white people, black music and liberation

the term "reverse racism" often gets used as a weapon to shut down conversation, but the feeling underneath it is real and worth naming honestly. this is an attempt to offer a better frame for that feeling, one that points toward liberation rather than division, and one i don't hear enough people talking about.

resources: 
Why I Can't Make Up My Mind About Race Policies & Reparations | Know Better, Do Better




















white people, black music, and liberation is an independent podcast exploring race, music, and what it means to move from *programming* into liberation. 
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have a thought, a question, or a story of your own? reach out at [email protected] 
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follow the journey at whitepeopleblackmusic.com
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i used to believe i could love Black music and stay out of politics. a relationship forced me to confront how much harm was hiding inside that belief. this episode is a personal story about music, privilege, accountability, and what it actually means to be in right relationship with the culture you love. if you've ever said "i just want to play music," this one is for you.

white people, black music, and liberation is an independent podcast exploring race, music, and what it means to move from *programming* into liberation. 
.
have a thought, a question, or a story of your own? reach out at [email protected] 
.
follow the journey at whitepeopleblackmusic.com
✶

what happens inside you when someone is hurt by watching you play music rooted in a culture that isn't your own? drummer and educator aaron kierbel gets honest about the tension many white musicians carry, and shares a remarkable story from his adolescence about identity, belonging, and what he calls a moment of "racial confusion." 

white people, black music, and liberation is an independent podcast exploring race, music, and what it means to move from *programming* into liberation. 
.
have a thought, a question, or a story of your own? reach out at [email protected] 
.
follow the journey at whitepeopleblackmusic.com
✶

(00:00:00) are we just coddling white folks? (with aaron kierbel)

(00:00:01) Welcome to White People, Black Music, and Liberation

(00:00:29) Introducing Aaron Kerbel: Drummer, Educator, and Friend

(00:01:17) The Tension Between White Space and Racial Justice

(00:03:46) The Importance of White Spaces for Racial Reflection

(00:10:56) Creating Spaces for Cross-Racial Dialogue

(00:12:03) Wrapping Up and Next Episode Preview

(00:12:28) Support the Podcast Community

white people doing racial justice work often face a hard question from their own communities: is focusing on white folks actually helping or just letting them off the hook? in this conversation with drummer and educator aaron kierbel, we explore the healing power of honest conversation, why white people need spaces to talk about race with one another, and how that work can open the door to deeper cross-racial dialogue rather than replace it.

white people, black music, and liberation is an independent podcast exploring race, music, and what it means to move from *programming* into liberation. 
.
have a thought, a question, or a story of your own? reach out at [email protected] 
.
follow the journey at whitepeopleblackmusic.com
✶

in this conversation with matré we explore the role spiritual practice can play in antiracism work. meditation, inner reflection, and deep conversation can open spaces where we see our patterns more clearly and respond from courage and love rather than fear. https://whitepeopleblackmusic.com/

white people, black music, and liberation is an independent podcast exploring race, music, and what it means to move from *programming* into liberation. 
.
have a thought, a question, or a story of your own? reach out at [email protected] 
.
follow the journey at whitepeopleblackmusic.com
✶

continuing the conversation with matré, we explore the idea that racism is a collective wound in our society. what does liberation actually look like for white or white passing people doing this work? and how can inner growth, spiritual practice, and racial justice support each other on the path toward healing?

white people, black music, and liberation is an independent podcast exploring race, music, and what it means to move from *programming* into liberation. 
.
have a thought, a question, or a story of your own? reach out at [email protected] 
.
follow the journey at whitepeopleblackmusic.com
✶

why should anyone care about racial justice? in this episode matré reflects on growing up near a racial divide and the emotional truth that something in our society simply does not feel right. we explore the idea that injustice harms everyone and why that realization can become a call toward healing and liberation.

white people, black music, and liberation is an independent podcast exploring race, music, and what it means to move from *programming* into liberation. 
.
have a thought, a question, or a story of your own? reach out at [email protected] 
.
follow the journey at whitepeopleblackmusic.com
✶

in this episode, erich continues his conversation with hip hop artist and cultural worker matré, exploring a central tension many white and white passing people encounter: how to relate ethically, honestly, and responsibly to being white and playing black music. matré reflects on his lifelong relationship with hip hop, the questions that arose as he navigated identity and belonging, and how conversations with trusted people, including his brother, helped clarify the real impact of race and access. this episode is not about arriving at a single answer, but about staying in relationship with the question. it’s an invitation into vulnerability, humility, and ongoing learning, grounded in love for the music and commitment to liberation. to hear more from matré, including reflections on music, healing, and courageous conversation, check out his podcast love bravely: https://podcasts.apple.com/podcast/the-love-bravely-podcast/id1783210134

white people, black music, and liberation is an independent podcast exploring race, music, and what it means to move from *programming* into liberation. 
.
have a thought, a question, or a story of your own? reach out at [email protected] 
.
follow the journey at whitepeopleblackmusic.com
✶

in this episode, erich is joined by hip hop artist and cultural worker matre for a candid conversation about why conversations around race can feel so charged, vulnerable, and difficult, even among people committed to justice and growth. together, they explore fear, in group dynamics, overlapping identities, and the tension between saying the “right” thing and speaking from love. the conversation touches on race as a collective wound, the vulnerability of being witnessed, and what becomes possible when we choose growth over performance. this episode is the first in a short series with matre, and opens space for honest reflection at the growing edge of race, music, spirituality, and liberation. to hear more from matre, including reflections on music, vulnerability, and healing, check out his podcast love bravely: https://podcasts.apple.com/podcast/the-love-bravely-podcast/id1783210134

white people, black music, and liberation is an independent podcast exploring race, music, and what it means to move from *programming* into liberation. 
.
have a thought, a question, or a story of your own? reach out at [email protected] 
.
follow the journey at whitepeopleblackmusic.com
✶

in this episode, erich responds to a question that arises often in conversations about cultural appropriation: is the narrative itself harmful, or is it naming harm that already exists? this conversation is especially oriented toward white and white passing listeners engaging with black, indigenous, and diasporic music and traditions, and who sense that responsibility, reciprocity, and liberation are part of the work. through personal reflection, lived experience, and spiritual framing, this transmission explores cultural appropriation as a product of deeper systems that center whiteness and make extraction invisible. rather than avoiding discomfort, this episode invites listeners to examine cause and effect, power dynamics, and the role of guilt and shame as signals of imbalance rather than moral failure. if you want to be a more deeply involved in this journey, sign up at:  http://whitepeopleblackmusic.com/

white people, black music, and liberation is an independent podcast exploring race, music, and what it means to move from *programming* into liberation. 
.
have a thought, a question, or a story of your own? reach out at [email protected] 
.
follow the journey at whitepeopleblackmusic.com
✶