloud.com/deoxysbeats1Music promoted by https://www.free-stock-music.comCreative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 Unportedhttps://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/deed.en_US

Transcript

NOTE: This transcript has been lightly edited for clarity.

INTRO: Hello, hello, hello, everyone! And welcome to The Game & Word Podcast. I'm your host, Jay Rooney, as usual. And I've got an amazing guest for you this week: Dr. Pete Etchells. Dr. Etchells is a professor of psychology at Bath Spa University, in the UK, and the author of Lost in a Good Game, which is an excellent primer on the fascinating field of video game psychology. 

Today, we deep dive into the nature of psychological research into video games, and why answers to questions like "are loot boxes addictive?" or "do video games increase aggression?" are never as clear cut as we'd like them to be. 

We also talk about some recent examples of games serving as vehicles for enabling a better understanding of not just certain mental illnesses, but even basic challenges of the mind, like processing grief. Finally, we end with some solid practical advice on how to tune out sensationalistic and misleading headlines on video games studies, and figure out what all the new psychological research coming out is actually saying. 

It's quite an illuminating conversation, and I'm thrilled to share it with you all today. So go ahead, grab your cup of Joe or your cup of tea, put your earbuds on or turn on your speakers, and hit that play button. I'll be back after we're done to wrap things up. 

Until then, enjoy Game & word's interview with Dr. Pete Etchells on video game psychology research. See you on the other side! 

Game & Word: Good afternoon, everyone. And welcome to another special edition of The Game and Word Podcast. Today, I have with me dialing in, live from the UK, Dr. Pete Etchells, author of Lost in a Good Game, which is one of the big books that informed a lot of my research on this last series I've been writing for this for the past couple of months.

Pete, you wanna introduce yourself?

Pete Etchells: That was a wonderful introduction. So I don't think there's much more to say there, but yeah, I'm Pete Etchells, I'm a professor of psychology and science communication at Bath Spa University in the UK, so I do research on lots of things, but all things, digital technology, really. So I'm interested in the behavioral and mental well-being effects of video games and playing them, things like that.

I'm also interested in screen time more generally. So how does digital technology affect us in good and bad ways? So yeah, all sorts of stuff like that. Oh yeah. Wrote a book. You've already said that.

Game & Word: And how do video games affect us and how do they not?

Pete Etchells: It's Is actually a really interesting question. So in so far as the answer is they affect us in lots of different ways, but in not massive ways. So if you're approaching that question in the sense of, "do video games impact on our mental health or do they make us more aggressive or do they make us smarter? Do brain training games make us smarter?" Things like that. The answer to all of those sorts of questions is generally "no." They have a bit of an impact, but not that much. And certainly not in such a ways that's worth worrying or considering about, games will make you a little bit annoyed or a little bit happy for a little bit of time when you're playing them.

But in terms of long-term differences, there's not much going on. Brain training games don't work, they don't make you smarter. So that's no good either. But in terms of both over positive and negative effects, there's not much of a swing, either way. I think if you approach that. So the other part of that was that they affect us in lots of different ways.

So I think from a kind of cultural perspective, I think they have quite a powerful impact. So what games do allow you to do is to explore I, I use this term in the book and I hate it. It's really rubbish term, but I'm gonna say anyway, I'll try and qualify it. They allow us to explore what it means to be human, which is a it's just a bit fiery, I think.

But I think what I mean by that is that because video games are unique amongst entertainment media, in the sense that they place you as the active agent in the thing that you're doing, rather than a passive watcher, they offer you the possibility of becoming fully immersed in this experience that you're having and taking on the role of the character that you're playing, the avatar that you are, and therefore feeling things as if you were them.

So video games allow you to explore things like grief or what it feels like to lose somebody, realize how it feels to be betrayed by somebody. It allows you to explore your moral compass as well. There's some great games that have come out recently where they're choice games, basically.

But in the process of making those choices, you can be different versions of yourself. We always like to think that in a certain situation, this is how we would react. But you only really find out what you're gonna do in that situation when it actually happens to you. Video games, give you a chance to look at a version of what you might do in tha…

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The Game & Word Podcast, Volume 3, Episode 2: Final Fantasy, Real Individuation (ft. Eve)

Table of Contents

* Introduction

* Podcast References

* Transcript

* Footnotes

NOTE: Gmail users, you might see a truncated version of this message. If this happens to you, just click the “View entire message” link next to where it says “[Message clipped]” to read the rest.

Introduction

Hello again, psychonauts!

For this episode of The Game & Word Podcast, we’re doing something a little different.

Our guest today, Eve, is not an academic, doesn’t have a Ph.D., isn’t a content creator, and is not on social media—but they are a longtime friend of the newsletter, as well as someone with a ton of personal experience with this week’s games and topics—both as a lifelong geek and a member of the LGBT community (oh, and they’re also a paid subscriber… hint, hint).

And we had one of the most profound conversations I’ve had the honor of hosting on this newsletter.

We chatted about facing one’s Shadows and the process of individuation, especially as shown in Final Fantasy VII (FF7) and—to a lesser extent—The Legend of Zelda series. We also talked about our own experiences and our own journeys of individuation—as well as the collective process of individuation currently unfolding in the COVID era.

Hope you enjoy our chat. Happy Pride, everyone!

~Jay

PS—This podcast goes into some depth on FF7. Before listening, I highly recommend brushing up on some background information by reading the section on FF7 in last week’s issue:

Or instead, you could spend 50 hours playing FF7 to completion—and then another ~10 hours reading and watching one plot analysis and summary after another in the vain hope of making sense of the narrative labyrinth you just emerged from. The choice is yours.

(And you thought Game & Word was long!)

It’s Time to Subscribe!

Game & Word is a reader-supported publication. To support my work, the best thing you can do is subscribe.

You can subscribe for free, and get each new issue and podcast episode delivered straight to your inbox (or the Substack iOS app) every Sunday.

Or, if you want to directly contribute to Game & Word’s production, and keep it free and accessible to all, upgrade to a paid subscription—and gain access to exclusive bonus content as well!

If you enjoy the newsletter but aren’t ready to commit to a paid subscription, consider buying me a cup of coffee instead. Just $5 will fuel one full night of writing. Just click the image below ☕️:

Podcast References

Books

* The Psychology of Final Fantasy, edited by Anthony M. Bean, Ph.D.

* The Lifestream of Identity Development, Memories, and the Final Fantasy Franchise, by Ryan Kelly

Games

* Final Fantasy:

* Final Fantasy VII

* Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children

* Final Fantasy VII: Crisis Core

* The Legend of Zelda:

* Zelda II: The Adventure of Link

* The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time

* The Legend of Zelda: Majora’s Mask

Extras

Our Guest: Eve

* Email: [email protected]

Newsletter: Nintendo Switch Weekly (NSW)

* Newsletter

* Twitter (NSW)

* Twitter (Chris Brandrick)

* Discord (Request an invite from Chris after subscribing to NSW!)

Video Podcast: Critical Role

* Homepage

* YouTube

* Twitter (Critical Role)

* Twitter (Travis Willingham)

Theme Music Attribution

Simply Me by Deoxys Beats | https://soundcloud.com/deoxysbeats1Music promoted by https://www.free-stock-music.comCreative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 3.0 Unportedhttps://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/deed.en_US

Transcript

NOTE: This transcript has been lightly edited for clarity.

Game & Word: Good morning, everyone. Welcome to another episode of The Game & Word Podcast, and Happy Pride! I'm your host, Jay Rooney, as usual. And today I've got a wonderful guest for you today: Eve.

That's right, "Eve." Now Eve is quite a different guest than usual. Eve is not an academic, doesn't have a Ph.D., isn't a content creator, and stays far away from social media. They're simply a good friend of the newsletter and one that happens to have extensive personal experience with the games and the topics that we're going to discuss today—as an avid geek, gamer, and fellow weirdo, and as a member of the LGBT community.

As a result, my conversation with Eve was one of the most profound and insightful that I've had with any guests since starting this publication… six months ago. Wow, time flies. Anyway, I hope you have as much fun listening to our talk as we did recording it.

Before we begin, though, I do want to caution you.

We will be delving fairly deep into some of the story and lore of Final Fantasy 7. So if you've ever played Final Fantasy 7 or just don't remember it, then I highly recommend reading Issue 3.5 of Game & Word, which on the date of this episode's broadcast will be last week's issue.

You'll find a fairly condensed explanation of the relevant plot elements that we're going to discuss as well as links to several different plot summary and analysis videos. In case you just wanna dive in deeper. This way, you'll be better able to follow our conversation without feeling lost, even if you've never played the game before, or any game before.

Of course, you could also play Final Fantasy 7, which I do recommend if you're into Japanese role playing games, or JRPGs for short. But since completing the game takes at least 50 hours, and that's if you kinda hustle through it, and fully grasping the stories, twists, layers, and nuances is gonna take multiple play throughs, or a comparable amount of time, perusing analysis, videos, and fan discussions, trying to parse together just what the hell kind of story you just experienced.

Which if that's cool with you, awesome! But reading last week's issue is definitely much quicker.

Imagine that. There are things longer than Game & Word, after all!

In any case, once you're ready, grab your cup of Joe or your cup of tea, put your earbuds on lay down on your couch, like you would in an old-timey psychiatrists office, and press the play button.

I'll be back after we're done to wrap things up. Until then, enjoy Game & Word's interview with Eve on Final Fantasy 7 and individuation. See you on the other side!

Interview

Game & Word: Thank you for joining me today, Eve. Do you want to introduce yourself?

Eve: Hi! I'm Eve, I'm the guest for this episode. I am a LGBT individual. So, Happy Pride to all my fellow queer folks out there! I'm a gender queer man, or non-binary man. I use any pronouns. And today we're gonna be talking about some topics related to individuation and the sense of self and the masks that we wear as individuals. We're gonna be focusing on two specific sets of video games or franchises: Final Fantasy 7 specifically, and the Zelda franchise, with a focus on Majora's Mask and some of the games where Link has to fight a Dark Link version of himself.

I played Final Fantasy 7 when I was 14 and a freshman in high school. So it was around 2001 or 2002. And I revisited some parts of Final Fantasy 7, so that I can have a fresh memory for this recording. And I have also played a whole bunch of Zelda games. And then I've watched playthroughs of some of the ones that I haven't played.

Game & Word: All right. So Eve, we are talking about a very particular scene in Final Fantasy 7, but of course, we'll be expanding a bit beyond that.

We're looking at Cloud's process of, by the way, I should also say this: spoiler alert! This video is one massive spoiler for Final Fantasy 7 and a few Zelda games. So if you don't want this game spoiled for you, feel free to stop the video.

Eve: You either need to go play, yeah, the 50 hours of that game or do what I did to refresh my memory right before this, and go watch someone's 40 minute Final Fantasy …

⚠️💬📢 PLEASE NOTE 📢💬⚠️

This is an early access podcast episode; paid subscribers can listen to it right away, and anyone can listen to it two weeks after the publication date. So this episode will open up on June 1, 2022. If you want to listen to it sooner, upgrade your subscription today.

Table of Contents

* Introduction

* Podcast References

* Transcript

* Footnotes

Introduction

Hello, psychonauts!

This week, I sit down with Jared Hansen, author of The Symbolism of Zelda: A Textual Analysis of Majora’s Mask (the same book I’ve listed under “Further Reading” throughout this volume), to talk about Zelda, symbolism, and game scholarship.

If I sound a little tired or weird, apologies in advance. I actually had to re-record this episode (and a few others), because apparently, nobody’s figured out how to make a user-friendly, reasonably priced, and powerful stable decent functional screen recording tool yet... 😞 So I might sound a little out of it, mostly because I was a little out of it.

(Relatedly, this is also why I’m delivering this to you today instead of last week as scheduled.)

Still, I hope you enjoy the conversation! As usual, you can find this episode’s podcast references, footnotes, and full transcript below.

See you next week!

~Jay

PS—If you need a refresher on Majora’s Mask before diving in, here are the relevant articles:

A Quick Note for Our Listeners

Starting with this episode, comments on all future Game & Word Podcast episodes are only available to paid subscribers. This particular episode is also early access, which means paid subscribers can listen to it two weeks before I unlock it to the public.

Not paid? Want in on these perks? There’s an easy fix for that… ⬇️⬇️⬇️

Game & Word is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

PS—If you enjoy the newsletter, but aren’t ready to commit to a paid subscription, consider buying me a cup of coffee. Just $5 will fuel one full night of writing. Just click the image below ☕️:

Podcast References

Books

* The Symbolism of Zelda: A Textual Analysis of Majora’s Mask by Jared Hansen

* The Symbolism of Zelda: A Textual Analysis of The Wind Waker by Jared Hansen

Games

* The Legend of Zelda [Official Site]

* The Legend of Zelda: Majora’s Mask

* The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker

Extras

* Jared Hansen

* Blog (Hyrule University)

* Twitter

Transcript

NOTE: This transcript has been lightly edited for clarity.

Game & Word: Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to another bonus audio edition of Game & Word. Here, with me today, I have Jared Hansen: a Ph.D. candidate at the University of Oregon and author of [The Symbolism of Zelda: A Textual Analysis of Majora’s Mask], one of the sources for our recent two-parter on Majora's Mask. Thank you, Jared, for joining me today.

Anything you want to tell my listeners that I haven't covered? 

Jared Hansen: Sure. Like you said, I'm a Ph.D. candidate. I've been writing my dissertation on video games. And I've got two Zelda books out. You mentioned one of them, the other one is on The Wind Waker.

And I'm excited to join you on this podcast to talk about it. 

Game & Word: Yeah, thanks for coming on! Tell us a bit about your dissertation. What are you writing it on? 

Jared Hansen: I'm really fascinated with video game nostalgia in all of its forms. And so I'm actually studying a community of players who are playing an older video game, Star Wars Galaxies, and analyzing why they're keeping this RPG running.

Since the official servers shut down in 2011, they've been hosting their own private server since then. Because they don't want this experience to die. And it's just been really fascinating to be with these players in a game that's very dated as far as graphics go, but it's still fun and they love it.

Game & Word: And how did you come to start studying video games in an academic setting? 

Jared Hansen: In my master's program, I was trying really hard to find a topic. And it was actually Zelda that got me inspired, because I was reading some academic literature on other things, and tried to find what's been written about Zelda. Which is one of my favorite series in video games. I found out no one was really writing about it, so I was like, “Hey, I can make my stamp. I can fill this hole." And that's when I started my master's thesis on Zelda.

And now, my dissertation is a different topic, but [I’m] still studying video games.

Game & Word: So about your books. As we just mentioned, you have two out so far: one on Majora's Mask and one on Wind Waker. What made you choose those two games in particular? 

Jared Hansen: These games, along with Ocarina of Time, represent my “peak” involvement, I guess you could say, in Zelda. That's when I was a kid growing up with them, and those are the three games that really resonated with me during that formative time.

I think with a lot of people, that's how Zelda is for them. Their favorite game is the game that they played the most as a kid. 

Game & Word: And what really resonated with you?

Jared Hansen: As a kid, I think it was the action-adventure genre. Because it's very engaging. It involves some skill, but it's still a skill that you can master, even at that age. As opposed to something like a racing game which takes a lot more hand-eye coordination, or RPGs which sometimes aren't quite as interactive.

And so, I really loved these games for that sense of adventure. And at the same time, that sense of accomplishment, when you complete a dungeon. It's fun and rewarding. 

Game & Word: Absolutely. And how about in terms of the narrative or themes? 

Jared Hansen: There's a joke about the Zelda formula, as far as [gameplay] goes, but it also applies to their storylines. Eventually, the series is almost like a fairytale that just keeps getting repeated over the generations.

But for me, it's almost comforting. To know that at the end of the day, there's going to be a Princess Zelda. There's going to be a hero Link and there's going to be a villain Ganon or Ganondorf.

And, yeah, I wouldn't mind if they swap out some villains occasionally, that's fine too. But just as long as we have some recurring myths, tales, and stories that you can rely on and come back to. 

Game & Word: Yeah. That does make Majora's Mask an interesting case because It's just so different than any of the other Zelda games, in so many ways. It's even up there with Breath of the Wild, just as far as how different it is while still being recognizably Zelda.

I'm curious to know your thoughts as to your first time playing it. And how your reaction to it was. 

Jared Hansen: Yeah. It had a lot of hype when I was a kid, just because the three-day mechanic was so revolutionary. I know there are a lot of people, myself included, I was like, “how can you finish a game in three days?” It just didn't make any sense.

But obviously, after playing it, it's "oh, it's just a matter of rewinding time over and over." And so that mechanic weaves itself into the narrative, and it's just fun. I guess at a subconscious level, it's similar to playing any video game, really.

The whole concept of video game lives, of game overs? Just this idea of, "okay, let's restart, let's reset, let's wind things back and try it again a second time." And that's something that you find in all kinds of video games. I think it's a universal experience that we all enjoy and love.

And Majora's Mask, on the other hand, just puts that in the forefront and reminds you, "Hey, you have this ticking clock, and if you don't get everything done, then it's going to be undone."

That was a little frustrating, but also rewarding, as a kid. And even now, it's fun knowing that throughout the game, my back is up against the wall. 

Game & Word: And of course mechanically, it's very different. And in a way that really, really holds up remarkably well, I would add. And thematically, very different, too. Much darker and somber and kind of mature in a way.

What do you think are the main…

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Table of Contents

* Introduction

* Newsletter Updates

* Podcast References

* Transcript

* Footnotes

Introduction

Ahoy, me hearties!

Wow, guess that’s the last time I’ll open with that in a while :-(

Alas, all good things must eventually come to an end, including this series. This bonus podcast will be Volume 2’s last issue, which means our exploration of pirates and video games ends here. For the time being, at least.

And while I’m excited for Volume 3, I can’t help but feel a little melancholic while wrapping up this topic. Fortunately, we’ve got a great guest and an awesome conversation for you this week. So, let’s end our pirating expedition with a BANG! from the cannons and another tankard of grog. YARRRRR!!!

Also, if you want a refresher on the entirety of Game & Word: Volume 2 before you listen, here’s the complete series: Issue 1 ● Issue 2 ● Issue 3 ● Bonus 1 ● Issue 4 ● Issue 5 ● Issue 6 ● Issue 7 ● Issue 8

You can find this week’s podcast references, footnotes, full transcript, and a couple of big updates after the updates section. See you next week!

~Jay

Game & Word is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

PS—If you really enjoy this newsletter, but aren’t ready to commit to a paid subscription, consider buying me a cup of coffee. Just $5 will fuel one full night of writing. Just click the image below ☕️:

Newsletter Updates

Our guest this week, Dr. Anthony Bean, has set aside two signed copies of his books (listed below), which Game & Word will give away to two lucky subscribers! For more details, be sure to read next week’s newsletter, when the giveaway officially launches.

Thank you for reading Game & Word. This post is public so feel free to share it.

Podcast References

Books

REMEMBER: Game & Word will be giving away one signed copy each of The Psychology of Zelda and The Psychology of Final Fantasy. More details next week! If you’re the impatient type, you can purchase the book

* The Psychology of Zelda, edited by Anthony M. Bean, Ph.D.

* The Psychology of Final Fantasy, edited by Anthony M. Bean, Ph.D.

* The Psychology of Pokémon, edited by Anthony M. Bean, Ph.D. [PRE-ORDER]

Games

* Sea of Thieves

* World of Warcraft

* Pokémon Legends: Arceus

Extras

* Geek Therapeutics

* Web

* Facebook

* Twitter

* Instagram

* Dr. Anthony Bean

* Email 1

* Email 2

* Twitter

Transcript

NOTE: This transcript has been lightly edited for clarity.

Game & Word: Hi everyone, Jay here. Just wanted to let you know that at one point during the interview, we talk about the IGD-9 form; its correct name is the IGDSF-10. Just FYI.

[BLEEP]

Game & Word: Hello everyone. And welcome to another bonus edition of Game & Word. I have with me right now, Dr. Anthony Bean: the gamer psychologist, in a nutshell.

Anthony Bean: Anybody—like a gamer, geek, everything. Certified Geek Therapist. We run Geek Therapeutics, where we train people on how to work with video games. We actually have a really cool, “Problematic Gaming” course coming out. It's probably gonna be 12 to 15 CEs [Continuing Education Credits], that is gonna really hit it more from the idea of “gaming is a healthy mechanism, but we just need to work on the mental health symptoms.”

Game & Word: So when you say “problematic,” do you mean problems that are external to gaming, or that involve the act of gaming itself? Or is [gaming] therapeutic?

Anthony Bean: It's kinda all of it. So, what we know basically about the World Health Organization's coming out with their “gaming disorder” [classification], I would say a good 70-80% of therapists are out there being like, “Yeah, we see this as a problem, but we don't see it as the same problem as what the World Health Organization’s doing."

The other 20% are... not great clinicians, is what I would say. Just because it's based in not a great narrative and really faulty research. But what we're doing, is we're taking what is the good research—things that have double-blind studies, things that are verified with good actual psychometrics, not this thing that's "I gave them the IGD-9 short form [IGDSF-10] and, look at this, they have all of these symptoms!" And it's "yeah, but the IGD-9 or Short Form SF [IGDSF-10] has been disproven multiple times." Wo we basically take all the good research, we teach people about everything from neurotransmitters to beginning behaviors, to a whole bunch of other stuff. 

So, one of the big things that always comes into play is, “Well, games are just releasing all this dopamine" type stuff. Yes, games release 170% more dopamine than other stuff in life. But guess what? Cocaine's 10,000%. Cheese is 300[%]. Some foods are higher than that, too. If you're going to be taking that little small statistic, let's give it some breathing room and let's show what other types of dopamine receptors come in. When you go and eat a piece of pizza, and you've higher dopamine dopaminergic information happening in your brain, and you're like "gaming's the problem,” you're a little wrong. 

So, that's what the whole thing is. We're taking it, and then we're gonna hit it from five different viewpoints of “how do we treat problematic gaming?” Cause we don't treat it as gaming addiction. We treat it as a union approach, as a social construct, family approach, behavioral for ones that get really difficult, a mindfulness one, and then also a one based on trauma, because we've all experienced some trauma and we've seen a lot of things happen that way. 

Game & Word: Wow. That’s…

Anthony Bean: It's a lot! 

Game & Word: No, it's good! It's good work. It's important work. Certainly, I as a gamer, I'm glad that you're out there basically advocating for us within the mental health community. That's very important work. So thank you for doing it. 

Anthony Bean: Absolutely. We like what we're doing, and we like to making sure that we spend the correct amount of time going on with it. 

Game & Word: And speaking of time going on with games… this interview is part of a series that I'm doing on pirates, and specifically video games about pirates. And the one that I want to connect this particular interview to is Sea of Thieves. Have you ever played Sea of Thieves? 

Anthony Bean: I have a little bit, more of my clients have. And they talk about how they just actually act like pirates and wait behind rocks until someone comes by with the quest’s mega treasure and steal it.

And they're like, we really feel like, we're being a-holes and I was like, “You're playing the game the way it was meant to be played!" If someone is a pirate, but they're finishing a quest, it's your duty to go and take it, take that back from them.

Game & Word: Absolutely, like I was playing and I was matched up with some random dude.

I could tell just by his title and everything, he out leveled me by at least a factor of 10. But whatever, we outfit the ship, we get our provisions, just whatever, we set sail, we chart a course. Just to kill some time, I take out my Hurdy-Gurdy and start playing a shanty, and this dude just throws a blunderbomb and he knocks me overboard!

Anthony Bean: And you’re like, “Oh, man!”

Game & Word: But at the same time, I was like, “That's funny, in a sitcommy way.” Like imagining a pirate getting thrown overboard, just for being a terrible musician.

But that brings me to what I wanted to talk about: inhabiting this archetype of the pirate. Why is it so enduring and so appealing? 

Anthony Bean: It really is because we don't have a chance to actually act like that anymore.

Obviously, we have Somali pirates and things like that. But there are quite a few instances [in games] where we get a chance to live and do something that we don't, that doesn't exist in this world anymore. So like these types of swashbuckling pirates—you could take this video game, you can take World of Warcr…

Table of Contents

* Introduction

* Newsletter Updates

* Podcast References

* Transcript

* Footnotes

Introduction

Ahoy, me hearties!

Ok, this bonus issue isn’t as “piratey” as the last one, but it’s still one hell of a haul for the S.S. Game & Word, and I tell you why!

This week, I have another audio interview for you, recorded live at GDC 2022! I spoke with Chris Smith, Metanomic’s chief economist, about how video game economies work. That’s right, “game economist” is a real job. And, as it turns out, quite a fascinating one!

Now, before we begin, I must apologize in advance for the audio. I edited out all the distracting conference background noise, but as a result, parts of our conversation might sound a little stilted. It shouldn’t be too distracting, but if it is, please accept my sincerest apologies. Also, thank you for bearing with me as I slowly get the hang of this whole podcasting thing.

Also, if you want a refresher on Game & Word’s current volume before you listen, here’s the full series on pirates so far: Issue 1 ● Issue 2 ● Issue 3 ● Bonus 1 ● Issue 4 ● Issue 5 ● Issue 6 ● Issue 7

You can find this week’s podcast references, footnotes, full transcript, and a couple of big updates after the updates section. See you next week!

~Jay

Thanks for reading Game & Word! Subscribe for free to receive new posts and support my work.

PS—If you really enjoy this newsletter, consider buying me a cup of coffee. Just $5 will fuel one full night of gaming writing. Just click the image below ☕️:

Newsletter Updates

Ok, I’ve got a couple of updates. I’ll start with the biggie: I’m back from GDC (Game Developers Conference)! This means Game & Word will resume its normal publishing schedule, starting now.

Oh, and the conference was a blast! In fact, I have a message for all my new subscribers from GDC:

Welcome to Game & Word!

I hope you enjoy the newsletter. Please feel free to reach out to me any time by replying to this post, dropping a comment, or emailing me at [email protected]—I love hearing from my readers!

That panel I moderated also went quite well! I haven’t located any video yet, but I did find a picture of a picture of me looking all moderator-like. And no, that wasn’t a typo. Behold:

Well… technically it’s a picture of a frame/screengrab, not another “picture,” per se. But you get the idea.

Anyway, moving on!

In other news, I wrote a guest post for Night Water, an excellent newsletter for the nocturnally-inclined among us, published by writer and veteran podcast producer Adam Cecil (Welcome to Night Vale, Milky Way Underground). Have you ever wondered why gamers seem to be natural insomniacs? Well, I think I’ve cracked the mystery:

So, what did you think? Did I nail it, or was I way off? I’d love to hear your thoughts:

Oh, and if you’re as much of a night owl as I am, I highly recommend subscribing to Night Water. And no, not because I wrote on there (ok, not just because I wrote there). It really is a great newsletter for the naturally nocturnally inclined:

Ok, that’s it for the updates! Podcast references, transcript, and footnotes are below.

Podcast References

Books

* Freakonomics by Steven D. Levitt and Stephen J. Dubner

* Predictably Irrational by Dan Ariely

* Papers and studies published by Ted Castronova

Games

* Minecraft

* Port Royale

* Tropico 6

* Civilization

Extras

* Follow Metanomic on:

* LinkedIn

* Twitter

* Follow Chris Smith on:

* LinkedIn

Transcript

NOTE: This transcript has been lightly edited for clarity.

Game & Word: Hello, everyone! And welcome to another bonus edition of Game and word recorded at GDC 2022 in San Francisco. Today I have with me, Chris Smith, chief economist at Metanomic, a company that automates economics and games. If you want to elaborate on that, Chris, go ahead. 

Chris Smith: Yeah. Thanks for having me. So, I'm Chris, I'm the chief economist at Metanomic. What we do is, we consider ourselves the first runtime autonomous economy engine. So what we specialize in is essentially trivializing the amount of time that the game designers spend designing their economy. We tried to take the boring stuff out of game design and handle all the calculations and stuff that they would need to do.

Game & Word: Do you know, on average, how [much time] the designer saves? 

Chris Smith: So it depends on the genre and the type of studio, obviously. If you're talking about a giant AAA studio you're potentially talking about, I would say two to three man-hours a day for 18 months. If you're talking about a smaller game, maybe an indie, you're probably still talking about three to four months of a game designer's time. So we like to think that we've cut out a lot of that. 

Game & Word: Gaming economists seem to be a pretty rare breed. I was stuck, I was really struggling to find a source that was knowledgeable in both areas for this piece. How did the path to your current position look like? 

Chris Smith: Yeah. My background is actually as a PhD in economics, originally. In my undergrad, I loved video games. So I was trying to study video game economies in an academic setting. And then I ended up going on to do a PhD and I started to study more hardcore economics topics like labor market discrimination, transportation, kind of “classic” econ topics. Well, transportation's not necessarily a classic econ topic… but because of my undergraduate work, I ended up having a guy, the CEO of Metanomic, Theo Priestley, reach out to me just randomly.

And he was like, “hey, do you want to come design a video game economy?” And I was like, oh, that sounds cool enough. So yeah, I'll do some consulting work. What it ended up becoming was Metanomic. We ended up designing on accident, a tool that could be used for any economy, not just a large MMORPG. So that's how I got here. I had all the training and, fortunately, the interest to perfectly fit [in] this type of position. 

Game & Word: And to what extent do game economies function, I guess for lack of a better term, like “IRL” economies? 

Chris Smith: So, that's a really good question. And I think it's going to become a more popular question to be answered in an academic setting.

I know, personally, prominent economists who are interested in studying digital economies, particularly video game economies. So, it obviously depends on the game. In terms of the fundamentals of economics, you think about classics, [the] Law of Supply and Demand. Those are all, we see all of those in these digital economies, which is interesting because we think of digital economies as this free-range, infinite scalability, you can do whatever you want, there's no limit. [But] there are limitations in these digital environments, and they replicate those that we see in the real world. And so that's why we see a similar economic phenomenon in video game environments [as] we would in real life. 

Game & Word: An example of that would be, I guess like what we'll call a “bubble.” How often do you see that? 

Chris Smith: So bubbles are very common. In the MMORPGs sometimes, though, they're driven by open information speculation. Where people know what's going on, people know why these bubbles are forming whereas in the real world, we don't have anywhere near as much information as we do in video games.

So it's hard for us to know whether something's a bubble or something is actually, that's the real value. That, to me, is one of the great, liberating things about digital economies: it’s the openness of information. There's no longer these hardcore asymmetries of information. So I know if I'm buying this bubble asset or something like that.

Game & Word: Yeah. And what extent do you think that affects the usefulness of looking at digital economies as a way to like better understand or even predict an IRL economy. 

Chris Smith: So that was actually one of the reasons I started studying video games when doing undergrad. One of the reasons I was interested was if we can find an environment that is controlled, that is experimental, that rep…

Ahoy, me hearties!

This week, I present to you a bonus interview with Matt McLaine: gamer, pirate historian, and an indispensable source for this whole pirate series. So grab a cuppa grog, have a seat, kick up your peg leg, turn your parrot’s volume up, and enjoy!

Oh, before you do: in parts of the recording, you might hear my daughter milling around in the background (clearly, she wants to be a gaming writer/podcaster as well!). Apologies in advance if you find her chirps distracting. If you find them cute, however—and there’s no reason you shouldn’t—then I apologize for nothing.

Also, if you want a refresher before you listen, here’s the full series on pirates so far: Part 1 ● Part 2 ● Part 3

References and transcript below the fold. See you next week!

~Jay

PS—As a reminder, Game & Word will now publish on Sundays instead of Mondays. If you have any thoughts on the change, feel free to let me know by replying to this email.

Thanks for reading Game & Word! Subscribe for free to receive new posts and support my work.

Podcast References

Books

* A Merry Life, and a Short One: Unhelpful Self-Help and Terrible Advice from the Golden Age of Piracy by Matt McLaine

* Piracy Papers: Primary Source Documents from the Golden Age of Piracy by Matt McLaine

* At the Point of a Cutlass: The Pirate Capture, Bold Escape, and Lonely Exile of Philip Ashton by Gregory Fleming

* Ashton’s Memorial

* Under the Black Flag by David Cordingly

* Pirates in Their Own Words by Ed Fox

* Villains of all Nations by Marcus Rediker

Games

* Sid Meier’s Pirates!

* Assassin’s Creed IV: Black Flag

* Sea of Thieves

* Pirate 101

* Risen II: Dark Waters

* Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire

TV Shows

* Black Sails

* Crossbones

Extras

* Follow Matt McLaine on:

* Twitch

* Twitter

* Amazon

* Reddit

* r/pirates

Transcript

NOTE: This interview and its transcript have been edited for length and clarity.

Game & Word: Hello everyone! Thank you for joining us for this bonus edition of Game & Word, featuring gamer and pirate historian, Matt McLaine. Matt, do you want to say a few words?

Matt McLaine: Welcome aboard! I'm glad to be a part of Game & Word. This has been a fascinating journey. I can't wait to dive into pirate history, and how video games treat that history, and how they weave back and forth between them. This is going to be a great ride.

G&W: So, what's your verdict, generally speaking? What's your assessment on how good a job they do of that?

McLaine: In general, there's a lot of them that just slap a skull and crossbones on anything random and call it “piratey.” I mean, literally, if you give your character a pirate hat and a cutlass, Skyrim can be a pirate game, so to speak.

G&W: Right.

McLaine: If you're standing on a ship and you're holding a cutlass, well, close enough, right? There's the games that just put the appearance on it, just the facade of piracy, and there's ones that actually take their time to do some research.

Assassins Creed Black Flag? Obviously, they changed a lot of things; you have their mythology behind everything, but the names, the events, a lot of the interactions are a lot more realistic.

Then there are games like Sid Meier's Pirates!, which again, given that you have to play through game mechanics as a player, you have to make it fun, you have to make a game of it-

G&W: Yes.

McLaine: Games like that, that actually set out to be more historical, tend to, I think, do a surprisingly good job of it.

Sid Meier's Pirates! dates back to the 1980s. It was a Commodore 64 game, an Apple II game, and then they remade it in 2000, and again in 2012. So, it's just been going on and on, but it's essentially the same game under the hood. They haven't really changed the history of it, but they did a decent job getting most of it right.

Granted, [there are] things like you're in the Buccaneer Era hanging out with Henry Morgan, and then Bartholomew [“Black Bart'“] Roberts shows up—from 1720—in 1666. You're like, "Hmm," but, again...

G&W: Yeah. It's also like [that] in Civilization.

McLaine: Right. You can play historically, or you can go to Alpha Centauri in 1700.

G&W: Exactly.

McLaine: Given that game players are going to find a way around it, they're going to run out of content if [the developers] limit themselves to what only happened in 1715.

So there are the games that try and do a good job of it, historically, given what they have to work with. And there are games that just put the “look and feel” on it. Like Sea of Thieves, for instance, is just a free for all without bothering with much of the history behind it. It's giving you the environment and a sandbox to play in, but it's not trying to be historical.

G&W: Basically, it's giving you the archetype of the pirate, versus the reality of the pirate.

McLaine: Right.

G&W: If you do play Sea of Thieves, I'm always looking for crewmates!

McLaine: Everyone is, right?

G&W: Yeah. Specifically, ones that aren't a**holes.

McLaine:  Yeah, knowing my life, I'm going to show up and they're all manatees.

G&W: A funny thing happened to me this morning, actually. I was on a sloop, open crew, and this guy joined me. He clearly out-leveled me by a factor of at least 10. So we all get set up, we get our provisions on the ship, we're en route, we decide on the voyage. And then, I'm just kind of wasting some time playing my hurdy-gurdy, and the stupid a**hole shoots me overboard. He just shoots me overboard!

McLaine: Yeah, that's Sea of Thieves for you. That's the whole game in a nutshell, right there.

G&W: I know you mentioned Sid Meier's Pirates! and we talked about Assassin's Creed, but ignoring the historical accuracy part, which pirate games do you personally enjoy the most?

McLaine: I get a lot of historical piracy in the things I do outside of gaming. Just research, and writing, and things like that, so when I'm gaming, it's like, "Yes, I've seen that before."

It's like, my wife teaches dance at the college level, so when she watches serious performances, that's one thing. But when she watches a random TV show that has a dance bit thrown in the middle, she just turns her head and says, "I can't watch it." She's like, "Nope. I can't look at that, because all I'm going to do is nitpick."

[Like me] sifting in through the history, I'm like, "Yeah, that's pretty cool. They actually got that right. They're pretty accurate there," but then, I find myself bogged down. I'm like, "Ah, no! No! That was a Bartholomew Sharp expedition, that wasn't Morgan! That was 1692, not 1688!" And then I’ve got to stop, and take a step back, and be like, "Okay, chill." It's Tropico 4: Pirate's Cove. It's not The General History of Pirates: The Game. We can just let it go.

But, if I'm looking to have pirates in a game, I have to make myself not be worried about historical accuracy. So, something like Risen II: which is a complete sword-and-sorcery fantasy world, but it takes place on ships and islands.

There's a lot of shipborne activity, and you can take the “pirate” route in your playthrough, and again, it hits the tropes, but without even trying to take itself too seriously.

G&W: Right.

McLaine: Games like Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire, which is a fantastic role-playing game; if you like the old Baldur's Gate-style RPGs, that’s the next step. But again, takes place in a very coastal, islandy environment. And you can follow that route, and you can deal with those characters, and you can just sort of hang a hat on it and say, "Okay, this is as ‘pirate’ as it's going to get without having to worry about the history of it.”

Because if I want the history, I got a whole bookshelf over here that's packed with history, and I got a hard drive full of articles, and chapters, and things. So I'm like, "Sometimes I just need to step back from the pure realism."

G&W: Right.

McLaine: There's a link on my desktop right now for Pirate 101, which is a kid's game. And I was playing through Pirate 101 for a while, just as part of my Twitch series. And I'm like, "This is [an] absolute kids’ clickbait, ‘please pester mom and dad to pay some real money’ loot box.” But just to kil…