This one’s spicy!  I am not the biggest curser.  I like the occasional f-bomb, but it’s not typically how I speak, so I don’t do it often in my business.  For some people, it’s part of their brand.  Not me.

This is an exception.

I had a BIG insight when working with one of my coaches who talked about re-writing our thoughts, beliefs and stories.  In my notes I wrote TBS for short. 

Then a bubble burst and I saw our limiting thoughts, beliefs and stories as This Bull Sh*t.

I go into further detail in this short and FEISTY episode about how to drop TBS and grow a garden with all that fertilizer! (Wear headphones if little ones are around). 

Specifically, I talk about:

• How limiting beliefs show up for women lawyers who feel trapped or stuck.
• How to recognize BS thoughts by paying attention to your body and inner language.
• A simple exercise to replace limiting stories with expansive, true beliefs.

WILL

The WILL- Women Interested in Leaving Law Podcast is hosted by Elena Deutsch, a dedicated legal career coach and catalyst. This podcast is more than a good listen; it’s an invitation to explore new possibilities and shed limiting beliefs. As WILL Alumni and guests share their journeys beyond traditional legal practice, you’ll see that change is not just possible, it’s within your reach

Feel stuck, unhappy, or ready to explore your own WILL journey?

Book your consultation with Elena: womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com/book-a-call

Follow

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/elena-deutsch/
• Instagram: www.instagram.com/womeninterestedinleavinglaw
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/womeninterestedinleavinglaw

Web:https://womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com

Imagine you’ve gone from big law to in-house and become a GC.  Yet, you feel empty. 

You’ve been a “success” and yet you long for more.

Finally, you allow yourself to explore what else you can do and your passion for travel rises to the top.  

At first you don’t believe it’s possible to make money doing that, but you take one small step at a time to explore.   (Travel is a multi-billion dollar industry after all!)

In this episode of the WILL Podcast, Kathleen Fong shares how WILL guided her transformative journey to become a travel advisor. 

• What helped her transition from GC to entrepreneur. 
• How her legal skills have been instrumental in her new role.
• How she couldn’t have imagined it was possible to meet her financial goals for the year, but she surpassed them in October! 

Kathleen delights in the joy of helping clients create unforgettable travel experiences. For her the WILL Community and support was instrumental in pursuing her dreams.

About Kathleen

Kathleen Fong has been a practicing attorney for more than 20 years - in Big Law and in-house General Counsel and Chief Legal Officer roles from San Francisco to New York. She understands firsthand the pressures of a demanding legal career and the constant pull of competing priorities. After stepping away from full-time legal practice, she began exploring what a fulfilling next chapter could look like. Joining WILL helped her find purpose and joy through her lifelong passion for travel.

She's now the founder of a boutique travel advisory grounded in the skills she honed as a lawyer: meticulous planning, strategic thinking, and creative problem-solving. Today, she specializes in helping busy professionals, especially women lawyers including some WILL members, take thoughtfully curated, effortless, and exceptional trips, without the time-consuming details

WILL

The WILL- Women Interested in Leaving Law Podcast is hosted by Elena Deutsch, a dedicated legal career coach and catalyst. This podcast is more than a good listen; it’s an invitation to explore new possibilities and shed limiting beliefs. As WILL Alumni and guests share their journeys beyond traditional legal practice, you’ll see that change is not just possible, it’s within your reach.

Feel stuck, unhappy, or ready to explore your own WILL journey?

Book your consultation with Elena: womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com/book-a-call
 

Follow Us:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/elena-deutsch/
• Instagram: www.instagram.com/womeninterestedinleavinglaw
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/womeninterestedinleavinglaw

Web:https://womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com

Imagine everything in your business or career is successful, but something tugs at you to pause.

Imagine allowing yourself to stop producing, proving, and hustling long enough to ask who you are without your work or title.

In this episode, I’m joined by Goli Kalkhoran, creator of  ‘Lessons from a Quitter’, to explore what it means to press pause on a successful business and sit with uncertainty to uncover what’s next.

She illuminates how:

• Success and alignment are not the same.
• Productivity and hustle culture are deeply tied to identity, especially for high-achieving women and lawyers.
• Growth requires stopping, stillness, and trust. 

Listen in as Goli offers a compassionate and honest perspective on evolving beyond fixed identities, and trusting what’s next.

About Goli

Goli Kalkhoran is a Master Certified Life Coach, and former attorney, who helps unfulfilled professionals create a career (and life) they actually like. She is the host of the Lessons from a Quitter podcast where she uses her platform to de-stigmatize quitting and provide resources and inspiration to individuals looking to pivot in their established careers. She challenges people to exceed their own expectations and guides them through the initial steps of starting over in order to build a more intentional, fulfilling life.

At the time of recording this podcast, Goli had pressed pause on “Lessons from a Quitter” for an indefinite sabbatical.  

Website: www.lessonsfromaquitter.com

Instagram: www.lessonsfromaquitter.com/lessonsfromaquitter

Facebook: www.facebook.com/lessonsfromaquitter

Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@lessonsfromaquitter

WILL

The WILL- Women Interested in Leaving Law Podcast is hosted by Elena Deutsch, a dedicated legal career coach and catalyst. This podcast is more than a good listen; it’s an invitation to explore new possibilities and shed limiting beliefs. As WILL Alumni and guests share their journeys beyond traditional legal practice, you’ll see that change is not just possible, it’s within your reach.

Feel stuck, unhappy, or ready to explore your own WILL journey?

Book your consultation with Elena: womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com/book-a-call
 

Follow Us:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/elena-deutsch/
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/womeninterestedinleavinglaw
• Web: https://womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com

Show Notes

What Else If Not Law workshop, Feb 11th. Sign up here: https://whatelseifnotlaw.womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com/main

Do you feel successful on paper but internally frustrated, exhausted, or unfulfilled?

Do you wonder whether the problem is the law itself, or whether you’re in the right environment?

Do you feel anxious, wondering whether you will ever feel truly satisfied in your career?

You’re far from alone.

In this episode, I’m joined by Jennifer Gillman; a former practicing attorney, turned legal matchmaker, and founder of Gillman Strategic Group. Jennifer helps rainmakers find the right law firm fit and re-claim fulfillment without leaving the profession.

She shares her own unexpected transition out of practice and offers a candid look at what actually creates autonomy, leverage, and satisfaction for lawyers, especially women. 

Listen in and learn:

• Why success and fulfillment are not the same.
• How building relationships and clients creates real power, flexibility, and boundaries.
• Why women consistently undervalue themselves and how that mindset limits compensation and choice.

This conversation is an honest, nuanced look at what it takes to be a happy lawyer, whether that means staying put and changing the rules, moving firms strategically, or simply seeing new possibilities you didn’t know existed.

About Jennifer

She is the founder of Gillman Strategic Group, where she helps rainmakers find their exact right, perfect-fit firm and law firm owners navigate strategic mergers. 

After earning her J.D. from NYU School of Law and B.A. from Brandeis University, Jen practiced law for 12 years before transitioning to legal recruiting.

Unlike traditional recruiters who find lawyers for firms, Jen finds firms for lawyers. She helps partners identify what they truly need to be fulfilled, whether that's better resources, growth opportunities, or work-life balance, and then matches them with firms where they can thrive.

Connect

Web:http://happyrainmakers.com

Show notes

Book: The Happy Rainmaker: A Little Tale About a Lawyer Who Found Success and Happiness Too. Launching on January 16th.

Imagine you make great money as a lawyer, yet feel trapped by the “golden handcuffs” and unsure if this is the life you want.

Imagine you see that you could leave (big) law, reduce stress, AND pursue a life that aligns with your values, without sacrificing your financial stability.

In this episode, financial advisor Niraj Chhabra, talks through how lawyers; especially women attorneys, can gain clarity around money, values, and career choices.

He shares deep insights into how:

• Behavioral financial planning isn’t just about numbers; it’s about understanding the why behind your money choices and life impact.
• Many lawyers stay in roles long after they need to because of misconceptions about what they can afford and their values.
• Women attorneys face unique financial pressures like guilt around spending on support to long-term planning tied to longevity, caregiving, and confidence with decision-making.

Listen as Niraj breaks down practical strategies on how to align your finances with your life goals and offers an empowering perspective for women in law to take control of both their money and their futures.

About Niraj

Niraj Chhabra is the founder of Sidebar Advisors, a boutique financial planning firm built exclusively for attorneys navigating complex compensation structures, demanding careers, and long-term wealth strategies. The firm serves a range of legal professionals, from rising associates to equity partners, with a mission to provide personalized, behavior-focused guidance that supports both professional success and personal clarity. 

Niraj is also the host of the Sidebar Advisors podcast, where he highlights diverse journeys within the legal field and explores what’s ahead for the profession.

Connect

Website: https://sidebaradvisors.com/ 

Niraj LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/nirajchhabra 

Sidebar Advisors LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/sidebaradvisors/ 

Sidebar Advisors Legal Podcast: https://www.buzzsprout.com/2033338  

WILL

The WILL- Women Interested in Leaving Law Podcast is hosted by Elena Deutsch, a dedicated legal career coach and catalyst. This podcast is more than a good listen; it’s an invitation to explore new possibilities and shed limiting beliefs. As WILL Alumni and guests share their journeys beyond traditional legal practice, you’ll see that change is not just possible, it’s within your reach.

Feel stuck, unhappy, or ready to explore your own WILL journey?

Book your consultation with Elena: womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com/book-a-call
 

Follow Us:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/elena-deutsch/
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/womeninterestedinleavinglaw

Imagine realizing your vision of practicing law doesn't fit in someone else's structure.

Imagine trusting yourself enough to bring that vision to life. Building a firm grounded in your values, your instincts, and the impact you want to make.

Imagine choosing to create something meaningful. Not because the path is certain, but because staying aligned with your purpose matters more than staying comfortable.

In this episode, Princess Uchekwe, talks through how she made the leap into founding The Chief Counsel; her fractional general counsel firm that provides legal expertise to start-ups. 

She shares her journey of cultivating “quiet courage,” trusting her inner vision, and building a business rooted in clarity, collaboration, and competence. 

Listen is as Princess covers:

• Why courage isn’t just a series of bold moves, and more a quiet, daily self-trust that sustains you when external validation is missing.
• How legal advice can be reframed from “no” to “how,” so you can move forward with compliance, clarity, and confidence.
• How to make the leap into entrepreneurship even if you don’t feel 100% ready and why that leap might be exactly what helps you grow.

She offers heartfelt advice to other women lawyers “Trust yourself, start where you are, and take the leap!”

About Princess

Princess, the Founder and Managing Attorney at The Chief Counsel, is a fractional general counsel firm for start-ups and emerging companies.

Before starting The Chief Counsel, Princess spent seven years at Eldridge, a leading investment firm, where she served as Director and Legal Counsel. During her time there, she played a key role in advising on private equity and credit transactions across entertainment, technology, and real estate.

Connect with Princess

• Website: www.thechiefcounsel.com 
• IG: www.instagram.comthe.chiefcounsel 
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-chief-counsel-law-firm/ 
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/princessuchekwe/ 

WILL

The WILL (Women Interested in Leaving Law) Podcast is hosted by Elena Deutsch, a dedicated legal career coach and catalyst. This podcast is more than a good listen; it’s an invitation to explore new possibilities and shed limiting beliefs. As WILL Alumni and guests share their journeys beyond traditional legal practice, you’ll see that change is not just possible, it’s within your reach.

Feel stuck, unhappy, or ready to explore your own WILL journey?
 

• Book a consult: https://bit.ly/4oq9l2d
• LI: https://bit.ly/4oskvDH
• Web: https://womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com

In this special one year anniversary celebration episode of the WILL Podcast, I reflect on key moments in the podcast.  

I share about the top themes from interviews with women lawyers - especially pivotal moments that helped them make their career changes.  I also focus (okay, rant!) on the importance of getting okay with discomfort as we grow and make bold new moves.  

I highlight:

• The “straw that broke the camel's back” moments..
• How “aha moments” lead to perspective shifts.
• How discomfort is good for us. 

This episode encourages you to tune into your own 'straw that broke the camel's back' and/or “aha-ha” moments and how they can help galvanize you.  

The WILL- Women Interested in Leaving Law Podcast is hosted by Elena Deutsch, a dedicated legal career coach and catalyst.

Book a consult: https://bit.ly/4oq9l2d
 

Follow:

• LI: https://bit.ly/4oskvDH
• Web: https://womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com
  

Show Notes

• Samorn Selim https://bit.ly/4pGzJG5
• Yael Eiserike https://bit.ly/445sfEs
• Sarah Burke https://bit.ly/3KlAUfl
• Erin Cowling https://bit.ly/4iTEcDv
• Courtney Schulnick (unpublished)

Consultants:

• Christina Gilibert, Marketing Strategist https://bit.ly/4ry7RFR
• Holly Cope, Global Legal Tech Creator https://bit.ly/44254ei
  

Pivot: The Nontraditional J.D. Careers Handbook by Alexandra Davis http://bit.ly/44yH02I

Do you ever feel like you’re doing everything for everyone else and still running on empty?

Would you love to show up as confident and grounded, but you’re often overwhelmed, burned out, or questioning whether you even want to stay in law?

You’re not alone.

In this episode, I’m joined by Career Leadership Coach Emily Hirsekorn, who helps lawyers build clarity, confidence, and fulfillment using her Career Leadership Code and a powerful Energy Leadership framework.

Emily, as she explains “The big idea is there's energy behind our thoughts, our feelings, our actions and communication. . . . it’s very practical.”

Listen in and learn:

This conversation is a deep exhale for any lawyer who’s tired of pushing harder and ready to show up differently, with more clarity, confidence, and compassion for herself.

About Emily

Emily is a career leadership coach for lawyers with a background in private legal practice, anti-bias education, law career advising, and professional development. She is credentialed with the ICF and is also certified with the Institute for Professional Excellence in Coaching (iPEC) as an Energy Leadership™ Index-Master Practitioner and COR.E Leadership Dynamics™ Specialist. She offers iPEC’s robust leadership development curriculum designed to help maximize lawyer performance, influence, and fulfillment and delivers talks regularly on performance management and her signature framework The Career Confidence Code.

Connect

www.hirsekorncoaching.com

www.linkedin.com/in/emilyhirsekorn/ 

www.instagram.com/hirsekorn_coaching/

WILL

The WILL- Women Interested in Leaving Law Podcast is hosted by Elena Deutsch, a dedicated legal career coach and catalyst. This podcast is more than a good listen; it’s an invitation to explore new possibilities and shed limiting beliefs. As WILL Alumni and guests share their journeys beyond traditional legal practice, you’ll see that change is not just possible, it’s within your reach.

Feel stuck, unhappy, or ready to explore your own WILL journey?

Book your call with Elena: womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com/book-a-call

Follow Us:

Imagine you are a Romanian immigrant Lawyer who relocates to New York at 22 years old, re-does law school and passes the NY Bar.

Imagine you think you have to be “Superwoman” and do it all - set up and run a business, have a baby, look a certain way - and not realize the mistakes you're making along the way.

Imagine you’re arrested and your 14 year-old daughter sees your mug shot while watching TV after school.   

Andreea Parc never asked for help in her law practice because she thought “I can handle it.” Even while on trial for unethical practices, she felt that her ignorance of US procedures would lead to a non-guilty result.

She made a mistake, and went to prison.

Yet instead of prison being the proverbial “cage”,  Andreea felt free; liberated from the pressures of perfection, shame and a “Superwoman” identity.

She shared everything she learned with her teenage daughter Alexa Dumitru, and created a dual-journey of transformation.

Mother and daughter honestly share their experiences and how Andreea’s journey to prison, ultimately set both of them free. 

Andreea helps attorneys and law firms prevent ethical, financial, and emotional crises before they happen.

Because prevention isn’t just about compliance — it’s about sparing yourself, your team, and your clients from the pain that follows when awareness breaks down.

As a former attorney in private practice and CFO to the New York Taxi King (who was also an attorney), Andreea has lived through the high-stakes pressure, temptations, and blind spots and the decisions and behaviours that resulted in quiet destruction of even the most successful careers, firms and business.

Today, through Quantum Risk Management Consulting, she bring that lived experience into a holistic framework that blends law, psychology, geneology, ethics, and human awareness — helping professionals recognize and manage risk from the inside out.

The WILL- Women Interested in Leaving Law Podcast is hosted by Elena Deutsch, a dedicated legal career coach and catalyst. This podcast is more than a good listen; it’s an invitation to explore new possibilities and shed limiting beliefs. As WILL Alumni and guests share their journeys beyond traditional legal practice, you’ll see that change is not just possible, it’s within your reach.

Feel stuck, unhappy, or ready to explore your own WILL journey?

Book your consultation with Elena: womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com/book-a-call

Follow Us:

Do you spend much of your day thinking: “I need to do XYZ…”?

Does your endless to-do list and litany of “shoulds” parade through your mind?  

If it’s hard to hear what YOU TRULY want to do, you’re not alone.

Here are three questions that quickly cut through the internal noise. 

Listen to these three simple questions.

And because I LOVE you for being here, and value your time,  here they are! 

Here they are:

Listen in to play along and…

This episode is your gateway to freedom from mental clutter and offers almost instantaneous relief.

WILL

The WILL- Women Interested in Leaving Law Podcast is hosted by Elena Deutsch, a dedicated legal career coach and catalyst. This podcast is more than a good listen; it’s an invitation to explore new possibilities and shed limiting beliefs. As WILL Alumni and guests share their journeys beyond traditional legal practice, you’ll see that change is not just possible, it’s within your reach.

Feel stuck, unhappy, or ready to explore your own WILL journey?

Book your consultation with Elena: womeninterestedinleavinglaw.com/book-a-call

Follow Us: