the un# podcast

Most asset managers still can't accept stablecoin payments, yet over $300 billion in regulated capital is already sitting on-chain. Jim Hiltner, Co-Founder of Superstate, explains how the tokenization of capital markets is reshaping the rails now powering Invesco, Bitwise, and Coinbase Asset Management, with the first fully on-chain IPO targeted for H2 2026.

Building tokenization rails for Wall Street is a credibility game, and few operators have stacked credentials as deliberately as Jim Hiltner, who moved from Citibank to Compound Treasury before co-founding Superstate in 2023. Superstate now manages over $1.2 billion across two tokenized funds and powers Opening Bell, the platform letting SEC-registered companies issue native tokenized equity on Ethereum and Solana with the same CUSIP, voting rights, and dividend rights as traditional shares. In conversation with un# host Sri Misra, Jim explains why Superstate handed its $1 billion USTB fund to Invesco in Q2 2026, why Circle's IPO mispricing exposes a structural flaw in capital formation, and why the first on-chain IPO is coming in H2 2026. With the SEC's Innovation Exemption now formalizing rails for tokenized stocks and RWA tokenization crossing $34 billion globally, this conversation captures the inflection moment for on-chain capital markets.

👉Why Superstate handed its $1 billion USTB tokenized treasury fund to Invesco in Q2 2026, and what the hand-off signals about the future of fund management

👉How Opening Bell makes a tokenized stock legally identical to a Nasdaq share, with the same CUSIP, voting rights, and dividend rights

👉What Circle's IPO trajectory, from $30 allocation to $150 first-week close, reveals about structural underpricing in traditional capital formation

👉Why $300 billion in regulated stablecoins is forcing every major asset manager to build on-chain distribution rails

👉How Jim Hiltner went from Citibank to Compound Treasury to co-founding Superstate, and why the 2022 crypto lender collapse was the catalyst

👉What needs to happen before AI agents can manage real money on-chain, and why the ultimate defense is legal, not cryptographic.

Subscribe to the un# podcast for weekly founder conversations and follow Sri Misra on LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/in/srimisra] for daily insights.

00:00 - Inside Tokenization of Capital Markets

0:55 - From Citibank to Tokenizing Wall Street 04:05 - FTX Collapse: The Superstate Origin Story 07:09 - How Superstate's Tokenization Stack Works 11:12 - Invesco Takes Over $1B Tokenized Fund 16:38 - How Opening Bell Tokenizes Real Stocks 23:36 - Why $300B Stablecoins Force Tokenization 30:05 - Disintermediating DTCC With Public Blockchains 42:11 - First On-Chain IPO Coming H2 2026 45:19 - Why Agentic Finance Isn't Ready Yet#JimHiltner #Superstate #SriMisra #Unhashed #Tokenization #RWA #OnChainIPO #OpeningBell #TokenizedStocks #TokenizedTreasuries #Stablecoins #USTB #DeFi #WallStreet #CapitalMarkets #BlockchainFinance #InstitutionalCrypto #CryptoFinance #Web3Finance #RWATokenizationDisclaimer: The information presented is for educational purposes only. Views expressed are those of the speakers, not necessarily the channel. You are responsible for your own research and decisions.Copyright: © 2024 Aarna AI Pte Ltd, Singapore. All rights reserved.

Spark Protocol Co-founder Sam MacPherson breaks down the two-layer stablecoin stack: a money layer led by USDT, USDC, and incoming bank and fintech issuers  and a credit layer where USDS and Spark live. Instead of fighting for payments share, Spark wraps yield around every major stablecoin and handles DeFi deployment for Web2 partners who don't want to manage it themselves.

His 2030 projection: tens of billions in USDS at the low end, $100B+ at the high end.

Spark Protocol Co-founder Sam MacPherson explains why his team offboarded rsETH as collateral in January  months before the $292M KelpDAO exploit drained Aave's lending markets. The takeaway: a minimalist collateral set, ruthless risk-return reviews, and a philosophy of shrinking the attack surface kept Spark depositors whole while the rest of DeFi absorbed the blow.

A masterclass in why disciplined governance beats yield chasing.

Sam MacPherson spent two years inside MakerDAO's core engineering team before co-founding Phoenix Labs to build Spark, the on-chain capital allocator that now manages billions in stablecoin liquidity across DeFi, CeFi, and tokenized real-world assets within the Sky ecosystem. Spark sits at the credit layer beneath USDS, Sky's $9B+ stablecoin, intermediating yield for institutions, fintechs, and retail through products like Spark Savings, Sparklend, Spark Prime, and an Anchorage Digital integration for institutional Bitcoin-backed loans. In a wide-ranging exchange with host Sri Misra, Sam explains why Spark offboarded rsETH three months before the KelpDAO exploit, why pure DAO governance does not scale, and why "boring" stablecoin yield products are quietly winning the institutional DeFi race. The conversation lands at a moment when the GENIUS Act has banned regulated stablecoin issuers from paying interest, pushing $300B in idle deposits toward Spark Protocol and its competitors, and when AI agents are emerging as the next stablecoin user base.👉How Spark Protocol avoided the $292M KelpDAO exploit by offboarding rsETH three months early through routine risk reviews👉Why MakerDAO's original DAO governance model failed, and how the new Sky "Stars" structure with sub-DAOs like Spark, Grove, and Obex actually works👉What the math behind a median oracle running Chainlink, Chronicle, and Redstone together protects DeFi lending protocols from👉How Spark generates $21M in annual revenue today and earned $80-$100M ARR at the last bull market peak, while running a programmatic SPK token buyback👉Why the institutional OTC crypto lending market at $20-30B is 3-6x larger than the on-chain side, and how Spark Prime is going after it👉Why stablecoin yield, AI agent payments, and cross-border settlement are converging into the next decade's biggest fintech opportunitySubscribe to the un# podcast for weekly founder conversations and follow Sri Misra on LinkedIn [https://www.linkedin.com/in/srimisra] for daily insights.00:00 - Inside DeFi's Oldest Lending Protocol 03:08 - What Spark Protocol Actually Does 06:30 - From MakerDAO to Sky Rebrand 09:11 - Why DAO Governance Failed at Scale 12:39 - Grove, Obex, and Sky's New Stars 14:46 - How Spark Stablecoin Yield Really Works 21:14 - The KelpDAO Exploit and Spark's Response 22:42 - Conservative Collateral Beats Degen Yield 28:08 - Median Oracles and Risk Engineering 35:00 - Spark Protocol Revenue and SPK Buybacks 40:53 - Stablecoins as the New Credit Layer 48:09 - Lessons From Three DeFi Cycles #SamMacPherson #SparkProtocol #PhoenixLabs #MakerDAO #Sky #USDS #DeFiLending #StablecoinYield #InstitutionalDeFi #KelpDAOExploit #DeFiInterview #CryptoFounderInterview #SriMisra #aarnaProtocol #StablecoinExplained #RealWorldAssets #OnChainCredit #CryptoLending #defi2026 Disclaimer: The information presented is for educational purposes only. Views expressed are those of the speakers, not necessarily the channel. You are responsible for your own research and decisions.Copyright: © 2024 Aarna AI Pte Ltd, Singapore. All rights reserved.

Anton Katz, Founder of Talos, built the institutional crypto trading infrastructure that BlackRock, Nasdaq, and Robinhood rely on, and in this conversation with host Sri Misra on alpha un#, he explains exactly what happens to finance next.Anton Katz is a MIT computer science graduate, IDF veteran, and former Head of Trading Technology at AQR Capital Management, who left in 2018 to build the institutional infrastructure his former employer could not. Talos is now a $1.5 billion digital asset trading platform connecting over 100 venues, serving asset managers with $21 trillion in AUM, and powering execution behind BlackRock's Aladdin integration and Nasdaq's tokenized collateral initiative. In this conversation, Katz makes a counterintuitive declaration: Talos is not a crypto company. Crypto was simply the first asset class on digital rails, and equities, bonds, and treasuries are next. He describes three separate financial conversations running simultaneously, why most builders are watching only one, and recounts a real exchange with a Wall Street trading head who admitted 40% of market liquidity will soon be native on-chain with no system to bridge the gap.👉How Talos became the execution layer behind BlackRock's crypto trading workflows and what that integration actually required to build👉Why Anton Katz says "crypto is just the first asset class on digital rails" and what that means for equities, bonds, and treasuries moving on-chain👉What a major US bank's head of trading told Katz four weeks before recording: that 40% of market liquidity will go native on-chain and no bank has a system to operate across both worlds👉How Talos navigated the FTX collapse and the 2022-23 crypto winter by building a churn model that doesn't compete with rivals but instead tracks whether clients' entire businesses survive👉Why DeFi vaults may fundamentally change the cost structure and access model of institutional asset management, from the perspective of someone who ran trading technology at one of the world's top quant funds👉What three financial conversations are running in parallel right now, crypto as an asset class, stablecoins as payment rails, and capital markets tokenization, and why understanding all three simultaneously is where the real opportunity sitsSubscribe to unhashed for weekly founder and builder conversations, and follow Sri Misra on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/srimisra for daily insights on DeFi, AI, and the future of finance00:00 - Inside Talos: The Institutional Crypto Infrastructure Story 02:04 - What Talos Actually Does for Institutions 08:09 - How Institutions Use CeFi vs DeFi Today 12:28 - Why DeFi Vaults Could Change Asset Management 14:35 - Talos, BlackRock Aladdin, and Crypto Adoption 18:07 - Leaving AQR: The Origin of Talos 24:28 - The Founder Mindset: Optimist and Pessimist 28:55 - The ETF Moment That Unlocked Institutional Crypto 32:21 - Stablecoins as the New Settlement Rail 35:03 - The $130 Billion Remittance Problem Stablecoins Solve 37:06 - Phase 3: Talos Beyond Crypto Assets 40:56 - BlackRock's Warning: 40% Goes On-Chain 43:47 - Is Talos Becoming a DeFi Gatekeeper? 47:18 - No Token, Possible IPO: What's Next#AntonKatz #Talos #InstitutionalCrypto #DigitalAssetTrading #CryptoInfrastructure #BlockchainCapitalMarkets #TokenizationRWA #DeFiForInstitutions #CryptoAdoption #BlackRockCrypto #SriMisra #CryptoStartup #InstitutionalBlockchain #StablecoinPayments #DeFiYield #CryptoFounder #Web3Infrastructure #DigitalAssets #CryptoUnicornDisclaimer: The information presented is for educational purposes only. Views expressed are those of the speakers, not necessarily the channel. You are responsible for your own research and decisions.Copyright: © 2024 Aarna AI Pte Ltd, Singapore. All rights reserved.

"We don't make fees when we liquidate you." Most DeFi protocols profit from your liquidation. Sidney Powell explains why Maple designed the opposite incentive.Full episode at: unhashed.co/sid

The same way Amazon got ahead of Walmart - same business model, different technology stack.Sid Powell on why crypto-native lenders will overtake Apollo and Blackstone. Full episode at: unhashed.co/sid

"No plan survives first contact with the enemy." Sid Powell built Maple through 3 brutal pivots - tokenized bonds → uncollateralized lending → where they are now. Full episode at: unhashed.co/sid

"DeFi is dead" - and the CEO who built $20 billion in institutional DeFi lending is the one saying it. In this conversation, Sid Powell of Maple Finance explains why that declaration is the most bullish signal in crypto, how onchain credit is now undercutting Apollo and KKR on price, and why the $3 trillion private credit market has no idea what is coming for it.Sid Powell spent years at National Australia Bank structuring securitisations and running a $200 million bond funding program before walking away from traditional finance to rebuild those exact instruments on a blockchain - without a bank, a clearing house, or Monday-to-Friday operating hours. Maple Finance, the institutional DeFi lending platform he co-founded with Joe Flanagan in 2019, has since originated over $20 billion in loans, closed a single $500 million transaction in December 2025, and grown AUM tenfold in one year to $5 billion - managed by just 41 people. Among the episode's most counterintuitive revelations: that standard DeFi protocols are structurally designed to profit from borrower liquidations, that there is no real technology moat in DeFi and never was, and that FinTech companies which have never touched a stablecoin are now approaching Maple for credit facilities. Host Sri Misra, founder of aarna.ai, draws out the full arc of this story - the 2022 near-collapse, the vertical integration pivot, and the long-term bet that all capital markets will eventually settle on a blockchain - in a conversation that is as much a masterclass in credit market structure as it is a DeFi episode.👉How Maple Finance built a $5 billion institutional DeFi lending platform with 41 people by automating risk management and leveraging AI to scale without scaling headcount👉Why standard DeFi lending protocols are incentivised to liquidate borrowers, and how Maple's recourse loan model and 24-hour margin call window inverts that dynamic entirely👉What the $500 million single on-chain loan closed in December 2025 signals about where institutional appetite for onchain credit has genuinely arrived👉Why Sid Powell abandone the infrastructure positioning that defined Maple's early years, and how the Apple and Tesla vertical integration model became the blueprint for Maple's rebuild after 2022👉How DeFi's low cost of capital in 2026 is making onchain lenders genuinely price-competitive with private credit funds in card receivables, invoice finance, and SMB lending for the first time👉What the convergence of stablecoin regulation, tokenized assets, and FinTech origination means for the $3 trillion private credit market over the next three years, as explored by Sri Misra and Sid Powell in this alpha un# episode - subscribe to alpha un# for weekly founder conversations and follow Sri Misra on LinkedIn and X for daily insights on the future of onchain finance00:00 - DeFi is Dead: What That Really Means 04:16 - Institutional DeFi Lending Explained Simply 07:09 - The $500M Loan and Maple Finance Scale 09:38 - When Non-Crypto Firms Enter DeFi Credit 13:00 - FinTech Asset-Backed Lending on Blockchain 18:28 - Maple Finance Founding Story and 2022 Crisis 20:53 - Why Vertical Integration Beats DeFi Infrastructure 23:13 - SyrupUSDC, Stablecoin Yield and Composability 27:53 - Onchain Risk Management and Margin Call Process 33:55 - Competing With Apollo, KKR, and Blackstone 36:30 - Tokenized Assets as Collateral by 2027 #Maplefinance #SidPowell #InstitutionalDeFi #DeFiLending #OnchainCredit #StablecoinYield #TokenizedAssets #SriMisra #AlphaUnhashed #DeFi2026 #PrivateCredit #OnchainFinance #SyrupUSDC #CryptoLending #TradFiDeFi #BlockchainFinance #DigitalAssets #OnchainAssetManagementDisclaimer: The information presented is for educational purposes only. Views expressed are those of the speakers, not necessarily the channel. You are responsible for your own research and decisions.Copyright: © 2024 Aarna AI Pte Ltd, Singapore. All rights reserved.

In this episode, host Sri Misra sits down with Eric Saraniecki to unpack why the future of crypto may not be driven by hype cycles, but by durable, repeatable financial activity. From token burns and network activity to the long-term convergence of TradFi and DeFi, this conversation explores what real utility on-chain could actually look like.Full episode at: unhashed.co/eric