This Legal Life: Lessons Learned from a Life in Legal

In this inspiring episode of This Legal Life, host Ben Chiriboga speaks with Elise Holtzman, founder of The Lawyer's Edge and a pioneer in coaching and consulting for legal professionals. Elise shares her journey from being a big law attorney to creating a business that empowers lawyers to thrive. She discusses the challenges of transitioning careers, the importance of building meaningful relationships, and her passion for helping others achieve their full potential. Packed with actionable insights, this episode is a must-listen for anyone seeking growth in their legal career.

About Our Guest

Elise Holtzman has dedicated over 16 years to working with lawyers and law firms to help them be proactive about business development, leadership, and career acceleration. As a former practicing attorney with experience working at Fried Frank and Morgan Lewis, Elise brings a deep understanding of the practice of law (and the demands of operating a firm) to her work.

As the founder of The Lawyer’s Edge, she helps leaders promote a healthy, growth-oriented culture in their firms and coaches lawyers on how to bring in more business, retain clients, and communicate effectively. Elise frequently speaks and writes on the subject of business development and career acceleration for lawyers and is the host of The Lawyer’s Edge Podcast.

Website: https://thelawyersedge.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eliseholtzman/

In this episode of This Legal Life, Ben Chiriboga sits down with Christine Uri, a seasoned legal professional turned ESG consultant, to explore her transformative career journey. Christine shares her transition from private practice to in-house roles, the challenges and growth of embracing ESG responsibilities, and the courage it took to launch her own consultancy. This conversation delves into the evolution of legal leadership, the integration of sustainability in business, and valuable insights for navigating career pivots with purpose.

Guest Bio:

Christine is an experienced legal executive committed to making companies more profitable, sustainable, and human-centric. During her corporate career, she served as a Chief Legal Officer, Chief Sustainability Officer, and CHRO at a global company that leveraged technology and expertise to decarbonize the Fortune 500.

In 2023, Christine launched Impact 360, where she partners with general counsel and corporate leaders to level up their game on environmental, social, and governance performance.

You can find Christine on LinkedIn, where she publishes practical insights on sustainability and AI governance for over 24,000 followers.

Connect with Christine on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/christineuri/

In this engaging episode of This Legal Life, host Ben Chiriboga connects with Joel Ankney, a seasoned attorney, author, and solo practitioner. Joel shares his inspiring story of transitioning from big law to founding his own practice, the pivotal moments and mentors that shaped his path, and the lessons learned from over two decades of legal and entrepreneurial experience. A deep dive into building a career aligned with personal values, this episode is filled with insights for those looking to carve their unique path in the legal field.

Guest Bio:

Joel is a business lawyer and author. He graduated first in his class from William & Mary Law School, practiced for 12 years at some of the nation's largest law firms, and then started his own solo practice in 2003.

Joel has self-published three books: one about how to buy a small business, another about how to start a freelancing business, and another about how he has marketed his practice for over 30 years. Joel's books and reputation have created opportunities for him to speak as a guest on numerous podcasts and at leading business schools.

Links:

www.riverguideesq.com | www.ankneylaw.com | LinkedIn | Amazon Author Page

In this engaging episode of This Legal Life, host Ben Chiriboga sits down with Nancy Myrland, a renowned social media consultant and legal marketing expert. Together, they explore the evolving role of podcasting in the legal profession, the power of authentic connection in a digital age, and Nancy’s inspiring journey from sales to becoming a Hall of Fame legal marketer. Through anecdotes, reflections, and actionable advice, Nancy shares how embracing change, trusting your unique perspective, and building genuine relationships can transform careers and industries alike. This conversation is a testament to the impact of personal growth and community in the world of legal business development.

Connect with Nancy:

Email: [email protected]

Twitter: twitter.com/NancyMyrland

Facebook: facebook.com/NancyMyrland

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/NancyMyrland

YouTube: youtube.com/NancyMyrland

Instagram: instagram.com/NancyMyrland

The Myrland Marketing Minute Blog: www.myrlandmarketing.com

In this episode of This Legal Life, host Ben Chiriboga chats with Jonathan Hawkins, founder of Law Firm GC, about his journey from traditional law practice to leading innovative solutions for law firms. Jonathan shares his experiences navigating career crossroads, the trials of building a niche practice, and the evolution of legal operations. From leveraging LinkedIn to adopting entrepreneurial mindsets, this conversation delves into the skills, challenges, and strategies required to thrive in modern legal landscapes.

Bio:

Jonathan Hawkins is the Founder of Law Firm GC and Host of Founding Partner Podcast. He is a business lawyer for lawyers. He helps attorneys and law firm owners identify, understand, and navigate the legal, business, and ethics-related issues that stem from running a law practice. More specifically, he assists lawyers and law firms in starting law firms, law firm structuring, partnership agreements, lateral moves, separation agreements, law firm breakups and dissolutions, health crisis planning, and succession planning.

Connect with Jonathan Hawkins:

• Website – www.lawfirmgc.com
• LinkedIn – https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathan-hawkins-law-firm-general-counsel/
• Instagram – @lawfirmgeneralcounsel
• YouTube – @LawFirmGC

In this episode of This Legal Life, host Ben Chiriboga sits down with EJ Stern and Katherine Wilson, co-founders of Fractional Law Firm CMO, to explore their journey of partnership and innovation. From their early days in traditional legal marketing roles to building a business that serves small and mid-sized law firms, EJ and Katherine share how they leaned into collaboration, creativity, and courage. Their conversation covers the personal and professional turning points that shaped their careers, the challenges of launching a business, and their shared vision for delivering high-impact marketing solutions. This inspiring episode showcases the power of partnership in navigating change and driving results.

About Our Guests:

EJ Stern, MA, CPC, Co-Founder, CMO

EJ is the co-founder of Fractional Law Firm CMO, a company dedicated to helping law firms achieve marketing excellence and sustainable growth. EJ advises law firms and lawyers on how to effectively expand their business and generate greater revenue. She is recognized for her ability to quickly assess challenges and develop and implement solutions.

EJ has nearly 20 years of experience leading strategy, business development, marketing, and lateral integration for the legal industry. As a business development coach, she is adept at helping lawyers cultivate, retain, and grow their client base.

EJ served as US Head of Client Development for Clyde & Co, and Associate Director – Business Development Coaching for Troutman Pepper (f/k/a Troutman Sanders). She previously held marketing positions at Steptoe & Johnson and Proskauer Rose, as well.

EJ is certified through the Academy of Creative Coaching. She received her Master’s degree from New York University, summa cum laude, and her Bachelor’s degree from American University, summa cum laude and Phi Beta Kappa. She lives in Georgia with her husband, two children, and two pugs.

Katherine Wilson, JD, Co-Founder, Fractional Law Firm CMO

Katherine Wilson is the co-founder of Fractional Law Firm CMO, a company dedicated to helping law firms achieve marketing excellence and sustainable growth. With over twenty years of experience as both a lawyer and legal marketer, Katherine understands the unique challenges and opportunities in legal marketing, offering innovative solutions that drive results.

At Fractional Law Firm CMO, Katherine leads a team that provides fractional CMO services, comprehensive marketing strategy, social media management, digital content development, and business development coaching and workshops tailored to the legal industry.

Katherine regularly writes and speaks on how law firms can leverage emerging technologies like generative AI, optimize their marketing efforts, and build stronger client relationships. She is also the author of the forthcoming book, No Clubs Required, which highlights the unique paths women take to achieve success outside traditional business norms.

Passionate about helping law firms thrive, Katherine’s mission is to equip legal professionals with the tools and strategies needed to elevate their marketing and business development efforts, allowing them to focus on what they do best—practicing law.

In this episode of This Legal Life, Ben Chiriboga interviews Alex Su, Chief Revenue Officer at Latitude, about his unconventional journey from practicing lawyer to thriving in the legal tech world. Alex candidly shares his experiences, from clerking and working at prestigious law firms to navigating setbacks in small firms and ultimately discovering his passion for sales, marketing, and technology. He delves into the transformative power of community, social media, and embracing one's unique strengths in building a career outside traditional legal roles. The conversation also highlights emerging opportunities in the legal industry, fueled by innovation and shifting professional paradigms.

Meet Alex:

Alex is the Chief Revenue Officer of Latitude.

As a member of the executive leadership team, Alex is responsible for leading the company’s sales and marketing efforts.

Prior to joining Latitude, Alex spent nearly fourteen years working at the intersection between law and innovation. Previously, he held a range of sales and marketing roles at emerging startups serving the legal sector and was most recently the Head of Community Development at Ironclad, a contracts technology company.

In addition to his sales and marketing experience, Alex has an active presence on social media. He has over 250,000 followers on LinkedIn, Twitter, Instagram, and TikTok and publishes a newsletter called Off The Record that discusses unique career paths, business development, and the future of work. Alex is a member of the Fastcase 50, a group of visionaries and leaders who are “leading the charge on innovation in the law.”

Alex graduated from the Northwestern Pritzker School of Law in 2010 where he served as an editor of the law review and was the student commencement speaker. He is a former associate at Sullivan & Cromwell and clerked for the Hon. Edmond E. Chang of the Northern District of Illinois. Alex is a New York native who now lives in Alameda with his wife and their two children.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexander-su/

https://latitudelegal.com/

In this episode of This Legal Life, host Ben Chiriboga sits down with David Sazant, a former litigator turned therapist and founder of Pursuit Counseling and Therapy. The conversation explores David’s unique journey from the courtroom to counseling, delving into how his legal background shapes his therapeutic practice. Together, they discuss the emotional toll of legal careers, the importance of mental health in the profession, and practical insights for navigating career transitions with purpose and resilience.

About David:

David is a former litigator turned men’s therapist. After coming to terms with his own reality that a career in litigation wasn’t in line with his values nor his strengths, David decided to leave litigation for a career in mental health where he now helps clients navigate similar concerns, among others. In helping others navigate anxiety, self-doubt, low self-esteem, low assertiveness, depression, and more, David’s mission is to have clients find their confidence, clarity, and drive.

• Website: www.pursuittherapy.ca
• Instagram: @pursuit.therapy
• TikTok: @pursuittherapy

In this episode of This Legal Life, host Ben Chiriboga engages with Jen Leonard, founder of Creative Lawyers and former Chief Innovation Officer at Penn Carey Law. The conversation spans Jen's dynamic career journey, from her roots as a litigator to her current role driving change in the legal profession through innovation and education. Jen shares insights on the transformative potential of generative AI, the importance of diverse professional networks, and how design thinking can reshape the future of legal services. This episode is a masterclass in resilience, creativity, and embracing change in an evolving industry.

Guest Bio:

Jen Leonard is the Founder of Creative Lawyers, a company dedicated to supporting law firms, corporate legal departments, and courts that understand the urgency to modernize practice and services. Jen works with leaders to cultivate innovative cultures, build nimble strategies to navigate a volatile environment, and promote mindsets that drive change. She leads design thinking workshops, facilitates innovation challenges, delivers retreat keynotes, provides ongoing strategic support, designs educational Generative AI content, and offers structured events that help lawyers reflect on their careers as they build the next stage in their journey.

Before launching her company, Jen was the first Chief Innovation Officer and Executive Director of the Future of the Profession Initiative at Penn Carey Law. She practiced law for ten years after graduating from Penn Carey Law in 2004 and before returning to build the Law School's Center on Professionalism, which became a nationally-recognized law student professional development program.

At Penn, she teaches Generative AI in Law Practice, Design Thinking for Lawyers, Modern Law Firm Business and Innovation Strategy, and Attorney Well-Being as Ethical Obligation. She has also taught design thinking and ideation techniques to industry leaders in Wharton's Executive MBA program and Penn Nursing's Summer Innovation Institute.

Jen is a Fellow of the College of Law Practice Management, a member of Penn's Inn of Court, served on NALP's Driving Inclusion Task Force, and received Penn's Beverly Edwards Award for Exceptional Leadership. The American Bar Association honored Jen in its 2024 list of Women in Legal Tech. She also serves on the Board of Pro Bono Institute.

Jen hosts several podcasts about the legal profession, including 2030 Vision: AI and the Future of Law (co-hosted with the President & CEO of the American Arbitration Association, Bridget McCormack), Law 2030, Future-Proofed (co-hosted with Kirkland's Chief Innovation Officer, Rachel Dooley), and Practising Law Institute's Fast-Tracked: Emergent Issues in the Legal Profession. She writes and speaks frequently about innovation and the legal industry's future.

Links:

http://www.creativelawyers.net/

https://www.youtube.com/@2030VisionPodcast

In this episode of This Legal Life, Ben Chiriboga sits down with Elizabeth Kennedy, Principal at New Edge BD, to explore her remarkable journey in the legal industry. From her early days at Jaffe Associates to leading innovative business development strategies at top firms like Weil Gotshal and Mayer Brown, Elizabeth shares insights on cross-practice collaboration, lateral integration, and client-focused growth. With reflections on the evolution of legal marketing and the challenges of aligning multidisciplinary teams, this conversation unveils practical strategies for adapting to an ever-changing legal environment while driving client success.

Meet Our Guest:

With three decades of experience driving business development and revenue growth in AmLaw 50 firms, Elizabeth founded NewEdge BD to help law firms drive value through their business development initiatives.

In-house Experience: Directed strategic initiatives and built business development infrastructure and teams at Mayer Brown, Bryan Cave Leighton Paisner (formerly Bryan Cave), Debevoise, Weil, and Hogan Lovells (formerly Hogan & Hartson).

Consulting Experience: Led impactful BD and strategic projects for law firm clients of all sizes, including boutique and mid-sized firms, at Jaffe Associates.

Favorite Projects: Busting practice silos by creating collaborative and multi-disciplinary solutions that bring the best of the firm to market.

Education: Fordham University, BS, Psychology and Economics

Personal: Native Washingtonian and long-time New Yorker, Elizabeth lives in Charlotte NC with her spouse, David, and their two Siberian husky-mix puppies, Jake and Roxy.