The JOY Hour

ABOUT THIS EPISODEThis week I am joined by Adele Cleaver, a playworker of 16 years and PhD researcher exploring playfulness as a state of mind. We talk about what happens when adults stop waiting for permission to play, and start accepting that play belongs everywhere.Adele shares how she creates spaces for unstructured play in settings from hospitals to asylum seeker hotels, what the play cycle involves, and why mischief might be one of the most direct routes to joy. We also talk about her research into Nottingham's growing intolerance to children's play, and the invitation to playfulness she is building for her 40th year.LAND ACKNOWLEDGEMENTRecorded between the UK and Lisbon, Portugal. We acknowledge the colonial histories connected to both places, and honour the diverse communities whose lands and labour built these cities.FREE GIFT FOR LISTENERSFree Joy Hour resource: www.goddxxpath.com/joyhourgiftIN THIS EPISODE16 years creating and protecting play spaces, hospitals to asylum seeker hotelsHer PhD, Reimagining Practices of Play, and Nottingham's inclusive programmeResearching the UK's growing intolerance to children's playPlayfulness as a state of mind versus play as an actionThe play cycle: environment, play cue, flow and annihilationWhy adult play exists wherever capitalism doesn't interruptMum and Bass, the One O'Clock Club, and playground hackingLoose parts play, and the magic of a colander or a fencing chainPermission versus acceptance, and the power dynamic between themA recent joy: Grandmaster Flash and a living room dance40 Plus Playful, her invitation to play this winterTIMESTAMPS00:38 - Adele's background across 16 years of playwork02:23 - The PhD title, Reimagining Practices of Play05:51 - What playwork actually involves07:16 - Playfulness as a state of mind, play as an action09:09 - Her own childhood, and where her relationship with play began11:11 - The play cycle: environment, cue, flow, annihilation14:08 - The genius zone, and play for adults17:52 - Mum and Bass, the One O'Clock Club, playground hacking20:32 - Loose parts play, and the light bulb moments23:06 - A recent joy: Grandmaster Flash and a living room dance27:44 - Permission versus acceptance of play29:09 - 40 Plus Playful, her winter invitation to playABOUT THE GUESTAdele Cleaver trained as a playworker in 2009. Over 16 years she has created and protected spaces for unstructured play across community centres, a museum on the move, public parks, a community allotment, Great Ormond Street Hospital, an asylum seeker hotel, schools of every kind, urban woodland, empty shops and residential streets closed for play. Most recently in Nottingham, she worked as a primary school play coordinator and freelanced for Ignite, delivering therapeutic play for asylum seeker children.She is now in the first year of a PhD, Reimagining Practices of Play, researching child voice and the growing intolerance to children's play at a neighbourhood level in Nottingham.RESOURCES & MENTIONSReimagining Practices of Play, Adele's PhDIgnite, therapeutic play for asylum seeker childrenGrandmaster Flash and the Furious FiveThe Goddxx Path coaching programmeThe Playful Path, a book referenced by Adele40 Plus Playful, Adele's forthcoming winter invitationCONNECTElla MesmaWebsite: www.goddxxpath.comBook: www.goddxxpath.com/journal-to-joy/Current offers: www.goddxxpath.com/links/Instagram: instagram.com/ellamesmaAdele CleaverInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/adeleplayworker/LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/adelecleaver/LISTEN & SUBSCRIBEApple: podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-joy-hour/id1849505845Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/1e2AslgK9q1hnEimdgQHzrYouTube: youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4ybUzyvIV4PVoZ3S9ZK1pEGKuY7XcY8M

ACKNOWLEDGEMENTSMusic: LamRock. Brought to you by Ella and guests.

ABOUT THIS EPISODE
This week I am joined by Warren Roberts, founder and CEO of Living Legacy Forest, the first company in the world creating master planned forests from human ashes. We talk about presence, abundance and “IT".
Warren shares how Living Legacy Forest evolved from him thinking about how we remember people, and why he believes grief and gratitude can both be honoured at Living Legacy Forests, and the book he is writing about the one word he believes shapes our reality. We also talk about conflict as connection, and what it means to lean in to joy.

LAND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT
Recorded between Bali, Indonesia and Lisbon, Portugal. We acknowledge the colonial histories connected to both places, and honour the diverse communities whose lands and labour built these cities.

FREE GIFT FOR LISTENERS
Free Joy Hour resource: www.goddxxpath.com/joyhourgift

IN THIS EPISODE

• Presence over striving, and finding joy in the ordinary moments of family life
• Snapping out of lack mentality by noticing what we have
• 6 years of journaling to joy, and the peacock and the ducks
• A conflict that deepened a relationship
• Living Legacy Forest: turning ashes into master planned forests at scale
• The family tree concept, generations added to one living tree
• Un-earthing family history and the story of the returnees
• Warren's book about the word "it", and how language creates reality
• The invitation to reforest the planet

• Living Legacy Forest, Warren's forest and legacy company
• Journal to Joy, Ella's 6-year daily practice
• The Wheel of Consent, referenced by Ella
• Deconstructing Colonialism, Decolonizing the Imaginary, the book Ella references
• Warren's forthcoming book on the word “IT" and language

TIMESTAMPS
00:59 - Joining from Bali, and a recent joy in presence with family
02:52 - Abundance, lack mentality and reframing what we already have
04:45 - 6 years journaling to JOY, the peacock and the ducks
07:53 - A conflict that brought connection rather than distance
14:57 - What is Living Legacy
16:50 - The scale of the forests, and cherry blossoms underfoot
19:09 - The family tree, and ashes added across generations
20:20 - Family history, the returnees, and finding his grandfather's grave
23:30 - The book about the word “IT", and language creating reality
31:48 - Expanding beyond Australia, and reforesting as legacy

ABOUT THE GUEST
Warren Roberts is the founder and CEO of Living Legacy Forest, the first company in the world to create brand new master planned forests from the ashes of people who have died. Operating across Perth, Melbourne, Sydney and Queensland, Living Legacy Forest has spent 12 years transforming ashes into the nutrients that grow forests of cherry blossoms and jacarandas at scale, changing how people are remembered and grieved.
Warren is also writing a book exploring how language, and one word in particular, shapes the reality we experience without our awareness.

RESOURCES & MENTIONSLiving Legacy Forest, Warren's forest and legacy companyJournal to Joy, Ella's 6-year daily practiceThe Wheel of Consent, referenced by EllaDeconstructing Colonialism, Decolonizing the Imaginary, the book Ella referencesWarren's forthcoming book on the word “IT" and language

CONNECT

Ella Mesma
Website: www.goddxxpath.com
Book: www.goddxxpath.com/journal-to-joy/
Current offers: www.goddxxpath.com/links/
Instagram: instagram.com/ellamesma

Warren Roberts
Living Legacy: https://livinglegacyforest.com/

LISTEN & SUBSCRIBE
Apple: podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-joy-hour/id1849505845
Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/1e2AslgK9q1hnEimdgQHzr
YouTube: youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4ybUzyvIV4PVoZ3S9ZK1pEGKuY7XcY8M

ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS
Music: LamRock. Brought to you by Ella and guests.

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

This week I am joined by Nicholas Ferguson, a London based artist and imagination guide who uses painting to honour the unrepeatable complexity of being human. We talk about having the audacity to come back to the thing we loved as children after years of doing what felt sensible, and what it cost us to push rather than follow our intuition.

Nicholas shares how a school grade nearly kept him from calling himself an artist, and how two decades in hospitality and beauty eventually led him back home to the canvas. We talk about his burnout pattern, the nervous system work helping him recognise it early, and the immersive performance he created for Edinburgh Festival that plays on the hero's journey… as well as the audacity to create.

LAND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT

Recorded between London and Lisbon, we acknowledge the colonial histories of the UK and Portugal, and honour the diverse communities whose lands and labour built these cities.

FREE GIFT FOR LISTENERS

Download your free Joy Hour resource at www.goddxxpath.com/joyhourgift

IN THIS EPISODE

Turning discarded flip chart paper into abstract art

Painting outdoors in mud and charcoal

Painting as childhood expression before he had the words

The GCSE grade that changed his path away from art school

20 years across Wallpaper, Estee Lauder and MAC

Naming the burnout pattern and where it started

Nervous system regulation, breathwork, forcing versus flow

Icons of London, his series of 70+ watercolour portraits

The immersive Hero's Journey performance he created with friends

Finding his singing voice through beatboxing and vocal coaching

TIMESTAMP

12:42 - Joining from Crystal Palace and Lisbon, recent joy and outdoor painting

15:56 - What is a Fermax board

18:05 - Painting as childhood expression

21:01 - The GCSE grade and art school

23:44 - Twenty years in hospitality, beauty and magazines

26:07 - Naming the burnout pattern

29:00 - Nervous system, forcing versus flow

34:51 - The Hero's Journey performance

50:55 - Where to find Nicholas

ABOUT THE GUEST

Nicholas Ferguson is a London based artist and imagination guide who uses creative expression to honour the unrepeatable complexity of being human. He grew up using painting to process what he felt before he had the words for it, and after two decades in hospitality, beauty and magazines he came back to the canvas.His portrait series Icons of London celebrates the imperfect perfection of being human, with over 70 watercolour portraits completed so far. His imagination practice, The Colour of Splash, creates space for people to reconnect with creativity as a compulsion and a practice, not just a talent.

RESOURCES & MENTIONS

Icons of London, Nicholas's portrait series

The Colour of Splash, Nicolas's imagination practice and monthly workshop

Joseph Campbell's Hero's Journey

Marv Radio, Beatboxer and Vocal Coach

Dr Voice, Vocal Teacher

The Shift with Giel

Create Your Destiny with William Whitecloud

SuperGenius with Ryan Pinnock

CONNECT

Ella Mesma

Website: www.goddxxpath.com

Book: www.goddxxpath.com/journal-to-joy/

Current offers: www.goddxxpath.com/links/

Instagram: instagram.com/ellamesma

Nicholas Ferguson

Website: www.thecolourofsplash.com / www.atelier-naf.com

Instagram: @atelier_naf / @thecolourofsplash

LISTEN & SUBSCRIBE

Apple: podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-joy-hour/id1849505845

Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/1e2AslgK9q1hnEimdgQHzr

YouTube: youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4ybUzyvIV4PVoZ3S9ZK1pEGKuY7XcY8M

ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS

Music: LamRock. Everything else: brought to you by Ella and guests.

ABOUT THIS EPISODE:
This week I'm joined by the wonderful Judith Quin, multi-award winning voice coach and holistic practitioner. This conversation dived into the joy of the shadow. Judith shared the story of how her acting career led her to vocal sound healing in 2010, and how liberating her own voice became the foundation of the work she now does helping others find theirs. We talk about what shadow really means (hint: it isn't always the scary stuff), the 6 years it took her to acknowledge the truth beneath her relationship with her dad, and a remarkable story of ancestral healing that unfolded in a Temezcal ceremony in Mexico. Judith also shares her daily practice of delight, and why she's come to prefer that word over joy altogether. This is a conversation about embracing the gunk so there's room for the glory, and about what happens when we finally own who we really are out loud.
LAND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT:
Recorded between London, UK and East London, UK.
CONTENT WARNING:
This episode includes discussion of caring for a family member experiencing a mental health crisis, a reference to suicidal ideation, family estrangement and explicit language. Please take care while listening.
🎁 FREE GIFT FOR LISTENERS:
Download your free Joy Hour resource at ⁠www.goddxxpath.com/joyhourgift⁠
IN THIS EPISODE:
Judith's journey from acting to vocal sound healing and confidence coaching
What shadow work really means, and why it isn't always the scary stuff
The client whose shine became her own shadow
Being sole carer for someone experiencing a mental health crisis
The 6 year journey to healing her relationship with her father
A story of ancestral healing that unfolded in a Temescal ceremony in Mexico
How owning the words "world class" shifted her business
Daily delights: the nightly practice that keeps her going to sleep smiling
Why Judith prefers the word delight over joy
Voice as vibration, and how it reflects every experience, thought and feeling we carry
TIMESTAMPS:
00:01 - Welcome and introduction to Judith Quin
04:30 - What Judith is currently journeying: closing a nine-year cycle
11:23 - Discovering vocal sound healing, and the moment it became her calling
14:03 - What shadow really means
17:11 - A hellish year: sole caring through a mental health crisis
21:08 - 6 years to acknowledge wanting to be wanted by her dad
24:57 - The Temezcal ceremony and Ella finding her grandfather
27:01 - Owning the words "world class", and what happened next
32:16 - Daily delights: her nightly practice
33:22 - Delight versus joy, and her complicated relationship with the word
35:23 - Voice as vibration
37:09 - Where to connect with Judith
ABOUT THE GUEST:
Judith Quin is a multi-award winning voice coach and holistic practitioner who understands the profound connection between the voice and the self. Her unique approach to working with and through the voice moves beyond traditional coaching methods. In 2011, her own experience of the power of vocal sound healing became the foundation for her transition into this work, and her passion for holistic wellbeing led her to a professional coaching qualification alongside energetic and intuitive practices. She loves nothing more than the transformation that comes from liberating voices, so that people can liberate and elevate their lives.
RESOURCES & MENTIONS:
Ballroom Burn – Judith's dance class
Vocal sound healing membership – first 3 sessions free
Free monthly practice space for speaking about who you are with confidence
Free online course samples
Sound healing retreats, including a seven-day retreat in September 2026
CONNECT:
Ella Mesma
Website: www.goddxxpath.com
Book: www.goddxxpath.com/journal-to-joy/
Current Offers: www.goddxxpath.com/links/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ellamesma/
Judith Quin
Website: yourwholevoice.com
Instagram / Facebook / LinkedIn: (@yourwholevoice)

ABOUT THIS EPISODE:This week I'm joined by Giel, an American singer-songwriter, producer and connection curator who moved to Lisbon in 2021 and built a life there rooted in music, community and wellness. We talk about the fear that sits underneath so many of our creative gifts... the ones we've been carrying since childhood... and what it takes to keep choosing joy when life hasn't made that easy.Giel shares the story behind The Shift, the community night where I first witnessed her hold space for people to sing in public for the first time, and we talk about what it means to have someone believe in your voice before you believe in it yourself. She also opens up about a devastating loss in her life and how it led her to found Reignwel Global, a mental wellness startup serving the diaspora with culturally relevant healing practices.This is a conversation about faith, resilience and the daily choice to keep showing up in joy even when things are falling apart around you. If you've ever felt blocked in your own creative expression, or wondered how anyone keeps their light on through grief, this one is for you.LAND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT:Recorded between London, UK and Lisbon, Portugal.CONTENT WARNING:This episode discusses suicide, depression and the loss of a family member. Please take care while listening.🎁 FREE GIFT FOR LISTENERS:Download your free Joy Hour resource at www.goddxxpath.com/joyhourgiftIN THIS EPISODE:The joy of building community and connection in a place where nobody knew herThe Shift: the community night where creatives find the courage to sing in publicChildlike faith and staying in "flow state" through choice, not easeThe loss of her nephew, Darius Roberts, to suicide and how it changed everythingFounding Reignwel Global, a mental wellness startup for the diasporaPursuing JOI, her personal vlog on choosing joy transparentlyTIMESTAMPS:00:01 - Welcome and introduction to Giel01:22 - Joining from Lisbon, and the story of how she got there05:17 - The recent joy of sitting in connection and community10:10 - Learning to hold space and believe in others before they believe in themselves16:22 - Flow state, resistance and the choice at the centre of it all19:01 - Faith, healing, and being honest about what joy really costs21:40 - How to connect, and an introduction to The Regulated Creative24:36 - The story of Reignwel: loss, grief and finding her purpose33:45 - Reignwel's slogan: "Here we reign well"34:16 - Where to find and connect with Giel35:32 - OutroABOUT THE GUEST:Giel is an American singer-songwriter, producer and connection curator whose work bridges music, wellness and global culture. After relocating to Lisbon in 2021, she returned to songwriting, inspired by the city's rhythm, warmth and soul. As a wellness facilitator, she creates memorable melodies and powerful anthems that resonate deeply with creatives across the global diaspora.She's the founder of Reignwel Global, a mental wellness health tech startup born from personal loss, and hosts The Shift, a community night in Lisbon where people gather to sing, share and be met exactly as they are.Giel's work is about helping people feel seen, grounded and alive.RESOURCES & MENTIONS:The Shift – community night in Lisbon (Instagram @the_shift_live)The Regulated Creative – Giel's coaching offering for artists and creatives (⁠theregulatedcreative.club⁠)Pursuing JOI – Giel's vlog (spelled J-O-I, her birth name is Joi) (Instagram: @pursuingjoi)Reignwel Global – mental wellness health tech startup, ⁠reignwel.com⁠ | @reignwelglobal  on InstagramThe eight wells of Reignwel's healing framework (Music Therapy, Art Therapy, Horticulture Therapy, Nutrition, Movement, Language, Soul Care, Community)CONNECT:Ella MesmaWebsite: www.goddxxpath.comBook: www.goddxxpath.com/journal-to-joy/Current Offers: www.goddxxpath.com/links/Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ellamesma/GielWebsite: reignwel.comInstagram: @heyitsgiel

ABOUT THIS EPISODE:

Kirsty Carr is a comedian, coach, and mum who won the 2023 Australian Roast Battle Championship and is now president of Roast Battle Australia. But her story isn't just about standing on stage making people laugh... it's about taking something that was a survival mechanism at age 8 and alchemizing it into her genius, her truth, her gift to the world.

LAND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT:

Recorded between Sydney, Australia and London, England. We acknowledge the Gadigal people of the Eora Nation as the Traditional Custodians of the land where Sydney stands, and the colonial histories of both Australia and the UK.

🎁 FREE GIFT FOR LISTENERS:

Download your free Joy Hour resource at www.mayagandaia.com/joyhourgift

IN THIS EPISODE:

How imposter syndrome stops us seeing that we have made it

How career desires shift over time and what relevance means when you stop striving

Juggling multiple identities: comedian, coach, consultant, mum

Can you integrate spirituality, psychology, neuroscience and comedy into one path

Fear doesn't go away, it just gets easier and the stakes keep rising

Defense mechanisms becoming your greatest gifts

The lesson of clinging to safety and getting pulled back to your real path

Motherhood as forced slowing down and boundary creation

Being yourself without the fear of judgment or exclusion

TIMESTAMPS:

00:01 - Welcome and introduction

01:53 - What's a recent joy: booked at the Comedy Store

03:00 - Do you feel like you've made it

04:28 - Relating to dance and shifting desires over time

05:39 - Journeying: not having the same desire to train

07:11 - What are you journeying right now

09:14 - Fear of being seen and getting over yourself

10:47 - Stakes rising as you get better

12:17 - Roast battles and the fearlessness required

13:00 - Strategic preparation for roasting

14:05 - Separating the personal from the performance

15:27 - The duality of being lovely and mean

16:13 - Dance as opposite expression

20:40 - Following your true path not the money path

23:32 - Operating from fear and lack

24:06 - Getting back on your right path

25:49 - Your spirituality and coaching all weave together

27:37 - Alchemizing suppressed voices into creativity

30:23 - Balancing comedy, coaching, mum

ABOUT THE GUEST:

Kirsty Carr is a comedian, roast battle champion, and coach based in Sydney, Australia. Known as the Roast Queen, she won the 2023 Australian Roast Battle Championship and is now president of Roast Battle Australia, producing shows across the country. A regular in the Sydney comedy scene, she's performed at Sydney and New Zealand Fringe festivals, conquered the legendary Comedy Store in LA in late 2024, and had sellout shows at the Tokyo International Comedy Festival in 2025. Her debut stand-up hour, Me and My Drunken Inner Child, premiered at Sydney Fringe Festival in 2025 to rave reviews, and she's touring across Australia in 2026. Beyond comedy, Kirsty works as a consultant and coach, integrating her passion for psychology, neuroscience, spirituality and personal transformation.

RESOURCES & MENTIONS:

Roast Battle League

Roast Battle Australia

Yeah Mad TV

Sydney Fringe Festival

Tokyo International Comedy Festival

Comedy Store Sydney

Pen Game Rap Battle

youtube.com/@PenGameRapBattle

CONNECT:

Kirsty Carr

Instagram: @_kirstycarr_

Google: Kirsty Carr Comedian

Also on: TikTok, Facebook, YouTube, LinkedIn

Ella Mesma

Website: www.mayagandaia.com

Book: https://mayagandaia.com/journal-to-joy/

Current offers: https://mayagandaia.com/links/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ellamesma/

LISTEN & SUBSCRIBE TO THE JOY HOUR:

Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-joy-hour/id1849505845

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1e2AslgK9q1hnEimdgQHzr

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4ybUzyvIV4PVoZ3S9ZK1pEGKuY7XcY8M

ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS & THANKS:

Music: LamRock

Everything else: Brought to you by Ella and guests ❤️

Enjoyed this episode? Like, Subscribe, and Share!

LAND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT:
Recorded between New Delhi and London. We acknowledge the diverse peoples and communities upon whose lands these cities stand, and the colonial histories that have shaped them.
ABOUT THIS EPISODE:
Arush Bakshi is an Identity Transformation Coach, health influencer, and Marketing and Operations Head at a football academy in New Delhi... and he came into this conversation with a reframe that I have been sitting with ever since. The monster is never as frightening as the shadow it casts before you face it.
We talk about what shifted when Arush stopped living as though he were a guest in someone else's life, how a past life regression he did purely out of curiosity cracked open his whole relationship with responsibility, and why choosing the risk every single day, not just on the days you feel ready, is what builds real momentum. We also get into gut health, grassroots football culture in India, a Netflix script that nearly happened, and what it looks like when you follow your own compass rather than the rulebook someone else handed you.
Grab your free gift from Journal to JOY: mayagandaia.com/joyhourgift
IN THIS EPISODE WE EXPLORE:

• Why the monster is always smaller than its shadow
• Choosing the risk every single day, not just when motivation shows up
• What a past life regression taught Arush about responsibility and belonging
• How stepping into his family rather than away from it changed everything
• Finding your real capabilities rather than measuring yourself against someone else's standard
• Building three very different businesses and staying sane doing it

• Iduna: @iduna_eternalhealth

TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Welcome
01:14 A recent joy: the best football tournament his city has ever seen
02:21 Going viral on Instagram... from 10 followers to 40,000
05:30 A past life regression he did just for fun and what it revealed
08:30 How his relationship with his family transformed
11:40 Turning inward to find his real capabilities
16:27 Choosing the risk every single day
20:13 The monster is always smaller than its shadow
25:27 What Arush is creating next: coaching, filmmaking, and a gut health brand
30:13 Iduna: the Norse goddess and the vision behind the health brand
ABOUT ARUSH:
Arush Bakshi is an Identity Transformation Coach based in New Delhi, helping people build their dreams through a blend of coaching, creativity, and what he calls magic. With a decade of experience in life coaching, he also heads marketing and operations at a football academy with a mission to transform grassroots football culture in India, and co-runs a health brand called Iduna, inspired by the Norse goddess whose golden apples grant the gods immortality. He works with clients across Europe and India, and filmmaking is next on his horizon.
RESOURCES MENTIONED:CONNECT WITH ARUSH:
Instagram: @iduna_eternalhealth
Email: [email protected]
CONNECT WITH ELLA MESMA:
Website: mayagandaia.com
Free Gift: mayagandaia.com/joyhourgift
LISTEN AND SUBSCRIBE:
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-joy-hour/id1849505845
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1e2AslgK9q1hnEimdgQHzr
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4ybUzyvIV4PVoZ3S9ZK1pEGKuY7XcY8M
ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS:
Music by LamRock. Thank you to Arush and to you for listening.

ABOUT THIS EPISODE:
Sohyoung Ward is the founder of True Level Leaders, and her own path took her from physicist to economist, from Wall Street to law school, from corporate restructuring attorney to holistic health counsellor and yoga teacher. In this conversation, we talk about what happens when the safe path and the true path are not the same thing... and what it costs to keep choosing safety over truth. Sohyoung shares the moment childbirth showed her what really matters in life, the year and a half she didn't speak to her mother over the choice to marry outside her culture, and how she taught her 9 year old son alchemy through the imagination. We talk about softness as a cellular, structural quality rather than a soft option, and why every human being is capable of choosing change in favour of their own joy. 

LAND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT:
Recorded between London and Indianapolis. We acknowledge the colonial histories of the UK, and the Miami and Potawatomi peoples upon whose ancestral lands Indianapolis now stands. 

Grab your free gift from Journal to JOY: mayagandaia.com/joyhourgift 

IN THIS EPISODE WE EXPLORE:
Why the safe path was never really safer
Softness as an ingredient of openness
The moment childbirth showed Sohyoung what life is really all about
Choosing your path against your parents' expectations
Teaching children to imagine something other than fear
Bringing consciousness and joy into corporate culture 

TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Welcome
01:37 A recent joy: helping her son imagine sleep instead of catastrophe
06:14 Journeying softness and vulnerability after stepping off an old identity
12:14 Why the safe path was never guaranteed
24:16 What was your truth, or is your truth?
27:02 Marrying outside her culture and not speaking to her mother for a year and a half
28:17 The moment of childbirth that changed her understanding of the world
35:18 Bringing consciousness, creativity and joy into corporate culture
37:41 Every human is capable of choosing change in favour of their joy 

ABOUT SOHYOUNG:
Sohyoung Ward is the founder of True Level Leaders, coaching and training leaders and high performance teams to create what they love and serve the world with their vision and heart. She is also an artist, writer, and mother of two. Her own background spans physics and economics, portfolio analysis and corporate restructuring law, alongside her training as a holistic health counsellor and yoga teacher. 

RESOURCES MENTIONED:
True Level Leaders: truelevelleaders.com
 CONNECT WITH SOHYOUNG:
Website: truelevelleaders.com
Email: [email protected]
 CONNECT WITH ELLA MESMA:
Website: goddxxpath.com
Free Gift: goddxxpath.com/joyhourgift
 LISTEN AND SUBSCRIBE:
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-joy-hour/id1849505845
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1e2AslgK9q1hnEimdgQHzr
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4ybUzyvIV4PVoZ3S9ZK1pEGKuY7XcY8M
 ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS:
Music by LamRock. Thank you to Sohyoung and to you for listening.

LAND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT:Recorded between Ibiza and London. We acknowledge the colonial histories of Spain and the UK, and honour the diverse communities whose lands and labour built these cities. ABOUT THIS EPISODE:Canay Atalay is a regenerative innovation architect who works at the intersection of business, AI, and planetary regeneration... and in this conversation, she invites us to question one of the assumptions we most take for granted: that technology and nature are separate things. They are not. We are not.We talk about human agency in an age of AI, why your body is still the most sophisticated technology available to you, and how the quality of what you are feeling shapes everything you create. This is one of those conversations that asks you to sit with a tree, look honestly in the mirror, and take responsibility for the energy you bring into everything you touch.🎁 FREE GIFT FOR LISTENERSGrab your free gift from Journal to JOY: mayagandaia.com/joyhourgift IN THIS EPISODE WE EXPLORE:Why AI is not separate from nature... and neither are youHow your emotions shape the reality you are co-creatingWhat "recoding" means in business and personal transformationStrength training, embodiment, and women in leadershipWhy asking the tree in your garden might give you better answers than you expectTIMESTAMPS:00:00 Welcome02:04 The gym, accumulated stress, and a moment of recognition: this is the life I was dreaming of06:15 What her daughters reveal about ego and what is truly meaningful09:44 How the world is a mirror of what we have not yet integrated within ourselves15:50 Finding discernment with AI: what is good for me, and what is good for us?19:33 Thoughts are using humans, not the other way around25:19 Forgetfulness and remembrance... the game of being human29:21 Have you asked the tree in your garden?39:27 Canay's invitation: drink water, bless it, move it, be grateful for it ABOUT CANAY:Canay Atalay is a regenerative innovation architect and founder of the RX Innovation Institute and The Heroines, curator of Heart Masters Ibiza, and host of Regenerative Innovation with Canay at Harvard Business Review. She advises executives and boards on cultural transformation, intelligent systems design, and token economics across organisations and ecosystems. RESOURCES MENTIONED:RX Innovation InstituteThe Heroines: theheroines.coHeart Masters IbizaCONNECT WITH CANAY:Instagram: @canay.atalayLinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/canayEmail: [email protected]CONNECT WITH ELLA MESMA:Website: mayagandaia.comFree Gift: mayagandaia.com/joyhourgiftLISTEN AND SUBSCRIBE:Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-joy-hour/id1849505845Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1e2AslgK9q1hnEimdgQHzrYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4ybUzyvIV4PVoZ3S9ZK1pEGKuY7XcY8MACKNOWLEDGEMENTS:Music by LamRock. Thank you to Canay and to you for listening.

In this conversation, we explore what it means to find your own rhythm in life... We talk about structure and freedom, manifesting dreams into reality through Lifebook, how to show up as your authentic self, and why martial arts, healing work, and teaching are all expressions of genuine human connection.

LAND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT:

Recorded between London and Antwerp. We acknowledge the colonial histories of the UK and Belgium, and honour the diverse communities whose lands and labour built them.

🎁 FREE GIFT FOR LISTENERS:

Download your free Joy Hour resource at www.mayagandaia.com/joyhourgift

IN THIS EPISODE:

• Why choosing your rhythm is more important than the choreography itself
• The journey from physiotherapy to energy healing to teaching to stunt fight choreography
• How healing work taught Cliff that the heart matters more than technique
• Structure and freedom: the paradox of real freedom living in structure
• Manifesting through Lifebook: writing down your dreams and watching them unfold
• The childlike energy of curiosity and awe... and how to keep it alive
• The power of community and doing things together
• From lightsaber videos to Netflix sponsorships: the unfolding of a creative dream

TIMESTAMPS:

00:01 - Welcome and introduction

06:06 - Michael Jackson and keeping childlike energy alive

11:28 - Cliff's teacher in Malaysia: the missing piece is feeling

13:09 - Healing people with your heart not just technique

24:24 - Inner and outer journey: we need mirrors from other people

28:26 - This year my journey is more rhythm

40:37 - Love for Wushu sparked again after prison in Indonesia

43:22 - Creating Team Kai and the lightsaber journey

48:06 - Lifebook: the sacred book holding your vision

ABOUT THE GUEST:

Cliff Tang is a Belgian-born Chinese energy healer, body worker, stunt fight choreographer, and newly minted teacher based between London and Antwerp. His journey reflects a deep commitment to learning from lived experience... beginning with medical school, then physiotherapy and manual therapy, traditional Chinese medicine, and training in bone setting with a master in Malaysia who taught him the most crucial lesson: healing happens through the heart, not through technique alone. That teaching shifted everything. When Cliff returned to Belgium, his clients began releasing emotional baggage simply by being given space to feel. His work evolved to include intuitive energy healing, and he now teaches physical education to children aged 9-12, bringing that same heart-centred approach to helping young people discover their own light. Beyond that, Cliff is part of Team Kai, a stunt fight choreography group that creates martial arts content for films, recently sponsored by Kenjo Sabers. He's a dreamer who writes his vision down, takes small consistent actions, and trusts that the rhythm of life will carry him where he needs to go.

RESOURCES & MENTIONS:

• Lifebook: A vision-crafting program for imagining your life across multiple categories
• Mindvalley platform & Vishen Lakhiani
• Chinese bone setting

• Physiotherapy and manual therapy
• Traditional Chinese medicine
• Wushu (modern martial arts)
• Team Kai (stunt fight choreography group)
• Kenjo Sabers (high-quality lightsaber sponsorship)
• Jackie Chan films and philosophy
• Bruce Lee philosophy: truly express yourself
• Hubert Goddard and tonic function theory

CONNECT:

Cliff Tang

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/kaizen_project

Ella Mesma

Website: www.mayagandaia.com

Book: https://mayagandaia.com/journal-to-joy/

Current offers: https://mayagandaia.com/links/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ellamesma/

LISTEN & SUBSCRIBE TO THE JOY HOUR:

Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-joy-hour/id1849505845

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1e2AslgK9q1hnEimdgQHzr

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4ybUzyvIV4PVoZ3S9ZK1pEGKuY7XcY8M

ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS & THANKS:

Music: LamRock

Everything else: Brought to you by Ella and guests ❤️

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