Third Space Podcast

I had a great conversation with Sarah Carter about how apologists/pastors/theologians/influencers (“middle managers”) in the Church have coerced the consciences of the faithful in matters of voting and sex. We also got into a great conversation about conscience and development of doctrine.

We made frequent reference to my article from earlier this week:

Third Space is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

Today I’m sharing a conversation I had last week with Mike Lewis about Fr. Chad Ripperger of the Archdiocese of Denver. For the past several months, Mike and I have been wanting to record a discussion about Ripperger. Mike has written several really great articles  at Where Peter Is about Ripperger over the last year or two. He is one of the few Catholic journalists who is bringing the many grave concerns about Ripperger to light. We’ve been waiting for the right time to record a conversation and then news broke this week that Ripperger was asked by Archbishop Golka to have a year long “fast” from public speaking. So we thought: Now's the right time.

Mike Lewis is the founding managing editor of Where Peter Is. In addition to his work for the site, his writing has appeared in America Magazine, National Catholic Reporter, US Catholic, The Irish Catholic, Catholic Outlook, The Synodal Times, and other Catholic publications. He has been quoted in The Washington Post, Vanity Fair, The New York Post, and other mainstream outlets on Catholic affairs. He previously co-hosted the Field Hospital podcast with Jeannie Gaffigan and The Debrief podcast. Before founding Where Peter Is, he worked in communications at the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops and Catholic Climate Covenant. He is married with four children.

LINKS:

Fr. Ripperger Steps Back: Denver Restricted Him in 2025https://wherepeteris.com/fr-ripperger-steps-back-denver-restricted-him-in-2025/

Fr. Ripperger’s Bizarre and Dangerous Views on Womenhttps://wherepeteris.com/fr-rippergers-bizarre-and-dangerous-views-on-women-part-1/

Fr. Ripperger’s Disturbing and Harmful Views on Marriagehttps://wherepeteris.com/fr-rippergers-disturbing-and-harmful-views-on-marriage/

The bizarre and dangerous views of a celebrity exorcisthttps://wherepeteris.com/the-bizarre-and-dangerous-views-of-a-celebrity-exorcist/

ABOUT THIRD SPACE: Third Space is the podcast for those who see the beauty of Catholicism, as well as the ugliness, who have experienced real harm AND real grace in the Church. Every episode I will have conversations with guests about the good and the bad in the Church—avoiding easy answers or black & white fundamentalism—in order to hold on to all that is true.

SUPPORT THIS SHOW: Please consider becoming a paid subscriber. All of your support directly helps my family and allows me to continue working on projects like this podcast, the newsletter, as well as resources about spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church.

www.catholicthirdspace.com

LIVING SOLIDARITY: Living Solidarity upholds the infinite dignity of every person by addressing the reality of spiritual abuse and abuse of conscience in the Catholic Church. Living Solidarity helps to build a Church of integrity and solidarity by accompanying survivors of spiritual abuse with trauma-informed life coaching; equipping Church leaders and institutions to confront systemic harm; and creating resources grounded in psychological research and the Church’s Social Teaching. Visit livingsolidarity.com to learn more, to connect with Paul, to schedule individual life coaching, or to invite Paul to speak or consult with your community, parish, seminary, or diocese.

ABOUT THE HOST: Paul Fahey is currently a professional counselor, retreat leader, and the host of the Third Space podcast. He provides counseling for those who have been spiritually abused and creates resources for Church leaders to better safeguard their communities against all forms of abuse. He previously worked for eight years as the Director of Religious Education at a Catholic parish. Paul Fahey lives in Michigan with his wife, Kristina, and their five kids.

Third Space is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

Thank you, Marco for this great conversation about the importance of Amoris Laetita.

Articles we referenced:

Pope Leo XIV Opening Speechhttps://www.vatican.va/content/leo-xiv/en/speeches/2026/october/documents/20261007-anniversario-amoris-laetitia.html

Cardinal Pablo Virgilio David’s addresshttps://www.amorislaetitia.va/content/dam/amorislaetitia/12-october/al-david-eng-original.pdf

Archbishop Timothy Costelloe’s addresshttps://www.amorislaetitia.va/content/dam/amorislaetitia/9-october/al-costelloe-eng-original.pdf

Bishop Erik Varden’s "Laetitiae Amor” articlehttps://coramfratribus.com/life-illumined/laetitiae-amor/

Thank you Brad Klingele, Marco, Rachel Amiri, Theresa Westergard, ElizabethMuhleisen, and many others for tuning into my live video with Sarah Carter and Hendro Munsterman! Join me for my next live video in the app.

Third Space is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

I’ve been really enjoying The Moral Revolution Podcast with Laura Segafredo and Tony Annett, especially their ability to explain the histories and differences between socialism, liberalism, social democracy, and Catholic Social Teaching. Also, it’s an election year and, living in Michigan with Abdul El-Sayed running for Senate, I’ve seen renewed use of the word “Socialism” and rhetoric about how Catholics can’t be Socialists. So I wanted to have Tony Annett on my podcast again, this time to talk about Socialism.

Anthony Annett is an economist and author whose work sits at the intersection of political economy, democracy, and moral philosophy. He spent two decades at the International Monetary Fund, including as speechwriter to two Managing Directors. He holds a Ph.D. in economics from Columbia University and a B.A. and an M.Litt from Trinity College Dublin. He is also a member of the College of Fellows of the Dominican School of Philosophy and Theology. He helped organize Ethics in Action — an initiative that met regularly at the Vatican and brought together representatives of the major world religions alongside economists, development experts, philosophers, business and labor leaders, philanthropists, and activists to formulate a shared moral framework for addressing major global problems. He is the author of Cathonomics: How Catholic Tradition Can Create a More Just Economy (Georgetown University Press, 2022) and Bread and Ballots: Why Democracy Needs Economic Justice to Thrive (forthcoming, Georgetown University Press, 2027). He is also a co-editor of Ethics in Action for Sustainable Development (Columbia University Press, 2022) and a contributor to The Age of Fraternity: An Economy for the Common Good (forthcoming).

Also, I just opened up registration for my next spiritual abuse workshop. This is an online workshop focused on recognizing, preventing, and responding to spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church.

This workshop is for:

* Individuals trying to better understand their experiences of spiritual abuse in the Church

* Clergy and lay leaders interested in safeguarding their communities from spiritual abuse and abuse of conscience

* Therapists or spiritual directors working with clients who have been spiritually abused

This workshop will help you:

* Recognize and prevent spiritual abuse and abuse of conscience in the Church

* Know the symptoms of spiritual abuse, religious trauma, and moral injury

* Better understand and respond to abusive systems in the Church

This is a live online workshop that meets in a small group over the course of five weeks, beginning on October 26.

Visit here for more details:

https://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/spiritual-abuse-workshop-november

LINKS:

The Moral Revolution Podcast https://moralrevolution.substack.com

Tony’s book: Cathonomics: How Catholic Tradition Can Create a More Just Economyhttps://press.georgetown.edu/Book/Cathonomics

Pope Francis Generation episode with Tonyhttps://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/interview-with-tony-annett-a-more

ABOUT THIRD SPACE: Third Space is the podcast for those who see the beauty of Catholicism, as well as the ugliness, who have experienced real harm AND real grace in the Church. Every episode I will have conversations with guests about the good and the bad in the Church—avoiding easy answers or black & white fundamentalism—in order to hold on to all that is true.

SUPPORT THIS SHOW: Please consider becoming a paid subscriber. All of your support directly helps my family and allows me to continue working on projects like this podcast, the newsletter, as well as resources about spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church.

www.catholicthirdspace.com

LIVING SOLIDARITY: Living Solidarity upholds the infinite dignity of every person by addressing the reality of spiritual abuse and abuse of conscience in the Catholic Church. Living Solidarity helps to build a Church of integrity and solidarity by accompanying survivors of spiritual abuse with trauma-informed life coaching; equipping Church leaders and institutions to confront systemic harm; and creating resources grounded in psychological research and the Church’s Social Teaching. Visit livingsolidarity.com to learn more, to connect with Paul, to schedule individual life coaching, or to invite Paul to speak or consult with your community, parish, seminary, or diocese.

ABOUT THE HOST: Paul Fahey is currently a professional counselor, retreat leader, and the host of the Third Space podcast. He provides counseling for those who have been spiritually abused and creates resources for Church leaders to better safeguard their communities against all forms of abuse. He previously worked for eight years as the Director of Religious Education at a Catholic parish. Paul Fahey lives in Michigan with his wife, Kristina, and their five kids.

Third Space is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

It was great talking with Sarah Carter about Pope Leo’s catechetical series on Gaudium et Spes!

We discussed the Church’s relationship with the world as well as how the Church too often squanders its credibility—and there its witness—to proclaim the common good, human dignity, and, ultimately, the Gospel.

Become a paid subscriber to Third Space here: https://www.catholicthirdspace.com/subscribe

Subscribe to Pope Leo Weekly here: https://popeleoweekly.substack.com/subscribe

“The promulgation of Gaudium et Spes recognized in this discernment an essential element of the nature of the Church, describing her pastoral character as constitutive; hence the definition of ‘pastoral Constitution.’ It is not a question of naïve optimism, but rather a renewed fidelity to the Mystery of Christ who, by becoming incarnate, chooses to share our life: He made Himself ‘like His brethren in every respect’ (Heb 2:17; cf. 4:15) and took upon Himself the consequences of sin, dying ‘as a ransom for all’ (1 Tim 2:6). This sharing in our humanity is the path that Christ calls the Church to follow; hence, the Conciliar Constitution Gaudium et Spes begins by declaring that the Church makes her own ‘the joys and the hopes, the griefs and the anxieties of the men of this age, especially those who are poor or in any way afflicted’” (GS 1).

Amoris Laetitia was a pivotal document for me in my own deconstruction away from a rigid and transactional faith to a faith grounded on the gratuitous love of God.

It’s also a document that I often cite in my work to address spiritual abuse and abuse of conscience in the Church. It has really grieved me how much this document is dismissed and maligned by so many Catholics in the US.

So I’m encouraged that Leo is putting it back into the spotlight as a normative teaching for the Church.

This live video has four parts

* Overview of the upcoming meeting on Amoris Laetitia

* Look at the four sections of Amoris that I cite in my work addressing spiritual abuse

* The Communion for divorced and remarried Catholics controversy

* Time for Questions and Response

Thank you to everyone who joined the live discussion!

You see all my notes and citations here:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1cLs2NXijlhM8rHzFYOaWi98OBsoSyxI-/view?usp=sharing

Third Space is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

Over the summer I came across a series of articles on Substack titled, A Proverbial Naked Bike Ride Through Steubenville, Ohio. The author, Lindsay Tsohantaridis, talked about abuse of power  and systemic cultures of abuse within the Franciscan University of Steubenville and wider charismatic community. I found her writing to be insightful and extensively researched. Lindsay was able to put  words to experiences that are really hard to put words to and provided principles and examples that can be applied to any system and subculture within Catholicism. So I was thrilled why she agreed to be on the podcast.

Lindsay Younce Tsohantaridis was born and raised in the Pacific Northwest as an evangelical Quaker. At 19, she became Catholic then earned a BA in English and Masters in Teaching from George Fox University. She worked briefly as an actress on stage and film, portraying St Therese of Lisieux in the independent Catholic film Therese, then taught high school English and Drama. She currently lives in Steubenville, Ohio with her husband and seven children, and has scribbled off to the side for the past twenty years, submitting poetry and non-fiction here and there before starting her Substack.

Also, I just opened up registration for my next spiritual abuse workshop. This is an online workshop focused on recognizing, preventing, and responding to spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church.

This workshop is for:

* Individuals trying to better understand their experiences of spiritual abuse in the Church

* Clergy and lay leaders interested in safeguarding their communities from spiritual abuse and abuse of conscience

* Therapists or spiritual directors working with clients who have been spiritually abused

This workshop will help you:

* Recognize and prevent spiritual abuse and abuse of conscience in the Church

* Know the symptoms of spiritual abuse, religious trauma, and moral injury

* Better understand and respond to abusive systems in the Church

This is a live online workshop that meets in a small group over the course of five weeks, beginning on October 26.

Visit for here more details:

https://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/spiritual-abuse-workshop-november

LINKS:

A Proverbial Naked Bike Ride Through Steubenville, Ohio (Part 1)https://lindsaytso.substack.com/p/a-proverbial-naked-bike-ride-through

Lindsay’s Substackhttps://substack.com/@lindsaytso

Spiritual Abuse Workshophttps://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/spiritual-abuse-workshop-november

ABOUT THIRD SPACE: Third Space is the podcast for those who see the beauty of Catholicism, as well as the ugliness, who have experienced real harm AND real grace in the Church. Every episode I will have conversations with guests about the good and the bad in the Church—avoiding easy answers or black & white fundamentalism—in order to hold on to all that is true.

SUPPORT THIS SHOW: Please consider becoming a paid subscriber. All of your support directly helps my family and allows me to continue working on projects like this podcast, the newsletter, as well as resources about spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church.

www.catholicthirdspace.com

LIVING SOLIDARITY: Living Solidarity upholds the infinite dignity of every person by addressing the reality of spiritual abuse and abuse of conscience in the Catholic Church. Living Solidarity helps to build a Church of integrity and solidarity by accompanying survivors of spiritual abuse with trauma-informed life coaching; equipping Church leaders and institutions to confront systemic harm; and creating resources grounded in psychological research and the Church’s Social Teaching. Visit livingsolidarity.com to learn more, to connect with Paul, to schedule individual life coaching, or to invite Paul to speak or consult with your community, parish, seminary, or diocese.

ABOUT THE HOST: Paul Fahey is currently a professional counselor, retreat leader, and the host of the Third Space podcast. He provides counseling for those who have been spiritually abused and creates resources for Church leaders to better safeguard their communities against all forms of abuse. He previously worked for eight years as the Director of Religious Education at a Catholic parish. Paul Fahey lives in Michigan with his wife, Kristina, and their five kids.

Third Space is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

It was so good to have this live conversation with Timothy Quigley!

This sort-of-impromptu video came from Timothy and I watching and discussing a couple of recent videos of Dominican priests ‘splaining about things they have no understanding of. The priests were exhibiting distilled clericalism, but the problem of clericalism in the Church extends far beyond our east coast friends in white habits.

Sources cited:

2024 Final Synod Documenthttps://www.synod.va/content/dam/synod/news/2024-10-26_final-document/ENG---Documento-finale.pdf

Final Report, Study Group 5: The Participation of Women in the Life and Leadership on the Churchhttps://www.synod.va/content/dam/synod/process/implementation/10workinggroups/final-reports/sg5/SG-5_ENG_Final-Report.pdf

Magnifica Humanitashttps://www.vatican.va/content/leo-xiv/en/encyclicals/documents/20260515-magnifica-humanitas.html

La croix article https://www.la-croix.com/religion/abus-spirituels-d-anciens-membres-de-communautes-demandent-au-pape-des-reponses-fortes-20260907

Dilexi Tehttps://www.vatican.va/content/leo-xiv/en/apost_exhortations/documents/20251004-dilexi-te.html

Today we’re kicking off Season Three! And we’re starting with something a little different. Earlier this month I was a part of a panel discussion with Aimee Murphy about Pope Leo’s encyclical, Magnifica Humanitas. The panel was for a young adult group in my new diocese. And I’m excited to share it with you all here!

I’ve been following Aimee and her work for over a decade now and have tremendous respect for her integrity living out a consistent life ethic. I interviewed her four years ago, during the second season of the Pope Francis Generation podcast, about her book: Rehumanize: A Vision to Secure Human Rights for All. It was a huge honor to present next to her on this panel.

I also want to thank Hunter for putting this event together and St. Monica’s parish in Kalamazoo, MI for hosting.

Two quick things before we jump into the episode.

First, if you like this discussion about Magnifica Humanitas and want to dive in more, I’m leading an online study group through October that will spend four weeks discussing this magnificent encyclical. Check out https://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/magnifica-humanitas-study-group for more details.

Also, if you want me to come out to your parish to give a presentation or day-long conference about Catholic Social Teaching, Conscience, or spiritual abuse, I’d love to see you! You can also find more info about that at https://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/i-can-present-in-person-too

Aimee Murphy is an author, speaker, and creator whose life itself exists at the intersection of communities often pitted against each other. Thus, she seeks to build bridges, breathe love and compassion into the tension, and draw people together across divides. She is the founder of the Consistent Life Ethic nonprofit Rehumanize International, a full-time caregiver for the first "snowflake baby" she and her husband adopted, and a soon-to-be-certified birth doula.

LINKS:

Pope Francis Generation interview with Aimee Murphy - A Consistent Life Ethichttps://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/interview-with-aimee-murphy-a-consistent

Magnifica Humanitas Study Grouphttps://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/magnifica-humanitas-study-group

Magnifica Humanitashttps://www.vatican.va/content/leo-xiv/en/encyclicals/documents/20260515-magnifica-humanitas.html

Have me out to speak at your parishhttps://www.catholicthirdspace.com/p/i-can-present-in-person-too

ABOUT THIRD SPACE: Third Space is the podcast for those who see the beauty of Catholicism, as well as the ugliness, who have experienced real harm AND real grace in the Church. Every episode I will have conversations with guests about the good and the bad in the Church—avoiding easy answers or black & white fundamentalism—in order to hold on to all that is true.

SUPPORT THIS SHOW: Please consider becoming a paid subscriber. All of your support directly helps my family and allows me to continue working on projects like this podcast, the newsletter, as well as resources about spiritual abuse in the Catholic Church.

www.catholicthirdspace.com

LIVING SOLIDARITY: Living Solidarity upholds the infinite dignity of every person by addressing the reality of spiritual abuse and abuse of conscience in the Catholic Church. Living Solidarity helps to build a Church of integrity and solidarity by accompanying survivors of spiritual abuse with trauma-informed life coaching; equipping Church leaders and institutions to confront systemic harm; and creating resources grounded in psychological research and the Church’s Social Teaching. Visit livingsolidarity.com to learn more, to connect with Paul, to schedule individual life coaching, or to invite Paul to speak or consult with your community, parish, seminary, or diocese.

ABOUT THE HOST: Paul Fahey is currently a professional counselor, retreat leader, and the host of the Third Space podcast. He provides counseling for those who have been spiritually abused and creates resources for Church leaders to better safeguard their communities against all forms of abuse. He previously worked for eight years as the Director of Religious Education at a Catholic parish. Paul Fahey lives in Michigan with his wife, Kristina, and their five kids.

Third Space is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.