This episode I interview two developers recreating historically significant computers so that indivuals can try them out inexpensively and easily. First Oscar Vermeulen who created the Pidp-8 and Pidp-11 projects to recreate the physical appearance as well as the experience of the pdp-8 and pdp-11, computers critical to modern operating system history. Then I interview Josh Dersch about his work recreating the Xerox alto and Xerox star, machines that pioneered graphical user interfaces, WYSIWYG document editing, and the desktop metaphor.