Thinking On Paper

Stablecoins already move more volume than Visa and Mastercard combined. There's a financial revolution in the air, and the banks don't want you involved.

Robby Yung, CEO of Animoca Brands, shows how people move dollars across borders in minutes with near-flat fees, from market traders in Nigeria to institutions shifting tens or hundreds of millions.

This is a short from our full length deep dive into web3, the decentralized internet, DOAs, AI and what Animoca has in store for the coming year.

Subscribe to Thinking on Paper for the full conversation.--

Other ways to connect with us:

• ⁠Listen to every podcast⁠

• Follow us on ⁠Instagram⁠

• Follow us on ⁠X⁠

• Follow Mark on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Follow Jeremy on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Read our ⁠Substack⁠

Email: [email protected]

Watch On YouTube: https://youtu.be/O_Iy1jYTRz8

China built its space station Tiangong in three years after being excluded from the ISS. It landed on the Moon twice—2020 and 2024—returning samples from high helium-3 areas. Now the race is for resources and rules.

Glen Martin (aerospace designer, ISS contributor) explains how China's space program connects: high-speed rail expertise at home translates to orbital infrastructure. Grid power systems scale to space stations. Industrial coordination enables lunar missions.

The timeline: 2029 crewed lunar landing planned for the 80th anniversary of the 1949 revolution. They're on track.

What they've already done:

- Built Tiangong space station (operational, continuously crewed)

- Landed on lunar far side using relay satellites and nuclear-powered rover

- Collected samples from helium-3 rich regions (twice)

- Demonstrated industrial-speed space development (3 years for Tiangong vs ISS decades)

Why the lunar south pole matters: "Rim of eternal light" has 24-hour sunlight plus water ice in permanently shadowed craters. Perfect for long-term habitation.

The rules fight:

- UN Space Resources Treaty draft due 2027 (two years before China's planned landing)

- US domestic space laws say "just go mine it" (no international permission needed)

- Deep sea mining comparison: UN trying to regulate, countries acting unilaterally

- Wild West vs regulated approach—which wins?

Who decides what happens on the Moon? Right now, nobody. That's the problem—and the opportunity.

China wasn't invited to play ISS. So they built their own game.

---

Guest: Glen Martin, Aerospace Designer | ISS Contributor, Extraterrestrial Mining Company CEO

Topics: China space program, Tiangong, Moon landing, helium-3, space law, UN treaty, lunar resources

Format: Short episode

--

📺Watch on YouTube

--

TIMESTAMPS

(00:00) Chinese Infrastructure

(00:47) Bringing Russia to ISS

(01:21) We Blocked The Chinese

(01:41) Tiangong & 2029 Moon Landings

(02:22) The Global Politics Of Space

(03:36) The Lunar South Pole

(04:07) The United Nations

(04:41) The Moon Wild West

--

Other ways to connect with us:

• ⁠Listen to every podcast⁠

• Follow us on ⁠Instagram⁠

• Follow us on ⁠X⁠

• Follow Mark on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Follow Jeremy on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Read our ⁠Substack⁠

Email: [email protected]

You're listening to AI-generated music and don't realize it. The musicians whose work trained those models know. They check their empty bank accounts daily.

99,000 new songs upload to streaming platforms every day. One in five are AI-generated (Deezer). You wouldn't play a single one at your funeral.

59% of musicians use AI in some aspect of their music (Ditto Music). The question: How do real musicians get paid when AI uses their work?

We break down Water & Music's research on AI music attribution. Cherie Hu, Yung Spielburg, and Alexander Flores investigated what's at stake and which companies are trying to solve it.

The problems:

- Session musicians, producers, songwriters—how do they get paid when AI uses their beats?

- Record labels can't track which training data influenced which outputs

- Proving a musician's input in a model's output is nearly impossible

- Copyright law wasn't built for this

- Most AI music companies scraped without permission or payment

We talk about:

- How attribution technology could work (vector matching, contribution tracking)

- Which companies are building payment systems

- Why Suno and Udio's approach creates legal chaos

- How ethical companies like Overtune license training data and split royalties

- Whether streaming platforms can detect AI-generated music

- What happens when the Beatles' catalog trains a model

The stakes: If attribution fails, AI becomes theft at industrial scale. Music becomes disposable content optimized for algorithms, not humans.

Based on Water & Music's research—the best reporting on AI music economics.

Share with a music lover.

---

Research: Water & Music (Cherie Hu, Yung Spielburg, Alexander Flores)

Topics: AI music, copyright, attribution, streaming, royalties, training data

–

(00:00) The Intersection of Music and AI

(03:26) Understanding Music Attribution

(03:51) Sonic Characteristics and AI Influence

(06:39) The Complexity of AI Music Generation

(07:36) The Value Equation in AI Music Creation

(08:08) Understanding Influence Functions in Music AI

(09:44) Challenges of Attribution in AI-Generated Music

(11:38) Exploring Embeddings and Their Role in Music AI

(14:17) Watermarking and Its Limitations in Music Attribution

(15:30) Synthetic Data and Its Implications for Music AI

(17:48) Innovative Solutions for Music Rights Attribution

(18:01) Distinguishing Compositional vs. Recording Contributions

(19:59) The Impact of AI on the Music Industry's Inequities

(23:03) Trust and Technology in Music Attribution

Other ways to connect with us:

• ⁠Listen to every podcast⁠

• Follow us on ⁠Instagram⁠

• Follow us on ⁠X⁠

• Follow Mark on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Follow Jeremy on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Read our ⁠Substack⁠

Email: [email protected]

Kevin Kelly, one of the great technological philosophers of our time, joined Mark & Jeremy to Think on Paper. Before he left, he asked a question. A question about the future and technology: What should humans be? 

At the end of every show, we ask every guest this question. And the answers always resonate on an emotional, human level. They land on something universal. The same words, the same ideas, the same wants for humanity come up again and again. Creativity, curiosity, kindness, empathy, discovery, adventure, ambition. 

This is the first part of our series compiling the answers. A reminder, in the dark days that technology is built by us, for us, and most people are nice, kind and want the best for us all. As you'll see. Yes, it maybe a simple message at times, but we're OK with that. Because on simple ideas are civilizations born.

Please enjoy this special compilation of thoughts and ideas. And tell someone to come Think on Paper with us.

We'd appreciate that.

Be curious, stay disruptive, keep thinking on paper.

Cheers, 

Mark and Jeremy.

--

Timestamps

(00:00) The Story

(00:58) Kindness (& Books)

(01:55) Meaning

(02:32) Connection

(03:03) Discovery

(03:36) Curiosity

(04:30) Consciousness

(05:00) Ambition

(05:31) Creativity

(06:07) Wisdom

--

Videos appear thanks to:

“Documentary — The Fourth Industrial Revolution” by World Economic Forum, licensed under CC BY 3.0: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Documentary_-_The_Fourth_Industrial_Revolution.webm" 

"Wikimedia Commons

 "“Out of This World — Prelinger Archives / Public Domain (via Internet Archive)”

--

Guests in this video

Mark Boggett: https://youtu.be/PExunxFL71E?si=XrpkRRmFCjR1VxC7

Rajeev Kapur: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWEuQmPcqJ8&t=193s

Rob Locascio: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaM8lITXx6Y&t=428s

Andrew Hill: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hk4BXeXS9wE&t=50s

Will Alpine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Obs2vxp-SP0&t=44s

Katia Moskovitch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPwM0dCEYkI&t=185s

Robby Yung: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHiSkSEQy-c&t=2010s

Khang Nguyen-Trieu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UbnVirwbGBc&t=85s

Martin Soltau: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zl-z1d6d_as&t=572s

--

Other ways to connect with us:

• ⁠Listen to every podcast⁠

• Follow us on ⁠Instagram⁠

• Follow us on ⁠X⁠

• Follow Mark on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Follow Jeremy on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Read our ⁠Substack⁠

• Email: [email protected]

The space economy is set to reach $1.8 trillion by 2035. Everyone talks about rockets. Almost no one talks about the infrastructure that connects orbit to Earth. This is where billions of dollars of that space investment are being increasingly allocated. 

Mark Boggett runs Seraphim Investments, a London-based fund that backs the companies building the foundations of the space economy. In this conversation, he explains why the future of space isn’t about launch or tourism, but data, defense, and the networks that will define a trillion-dollar market.

We look at how falling launch costs from SpaceX, Rocket Lab, and Firefly have moved the bottleneck from rockets to downlink infrastructure - the networks that move satellite data back to Earth. 

Boggett outlines the under-invested opportunities in ground terminals, communications, and cybersecurity that will define the next decade of the space economy.

He also talks about the rise of direct-to-device connectivity through companies like AST SpaceMobile and Globalstar, the coming laser mesh networks led by Amazon’s Kuiper constellation, and the new markets emerging in orbital services: debris removal, refueling, and regulation-driven sustainability through firms like Astroscale and LeoLabs.

This is the quieter side of the space race, the infrastructure and data layer where long-term investors are quietly shaping a trillion-dollar future.

Enjoy the show. 

And please subscribe so we can continue building the channel, and thinking on Paper. 

--

TIMESTAMPS

(00:00) Trailer

(01:56) Disruptors & Curious Minds

(03:08) Mark Boggett 

(03:27) The Reality Of A 10-Year Investment Period

(04:07) Predictions On The Space Economy

(04:39) Space Race 2.0: The USA V China 

(05:54) Direct to Device Space Communications

(08:05) Public Markets Love Space Tech Investments

(09:35) Space Exits & IPOS

(10:36) Trump & Musk To Dominate Space Agenda

(11:17) The Space Ecosystem 2025

(12:10) Satellite Companies: Hardware & Software

(12:36) Launch Companies: SpaceX, Firefly & Rocket Labs

(13:50) Satellite Constellations

(14:24) HAPS (High Altitude Platforms)

(15:22) Data Collection, Ground Terminals & Cyber Security

(16:46) Downlink: The Growth Area Of Space Investments

(18:50) Satellite Data Companies

(21:08) Space Verticals: Climate Success Stories

(22:20) How Satellites Verify Carbon Credits

(24:37) Space Debris & New Regulations To Clean Up Orbit

(26:38) Getting Old, Rickety Satellites Out Of Orbit

(30:26) Giving Regulators Teeth

(31:15) Geopolitics And Defense Based Space Investment

(36:33) Terraforming Mars

(36:48) Best Sci-Fi Movie

(36:56) Do Kids Look Up? The Accessibility Of Space

(37:20) The Best Reason To Go To The Moon

(39:51) What Should Humans Be?

--

--

Other ways to connect with us:

• ⁠Listen to every podcast⁠

• Follow us on ⁠Instagram⁠

• Follow us on ⁠X⁠

• Follow Mark on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Follow Jeremy on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Read our ⁠Substack⁠

• Email: [email protected]

A quarter of British 8 to 12 year olds have used generative AI. ChatGPT is the most popular tool, Snapchat AI is second. Half of teachers say they've already received homework that was clearly written by AI.

And 58 percent of private school kids have used AI compared to just 18 percent at state schools, which is a gap so large it's reshaping the next generation's relationship with this technology before any of us have figured out what we want it to be.

On this episode of Thinking on Paper, we unpack the Alan Turing Institute's new report on the impacts of generative AI on children, the largest study of its kind to date, based on a survey of 780 children, 1,001 teachers, and a workshop with 9 to 11 year olds in Scottish state schools.

The report was funded in part by Lego, which is a small detail with a lot of meaning when the people who built the world's best analog play company decide to fund research on what the next thing is doing to kids.

Along the way: why teachers are worried about critical thinking and parents are mostly positive, why ChatGPT is being used to "create fun pictures, find information, and entertainment" in that order, what the kids themselves said in their own words about misinformation and AI safety, the eight recommendations the Institute made for parents, teachers, and policymakers, and the one recommendation we found genuinely surprising — that kids themselves should be involved in designing the AI tools they're going to grow up using.

--

TIMESTAMPS

(00:00) Disruptors And Curious Minds

(02:40) The Alan Turing Research On The Impact Of AI On Children

(03:49) The Most Popular AI Platform For Kids

(04:41) How Are Kids Using AI?

(04:55) Key Statistics From The Research On AI Use In School

(05:33) The Divide: Private vs. Public School AI Usage

(08:08) Are Kids Using AI To Cheat In School?

(09:55) The RITECH Framework: Evaluating AI for Kids

(11:18) Quotes From Kids On AI

(16:13) Child Versions Of ChatGPT

(18:12) Recommendations From The Alan Turing Institute

--

Other ways to connect with us:

• ⁠Listen to every podcast⁠

• Follow us on ⁠Instagram⁠

• Follow us on ⁠X⁠

• Follow Mark on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Follow Jeremy on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Read our ⁠Substack⁠

• Email: [email protected]

IBM's Lory Thorpe warns that quantum computers could soon crack the encryption protecting our banks, health records, and personal data, enabling "harvest now, decrypt later" attacks that threaten global security.

Through IBM's collaboration with NIST and major institutions, she's racing to develop quantum-resistant algorithms before current encryption systems become obsolete.

Join hosts Mark Fielding and Jeremy Gilbertson to explore how organizations and individuals can prepare for this looming cryptographic crisis, featuring insights from Apple's quantum-safe iMessage initiative.

Please enjoy the show. --

TIMESTAMPS

(00:00) Intro: Disruptors and Curious Minds

(02:30) Meet Lory Thorpe of IBM Quantum

(03:21) Lory’s Journey: From Telecom to Quantum Security

(07:01) Why Healthcare Needs Post-Quantum Protection

(09:41) "Harvest Now, Decrypt Later": The Quantum Data Risk

(12:00) IBM’s Work with Governments and Regulators

(16:30) Cryptography 101: What You Need to Know

(18:47) The Cost of Quantum and the Threat to Today’s Encryption

(21:20) IBM & NIST: Setting Quantum Standards Together

(22:08) Inside the 3 Quantum-Resistant Algorithms

(25:17) Apple Adopts Post-Quantum Encryption in iMessage

(25:52) Crypto Agility Explained: A Key to Future-Proof Security

(29:54) The RSA Encryption Debate: Is the Quantum Threat Overblown?

(38:45) Thought Experiment: November 1st, 2031 – The Quantum Deadline

(42:51) Where Cryptography Touches Everyday Life

(46:57) How AI and Quantum Shape IBM’s Strategy

(52:35) Carryover Question for Next Episode--

Follow Thinking On Paper:

Twitter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://x.com/thinkonpaperpod⁠⁠⁠⁠

Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠instagram.com/thinkingonpaperpodcast/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

YouTube: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠youtube.com/@thinkingonpaper/videos⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

LinkedIn: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠linkedin.com/company/thinkingonpaper⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

--

Past guests on The Thinking On Paper Show include: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ciaran Murray⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (web3 for journalists), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Torrey Smith⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Robotics For Medicine), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jason Lynch⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Quantum Computing), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Joe Fitzsimons⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Quantum Computing), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Dana Sydorenko⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Gaming), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Don Norman⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Humanity Centered Design), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Mercina Tillerman Perez⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Circle & Crypto), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Tyler Adams⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Blockchain), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Todd Haselhorst ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠(Blockchain for Logistics), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Vince Yang⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (ZK Proofs)

Murray Thom, VP of Quantum Technology Evangelism at D-Wave, joins us to break down how D-Wave’s quantum computing technology (as used by NASA, VW, Lockheed Martin) is tackling complex, high-stakes problems across industries.

Learn how D-Wave’s unique use of quantum annealing helps solve real-world challenges, from logistics optimization to drug discovery and traffic management.

Murray explains how D-Wave’s hybrid quantum-classical systems maximize computational power by leveraging quantum effects alongside classical computing, enabling optimizations that traditional systems simply can’t match. Discover why D-Wave is trusted by organizations, including NASA, to handle high-dimensional, multi-variable data, delivering immediate benefits in efficiency, productivity, and operational insight.

From the development of the first quantum computer to real-world applications, Murray explains how businesses are gaining a competitive edge and solving their toughest challenges with quantum technology.

Stay tuned for practical insights, key D-Wave milestones, and a look at what’s next in quantum computing.

🔔And please subscribe.

--

TIMESTAMPS(00:00) Introduction to Quantum Innovation(01:22) Meet Murray Thom: Quantum Expert from D-Wave(02:30) How Quantum Incentives Drive Industry Collaboration(05:30) Breaking Down Quantum Complexity for the Real World(07:30) Murray Thom on Joining D-Wave 22 Years Ago(09:02) The Role of Quantum Physics in Real-World Solutions(10:07) Major Milestones in D-Wave’s Quantum Journey(12:36) Understanding Quantum Annealing: A Practical Guide(18:47) Key Benefits of D-Wave’s Quantum Annealing Technology(21:40) D-Wave’s Efficient Power Use: 15kW Explained(23:45) Quantum Computing Through a Pokémon Analogy(25:35) Real-World Impact: Workforce Scheduling with Quantum(31:45) Quantum Systems in Sports Team Optimization(33:02) Tackling Complex Industrial Problems with Quantum(34:48) Portfolio Optimization: Quantum vs. Classical Methods(40:53) What Does a D-Wave Quantum Computer Cost?(42:11) Exploring the D-Wave SDK(44:45) Partnering with D-Wave: What to Expect(45:58) Quantum Collaboration with IBM(49:39) A Question for IBM on Post-Quantum Cryptography

--

Follow Thinking On Paper:

Twitter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://x.com/thinkonpaperpod⁠⁠

Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠instagram.com/thinkingonpaperpodcast/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

YouTube: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠youtube.com/@thinkingonpaper/videos⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

LinkedIn: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠linkedin.com/company/thinkingonpaper⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

--

Past guests on The Thinking On Paper Show include: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ciaran Murray⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (web3 for journalists), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Torrey Smith⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Robotics For Medicine), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jason Lynch⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Quantum Computing), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Joe Fitzsimons⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Quantum Computing), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Dana Sydorenko⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Gaming), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Don Norman⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Humanity Centered Design), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Mercina Tillerman Perez⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Circle & Crypto), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Tyler Adams⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (Blockchain), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Todd Haselhorst ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠(Blockchain for Logistics), ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Vince Yang⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ (ZK Proofs)

Twelve metric tons and a SpaceX rocket. That’s all it would take to begin building industry on the Moon. Factories would rise. Humanoids would adapt.

Asteroids would be mined. And within decades, the solar system could host an economy millions of times larger than Earth’s today.

The catalyst is a paper by Philip Metzger, Anthony Muscatello, Robert Mueller, and James Mantovani outlining a pathway to scalable off-world industry. Their thesis: with as little as twelve metric tons delivered to the Moon, we could set in motion a self-sustaining system at a fraction of traditional costs.

The upside is clear. Manufacturing shifts away from Earth, easing climate pressure. Humanity secures a new home. Our culture extends beyond the planet, with no end in sight.The risks are equally sharp. Corporations could carve space into their next empire. Billions might remain behind, spectators to humanity’s expansion.This is the blueprint for how we leave Earth.

And the reason we may not all go together.Stay curious. Stay disruptive. Keep Thinking on Paper.Subscribe if you believe the hardest part of leaving Earth isn’t the technology. It’s us.

--

TIMESTAMPS

(00:00) Trailer

(02:05) The Vision for Humanity's Future in Space

(03:22) Affordable Rapid Bootstrapping of Space Industry

(04:58) The Role of Resources in Space Expansion

(05:06) Technological Advancements and Robotics

(08:12) Generational Development of Lunar Industry

(09:42) The Evolution of AI and Automation in Space

(10:47) The Future of Humanity Beyond Earth

(14:25) Exploring Space-Based Solar Power

(15:23) The Future of Robotics and AI in Space

(17:21) Challenges of Teleoperation in Lunar Environments

(18:05) The Ambitious Vision for Space Manufacturing

(20:25) Terraforming Mars vs. Space-Based Manufacturing

(22:32) Human Nature and the Future of Space Exploration

Other ways to connect with us:

• ⁠Listen to every podcast⁠

• Follow us on ⁠Instagram⁠

• Follow us on ⁠X⁠

• Follow Mark on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Follow Jeremy on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Read our ⁠Substack⁠

• Email: [email protected]

A 16-year-old in Barcelona dropped out of school, fell in love with ChatGPT, and built a $2 million business selling nasal breathing strips with a single employee in the Philippines.

A small-town tax company in South Carolina used AI to automate W-2 processing and is now on track to do five times its previous volume. A chef who used to spend a day rejigging menus for guests with allergies now does it in a minute.

The story isn't that AI is powerful. The story is that it's free, on a phone, and the gap between a kid in Nogales, Arizona and a kid heading to Harvard is now an internet connection and the ability to ask the right question.

On this episode of Thinking on Paper, we talk with Rajeev Kapur, author of Prompting Made Simple, AI Made Simple, and Chase Greatness, recently named by Forbes as the number one leader bringing AI to everyone, and founder of the Kapur Parada Center of AI in Arizona.

Kapur walks us through why a great prompt is not a sentence but a 300-to-400-word piece of storytelling, why ChatGPT is an answer engine and not a search engine, and how the winners of the next decade won't be the ones with access to AI but the ones who know how to talk to it.

Along the way: persona-based prompting and how to ask Einstein to teach you calculus, the small-business case studies that show what AI does when you point it at a real problem, the mental-health use case Kapur stress-tested with a CEO in crisis, and why storytelling and critical thinking just became the two most economically valuable skills you can develop.

--

🕓 TIMESTAMPS

Trailer: (00:00)

How Do We Democratize AI: (02:30)

Case Studies: How AI Is Being Used By Business Today: (05:44)

Outsourcing and AI Transform Businesses: (06:31) 

How To Prompt Better: (08:08)

Using ChatGPT For Mental Health: (09:25)

AIs Manipulation Of Empathy: (13:44) 

AI Advice For Parents: (14:49)

Deepfakes & Guardrails: (19:45)

Entrepreneur Spikes (26:19)

What Should Humans Be? (28:28) 

--

Other ways to connect with us:

• ⁠Listen to every podcast⁠

• Follow us on ⁠Instagram⁠

• Follow us on ⁠X⁠

• Follow Mark on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Follow Jeremy on ⁠LinkedIn⁠

• Read our ⁠Substack⁠

• Email: [email protected]

Watch on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWEuQmPcqJ8