Wicked Problems - Climate Tech Conversations

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In this episode of Wicked Problems, Kristian Ruby, Secretary General of Eurelectric, shares insights from his recent visit to a Ukrainian power plant operating under war conditions. Ruby discusses the resilience and ingenuity of Ukrainian engineers maintaining energy infrastructure despite frequent bombings, the importance of Europe's preparedness for similar scenarios, and the necessity for robust energy infrastructure and cybersecurity. The conversation also covers the strategic shifts required in Europe's supply chain and critical infrastructure ownership, emphasising closer cooperation with the authorities and increased vigilance against sabotage and other threats.

00:00 Introduction and Welcome

00:14 Experiences in Ukraine: A Personal Account

00:54 Visiting a Power Plant in a War Zone

02:49 Daily Realities of War for Power Engineers

04:41 Europe's Need to Prepare for War

06:10 Challenges in Energy Infrastructure Resilience

07:07 Recent Sabotage and Security Concerns

08:43 Strategies for Enhancing Resilience

13:01 Dependence on Foreign Infrastructure

19:41 Supporting Ukraine's Power Sector

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In this special edition of 'Wicked Problems,' host Richard Delevan moderates a session at the Climate and Energy Summit 2025 held by Chatham House. The session brings together prominent climate tech startups focusing on adaptation and resilience, AI, carbon capture, and geothermal energy, and more:

Julia Kumari Drapkin, CEO & founder, ISEECHANGE

Taco Engelaar, SVP & Managing Director UK & Europe, Neara

John Hartley, CEO, Levidian

Gus Grand, Chief Executive Officer, and Lucy Cotton, Principal Geologist, Eden Geothermal

Expert panelists Fiona Harvey, Marisa Drew, and Peter Hirsch question the startups on their solutions' feasibility and impact. The startups present innovative ways to mitigate climate risks, enhance grid resilience, and decarbonize hard-to-abate sectors. Audience interactions and polls reveal insights into which technologies and stakeholders are deemed crucial for the next wave of climate action.

00:00 Welcome to the Climate Energy Summit 2025

02:07 Introduction of the Host and Event Overview

03:36 Discussion on Climate Tech and Election Impact

04:39 Expert Panel Introduction and Climate Tech Debate

08:51 Audience Interaction and Polling

11:38 First Company Presentation: IC Change

18:23 IC Change Q&A Session

31:00 Second Company Presentation: Niara

38:08 Niara Q&A Session

43:13 Competitors and Market Positioning

45:23 Insurance Industry and Grid Failures

47:22 Decarbonizing Hard-to-Abate Sectors

48:30 Levidian's Loop System Explained

49:48 Real-World Applications of Graphene

54:48 Challenges and Opportunities in Methane Capture

01:01:44 Eden Geothermal's Innovations

01:03:32 Geothermal Energy in the UK

01:07:20 Global Geothermal Advancements

01:09:00 Audience Q&A on Geothermal

01:16:41 Closing Remarks and Future Outlook

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As other companies working on the energy transition in the US fold, the Finnish energy tech giant Wärtsilä - with big footprint in energy storage and energy management systems - is doubling down. What do they know that others don't? We asked Malin Östman, the company's head of strategy.

We had our conversation in person at the legendary Chatham House, during their Climate and Energy Summit 2025. And we share some highlights from the public bits of the event that caught our ear.

If you're enjoying these conversations and want to go ad-free, I'd invite you to check out ways you can help us keep offering independent analysis from the smartest folks in climate and energy. Go to wickedproblems.earth and check us out!

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Outro Track of the Day

For reasons that should become clear…https://open.spotify.com/track/5PGYWv9Xp4IraLSDs8h1bY?si=1b23870ffdad4629

Ben Cooke, Earth Editor at The Times and returning champion guest on Wicked Problems, walks us through why his news outlet just devoted a whole series to climate adaptation.

Over the past 18 months, a big thesis of this project is that a certain amount of climate risk and climate effects are already happening. Very few people are willing to talk about it publicly, which I think has put all of us at a huge disadvantage.

Because talking about adaptation takes you from some pretty abstract notions about mitigating emissions, CO2 levels and average global temperatures and becomes a really local thing. What's gonna happen in my town? What should we done about it? Who's gonna pay for that?

Seeing the series of reporting on adaptation in the UK’s paper of record, particularly with the scene-setter from Science Editor Ben Spencer and cobylined with Anna Dowell, to me says we’ve really hit a big moment.

Some other pieces in the series that we discuss:

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/environment/article/solar-panels-farmland-food-security-times-earth-wdb6dlhk8

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/environment/article/reforestation-flood-defence-farmers-times-earth-8wgzqjdg7

https://www.thetimes.com/article/f6181881-35b2-4333-97ae-2396ca835727

Yeah But What Can I Do?

Funnily enough, as we discussed in last episode with Ivo Mensch of the Climate Majority Project’s Forum, you might stop doomscrolling and hang out in meatspace with other people who see now for what it is but are not queuing up to throw soup at plexiglass protectors of famous Van Gogh paintings.

Talking to your neighbours about how to save each other in a natural catastrophe far more likely because of climate change that is here now is a very different chat from ‘you should go vegan to save some future version of the sky’.

Tickets are still on sale for their event 15-16th March at Limehouse Town Hall in London.

Spam is Bad

A few people have said we’re pushing you to many things that aren’t relevant. Some of you have nixed our emails. That happens with a fast-growing audience but we care what you think. We want to provide you things in which you find value.

Shorter eps? No emails about eps bar a once-a-week thing? Different content streams for our themes, because to be fair we cover a lot of waterfront from politics to tech to law to finance to culture to science. We value your time and don’t want to waste it.

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It’s late. Stupid late. Despite remaining in recovery from 3 broken ribs and a part-collapsed lung that have sidelined me for 10 days, here’s a bit of catching up with some hope - some chaps in America who did what they could in this moment: sensing that climate data and analytics (along with other funded science) was about to go under the wheels of the Tump Train, we caught up with some guys organising a flotilla of small boats to carry what they can away from the blitzkrieg onslaught to help prepare to fight another day. It’s a climate data Dunkirk.

Outro of the Day

If that’s the opiates talking I make no apologies. Time to figure our where you fit in to help, as things collapse into a nightmare timeline.

We interview Ivo J. Mensch about the Climate Majority Project Forum focused on grassroots climate actions with a particular focus on adaptation, happening in London this weekend.

And we speak with Raj Desai and Jeremy Herzog of Fulton Ring, who have successfully rescued important FEMA climate risk data from the MAGA bonfire. Finally, we talk with Jonathan Gilmour, a data scientist at Harvard School of Public Health, who helps lead a nationwide effort to safeguard environmental and public health data in the current emergency.

They discuss the importance of data preservation, the role of international backups, and ways the tech community can contribute to this critical mission.

Outro Tracks

Hopefully listening will be as cool as compiling it. Listen: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/2AWvHdqqNAUCJcByQEokut?si=e9d16d87d386420a

Having cleared our guns, we’ll be back soon with the Times’ Ben Cooke on their turn to adaptation, Leo Rayman on Eden Lab on how to properly score the sustainability of business operations, and much more.

If you can help us keep this going, we’d very much appreciate it.

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In this episode of Wicked Problems, host Richard Delevan delves into the latest developments in the UK's carbon budget and examines the prospects for clean industrial transitions in Europe. With highlights from the UK's Climate Change Committee's seventh carbon budget and insights from Emma Pinchbeck on future household energy savings, the discussion emphasizes the urgent need to reduce electricity prices while expanding clean power technologies. Interviews with climate tech experts, including Liam Hardy from Green Alliance and Charlie Mercer from the Startup Coalition, explore the pressing need for government support in electrifying industries and the potential impacts of decentralized approaches to renewable energy. The episode concludes with reflections on BP's strategic pivot back to oil and gas and the broader geopolitical implications of the energy transition.

00:00 Introduction to Clean Electricity and Carbon Capture

00:21 Weekly Climate News Recap

01:33 UK's Carbon Budget and Future Projections

03:34 Challenges and Opportunities in Clean Energy Transition

05:45 BP's Shift in Energy Strategy

07:06 Interview with Charlie Mercer on Climate Tech

09:08 Government Spending and Climate Tech Investments

15:41 Liam Hardy Green Alliance

17:16 Interview with Liam Hardy on Electrification of Industry

29:46 Encouraging Innovation in Smaller Startups

30:20 The Cost Disparity Between Electricity and Natural Gas

31:11 Understanding the Spark Gap

33:19 Challenges in Reducing Electricity Costs

37:17 Government Policies and Industrial Support

39:32 Creative Solutions for Energy Transition

41:24 Debating Hydrogen and Carbon Capture

45:43 Final Thoughts and Future Directions

48:39 BP Investor Call

48:39 BP's Strategic Reset and Future Plans

56:19 The Gulf of America Controversy

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In this episode, host Richard Delevan discusses the failures and frustrations of traditional climate activism with sustainability strategist Joseph Gelfer. They explore Gelfer's call for 'climate populism'—a revolutionary, rather than reformist, approach to climate change that involves mobilizing public dissatisfaction with the elites. Delavan delves into how populist tactics used by figures like Donald Trump and Nigel Farage could inform a more aggressive climate strategy. The episode also touches on the far-reaching implications of political and technological trends led by influential figures such as Elon Musk and Peter Thiel, and what that means for the future of climate action.

00:00 Introduction and Frustration with Current Approaches

00:25 Welcome to Wicked Problems

00:51 Net Zero 2050: A Sinister Goal

01:17 Energy Policies and Their Consequences

01:40 Testimony of Secretary of Energy Chris Wright

01:56 The Role of Jordan Peterson and the Alliance for Responsible Citizenship

02:40 The Impact of Elon Musk and Data Control

03:27 Conversation with Joseph Gelfer: Sustainability Strategies

06:43 The Disconnect in Sustainability Efforts

07:58 The Need for Revolutionary Change

10:21 Understanding Trumpism and Climate Denial

17:39 Climate Populism: A New Approach

21:27 The Potential of Farage and Future Political Shifts

24:44 Defining Success and Truth

26:33 The Spectrum of Truth

27:30 The Climate Crisis and Ethical Dilemmas

29:54 Final Thoughts and Contact Information

33:47 The Conservative Movement's Long Game

37:41 Silicon Valley's Libertarian Vision

43:47 The Crisis of Democracy

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This edition is supported by our friends at the Climate Majority Project. If you’re in the UK, and have decided it’s time to do something more than doomscrolling and more useful than throwing paint…on 15-16 March at Limehouse in London.

Get more info and tickets here.

Fires in Los Angeles at last count had $35 billion plus of insured losses and probably $300 billion plus of economic losses. Who should pay?

Here to help decode that we spoke with Dave Jones - former Insurance Commissioner for California from 2011 through 2018. He's now the director of the Climate Risk Initiative at University of California, Berkeley. He recently wrote an oped in the New York Times arguing that the oil companies should have to pay for the damages of the LA wildfires, to arrest the insurance crisis.

Steve Coulter of the Green Alliance here in the UK expands on, slight tension, conundrum, paradox. Steve talks about his recent briefing on this point, particularly focusing on Lloyd's of London.

And, um, finally, our good friend, returning champion, Dana Drugmand, journalist, publisher of Climate in the Courts and One Earth Now, who's been helping us understand these issues in the US nearly a year now. She helps us explore the counteroffensive launched against the Empire State’s 2024 Climate Superfund law by 22 Republican state attorneys general who filed suit against state of New York to challenge the law signed by Governor Kathy Hochul at the end of last year. Dana compares that to some of the other pushback to the first-of-its-kind bill that was passed and signed into law earlier last year in Vermont.

06:35 Interview with Dave Jones: Background and Climate Risk

08:22 Insurance Industry's Role in Climate Change

10:11 Holding Fossil Fuel Companies Accountable

15:03 Subrogation and Legal Actions

18:12 Impact on Insurance Markets and Homeowners

20:15 Financial Risks and Regulatory Responses

38:39 Mitigation Measures and Legislative Actions

48:06 Industry Split on Sustainable Practices

49:09 Lloyd's of London: A Case Study in Poor Performance

50:33 The Growing Uninsurability Crisis

53:53 Government Intervention and Systemic Risks

56:33 Call to Action for Policymakers

59:50 New York's Climate Superfund Law and Legal Challenges

01:07:34 The Broader Implications of Climate Litigation

01:22:40 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

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Last week, to a lot of online reaction, not all of it good, we spoke to Kelly Wanser from Silver Lining, a non profit that advocates for research in this area. Not everyone was happy we talked about the subject. Understandably people are concerned, with good reason. Humanity doesn't have a great track record of avoiding being reckless or selfish and making decisions here in the so called global north that will definitely hurt other people — but we do it anyway.

Whether it's like small island states that will go under the waves in our lifetimes because of. These effects and at the International Court of Justice hearing lawyers for big nations basically saying, “oh, well, that's sad Sorry about that. I don't think we can do about it though But here here's some tickets to get some immigration for a couple thousand of you anyway to come to Australia but in exchange, we're gonna need your fishing rights and Mineral rights for the undersea stuff.”

Or telling India and China, “sorry. No, you cannot have the standard of living that fossil fuels enabled The West to have.” Weirdly, not everyone is super excited with that kind of trade off.

So if we’re going to feel obliged to look seriously at SRM - which is not the same as endorsing it - at the very least there should be ground rules: Insisting that the science done by and for researchers in the global south should be given privileged position in conversations about whether to do that research, about how to weigh potential costs and benefits, how to govern any of that stuff, how to even talk about it. Because places like Latin America, or South Africa, or Pakistan tend to have communities least able to cope with any potential negative outcomes. Andy Parker, Founder and CEO of the Degrees Initiative based in Bristol in the UK, has doing exactly that for 16 years - we think it made for an interesting chat.

And in May, Degrees Initiative is convening the world’s largest conference to date on SRM, in Cape Town, South Africa. It might well reset the global conversation on the science, the economics, and the geopolitics of SRM.

If you’re enjoying these conversations, do please share it, leave a rating and review on the platform of your choice, and send us feedback here at wickedproblems.earth.

00:49 Current Climate Challenges and Innovations

01:39 Global Perspectives on Climate Science

05:14 The Ethics of Solar Geoengineering

10:05 Interview with Andy Parker

19:22 The Degrees Initiative and Global South

23:45 Potential Risks and Considerations of SRM

26:32 Potential Side Effects of Not Using SRM

26:57 Security Implications and Uncertainties

27:40 Degrees Initiative: Research and Support

28:40 Fictional Scenarios and Real Concerns

30:03 Termination Shock and Climate Impact

37:01 Governance Challenges of SRM

40:22 Mainstream Media and SRM Discourse

43:15 Popular Culture's Take on SRM

45:50 Final Thoughts and Future Directions

48:34 Conclusion and Contact Information

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Professor Dana R. Fisher of American University is one of the most astute analysts of two things going through a huge stress test right now in the US - climate science, and democracy.

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The necessity of today’s outro track will become obvious, and with apologies for my slandering of Flava Flav:

She spoke to us from near Washington, where Elon Musk and his merry band of DOGE incels is being cheered on by Donald Trump as they ignore court orders and systematically gut research on the climate.

She joined us at the end of last year, to talk about her book Saving Ourselves: From Climate Shocks to Climate Action. We planned to talk for maybe 20 minutes today about her recent work researching and documenting the vandalism to American science underway. Then she told us about her new research surveying attendees at the “People’s March” who were 75% female, overwhelmingly moderate, middle-aged, mainstream Democratic voters, she found that 33% of people surveyed thought violence was justified to protect American democracy. And that was BEFORE Trump’s inauguration and his pardon of those convicted of violently trying to overturn the results of the 2020 US election on Jan 6 2021.

So we went over time. For nearly an hour.

Come walk with us.

Outro Tracks

Chapters

05:33 Introduction and Guest Welcome

05:52 Discussing the Current State of the Apocalypse

06:22 Field Work and Resistance Movements

08:37 The People's March and Data Collection

10:02 Media Misrepresentation and Crowd Sizes

15:00 Political Violence and Survey Findings

23:32 Impact on Federal Funding and Research

29:06 Government Actions and Future Implications

34:06 National Guard and Rising Tensions

34:49 Impact on Jobs and Development

35:39 USAID and Soft Power

37:51 Theories on Government Dismantling

38:38 Civil War and Martial Law Concerns

39:02 Military's Role and January 6th Reflections

48:20 Normalization of Violence

51:00 Climate Change and Democracy

52:36 Future Uncertainties and Personal Reflections

Thanks

Appreciate you listening/watching/reading us. As we also get into it’s more important than ever that we get voices like Prof. Fisher’s to you to make sense of what’s happening. And what might be coming. We hope you’d consider helping us continue the work by becoming a material supporter of Wicked Problems - and maybe even share the love by gifting a subscription to someone who appreciates apocalyptic optimsm.

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