In this conversation, Kenneth Mims speaks with Dr. Katie Strom about her neurodivergence journey, how late diagnosis reshaped her research, and why complexity theory offers a better way to understand neurodiversity than deficit-based models. They also get practical about teacher preparation, masking, scaffolding, assessment, and what real inclusion should look like in classrooms and higher education. Dr. Strom shares how her lived experience, teaching, and writing connect through autoethnography, neuroaffirming practice, and her book Scaffolding the Language of Power. The throughline is clear: if schools want to support neurodivergent learners well, they need to move beyond awareness and into structural, relational, and collaborative change.
Key topics
- Dr. Strom explains her late-diagnosis journey, starting with anxiety and panic attacks in 2018, then ADHD diagnosis in 2023, and autism diagnosis in 2025.
- She describes how women often mask neurodivergence effectively, which can delay recognition and support.
- Her research centers on critical post-human perspectives on education and complexity theories on education, with neurodiversity emerging through autoethnography and self-study.
- Dr. Strom and a neurodiverse student wrote Pebbling Pedagogies, using the idea of “pebbling” as a way to think about care, recognition, and teaching through small meaningful gestures.
- She contrasts the medical model and social model with a complexity perspective, arguing that neurodivergence is produced through interacting systems rather than a single cause.
- Dr. Strom says a complexity lens is anti-deficit because it accounts for biology, environment, culture, work demands, trauma, and broader social pressures at once.
Timestamps
00:00 - “Are you neurodivergent?” and Katie’s diagnosis journey
00:47 - Anxiety, burnout, and realizing the symptoms were not the root cause
01:44 - ADHD diagnosis, autism diagnosis, and seeking a neuroaffirming assessment
02:37 - How neurodiversity fits into Katie’s broader education research
03:33 - Pebbling pedagogies and using small gestures as a teaching tool
05:40 - Why complexity theory beats the medical model’s either-or thinking
06:34 - From individual blame to systems thinking, genetics, and environment
08:55 - Why complexity is anti-deficit and helps during crises like COVID
10:23 - Moving from autism awareness to appreciation of difference
11:48 - Why diverse systems are stronger, richer, and more adaptive
14:15 - Gaps in teacher preparation and the problem with add-on training
15:39 - New teachers, low support, and turnover in the hardest schools
18:42 - Scaffolding sensory environments to reduce overwhelm
21:32 - Double empathy, communication barriers, and the mind-body split
24:09 - The case for sustained, school-based professional development
26:16 - Masking, unmasking, and what happens when coping strategies stop working
30:28 - Why standardized testing fails neurodivergent and multilingual students
32:20 - Competency-based assessment as a more meaningful alternative
34:58 - Communication autonomy and academic language as a language of power
37:19 - Breaking the dissertation into transparent, teachable genres
41:16 - Why policy must be co-created with teachers and educators
45:29 - Where to find Scaffolding the Language of Power
The views expressed are those of the guest, and this conversation is intended for general informational purposes only. This podcast and its associated materials should not be used as a substitute for professional medical, legal, or financial advice.
Sponsor Opportunities:
Contact [email protected]
