Jody Hoffer Gittell is Professor of Management at Brandeis University's Heller School for Social Policy & Management, and co-founder and board member of the Relational Coordination Collaborative. She is an expert in the human and humane approach to building organizations.

Highlights from the conversation include: what it means to build a relational organization and culture; emphasizing internal conversation as a better form of accountability; having a broader set of measures when  assessing both individual and whole community performance;  leveraging numbers and data to promote a  feedback loop of learning, coaching and teaching as opposed to just punitive judgement; how to navigate power structures and politics while also recognizing the interdependence within an organization; building mutual relationships with external stakeholders; and Rod's golden rule of simply treating everyone  like human beings!