Maryam: Hey guys! Welcome back to the Extra Credit podcast. I’m Maryam, your host. If this is your first time tuning in to our podcast, let me give you a quick rundown.

Every month, we talk to students, graduates, professors and people from academia about their stories, their insights, and their thoughts about the beauty and challenges of studying abroad.

Today, we have a special guest, Monica Millares. She’s a trailblazer for women working (and thriving) in the financial technology market — or “fintech” for short. If you’re wondering what that is, think of online banking, e-wallets, virtual credit cards and other kinds of payment you can make that don't require you being face to face with an actual person.

With a degree in engineering and management of information systems, she has spent many years growing her career around the world, from her home country in Mexico to the UK and all the way to Asia. Seven years ago, Monica moved to Malaysia to spearhead the launch of BigPay, which is one of the largest digital banks in South-East Asia today. 

But before all of that, Monica here was just another ambitious international student like you and I. She travelled to the UK to pursue a Master’s degree in Management of Information Systems at the London School of Economics. 

Monica, welcome! So glad to have you join us today. 

Monica: Thank you, Maryam. The pleasure is all mine. Thank you.

Maryam: Alright. I just want to let you know that I think your journey is really inspiring, seeing how far you’ve worked your way up to becoming a major industry leader after you graduated. We know that it takes a lot of grit and hard work to succeed in this field.

For many of us, the experiences and skills we’ve gained during our student days often shape how we approach the real world. So, let’s go back to the beginning, alright, I’ll dive right into the questions, okay?

Growing up, what was your childhood like? What was it that sparked your interest in engineering?

Monica: Well, I had a good childhood. But at the same time, I was a nerd. I’ve always been a nerd. Since I was in kindergarten, I was the best in the class. So, my childhood was a lot about studying as well. I always got a diploma for “Best in Class” at the end of the year, from kindergarten all the way to middle school, high school, university, and then my master’s. 

So, that’s part of who I am and I guess, because I was at the top of the class many, many times, when it came to the moment to decide what to study, engineering was kind of one of the things that people suggested to me. It’s not that I wanted to, but they were like, “Oh, you should study engineering because you’re good at maths, because you have good grades.” And that’s how I ended up doing it. 

Maryam: That’s so great to hear but, yeah, sometimes, we do things because people tell us that that’s what’s good for us. But I’m glad that in your case, it’s something that you actually excelled in, so it became the right career path for you.

So, back in 2002, you used to study Industrial Engineering at a local university in Mexico, but what made you decide to do a master’s degree in Management of Information Systems in the UK?

Monica: Yeah, I guess, it was two things. One, my mother. She always said, “Hey, you have to continue your studies and, if possible, study abroad.” So, that was one thing, you know, like the push from parents.

Then, the other one was — my first job was as an intern in the product team in a development bank. And well, my parents didn’t pay for my master’s. I paid for it. So, basically, what I did — it’s like, I had to get a scholarship, and the easiest way to get a scholarship back then was to study a tech-related master’s. At the end, I did not get a scholarship, but instead, I got a loan to go abroad. But same, I got it because it was a very technical field that I was getting into. Just practical.

Maryam: Well, your mom wanted you to study abroad, but was it your choice to study in the UK or were there other options and other countries?

Monica: Well, I looked into the US and the UK and Europe, but my mom passed away when I was way younger. So, it was not like she forced me to, right. She was not around. It was 100% my choice to go. 

Maryam: As I know it, Management of Information Systems blends technical, scientific and business knowledge together. So, can you tell us a bit more about what sort of coursework you were doing? And which did you enjoy the most?

Monica: Yeah, so, when I studied engineering, we had coding classes, right. And I enjoyed them. But then when I started working, I used to work a lot with the tech team within the bank, so my idea of studying my master’s was like, oh, I wanted to do the systems architecture in a company and be super technical. And when I got to LSE — basically, LSE was very social science-based as well, at least back then. So, the programme that I studied ended up being not technical. It was called Analysis Design and Management, right, so it was the social aspect of technology. 

E.g. What happens when you introduce new tech to a company? You’re going to have resistance. How do you design it?

Like, it was much more the human side, if you want, of technology that I ended up studying, which was fascinating as well. 

Maryam: So, was there any sort of challenging coursework you had to do knowing that it’s more social science-geared rather than something that’s more technical?

Monica: Yeah, like I said, it was not technical. With technical, I mean, it was not me learning how to code, how to build a software, right. It was technical in the sense that we were talking about IT. So, in that sense, it was technical, but it was not like hands-on writing software as such. 

LSE is a very difficult uni, so every course was difficult. 

Maryam: I can imagine that. So, you know, being in London is really exciting, but like anyone going anywhere new, the first few days and weeks can be super tough. What was it like for you when you first got to LSE? And what were some of the biggest challenges you faced as an international student while you were abroad in the UK?

Monica: That’s a beautiful question. I think, at the beginning, it was super exciting. I was just extremely excited, so everything was like “Wow” and I got to London where I was staying. I was like, “Oh, it looks like Harry Potter!”

So, I was extremely excited to be there, so I always saw the good things. Some of the challenging things at the very beginning was the weather. It gets very cold — especially, you know, in Malaysia, we’re used to the sun. Mexico is not as hot as Malaysia, but still. So, the weather was a big deal. 

Then, of course, I spoke English, but my native language is Spanish, and when I got there, I couldn’t understand a thing. It’s because the accent was different. I was used to American English instead of British English, so I couldn’t understand it, really. And I was like, “Oh my God, this is so hard.”

So, English was a barrier and then, I think the social part was not because the great majority of people in the class were international. So, this is a uni where the great majority of people are international. So, it’s formed where you have international friends all in the same boat. However, when I finished my master’s, 99% of my friends left and that’s when it was really, really, really hard. Because then I was in London on my own with no friends and it was rainy and gloomy and dark, and I was like, “Waaah, I don’t like it.”

So, I went through what I call a quarter-life crisis and it was just because I didn’t have friends. 

Maryam: Aww, that’s okay. Can you tell us a bit more about that quarter-life crisis? How did you cope with it, especially when your friends left? How were you able to rise above that? Especially being by yourself.

Monica: Yeah. That was tough. I used to cry. I’m a crier. I don’t cry as much as I used to anymore, but I used to cry a ton. Basically, I wanted to come back home and my dad would tell me, “Monica, you don’t realise how lucky you are. So many people would love to be in your place.” 

So, I have this saying: Sometimes, you just have to push through, right. 

So, it’s not that I coped. I just have a large tolerance to pain, which is good and bad. But then, eventually, what I did was — I met a life coach. I went to one of his events. It was a dating coach. It was not just a life coach. It was a dating coach. I met him and went to a Saturday two-hour workshop and since then, I was like, “Oh my God, this is so good.” And then I started getting into life-coaching and “mindset” and basically managing my emotions, and that’s what really helped me. But before that, I struggled a lot. 

Maryam: I’m glad that you were able to overcome it and I’m glad that those events worked out for you. Were there other students in your batch at LSE who were also struggling with the same things as you did?

And also, I’m just curious, what was the student population like? 

Were there a lot of women or female students who were also going through the same thing as you, especially when they’re, you know, studying STEM?

Monica: Yeah, in my programme, we were, like, 5% women, but within the cohort of everyone else coming to LSE that year, there were, like, tons of women and such. So, I could say, my female friends were from the other programmes rather than from my own. Because we weren’t just like four, five, right, and I think most of us from “not cold weather” countries struggled a ton with the darkness and the weather. 

I have a friend, Sarah. I remember we used to live in the same residency and then, at the end of October or the beginning of November — I don’t remember — on a Sunday, it’s the change of the clock. So, basically, it’s, like, you need to move the clock one hour, right? So it’s like daylight savings and when that happened, I remember she called me and she was like, “Monica, what’s going on? It’s, like, 5pm and it’s already dark.”

And that was the beginning of winter. It was kind of like, oh my God. And all of us were not used to that.

Maryam: Yeah, I know, I’ve been through that as well, especially the change in weather. 

In my case, as someone from Malaysia, when I used to study in the UK as well, the four seasons were something I had to familiarise or acclimatise with, right?

So, just sort of like, circling back to you and your friend, Sarah and how women only made up 5% of your class, right?

We know that, nowadays, I’ve seen your other podcasts and also, you know, the other blog posts you used to write, we know that you often champion diverse voices in your field, but women represent less than a third of the global STEM workforce and in the UK alone, only 35% of STEM students in higher education are women. 

So, what was it like pursuing a STEM degree that’s usually male-dominated? 

I’m sure that was a different experience, right?

Monica: Yeah, I noticed it. I’m saying yeah, all the time. So, when I studied Engineering in Mexico, (it was the) same. We were five women. They were, like, all men and I think that was the first time that I struggled. But at the same time, I didn’t, because my family, like, my cousins were all men except my other cousin and I. So it was, like, many men and two women. And I used to play football and they were, like, “Oh, don’t be a girl. Don’t cry.”

I was somehow used to hanging out with boys, let’s say. So, when I started uni, I just became best friends with the guys and I was like, “Oh, I’m one of the guys. I’m one of the guys.” Like, that’s when I studied Engineering. 

When I moved to the UK, I didn’t really feel it, like, (while) studying my programme because I was used to it and everybody’s super friendly. When I felt it was when I joined the workforce and I remember the kind of, uh, vivid images I still have. It’s like me getting into the office in a very nice big building in Canary Wharf, getting into the lift and then, like, if you look at me in real life, I’m petite-sized. So, I’m not that tall. I’m petite-sized and slim. So, I got into the lift and I got to be surrounded by all these men in suits, British, you know, like, white. They looked different to me and I was like, oh my God, I’m the only girl here. That’s when I started noticing it, like, in the workplace, rather than in my degree. 

Maryam: But…did you face any challenges in the workforce when you’re being surrounded by mostly men? Especially since they’re local?

Monica: Yeah. I think I didn’t have confidence. I always used to think, “slash”, say, that people treated me differently because I was a Mexican woman in the UK. That was just in my mind probably — partially yes, partially no. I don’t really know. 

But yeah, I didn’t have much confidence back then. So, the struggles, they were always inner struggles rather than something specific happening. What I do remember, as in, if something specific happened, was at some point, I had a manager who gave me feedback and he told me, “Hey, you should be more of a bulldog” and I was like, “What is that supposed to mean?” 

And then if I already had, like, “so and so” confidence, that didn’t sit that well, right. Because I was like, “Well, I’m not a bulldog but what do you mean?”

And then it’s like — that was tough. 

Maryam: I can imagine that. So how did you manage to prove yourself in that sort of environment? 

Monica: That's a brilliant question. So, I think it’s a combination of three to four things. I am a hard worker. That’s it. I’m a hard worker. All the time, since I was a kid, right. So, that’s number one.

Number two, like I said, since I was a kid, I was a nerd. So I liked studying. When I moved from studying to work, what that meant is, I liked being prepared, I liked being the best in the class, right. So, that behaviour kind of, like, continues at work.

So, I always wanted to do, like, the best possible work ever. And then, given the somewhat lack of confidence, it was like uh, “Oh no, I need to do better.” Right, and then somehow the reality (is) that I think there’s some conscious biases that I could perceive or didn’t. It’s like, as a Mexican woman with a bubbly personality in a male, British-dominated environment, I just felt like I had to give the extra mile. Always. 

And that’s how I ended up proving myself. I worked a lot and I always gave the extra mile, and the quality of my work was really, really high. So, what happened, it’s like, when I was in school, I could always get a diploma at the end of the year. When I joined Visa, when I joined Barclays, if it’s performance reviews, back then, they also had, like, award programmes. At the end of the review cycle, I could get an award from the Visa programme and I could get an award from the Barclays programme just like I did in uni because that’s what I was programmed to be somehow.

Maryam: That’s so impressive! You really did prove them wrong, and you’ve basically worked your way up to a leadership role. 

Do you think that your experience at LSE had helped you get to that point in any way? 

And if so, how did it help you? 

Monica: Yes, I think it’s three things or two. In LSE, well, it’s a very prestigious university, right? So, I graduated with a Distinction. So, as much as I say that I didn’t have confidence, when it comes to academics and smarts, that’s where I have the most confidence, while being humble. So, what LSE did, by me graduating from this really good university and graduating with a Distinction, that gave me a super boost of confidence. 

Because I was like, oh, I am good at that. It was not like, oh, I got diplomas in Mexico. It was more of uh, oh, I got a Distinction in LSE.

And that helped (with) my confidence a ton. So, the first few years of my career, that, you know, that was part of me, I was like, yeah, I’m very proud that I graduated with a Distinction from LSE as a Mexican woman. So, that really helped a lot. And then, the other one is — one of the things I liked about LSE is that they used to have, like, open classes. And then, in the open class or lectures, they got to bring politicians, they got to bring the Prime Minister of so and so, the Prime Minister and then, it’s like, I could go to these rooms and I was like, “Oh my God.”

I don’t remember their nationalities now but it’s like, oh, there’s the Prime Minister of so and so just sitting a few rows in front of me. I’m like, “That is so cool.” And I’d get the chance to, not meet the Queen, like shaking hands, no, that didn’t happen, but I was in the same room as the Queen of England. And I was like, “Oh my God.”

So, all those experiences helped me build the — not only confidence — but this mindset of “I want to be like them. I could be like them.” These are, like, you know, successful people. They (LSE) put them in front of us because they are like role models and that could be us one day. So, I’m very ambitious as well.

I don't know where I got that from. I’m ambitious and I’m a dreamer. I’m both and I’m a hard worker. So, the mix of all those experiences — it’s like they just pushed me to be like, “Oh yeah, that’s possible.” And that’s how it influenced me.

Maryam: Right on. 

So you said that, you know, studying in LSE allowed you to meet really influential people from around the world. 

Did you get to actually, you know, speak to them or ask them for advice?

Monica: No, it was just like — they were on stage. They were being interviewed by someone, but sometimes, just like, it’s like when you go to a concert, right. You can hear the music in your house all the time. You can go to the movies. But when you go to a concert and you have your favourite artist in front of you, there’s something about the presence of that person in front of you that you’re like, “Oh my God, this is so inspiring.”

So, even though I didn’t get to speak with them one on one, just being in front of them was wow. Many years after, I loved going to conferences. You know, it’s that feeling of, “Oh, I’m meeting so and so in person.” It’s a, I don’t know, it’s a geeky thing as well. But yeah, I love meeting, like, not my heroes but the people I admire in person. It makes a difference.

Maryam: If you could name one of those public figures you met that, you know, influenced you the most, like, the ones that you met at LSE, the most memorable in-person experience, which one would it be?

Monica: The Queen. Obviously. 

Maryam: Tell us a bit more about that.

Monica: It was the opening of the new building in LSE. So, basically, they invited certain students to be part of the ceremony. It was a big deal, right. I mean, basically, uh, it influences from the moment of — hey, you’ve been invited to this ceremony and you’re like, “Oh my God, what do I, you know, what are the protocols?” Because it’s like, you cannot wear this, you cannot do this, like, shake hands with the other. I was not going to meet her and shake hands but you know, they tell you all these protocols. So, just like, from the moment of saying, “Oh, I’m going to be in the same room as the Queen and I’m going to see her walk in”, it’s amazing.

And I remember, yeah, like, she was coming in and I was on the sides. I was like, aah. So amazing. Yeah, that’s the most memorable one. 

Maryam: I’m sure that one was also iconic. Imagine being influenced by the queen though.

Monica: Oh, that could have been amazing, right? Like, finally meeting her. That could have been, like, wow.

Maryam: We were talking about powerful women. I think that is a great example, right?

Monica: Yeah, and actually, now that you said that, I should have some pictures somewhere, maybe on my Facebook, like from many, many, many, many, many, many, many years ago that I haven’t seen. I hope I still have them. You made me think. Now I’ll just, like, go and check if I have some. 

Maryam: Would be great! I mean, if you could share some of those photos with us as well, that would be awesome.

Okay, you know, so moving past your LSE experience, right, in the year 2009, you graduated with a master’s degree in Management of Information Systems. From then on, what made you explore the fintech industry? Is that a typical role? How did you make that decision?

Monica: Yup, I didn’t make a decision. I was in the UK. It was 2008, 2009. We were in the middle of a financial crisis. There were no jobs. I applied for over a hundred places, a hundred jobs, got tons of rejections, and I finally got a job at Visa. So, I took the job. 

So, it was not uh, “Oh, I want to get into financial services.” It was uh, “Oh, I want to stay in the UK. I want to get a job and I’m going to do anything in my power to do this.” It was a tough year to get a job, but eventually I did. So, that opened the door to financial services. But having said that, my previous work experience in Mexico was also in a bank, so I was not going from scratch. Then, I did a few years at Visa, a few years at Barclays, and then, basically, an opportunity came up to me. 

It was like, “Hey, basically these entrepreneurs are starting a new bank.” That was the beginning of fintech, such as we know it today. The Bank of England had only given one banking license in the past one hundred years. So, this was like a unique thing, like, they were applying for a banking license and back then, I was like, well, I could continue in my job, I could go and study an MBA, or I could take this very risky job and do an experiential MBA and go and build a bank from scratch. So, I did. 

Maryam: And you did it so well. 

Monica: I kind of did. 

Maryam: Did you ever, at any point in time, feel like you want to change your career paths, you know, from fintech to another? 

Monica: A thousand times, yes. Many, many times. All the time. Yeah. So, when I was telling you about the quarter-life crisis, back then, I was like, “I don’t like this. I’m not passionate about payments. I don’t [non-lexical vocables].”

Barclays, eventually, at some point, I was like, “I don’t like this. This is boring. [non-lexical vocables].”

So yeah, no, I didn’t like it. It was until I joined the start-up world, fintech as such, that I really became very passionate about it. And I think it was two things. The founder of Tandem bank, my first fintech, he was very purpose-driven. That’s it. Everything was about, like, helping customers. Banking is broken, people have a ton of financial stress, and basically, it was that sense of — we’re not just doing our jobs. We’re just not building a bank, but we are helping people with something meaningful. So, the moment that I started adding a lens of purpose and giving back added meaning to my day-to-day job, that’s the moment that I was, like, I love this.

Maryam: I’m glad you found that passion, so, at least now, you don’t have any thoughts of, sort of, switching careers, or anything.

Actually, instead of moving sideways, you’re building your way up. 

So, as someone who has already been there and done that, and has totally excelled at it, you know, what advice do you have for other women or young girls who also want to pursue, or further their education in STEM subjects, or work in the fintech sector like you? 

Monica: Yes, it’s tough. It’s really tough, so you must be prepared. That’s my best advice. Like, be prepared, give it your best, be strategic. And what that means is, know what you want and where you’re going. Be resilient because it’s going to be tough and you’re going to have setbacks, and you’re not going to get a promotion, and you’re not going to get this, and you’re not going to get that. And people are going to talk, like, not too nicely to you. 

I’m seeing your face and you’re like, “Oh my God, this sounds horrible.” I’m like, that’s the reality of the workplace. So, it’s, uh, don’t take things personal. Be aggressive with your dreams. I think it’s that. It’s, uh, don’t take no for an answer. It’s, uh, if you want to be the president of the company, work for it. You’ll make it, but be strategic and don’t let your emotions take the best out of you. 

Maryam: Can you explain a bit further how to be strategic about this? 

Monica: Oh, that’s a good question. 

Maryam: Whether it’s in university or in the workplace or both, like, how do we navigate that?

Monica: Yeah, I’m a planner. So, when I moved to the UK, it took me, like, a year or so before I got my scholarship. But I had a spreadsheet with tons of options on how I could move abroad. University scholarship is the other and I explored them all, and I kind of tried to maximise my opportunities. So, same, when I moved to the UK, I was very clear (on) what my objective (was). Some family members were like, “You just graduated from LSE with a Distinction. Come back home. You’re not finding a job. What are you going to do?”

I was like, “I’ll stick here and work in McDonalds if I have to. Just to stay here.” And they were like, “Are you serious?” So, I was like, “Yes.”

And the reason why I’m saying this is, like, be clear on what’s your objective. That’s being strategic. Because, you know, back then, for me, my objective was not to get the best job. For me, my objective was to stay one more year in the UK so that I could have UK experience and I was obsessed with it. And then, same, like, throughout my career — so that’s at the beginning, right?

Then, when I was in Tandem, back then, I used to do a lot of coaching and I had a friend from coaching school as well. And we used to go to the park every month or two. And we would be like, “Okay, what is this month or what is this chapter about?” We were like, “Oh, I’m facing these challenges. This is what we’re doing.” And we were like, “Okay, this is a chapter where we focus on learning financials. This is a chapter where we focus on stakeholder management. This is a chapter…” — it was very intentional. 

When I moved to Malaysia, I had a checklist. I had a matrix where I assessed the opportunity, the company, the managers, and how my life could be like. And I was like, okay, it ticks the boxes. I came here and then, same, I had a list of things that I wanted to achieve as a result of moving here. In a year, two, or three, I achieved them, and then I was like, “Why am I staying?”

And then again, it’s uh, you need to go back to “What do you want? What’s your objective?” and work for it. So, that’s what I mean (by) “be strategic”. Know what you want, have a plan, execute the plan.

Maryam: I think that’s really good advice. It’s really thorough as well and I think we can all learn from that.

So, last question but not the least, chuckles, last but not least, what’s next for Monica Millares? Are there any exciting projects you’d like to share or tease?

Monica: That’s a very difficult question because I don’t even know what’s next. In a way, but I’m like, “To dominate the world!”

Laughs, no, uh, the podcast. I love the podcast. As you know, like, I have my side project. It’s a passion project that, by now, has become my life’s work. So, whatever my next job is or remains to be, the podcast continues to have a ton of relevance and importance in my life. So, it’s more of, uh, how can I do it better? How can I impact more people? How can I contribute more to the industry, younger generations? I think that’s kind of — part of my life’s work is in communicating and I love the podcast. So, it’s like I’m obsessed again. 

Maryam: That sounds awesome. Yeah, I’ve seen your podcast before. I think you’re doing really, really great. 

Monica: Thank you.

Maryam: Alright! 

I think we’ve come to the end of our chat with the brilliant Monica. We hope you all had fun listening in. 

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Until next time!