Disgust, disdain and disbelief are emotions many of us have felt since the November election - and with good reason. But how long can we stay disillusioned and disaffected before fighting back? This week on Sea Change Radio, we speak with author Dave Zirin, from The Nation and Edge of Sports, to have a cathartic chat about the future of this country and how to cope.

Narrator | 00:02 - This is Sea Change Radio, covering the shift to sustainability. I'm Alex Wise. 

Dave Zirin (DZ) | 00:20 - History's gotta be our guide. Like there have been reactionary and revanchist periods in US society before. I think the real difference here, honestly, is people's lack of belief in an absolute truth. 

Narrator | 00:35 - Disgust, disdain, and disbelief or emotions many of us have felt since the November election and with good reason. But how long can we stay disillusioned and disaffected before fighting back? This week on Sea Change Radio, we speak with author Dave Zirin from The Nation and Edge of Sports, to have a cathartic chat about the future of this country and how to cope.

Alex Wise (AW) | 01:10 - I'm joined now on Sea Change Radio by Dave Zirin. He is the sports editor at The Nation, and he also runs the Edge of Sports, the Edge of Sports podcast, TV show, and he's the author of 11 books. Dave, it's a pleasure to have you back on Sea Change Radio.

Dave Zirin (DZ) | 01:29 - No, it's great to be here because we need a sea change, so why not start here with you, Alex? 

Alex Wise (AW) | 01:34 - Well, thank you. Like a lot of Americans, I'm at a crossroads spiritually right now in terms of fighting the good fight. When I read articles that tell me, you know, we got to keep fighting. I can't help but feel a little bit defeated at this point. I read a, a title of an article called the Triumph of Ignorance, that this latest election was the triumph of ignorance. And I can't help but feel that yes, the most vulnerable in our populations will suffer from this election, but so many of those people who are going to be affected by it voted for Trump and his lackeys. So how does one keep fighting the good fight in the face of all this terrible news, Dave? 

Dave Zirin (DZ) | 02:20 - Well, first and foremost, again, thanks for having me. Second, of course, we need history to be our guide, and we have to know that nothing in this country that's worth a damn was given to us on high. It has all been fought for from below. The other thing we learned from history is that struggle and opposition can come up from the wildest and most unexpected of places. And when it does come up, when it does rise, and I, I'm not only telling you it will rise, Alex, I'm saying it is rye zing right now demonstration in DC right now, freeway in la shut down yesterday. I mean, people are starting to wake up after an incredibly bruising year. And we could talk about what was so bruising about the past year if we can, but the anger and audience for a fight back. And it is so real and it's never been angrier. I mean, you think about the response to, uh, the, the Luigi killing of the healthcare CEO and I mean, I couldn't, I went to New York and there's Luigi Graffiti all over the place now. I think that's more of a cry of despair. You know, people feel like, well, there's nothing we can do. So the best we can hope for is kind of a lone assassin to extract justice from a society built on such terribly savage inequalities. But the, the anger in our healthcare system that exploded after that, I think was something that took a ton of people off guard. I mean, the, the governor of New York even set up a hotline for CEOs if they felt threatened or dangerous. I mean, it was unbelievable that, that our tax dollars are going to a CEO hotline. Thank you Kathy Hochul, about to push forward a $2 billion stadium for the Buffalo Bills on our tax dollars. Thanks for that. Um, but I think what we're looking at here is the potential for us to try to reclaim what's ...