The Health Leader Podcast

As massage therapists, we spend so much of our time looking after other people. But what happens when the work we love starts taking a toll on our own bodies?

Sore thumbs, aching wrists, tired shoulders. For many therapists, these things have almost become an accepted part of the job. But do they really have to be?

In this episode, I'm joined by Tig McGregor, co-founder of Four Elements Company in the UK, to explore a different approach to massage that puts the wellbeing of the therapist right alongside the wellbeing of the client.

Tig's journey began with an injury just six weeks into working as a massage therapist on a cruise ship. That experience eventually led her to discover zero strain massage, an approach that focuses on using your body differently to deliver everything from light, gentle treatments through to deep tissue work, without putting unnecessary strain on yourself.

We talk about why so many therapists accept pain and injury as part of their profession, how we can rethink the way we use our bodies during treatment, and why sometimes the simplest thing you can do is pause, adjust and make yourself more comfortable.

But this conversation goes well beyond looking after our hands.

We also explore trauma-informed care, the importance of communication, creating a sense of safety for our clients and how those little things we do in the treatment room can make an enormous difference to someone's experience.

One of the things I particularly loved about this conversation was Tig's reminder that we don't have to sacrifice ourselves to deliver an incredible treatment.

Because looking after your own body doesn't mean you're giving your clients less. In fact, it might just mean you're able to give them something even better.

If you're a massage therapist who wants to enjoy a long, fulfilling career, continue developing your skills and create meaningful experiences for your clients, this is a conversation worth listening to.

Your clients matter. But so do you.

Tigger McGregor is the co-founder of The 4Elements Company, based in the UK, which provides training and support to massage therapists around the world.

The company focuses on four key areas: helping therapists work in a way that creates zero strain on their bodies, developing psychologically informed therapeutic communication, incorporating trauma-informed approaches to help clients build resilience through touch, and creating opportunities for therapists to connect, learn and support one another.

Following the passing of her business partner, Wendy Mills, from cancer in 2024, Tigger now leads the company, continuing their shared passion for supporting massage therapists to enjoy long, fulfilling and sustainable careers.

Tigger holds a degree in Biological Natural Sciences from the University of Cambridge and qualified as a massage therapist in 2005. Her professional experience also includes working in the UK civil service and an international consulting firm.

Through 4Elements, Tigger is passionate about challenging the idea that injury is an inevitable part of being a massage therapist and helping practitioners deliver skilled, intentional treatments while looking after their own bodies.

Website: https://the4elementscompany.com

Free resource: 3 Tools to Get More From Every Massage https://www.the4elementscompany.com/bettermassage

In-person training: Explore 4Elements training options https://www.the4elementscompany.com/4ETT

If you employ massage therapists, myotherapists or other allied health professionals in Australia, there are some important changes coming into effect from 1 October 2026 that you need to know about.

In this episode, I'm joined by Norelle Pratt, founder of HR for Health Leaders, to unpack the upcoming changes to the Health Professionals Award and, most importantly, what they actually mean for you as a business owner.

Norelle has a pretty special connection to The Health Leader Co. She is a past graduate of our program, and we had the privilege of supporting her as she began building what has now become HR for Health Leaders. Today, she works specifically with health and allied health businesses to help them get their HR right, stay compliant and build teams that are sustainable and profitable.

We break down the new classification structure, how qualifications and years of experience affect pay rates, why the Fair Work Commission has made these changes, and what you need to review before 1 October.

But this conversation goes well beyond compliance.

We also talk about the real cost of employing a therapist, utilisation, rebooking, pricing and why simply being busy doesn't necessarily mean your team is profitable.

We explore what happens when you hire before your foundations are ready, why knowing your numbers is essential, and how charging the right price can be the difference between building a team that creates freedom and building yourself a very expensive job.

If you already employ a team, are considering hiring your first therapist, or want to grow your clinic in the future, this is an episode you'll want to listen to with your calculator nearby.

Because building a great team isn't just about paying people correctly.

It's about creating a business where your team can thrive, your clients can receive incredible care, and you can make a healthy profit too.

Award Reclassification Package - CLICK HERE

For clinic owners who are happy to complete the review of their team rather than engaging a HR Consultant to do it for them, we've developed a package to ensure they are confident they have it all correct. This includes practical tools you need to review your practitioners under the new Health Professionals classification structure, calculate the likely wage impact, and prepare clear communication for your team.

Includes:

• Training video explaining the key changes and how to complete the review
• Comprehensive pay rate guide outlining the 1 July, 1 October and annual phased rates
• Online classification tool and worksheet to enter your employees details with classifications and rates automatically populating for you
• Industry salary benchmarking information to compare your salaries to competitors
• Review letter templates to issue to your employees (both practitioners and admin team)
• Letter templates to advise of future classification increases
• Access to our Wage Cost vs Revenue Calculator to review your profitability

Here are also some FREE Calculators that Norelle has created:

Casual Employee vs Contractor Cost Comparison

This calculator shows how to compare casual employment to a % based "contracting" arrangement - forecasting revenue and accounting for total hours worked and expected utilisation.

https://go.hrforhealthleaders.com.au/commission-vs-employment-calculator

Practitioner Revenue vs Wage Cost Forecast

A plug-and-play calculator to forecast wages, revenue, and commission so you know exactly what a new hire will cost (or bring in). Allows for you to input variables such as salary, leave loading, superannuation, leave and professional development allowances and select from various incentive options and utilisation targets to generate a forecast most accurate for your clinic.

https://go.hrforhealthleaders.com.au/practitioner-revenue-vs-wage-cost-forecast-lp

What do you learn after more than 50 years of putting your hands on bodies?

In this very special episode, Elicia sits down with Susan Davis, remedial massage therapist, registered nurse, educator and lifelong learner, who is still treating clients at 70 years of age. She was also awarded the Life Member Award from Massage and Myotherapy Association at the 2026 National Conference in Geelong.

Susan shares the extraordinary story of growing up alongside the emerging massage profession in Australia, including how her mother Cynthia helped fight for massage to be recognised as a legitimate health profession after actually being arrested for practising massage in the 1970s.

Together, Susan and Elicia explore how massage has changed over the past five decades, what we've gained and perhaps lost along the way, and why great treatment is about so much more than finding a tight muscle and trying to fix it.

They talk about presence, intuition, chronic pain, the nervous system, lifestyle medicine, ageing, the power of touch and the importance of truly seeing the person on your table.

Susan's message after 50 years?

Stay curious. Keep learning. And never forget the privilege we have of working with another human being.

This is a beautiful conversation about our history, our profession and where massage therapy could go next. Davis Health Centre https://www.davishealthcentre.org/ Cynthia Davis History Archives - https://mobile.amt.org.au/downloads/journal-archive/March2014.pdf

Ep 142 | The Nervous System & Chronic Pain with Kylie Hicks

What if the missing piece in chronic pain wasn't another technique, but understanding the nervous system?

In this episode, we sit down with remedial massage therapist and chronic pain Specialist Kylie Hicks, whose work is changing the way therapists think about pain. Kylie has spent more than 20 years helping people who have often been told there's nothing more that can be done.

Together we talk about why so many people with chronic pain feel unseen, unheard, and misunderstood, and how understanding the nervous system can completely change the treatment experience.

In this episode we discuss:

• Why chronic pain is about so much more than tissue • How to recognise the nervous system patterns behind pain • The language Kylie listens for in every first consultation • Why helping clients feel truly seen is often the beginning of healing • How changing pain can change long-held beliefs about a diagnosis • The importance of therapist presence, rapport, and creating safety • Why rebooking is part of the treatment plan, not just good business

Kylie also shares the case study that earned her the Massage & Myotherapy Australia Case Study Award where she shared how one client went from years of pain and the prospect of another surgery to living pain-free and traveleing the world.

Whether you're a massage therapist, bodyworker, or simply fascinated by the connection between the nervous system and chronic pain, this episode will challenge the way you think about recovery and remind you of the incredible impact we can have as practitioners.

Enjoy the conversation. To find out more about Kylie Hicks: https://www.kyliehickscoaching.com/course/the-chronic-pain-mapping-method To listen to Di's Story: https://www.facebook.com/share/v/1Ef2aoGgkJ/

From Workshop to Clinic: Practical Strategies to Implement What You Learn

On the Health Leader Podcast, hosts Elicia, James, and Christine reflect after the Massage & Myotherapy Conference and discuss how to turn workshop learning into real clinical results.

Christine shares her high-volume training experience (about 33 workshops in three years plus advanced TMJ study in the UK) and her implementation system: pre-booking relevant clients to practise on immediately after training, reviewing manuals each night, creating mind maps with key takeaways and questions, using shorthand notes with memorable nicknames (e.g., "pizza slice muscle" for glute minimus), and posting prompts on the wall for practice until skills become muscle memory. They also explain how their workshops use grounding and nervous system regulation, reflection activities, multi-style teaching (visual, auditory, kinesthetic, analytical), scripted repetition, and real public models with before/after photos in Gentle Scar Therapy to build confidence and evidence of change.

00:00 Welcome to Health Leader

00:26 Conference Reflections

01:41 Christine's Workshop System

02:51 Mind Maps and Memory Hacks

06:05 Post Workshop Implementation

06:46 Charging While Practicing

10:09 Grounding and Presence

14:41 Teaching for Learning Styles

16:56 Hot Stones Demo Flow

18:52 Full Treatment Practice

20:09 Learning Styles and Script

21:35 Workshop Day Structure

23:10 Real Models and Results

26:39 Confidence Through Repetition

30:27 Trust the Technique

32:34 Embracing Beginner Mindset

33:22 Gentle Stones and Intent

34:10 Wrap Up and Next Steps

Ep 140: The Hidden Impact of Scars: Why Pain Keeps Coming Back

What if the reason your client's pain keeps returning has nothing to do with the area you're treating?

In this episode, Elicia and Christine unpack one of the most overlooked pieces of chronic pain and recovery: scars.

Not just the visible scar… But the adhesions, compensation patterns, breathing changes, nervous system responses and fascial restrictions that can continue affecting the body for years after surgery or injury.

This conversation will completely change the way you look at pain, posture and recurring treatment patterns.

Inside this episode: • why old scars can still create pain decades later • how scars affect fascia, lymphatics, nerves and movement • why some clients keep plateauing despite "good" treatment • the surprising symptoms linked to scars • the emotional and psychological impact of living with scars • when it's safe to work on newer scars and its totllay ok to WAIT! • why scar-informed care is still incredibly rare • and how gentle scar therapy can create profound shifts in the body

And Christine's first experince with scar therapiy IN a workshop (not related to scars!) how a 10-minute treatment relieved severe pain for 18 months! Why do some clients finally feel like themselves again after years of discomfort? Because scars are common. But scar-informed care is not.

What happens when your client's pain goes beyond the physical?

In this episode, we sit down with Matt Runnalls, a mental health advocate whose story is as powerful as it is important for every massage therapist to hear.

This conversation goes beyond techniques and into what's really happening beneath the surface. The nervous system. The patterns. The "knots" in someone's timeline that continue to show up in the body.

Matt shares how many of the challenges we face are not random. They are moments in our life that we have attached meaning to. And unless we change that meaning, we keep tripping over them again and again.

As therapists, we often become the place where people finally feel safe enough to open up. But where is the line? How do you support without stepping outside your scope? And how do you protect yourself while still holding space?

Inside this episode, we explore:

• Why presence is one of the most powerful tools you have • How emotional experiences show up as physical tension • The concept of "knots" in your timeline and how to reframe them • Why changing meaning can change everything • How to hold strong, healthy boundaries in your clinic • What to say when a client shares something deeper • How to refer with confidence and integrity

This is a conversation that will shift how you see your clients, your role, and even your own experiences.

Because when we stop trying to remove the pain and instead learn from it, that's where real change happens.

Meet Matt

Over many years, Matt Runnalls has worked tirelessly as a mental health advocate to create awareness, acceptance, and education. Having lived with a mental illness, surviving suicide attempts, and losing several friends to suicide, Matt utilizes his knowledge of lived experience to encourage others to feel comfortable to speak up and manage their well-being just as he continues to do.

Since devoting himself to advocacy full-time, Matt has delivered over 600 presentations, workshops, and events across Australia, Canada, and America. His story and journey have been featured in books, documentaries, songs, podcasts, films and throughout most big Australian media outlets. Matt's dedication and tireless efforts have been recognised as he was awarded an Australia Day Medallion in January 2018 and as a 2021 Australian of the Year nominee.

Matt is committed to using his voice and experiences as a platform to instill acceptance, purpose, and hope.

What do you do when a client freezes, over-explains, rushes the intake… or tells you way more than you expected?

In this episode, Christine Knox interviews Pam Fitch, on the foundations of trauma-informed massage: legitimate consent, deep listening, boundaries without shutdown, and building trust that keeps clients coming back.

Pam is a dedicated massage therapist with over 40 years in practice, and she shares from her personal experience as well as dep knowledge of the industry.

If you want practical language you can use in practice today – this one's for you.

MENTIONED:

– See more about Pam on her website: https://www.pamelafitch-rmt.com/about.html

– Watch more of The Health Leader Podcast and our other free trainings: https://healthleaderco.com/podcast

Join me on The Health Leader Podcast as I speak with Sarah Nehme, global head of programming at BFT, about her incredible journey in elite sports, athlete rehabilitation, and running multiple gyms while leading global training programs.

Sarah shares her strategies for mastering time management, balancing work and life, building strong networks with other practitioners, and staying disciplined while chasing big goals like marathons.

Whether you're a health professional, clinic owner, or someone striving to perform at your best, this episode is full of inspiration, actionable insights, and stories that show how passion, discipline, and smart choices lead to extraordinary results.

What if the most overlooked system in the body is the key to reducing inflammation, improving energy, supporting immunity and changing women's health outcomes forever?

In this powerful and honest conversation, we're joined by Chelsea Jean, sports therapist, naturopath, educator and the woman famous for saying "I rub boobs" (and meaning it in the most professional way possible).

Chelsea shares how lymphatic health became her life's work, why lymphatics have been overcomplicated for far too long, and how therapists can confidently integrate lymphatic education and treatment into their practice without fear, fluff or confusion.

From Boob Camp to compression boots, breast health to business growth, Chelsea Jean brings big energy, a big mission, and zero hesitation when it comes to helping women take control of their health. With a bold personality and deep expertise in lymphatics, she is a true force in the wellness space. Guest Links

Learn more about Chelsea Jean and her work here: https://chelseyjean.com.au/