The Modern Mexico Podcast

On this episode of THE MODERN MEXICO PODCAST, host Nathaniel Parish Flannery speaks to historian Benjamin Smith (author of the book THE DOPE: THE REAL HISTORY OF THE MEXICAN DRUG TRADE) about the impact of the arrest of Sinaloa Cartel kingpin Ismael "El Mayo" Zambada.

“El Mayo has had a very long history of almost five decades in the drug business. He started in the 1970s. He became a major exporter of cocaine. However, over the last decade or so El Mayo’s importance has... been as a key mediator between the Sinaloa Cartel and the federal and state government. He’s more of a political figure now. This is partly why people are worried about what’s going to happen in Sinaloa," Smith explains.

Smith says he gives Mexico's President Lopez Obrador a bad grade for his security policies.

"AMLO’s public attitude towards drug violence has been pretty depressing. He seems to delight in insulting civil society NGOs. He seems to denigrate victims. He excuses the military while at the same time talking very politely about narcos. He also appears to have made absolutely no effort whatsoever to improve the completely awful state of the judicial system," he says.

On this episode of the MODERN MEXICO PODCAST, host Nathaniel Parish Flannery speaks to journalist Ioan Grillo about the evolving dynamics of organized crime in Chiapas, Mexico.

Recent events in Chiapas raise questions about what the government can do as powerful organized crime groups move into the state and local criminals adopt increasingly violent tactics.

Over 98% of the murders recorded in Chiapas go unsolved.

Grillo describes the current dynamic in Chiapas as "oppressive," "fractured," and "worsening."

Chiapas has for centuries been a state where the federal government in Mexico City has struggled to exert control. Over the last thirty years many small towns controlled by the Zapatista rebel army have established their own autonomous fiefdoms.

So this dynamic of weak federal government capacity and the existence of local strongmen has existed for a long time in Chiapas.

But, in the last few years this nexus or synergy between local political bosses and organized crime groups seems to have become even more pervasive.

Overall, Grillo gives Mexican President Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador a "D" for his security policies.

Parish Flannery says, "Right now in Chiapas the police are only managing to solve around one in every hundred murders in the state. Social programs and soldiers are not a sufficient strategy for tackling violence. It just seems like it’s going to be impossible to improve the security dynamic in Mexico unless the new president takes the initiative to make a massive, multi-billion investment in improving the capacity of Mexico’s police and prosecutors."

On this episode of the podcast, host Nathaniel Parish Flannery talks to Katherine Corcoran, the former Associated Press Bureau Chief for Mexico, and the author of a fantastic new book called IN THE MOUTH OF THE WOLF: A MURDER, A COVER-UP, AND THE TRUE COST OF SILENCING THE PRESS.

Corcoran’s engaging book delves into investigating the murder of Regina Martinez, a high-profile journalist who covered the topic of political corruption in the Gulf Coast state of Veracruz, Mexico.

Over the last 12 years, Veracruz stands out as BY FAR the most dangerous state in Mexico for journalists.

The dynamics covered in IN THE MOUTH OF THE WOLF help explain the broader risks that critical journalists face when writing about organized crime and political corruption in Mexico.

"In the case of Veracruz, they operated under the system where the governor was the strongman who negotiated with the cartels and organized crime. That’s what was going on under Javier Duarte. They all made huge amounts of money in this criminal government either by stealing public funds or collaborating with drug cartels. That’s what created this atmosphere of fear and intimidation, and uncertainty. Because the authorities were the perpetrators. You couldn’t go to the police. They wanted to keep you silent," Corcoran says.

"The whole strategy of the president, Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador, has been to be very hands-off with the cartels. He is very much against confronting organized crime directly. What has happened is that these collaborations between the political system and organized crime have increased. Corruption has increased. That is why it continues to be so dangerous to be a reporter in Mexico," she adds.

In total, according to Article 19, 43 journalists were killed in Mexico during Lopez Obrador’s time in office (through the end of 2023). Another journalist was kidnapped and killed a few days before this podcast was recorded.

The 2023 Reporters Without Borders Press Freedom Index ranks Mexico in 128th place, among the world’s worst countries in terms of press freedom.

In 2022, Reporters Without Borders ranked Mexico as the most dangerous country in the world for journalists.

Nathaniel asks Katherine Corcoran what grade she would give President Lopez Obrador for his rhetoric towards the media in Mexico.

"I would give him a ‘D.’ He has used his daily press briefing to attack the press and say that any critical press of his administration is orchestrated by his enemies, by the United States. He doesn’t look at the press as any kind of component of a democracy where you have an independent watchdog that is keeping an eye on the government. To him, he doesn’t want a watchdog. He knows best. He is going to fix everything. He doesn’t need any critics. He has created a very hostile environment for reporters. His rhetoric is very dangerous. He is basically giving license to anybody who wants to attack the press," she says.

On this episode of THE MODERN MEXICO PODCAST host Nathaniel Parish Flannery talks to Noah Hurowitz, author of the book EL CHAPO: THE UNTOLD STORY OF THE WORLD'S MOST INFAMOUS DRUG LORD.

"El Chapo could operate without any true fear of being captured. This undercuts the way El Chapo is seen in popular media. He [is] often likened to outlaw figures [such as] Robin Hood. But, I don’t know how accurate that is because the role of someone like El Chapo was not some cops and robbers dynamic. The drug trade and the modern Mexican state developed together and intertwined with one another. Drug traffickers [historically] had strong links with local political bosses who ensured a level of stability," Hurowitz says.

Parish Flannery mentions recent trends in carjacking, homicides, and cargo truck hijacking in Sinaloa and also talks about his recent visit to Sinaloa to participate in an amateur cycling race between Culiacan and Badiraguato, two of El Chapo's former home bases.

"I recently visited the most exclusive cemetery in Culiacan– the Jardines del Humaya. Something that really stands out is that BOTH powerful narcos and local elite business owners are buried there. The families have built these incredibly ornate shrines which cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. Some have Roman columns and look like mini Ivy League university buildings. Others are hyper modern and made from glass and steel. When you are inside the cemetery you may see well-dressed, wealthy locals visiting the graves of deceased family members. You really can’t tell who is a narco and who is an empresario," Parish Flannery says.

Regarding recent allegations from ProPublica and The New York Times that people working with Mexico's President Lopez Obrador accepted drug money from the Sinaloa Cartel, Hurowitz says:

"I think it’s absolutely credible. I find it very believable that members of AMLO’s party potentially received bribes from El Chapo and Los Chapitos and other organized crime networks. Bribery is endemic in Mexico and it would not surprise me if members of government even at the highest level are on the take. [Lopez Obrador] has insisted that fentanyl is not being produced in Sinaloa which is absurd. I’ve seen it myself. I’ve been to a drug lab in Sinaloa where fentanyl was being manufactured."

Asked for one word to describe El Chapo's lasting legacy in Sinaloa, Hurowitz picks "nostalgia."

"The period [when El Chapo] held power in Sinaloa was one of economic development. Communities in the mountains have been suffering. The illegal market for marijuana has collapsed. There is a lot of joblessness in the mountains. Many people I spoke to [had] a certain nostalgia about El Chapo as this old school guy from the mountains who treated people right," he says.

On this episode of THE MODERN MEXICO PODCAST host Nathaniel Parish Flannery talks to Laura Calderon, the Executive Director of Justice in Mexico, a San Diego-based think tank.

In spite of persistently high levels of organized crime-related violence, Tijuana has become one of Mexico’s success stories when it comes to "nearshoring" investment.

The city has a thriving industrial sector that employs over a quarter of a million people.

Between 2016 and 2022 foreign aerospace, automotive, and electronics companies invested over 11 billion dollars in the state of Baja California where Tijuana is located.

Over 2,500 cargo trucks cross the border to the U.S. from Tijuana every day. The state of Baja California where Tijuana is located received $2.7 billion in foreign direct investment in 2023.

But, this economic success story has not catalyzed a significant improvement in the security dynamic in Tijuana.

Tijuana has earned a reputation as the most violent city in Mexico, and in terms of per capita homicides is often ranked as the most violent city in the world.

Tijuana recorded 10,725 murders during the first five years of President Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador's time in office (2019-2023).

But, we don’t see evidence that powerful organized crime groups are trying to intimidate and extort foreign companies in Tijuana.

Only 12 cargo truck hijackings occurred in the entire state of Baja California in 2023. That’s a tiny figure in comparison to the thousands of hijacking incidents recorded in the industrial states of Puebla and Estado de Mexico in central Mexico.

Calderon says that she thinks crime in Tijuana affects nearshoring companies on a level of about "4 or 5 out of 10."

"The economy is still going. There is a lot of industry, what we call maquiladoras. I think they are designing strategies to create alliances with the local government and ensuring protection for their businesses," she says.

Criminal groups in Tijuana are not killing or kidnapping foreign executives, for instance.

Calderon says that if the security situation in Tijuana is going to improve, Mexico needs to work to improve the institutional capacity of police and prosecutors.

On this episode of THE MODERN MEXICO PODCAST host Nathaniel Parish Flannery talks to James Frederich, a veteran Mexico correspondent who traveled to the beach city Acapulco to report on the storm damage caused by Hurricane Otis.

While 200 mile per hour gusts of wind buffeted the city, residents and hotel guests cowered inside.

Nearly 250,000 homes were damaged and many beachfront hotels were almost totally destroyed.

Initial estimates calculated that over 80% of the city’s 20,000 hotel rooms had been damaged and that the bill for reconstruction would top sixteen billion dollars.

Mexico’s president, a polarizing populist named Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador, has faced criticism for his response to the storm.

James gives him an "F" for his initial response to the hurricane.

"In terms of just helping people who needed food and water and medical care there was nothing those first couple of days. At the same time, President Lopez Obrador was playing down the damage and the deaths in Acapulco. I think unequivocally his response was terrible. They were just trying to do PR to make it not look as bad as it was. It was really terrible," James explains.

"The damage I saw in Acapulco was incomparable to anything I’ve seen anywhere else. It was the strongest hurricane to ever hit [Pacific Coast] Mexico [and] one of the strongest hurricanes to hit a city in recorded history. The winds that were recorded in Acapulco as Hurricane Otis was at its strongest, were some of the strongest winds ever recorded on Earth and were certainly the strongest to ever be recorded hitting a city," James adds.

"I don’t want to be pessimistic. It has such tremendous potential. It’s sad to see that not be realized. But, there are huge challenges for [Acapulco] to rebuild. I can’t be confident that it’s going to be back. But, I really hope it does. It’s a beautiful city. The idea that the hurricane was the death blow to it is really tragic to think about," he says.

On this episode of the Modern Mexico Podcast host Nathaniel Parish Flannery talks to Laura Tillman about her new book, THE MIGRANT CHEF: THE LIFE AND TIMES OF LALO GARCIA.

Lalo Garcia is one of Mexico's most celebrated chefs. His flagship restaurant Maximo Bistrot has helped to burnish Mexico's reputation as a culinary superpower.

Laura gives a detailed overview of her work writing about Lalo's impact on Modern Mexico's gastronomy and soft power standing in the world.

Asked about her favorite dish she has seen Lalo prepare, she says, “One that comes to mind that I watched him make is baby corn elote with hollandaise sauce and a chicatana / chile ant dust. The result was so rich and creamy. And these waves of flavor kept coming as you ate it from this sweet tender corn, the caramel notes in the brown butter, the deep richness of the parmesan cheese. None of these ingredients are incredibly luxurious. But, the result was so luxurious to eat. This was just a very delicious bite.”

She also explains how Lalo's life experiences have influenced the ever-evolving menu at Maximo Bistrot.

“[During his early childhood] he was eating the food from his village, tamales de ceniza, moronga blood sausage, mole, carnitas, all of these foods that his mother would prepare. When he came back to Mexico he was working at Pujol, this top restaurant, he learned a lot [there]. He traveled to Oaxaca. He spent a lot of time in Baja California. He’s brought all of those different experiences to his restaurant along with his travels to France and Italy. When you go to Maximo today you will see all of those influences on the menu," she says.

On this episode of the MODERN MEXICO PODCAST, host Nathaniel Parish Flannery talks to Stephanie Brewer, a Mexico-focused security expert at the Washington Office on Latin America.

When he was an aspiring presidential candidate, Mexico's current president, Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador demanded justice in the case of 43 missing students from Guerrero and criticized the rampant impunity that has long protected the politically powerful in Mexico.

Lopez Obrador once promised that if elected he would order the army to return to the barracks. As president, however, he has embraced Mexico’s armed forces to a degree that is unprecedented in Modern Mexican history.

"Whoever comes to office next has a large task before them. But, the necessary route to strengthen security and rule of law in Mexico is to bet on criminal justice, civil institutions, and policing and not continue this distorted and ultimately not effective focus on militarization," Brewer says.

"Lopez Obrador’s presidency has logged over 165,000 murders. With over a year to go in his term, Lopez Obrador’s is already marked as the most violent sexenio in Modern Mexican history. I’m not sure that people around the world really grasp the severity of the violence Mexico is experiencing," Parish Flannery explains.

Brewer recently published a report, "Human Rights and Democratic Controls in a Context of Increasing Militarization in Mexico."

On the latest episode of the MODERN MEXICO PODCAST, host Nathaniel Parish Flannery talks to veteran BBC correspondent Will Grant about his new book, ¡POPULISTA! THE RISE OF LATIN AMERICA'S 21ST CENTURY STRONGMAN.

During the conversation, Parish Flannery and Grant discuss the differences between populism and authoritarianism and compare and contrast Mexico's President Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador (AMLO) with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez, Bolivia's Evo Morales, Ecuador's Rafael Correa, and other modern authoritarian leaders in Latin America.

Grant says that one of the leaders that he thinks is most similar to Lopez Obrador is Rafael Correa.

"What I see [as a] similarity between their two trajectories is the increasing authoritarianism as time has gone by, their refusal to accept any meaningful criticism as anything but an attack on themselves and their political project. I think they both have dogmatic rhetoric [and] sense that they are simply right. There is very little space politically for reasoned debate. I see similarities there, too," he explains.

But he says that Lopez Obrador's embrace of the military is similar to a strategy Hugo Chavez used in Venezuela.

"The military is crucial to the populist leader in the Americas and we see that in Lopez Obrador. He’s leaned on them for all manner of tasks that go beyond security. They can get things done in a very satisfying way for the populist. That’s what the military does. They don’t question orders. They just carry them out. For Chavez that was key. Make them politicized, make them loyalists. [Now] we get to see the extent to which AMLO starts doing that to the military," Grant says.

Grant says that Lopez Obrador, like many other populists, choose to communicate directly with voters through press conferences, unfiltered by the media. But, he warns, Lopez Obrador doesn't match Chavez's ability to mesmerize a room with his presentations.

"Chavez could take to the stage. It was electric and electrifying. He was a rock star. AMLO has never had that in the same way. He inspires devotion. But rhetorically speaking… [AMLO] is like a university professor, one of the guys who just drones on and on," he says.

“I think that the bigger question is what kind of precedent Lopez Obrador has set for Mexico. He has proven this strategy of attacking and discrediting critics is very effective. His hyper-polarized rhetoric has really worked for him. He’s been able to maintain a high approval rating. I saw some survey data recently that shows that nearly 70% of respondents in Mexico said they had a positive view of having a powerful leader who is not beholden to congress or elections. Even more alarming, nearly half of survey respondents in Mexico said that they had a positive view of letting the army run the country. So, it certainly seems like there is an appetite for authoritarianism in Mexico," Parish Flannery explains.

On this episode of the MODERN MEXICO PODCAST, host Nathaniel Parish Flannery talks to Steve Woodman, a Mexico-based organized crime researcher at Advanced Intelligence Solutions, about the long history of vanilla production in the state of Veracruz, Mexico by Totonaco indigenous residents. Nathaniel talks about his recent visit to Veracruz where he met with indigenous vanilla growers and learned about the problems the sector faces today. One grower gave a tip for staying safe: "Always carry a shotgun." Veracruz is a hotspot for organized crime activity and vanilla growers in the state struggle to deal with thefts of their crops during harvest season. Nathaniel and Steve talk about how the problems in the vanilla sector in Veracruz reflect bigger political dynamics in the state.

“In that area [of Mexico] we’ve seen extortion rackets targeting indigenous communities. There have been forced disappearances and murders. Overall, agricultural crime is an issue in Veracruz. Extortion of farmers has been an issue. It’s not surprising that vanilla theft occurs. It’s a very profitable crop. Robberies are very likely given the broader security context in Veracruz. It matches a trend across Mexico where organized crime has diversified into new areas," Steve explains.