Yotam Ottolenghi, pioneering chef and restaurateur, has revolutionised the vegetable - from soggy afterthought to alluring centre of attention. And he’s been a trailblazer in gay surrogacy. 

Yotam talks to Tim Samuels about the fundamental rules which make a recipe work, how he (an Israeli) and his Palestinian business partner are received back home, why he’s so inspired by Nigella, and the profound lesson he’s learnt from Covid (they spoke just as a long period of lockdown was ending).

Brilliant Brains is a deep, deep - no holds - dive into the minds of some of the most fascinating thinkers out there. Find all the shows at karmacist.com/podcast.

Music by Natureboy - remixed by Mudd.

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