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[英语节目] Beyond the Stage: Navigating British Theatre as an East Asian Women Producer | 明外来客 Ming's Guests #1
This is an English-language episode and the first episode of Ming’s Guests, an experimental new series aimed for making spaces and hosting programmes by audio/podcast creators outside Ming Strike collective.
You will hear Burong Zeng in conversation with Natalie Chan, a Hong Kong theatre producer who has spent her past decade working in the UK. The one-hour conversation delves into Natalie’s journey as an East Asian woman stepping into leadership roles in the arts and theatre sector. She shares candid reflections on navigating cultural and systemic challenges, balancing organisational and freelance roles, and developing strategies for sustainability in a high-pressure industry.
《明外來客》是小明拆台的实验性新板块，旨在为与小明调性符合但欠缺一个平台的音频创作者提供一个发声的空间。
本期是英语节目，由Burong Zeng个人采访与制作。Burong与旅英十年的香港制作人Natalie Chan聊了东亚女性在艺术戏剧行业中，逐渐走向领导岗位时的心得与挑战。一小时的谈话里，Natalie深入分享了她在组织任职与自由职业阶段不同的工作经验与方法，以及她对英国文化系统中系统性失衡的看法。
The opinions expressed by the host and guests in this episode are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views of Ming Strike. 本期节目中主持人与嘉宾表达的观点仅代表个人立场，并不代表《小明拆台》的观点。
This episode is supported by / 本期节目资助方 'Artistic Directors of the Future' bursary for Burong Zeng investigating the heterogeneity of ESEA leadership in the performing arts sector.
Guests/本期嘉宾
Natalie Chan is a tenacious, innovative and energetic arts leader and producer based in Hong Kong and UK, she was most recently Director and CEO for Kakilang. Independent Producer credits includes as Associate Producer for Best of Enemies in the West End and Producer for This Is Not A Show About Hong Kong, which won Fringe First and New Diorama Theatre and Underbelly’s Untapped Award in 2022.
As a committed change-maker to support fellow Global Majority arts leaders, she was an innovator and Agent for Change with Artistic Directors of the Future.
She’s also held the role of Creative Producer for In Good Company, leading the Midlands’ artist development programme with 12 venues, and as General Manager for Creative Youth, where she has won the Arts Fundraising and Philanthropy’s Giving Tuesday Competition for Digital Innovation for the charity.
Natalie is also a recipient of the Blackbaud Scholarship for completing her Postgraduate Certificate in Philanthropic Studies at the University of Kent in 2022.
She’s supported the company development and produced projects for independent companies Chalk Line Theatre, Chronic Insanity, Nuu Theatre.
She proudly started her career working as Assistant Producer for Theatre503, Spun Glass Theatre, Arch468 and the Bread and Roses Theatre, and through Stage One’s Bridge The Gap scheme.
Natalie Chan，英国/香港独立戏剧制作人，曾任伦敦东亚艺术组织Kakilang CEO。
ins @ natnatnataliechan
Host & Production /本期主持 & 制作
Burong Zeng is a practitioner-researcher and an arts producer based in London and Beijing. As a multifaceted professional, Zeng conducts research in Theatre and Performance and produces innovative and impactful transnational performance projects. Before embarking on the PhD, Zeng honed skills as a playwright and performer, exhibiting and performing at renowned venues and festivals, including the Pratt Gallery (New York), Power Station of Art (Shanghai), G12 Hub (Belgrade), Southbank Centre (London), and Exeter Phoenix. Zeng is also a prolific writer, having published a broad range of materials, including journal articles, short novels, book chapters, and a co-authored book on contemporary performance.
She is a current research consultant for the UKRI “Shifting Power” project at The Open University.
曾不容，伦敦/北京独立制作人，艺术从业者，英国国家科研与创新署（UKRI）“Shifting Power” 项目学术顾问
ins @ burongz
Show Notes/这期我們聊了.....
1:50 From East to West: Natalie's Pioneering Path as an Asian Producer in British Theatre / 作为第一代移民，Natalie来英从事戏剧制作的职业背景
5:30 Hidden Gems: Discovering Producer Training Programs Beyond the London Theatre Scene / 伦敦以外的免费制作人培训项目与资源
9:00 The Producer's Playbook: Tailoring Your Approach to Different Artist Personalities/ 在制作人实践中，与不同艺术家的合作方法
11:10 Drawing the Line: Essential Boundaries for Healthy Producer-Artist Relationships / 制作人与艺术家需要维持的健康边界
16:00 Nurturing New Voices: Creative Solutions for Producing on Zero Budget / 如何与没有预算的年轻艺术家合作
22:50 The Money Talk: Navigating the Fundraising Landscape in British Theatre / 募捐和筹款的体系与经验
25:00 Inside the Funder's Mind: What Makes a Project Stand Out to Donors? / 募捐人会挑项目吗？
29:30 Sustaining Success: Building a Personal Wellness Toolkit in a High-Pressure Industry / 为身心健康建立自助系统
33:00 Solo vs. Structure: Comparing Life as an Independent and Organizational Producer / 在组织里做制作与个人制作的区别
42:30 Breaking Through: A Guide to Claiming Space in Theatre Leadership / 作为东亚移民，如何在戏剧圈跃升领导层
50:00 The Road Ahead: Essential Insights for Theatre Producers Starting Their UK Journey / 对在英国当职场戏剧制作人，有什么建议？
Ming's Guests / 明外來客
《明外来客》欢迎不同风格的声音投稿，包括艺术评论、访谈、声音创作等。有兴趣的朋友，请将您的 Podcast 构想、节目规划及样本集发送至 [email protected]。提案创作者保留完整版权及相关责任。
Ming’s Guests welcomes submissions from diverse voices and styles, including arts reviews, interviews, sound creations, and more. If you're interested, send your podcast concept, programme outline, and a sample episode to [email protected].
Creators retain full copyright and responsibility for their work.
小明拆台 Ming Strike 由几位现居海外的当代表演实践者独立制作。
Bilingual (Mandarin Chinese / English), independently produced podcast from the lens of Asian art practitioners living in the UK.
http://mingstrike.com
**
🧧支持我们：在 爱发电 或 Buy me a Coffee 上给我们打赏
📻收听方式：
推荐使用苹果播客 、Spotify、小宇宙App或其它泛用型客户端订阅收听本节目（复制rss feed手动添加 https://mingstrike.com/feed/audio.xml ），或通过网易云音乐、喜马拉雅FM收听。
📓自出版zine「你说呢？」及线下购买点
🦄与我们互动：
Facebook / Instagram / 小红书
💌给我们写信：[email protected]
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By 小明拆台 Ming Strike
3.7
33 ratings
This is an English-language episode and the first episode of Ming’s Guests, an experimental new series aimed for making spaces and hosting programmes by audio/podcast creators outside Ming Strike collective.
You will hear Burong Zeng in conversation with Natalie Chan, a Hong Kong theatre producer who has spent her past decade working in the UK. The one-hour conversation delves into Natalie’s journey as an East Asian woman stepping into leadership roles in the arts and theatre sector. She shares candid reflections on navigating cultural and systemic challenges, balancing organisational and freelance roles, and developing strategies for sustainability in a high-pressure industry.
《明外來客》是小明拆台的实验性新板块，旨在为与小明调性符合但欠缺一个平台的音频创作者提供一个发声的空间。
本期是英语节目，由Burong Zeng个人采访与制作。Burong与旅英十年的香港制作人Natalie Chan聊了东亚女性在艺术戏剧行业中，逐渐走向领导岗位时的心得与挑战。一小时的谈话里，Natalie深入分享了她在组织任职与自由职业阶段不同的工作经验与方法，以及她对英国文化系统中系统性失衡的看法。
The opinions expressed by the host and guests in this episode are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views of Ming Strike. 本期节目中主持人与嘉宾表达的观点仅代表个人立场，并不代表《小明拆台》的观点。
This episode is supported by / 本期节目资助方 'Artistic Directors of the Future' bursary for Burong Zeng investigating the heterogeneity of ESEA leadership in the performing arts sector.
Guests/本期嘉宾
Natalie Chan is a tenacious, innovative and energetic arts leader and producer based in Hong Kong and UK, she was most recently Director and CEO for Kakilang. Independent Producer credits includes as Associate Producer for Best of Enemies in the West End and Producer for This Is Not A Show About Hong Kong, which won Fringe First and New Diorama Theatre and Underbelly’s Untapped Award in 2022.
As a committed change-maker to support fellow Global Majority arts leaders, she was an innovator and Agent for Change with Artistic Directors of the Future.
She’s also held the role of Creative Producer for In Good Company, leading the Midlands’ artist development programme with 12 venues, and as General Manager for Creative Youth, where she has won the Arts Fundraising and Philanthropy’s Giving Tuesday Competition for Digital Innovation for the charity.
Natalie is also a recipient of the Blackbaud Scholarship for completing her Postgraduate Certificate in Philanthropic Studies at the University of Kent in 2022.
She’s supported the company development and produced projects for independent companies Chalk Line Theatre, Chronic Insanity, Nuu Theatre.
She proudly started her career working as Assistant Producer for Theatre503, Spun Glass Theatre, Arch468 and the Bread and Roses Theatre, and through Stage One’s Bridge The Gap scheme.
Natalie Chan，英国/香港独立戏剧制作人，曾任伦敦东亚艺术组织Kakilang CEO。
ins @ natnatnataliechan
Host & Production /本期主持 & 制作
Burong Zeng is a practitioner-researcher and an arts producer based in London and Beijing. As a multifaceted professional, Zeng conducts research in Theatre and Performance and produces innovative and impactful transnational performance projects. Before embarking on the PhD, Zeng honed skills as a playwright and performer, exhibiting and performing at renowned venues and festivals, including the Pratt Gallery (New York), Power Station of Art (Shanghai), G12 Hub (Belgrade), Southbank Centre (London), and Exeter Phoenix. Zeng is also a prolific writer, having published a broad range of materials, including journal articles, short novels, book chapters, and a co-authored book on contemporary performance.
She is a current research consultant for the UKRI “Shifting Power” project at The Open University.
曾不容，伦敦/北京独立制作人，艺术从业者，英国国家科研与创新署（UKRI）“Shifting Power” 项目学术顾问
ins @ burongz
Show Notes/这期我們聊了.....
1:50 From East to West: Natalie's Pioneering Path as an Asian Producer in British Theatre / 作为第一代移民，Natalie来英从事戏剧制作的职业背景
5:30 Hidden Gems: Discovering Producer Training Programs Beyond the London Theatre Scene / 伦敦以外的免费制作人培训项目与资源
9:00 The Producer's Playbook: Tailoring Your Approach to Different Artist Personalities/ 在制作人实践中，与不同艺术家的合作方法
11:10 Drawing the Line: Essential Boundaries for Healthy Producer-Artist Relationships / 制作人与艺术家需要维持的健康边界
16:00 Nurturing New Voices: Creative Solutions for Producing on Zero Budget / 如何与没有预算的年轻艺术家合作
22:50 The Money Talk: Navigating the Fundraising Landscape in British Theatre / 募捐和筹款的体系与经验
25:00 Inside the Funder's Mind: What Makes a Project Stand Out to Donors? / 募捐人会挑项目吗？
29:30 Sustaining Success: Building a Personal Wellness Toolkit in a High-Pressure Industry / 为身心健康建立自助系统
33:00 Solo vs. Structure: Comparing Life as an Independent and Organizational Producer / 在组织里做制作与个人制作的区别
42:30 Breaking Through: A Guide to Claiming Space in Theatre Leadership / 作为东亚移民，如何在戏剧圈跃升领导层
50:00 The Road Ahead: Essential Insights for Theatre Producers Starting Their UK Journey / 对在英国当职场戏剧制作人，有什么建议？
Ming's Guests / 明外來客
《明外来客》欢迎不同风格的声音投稿，包括艺术评论、访谈、声音创作等。有兴趣的朋友，请将您的 Podcast 构想、节目规划及样本集发送至 [email protected]。提案创作者保留完整版权及相关责任。
Ming’s Guests welcomes submissions from diverse voices and styles, including arts reviews, interviews, sound creations, and more. If you're interested, send your podcast concept, programme outline, and a sample episode to [email protected].
Creators retain full copyright and responsibility for their work.
小明拆台 Ming Strike 由几位现居海外的当代表演实践者独立制作。
Bilingual (Mandarin Chinese / English), independently produced podcast from the lens of Asian art practitioners living in the UK.
http://mingstrike.com
**
🧧支持我们：在 爱发电 或 Buy me a Coffee 上给我们打赏
📻收听方式：
推荐使用苹果播客 、Spotify、小宇宙App或其它泛用型客户端订阅收听本节目（复制rss feed手动添加 https://mingstrike.com/feed/audio.xml ），或通过网易云音乐、喜马拉雅FM收听。
📓自出版zine「你说呢？」及线下购买点
🦄与我们互动：
Facebook / Instagram / 小红书
💌给我们写信：[email protected]
爱发电上赞助