Amy Oldenburg spent 26 years at Morgan Stanley — operations, emerging-market FX, the trading desk, then the firm's global emerging-market investing business — before the bank created a Head of Digital Assets seat and asked her to do it full time. In this TRM Talks, Amy joins Ari to talk about how she leveraged over two decades at the Morgan Stanley to accelerate the firm’s exploration into digital assets.The conversation moves from bicycle-messenger settlements in India and currency devaluations to why so many of Amy’s former emerging-market FX colleagues ended up in crypto. Amy talks through what she is seeing across banking, equities, wealth, and asset management: what is possible today, what still depends on regulation, and what could change by 2028 and beyond. She also breaks down tokenization as financial plumbing — simpler systems, faster yields, and more efficient capital calls — and shares a lesson from having an expensive NFT phished from her wallet: transparency does not always mean safety.

Amy Oldenburg spent 26 years at Morgan Stanley — operations, emerging-market FX, the trading desk, then the firm's global emerging-market investing business — before the bank created a Head of Digital Assets seat and asked her to do it full time. In this TRM Talks, Amy joins Ari to talk about how she leveraged over two decades at the Morgan Stanley to accelerate the firm’s exploration into digital assets. The conversation moves from bicycle-messenger settlements in India and currency devaluations to why so many of Amy’s former emerging-market FX colleagues ended up in crypto. Amy talks through what she is seeing across banking, equities, wealth, and asset management: what is possible today, what still depends on regulation, and what could change by 2028 and beyond. She also breaks down tokenization as financial plumbing — simpler systems, faster yields, and more efficient capital calls — and shares a lesson from having an expensive NFT phished from her wallet: transparency does not always mean safety.

EP. 120 | From Emerging Markets to Tokenization with Morgan Stanley’s Amy Oldenburg

In this episode, Ari is joined by close friends and two of the most important voices in our space: Rebecca Rettig, Chief Operating Officer and Chief Legal Officer at Jito Labs, and Michael Mosier, founding partner of Arktouros and former acting director of FinCEN.Rebecca developed deep subject matter expertise as a financial-services litigator working with the earliest DeFi protocols, including an early pitch to Uniswap when the team numbered four people in a Williamsburg loft. Michael came through DOJ, OFAC, and FinCEN, and traces a through-line from protective orders for domestic-violence survivors to cryptography as a tool for people living under authoritarian control.The focus is on the future of DeFi. In a brand new paper, the dynamic duo lay out a framework institutions can implement under current law, and explains why OFAC and BSA enforcement has never targeted SWIFT, telecoms, or RPC nodes the way critics fear it will target crypto infrastructure. They cover the GENIUS Act's focus on issuers rather than networks, US DOJ’s prosecution of a Tornado Cash developer and the Blockchain Regulatory Certainty Act. Mosier also addresses the panic around AI, arguing these systems function as motion sensors rather than a person standing in front of the car with a red flag.

In this episode, Ari is joined by close friends and two of the most important voices in our space: Rebecca Rettig, Chief Operating Officer and Chief Legal Officer at Jito Labs, and Michael Mosier, founding partner of Arktouros and former acting director of FinCEN. Rebecca developed deep subject matter expertise as a financial-services litigator working with the earliest DeFi protocols, including an early pitch to Uniswap when the team numbered four people in a Williamsburg loft. Michael came through DOJ, OFAC, and FinCEN, and traces a through-line from protective orders for domestic-violence survivors to cryptography as a tool for people living under authoritarian control. The focus is on the future of DeFi. In a brand new paper, the dynamic duo lay out a framework institutions can implement under current law, and explains why OFAC and BSA enforcement has never targeted SWIFT, telecoms, or RPC nodes the way critics fear it will target crypto infrastructure. They cover the GENIUS Act's focus on issuers rather than networks, US DOJ’s prosecution of a Tornado Cash developer and the Blockchain Regulatory Certainty Act. Mosier also addresses the panic around AI, arguing these systems function as motion sensors rather than a person standing in front of the car with a red flag.

EP. 119 | How Institutions Can Use Permissionless Rails with Rebecca Rettig and Michael Mosier

Every other week, TRM’s Global Head of Policy, Ari Redbord, sits down with business leaders, policy makers, and investigators from across the globe to talk about the key crypto policy, regulatory and enforcement issues of the day.

Every other week, TRM’s Global Head of Policy, Ari Redbord, sits down with business leaders, policy makers, and investigators from across the globe to talk about the key crypto policy, regulatory and enforcement issues of the day.

TRM Talks Trailer

Every other week, TRM’s Global Head of Policy, Ari Redbord, sits down with business leaders, policy makers, and investigators from across the globe to talk about the key crypto policy, regulatory and enforcement issues of the day. Subscribe to our channel for the latest developments from the world of blockchain and cryptocurrency.

About TRM Labs
TRM provides blockchain intelligence to help financial institutions, cryptocurrency businesses and public sector agencies detect and investigate crypto-related fraud and financial crime. www.trmlabs.com.

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Every other week, TRM’s Global Head of Policy, Ari Redbord, sits down with business leaders, policy makers, and investigators from across the globe to talk about the key crypto policy, regulatory and enforcement issues of the day. Subscribe to our channel for the latest developments from the world of blockchain and cryptocurrency. About TRM Labs TRM provides blockchain intelligence to help financial institutions, cryptocurrency businesses and public sector agencies detect and investigate crypto-related fraud and financial crime. www.trmlabs.com.

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