For our double episode, we talk to Ron Kaufman, world’s leading educator and motivator for uplifting customer service and building service cultures. Tsun-yan, Ron, and Huijin have a wide ranging conversation about the “caring” crisis underlying more obvious crises like climate change, protectionism, and co-vid induced disruption, and how that could be overcomed if we let go our isolated sense of self, and instead embraced the human connection with others. This calls for Presence, the topic of episode 16, to lean into each moment, with joy and heart.