The world of surveillance has changed beyond recognition over the past 25 years with the advent of technology. From CCTV cameras to cookie tracking, it's not so easy to escape the long arm of the intelligence services in 2025.

David and Gordon are joined by the CIA's first Chief of Tradecraft and Operational Technology, Glenn Chafetz, to explore the ever-changing world of ubiquitous technical surveillance and why the Chinese state is upping their capabilities in this space.

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Just go to ⁠⁠therestisclassified.com⁠ or join on Apple Podcasts.

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THE REST IS CLASSIFIED LIVE 2026: Buy your tickets ⁠⁠⁠⁠HERE⁠⁠⁠⁠ to see David and Gordon live on stage at London’s Southbank Centre on 31 January.

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Email: ⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠

Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@restisclassified

Social Producer: Emma Jackson

Producer: Becki Hills

Head of History: Dom Johnson

Exec Producer: Tony Pastor

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