This week, I sat down with my good friend Michael Bair, founder of Bair Consulting, to unpack what really separates good CX in B2B from the DTC playbook, and why both worlds have a lot to learn from each other.

We cover B2B SaaS, enterprise customer success, DTC retention, and why too many brands still treat CX like an afterthought. Michael gets real about why B2B companies ignore brand at their own risk, what DTC can steal from SaaS (hint: product obsession), how subscription churn compares to six-figure SaaS contracts, the rise and overhype of AI in CX, and why empathy and product knowledge will always be the secret sauce of customer success.

If you’re leading a CX team, building SaaS, or trying to scale a consumer brand, this episode is packed with hard-won insights from two people who’ve lived on both sides of the table.

Listen now for the truth about B2B vs DTC CX, retention that actually works, and what “fractional” really means when you’re in the trenches with founders.

📲 Follow Michael:

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaeljbair/

📲 Check out Bair Consulting:

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/company/bairconsulting/

Website: bairconsulting.co

👋 Enjoying Above the Fold?

Keep the insights coming by subscribing to my newsletter, Sunday Postcards. Each week, I share tips, stories, and strategies that help you unlock the secrets to brand success. Written from my experience in the marketing world, it’s your go-to source for staying ahead of the curve. Subscribe at www.sundaypostcards.co and join the community!

Connect with Jess on:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jess-cervellon

Twitter: x.com/jesscervellon

Instagram: instagram.com/jess.cervellon

This week, I sat down with my mentee, Mackenzie Lukas, to talk about what it really means to put people first in customer experience. 💬✨

We get into her unexpected career pivot from commercial real estate to CX, what she’s learned as Sr. Director of Customer & People Experience at Hormbles Chormbles 🍫, and why empathy will always beat efficiency 💛.

Mackenzie shares how her team is building trust with customers through human interactions, why sampling is more than just a marketing play 🎁, and the lessons she’s carried from workplace culture into CX. We also talk about what it’s like to launch a brand in CPG without any prior industry experience, and why that can actually be a superpower 🚀.

If you’re building a brand, leading a CX team, or just curious about what makes people feel truly cared for, this episode is packed with insights you can use right away. 🔑

🎧 Listen now for takeaways on empathy, brand trust, and why CX deserves a seat at the table.

📲 Follow Mackenzie:

Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mackenzielukas/

📲 Check out Hormbles Chormbles:

Instagram: @hormbles

Website: hormbles.com

👋 Enjoying Above the Fold?

Keep the insights coming by subscribing to my newsletter, Sunday Postcards. Each week, I share tips, stories, and strategies that help you unlock the secrets to brand success. Written from my experience in the marketing world, it’s your go-to source for staying ahead of the curve. Subscribe at www.sundaypostcards.co and join the community!

Connect with Jess on:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jess-cervellon

Twitter: x.com/jesscervellon

Instagram: instagram.com/jess.cervellon

This week on Above the Fold, I sat down with Max Wallace, Director of CX at Tommy John, and Kara Randle, CX manager, to talk about what it really takes to scale a customer experience team without losing the human touch.

We get into career pivots, building long-term team culture, and why “first response time” is not the CX metric you should be obsessing over. Max shares how he has kept Tommy John’s CX standards high through outsourcing and team growth, while Kara talks about the ongoing training and empowerment strategies that keep agents confident and customers loyal.

We also cover the role of automation (and when it goes too far), how to make customer feedback actually influence product and marketing, and the hot take both of them have on CX as a driver of retention, not a cost center.

If you lead a team, work in customer experience, or want to understand how brands keep customers coming back, this episode is full of insights you can use right now.

🎧 Listen now for real talk on CX metrics, team building, and why great service is about more than speed.

📲 Follow Max:

Linkedin: linkedin.com/in/max-wallace

📲 Follow Kara:

Linkedin: linkedin.com/in/kara-randle 

📲 Check out Tommy John:

Instagram: @tommyjohnwear

Website: tommyjohn.com  

👋 Enjoying Above the Fold?

Keep the insights coming by subscribing to my newsletter, Sunday Postcards. Each week, I share tips, stories, and strategies that help you unlock the secrets to brand success. Written from my experience in the marketing world, it’s your go-to source for staying ahead of the curve. Subscribe at www.sundaypostcards.co and join the community!

Connect with Jess on:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jess-cervellon

Twitter: x.com/jesscervellon

Instagram: instagram.com/jess.cervellon

This week, I sat down with Berk Bahceci, founder of Heraclea, to talk about what it actually looks like to build a product-led brand from scratch, without cutting corners.

We talk about what it means to invest early (like, before a single sale), why he built a full production facility in Turkey instead of outsourcing, and how customer feedback led to one of Heraclea’s most important programs.

Berk also shares why he’s not interested in being in 5,000 stores, how he’s onboarding farmers into his supply chain without sacrificing quality, and what it looks like to grow with intention when most CPG brands are sprinting to exit.

If you’re building a product brand, growing DTC, or trying to stay values-aligned as you scale, this episode’s packed with takeaways you can actually use.

🎧 Listen now to hear how Berk’s building Heraclea brick by brick and why Turkish olive oil is having its moment.

📲 Follow Berk:

Instagram: @mberkbahceci

Website: linkedin.com/in/mberkbahceci/ 

📲 Check out Heraclea:

Instagram: @weareheraclea

Website: heraclea.co 

👋 Enjoying Above the Fold?

Keep the insights coming by subscribing to my newsletter, Sunday Postcards. Each week, I share tips, stories, and strategies that help you unlock the secrets to brand success. Written from my experience in the marketing world, it’s your go-to source for staying ahead of the curve. Subscribe at www.sundaypostcards.co and join the community!

Connect with Jess on:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jess-cervellon

Twitter: x.com/jesscervellon

Instagram: instagram.com/jess.cervellon

This week, I sat down with Lisa Nielsen, Senior Digital Marketing Manager at Victoria Beckham, to talk about what brand building looks like behind the scenes at a luxury fashion house and why customer experience is more than a post-purchase email.

We get into the real impact of handwritten notes (yes, real ink and paper), how to bring humanity into high-pressure digital roles, and why text marketing isn’t just for scrappy DTC brands anymore.

Lisa also shares her take on lifecycle strategy in luxury, why empathy matters in leadership, and how VB is experimenting with resale, sustainability, and segmented CX all without losing brand integrity.

If you’ve ever wondered how to scale without losing soul, or how to make your retention strategy feel more personal than automated, this one’s for you.

🎧 Listen now for insights on loyalty, lifecycle, and building brands with staying power.

📲 Follow Lisa:

Instagram: @lisaroonielsen

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/lisanielsen414/ 

📲 Check out Victoria Beckham:

Website: international.victoriabeckham.com/

Instagram: instagram.com/victoriabeckham/ 

This episode is brought to you by Attentive 💛

📲 Check out Attentive:

Website: attentive.com

Instagram: @attentivehq

👋 Enjoying Above the Fold?

Keep the insights coming by subscribing to my newsletter, Sunday Postcards. Each week, I share tips, stories, and strategies that help you unlock the secrets to brand success. Written from my experience in the marketing world, it’s your go-to source for staying ahead of the curve. Subscribe at www.sundaypostcards.co and join the community!

Connect with Jess on:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jess-cervellon

Twitter: x.com/jesscervellon

Instagram: instagram.com/jess.cervellon

This week, I sat down with Liz Ahern, former CMO of Chamberlain Coffee and current Founder of Brand 555 Marketing to talk about what actually drives brand longevity in a world full of creator launches and fast-moving CPG hype.

We talk about why most brands lose sight of their customer, what “community” actually means (hint: it’s not just comments), and why a retail strategy needs a lot more than shelf space to work.

Liz also breaks down the real role of a fractional CMO, what makes great packaging at retail, and why brands are getting community management completely wrong.

If you’re building, scaling, or just wondering how to turn attention into long-term love, this episode’s got you.

🎧 Listen now for insights on retail, retention, and building brands that stick around.

📲 Follow Liz:

Instagram: @lizaaaaay

Website: linkedin.com/in/ecahern/

📲 Check out Brand 555:

Instagram: @brand555_marketing

Website: brand555.com

👋 Enjoying Above the Fold?

Keep the insights coming by subscribing to my newsletter, Sunday Postcards. Each week, I share tips, stories, and strategies that help you unlock the secrets to brand success. Written from my experience in the marketing world, it’s your go-to source for staying ahead of the curve. Subscribe at www.sundaypostcards.co and join the community!

Connect with Jess on:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jess-cervellon

Twitter: x.com/jesscervellon

Instagram: instagram.com/jess.cervellon

This week on After Hours x Above the Fold, I sat down with CX specialist and Midwest dad extraordinaire, Larry Thoma.

We got into what great CX looks like after the checkout page, how brands can use returns to build trust (not just process refunds), and why “dishwasher safe” is not a real instruction. Larry’s worked with brands like Yeti, Caraway, and See’s Candy, so he’s got receipts (and hot takes!).

We talked about email touchpoints, refund timing, customer segmentation, and the wild world of return policies (Marine Layer, we’re looking at you). Plus, Larry’s take on what actually makes someone a loyal customer is one you’ll want to steal.

If you’re in retention, CX, or just trying to stop losing customers in the post-purchase void, you’ll want to catch this one.

🎧 Listen in for insights on retention, returns, and how to stop leaving money (and trust) on the table.

📲 Follow Larry:

Instagram: @lthoma1

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/larrythoma/

📲 Check out parcelLab::

Website: parcellab.com/

Instagram: @parcellab

👋 Enjoying Above the Fold?

Keep the insights coming by subscribing to my newsletter, Sunday Postcards. Each week, I share tips, stories, and strategies that help you unlock the secrets to brand success. Written from my experience in the marketing world, it’s your go-to source for staying ahead of the curve. Subscribe at www.sundaypostcards.co and join the community!

Connect with Jess on:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jess-cervellon

Twitter: x.com/jesscervellon

Instagram: instagram.com/jess.cervellon

✨ In this episode of Above the Fold, I sat down with Keri McGee, CMO of Attentive and a cx-to-marketing powerhouse, to talk about why good customer experience isn’t enough anymore—and what today’s best brands are doing to actually stand out. 📱💡

📊 The real reason 97% of brand messaging still looks like 2013

📦 How brands like UGG and OLLY are making omnichannel work—for real

🤖 Why AI isn’t the enemy (and how it’s already outwriting your content calendar)

📈 What orchestration looks like beyond just SMS and email

🧠 How to use data smarter—even if you’re just getting started

🛍️ What customer experience looks like in a mobile-first, AI-powered, “I want it now” world

👉 Hit play for insights on personalization, retention, and what modern lifecycle marketing requires in 2025.

📲 Follow Keri:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/keri-mcghee/

📲 Check out Attentive:

Website: attentive.com

Instagram: @attentivehq

✨ Want More Like This?

Subscribe for more founder stories, marketing insights, and behind-the-scenes action in the world of CPG, brand strategy, and customer experience!

About Sunday Postcards

Enjoying the show? Keep the insights flowing by subscribing to my newsletter, Sunday Postcards. Each week, I share tips, stories, and strategies to help you unlock brand success. Subscribe at www.sundaypostcards.co and join the community.

👋 Connect with Jess:

 • LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jess-cervellon 

 • Twitter: x.com/jesscervellon 

 • Instagram: instagram.com/jess.cervellon 

👍 Like, comment, and subscribe for more insights on brand-building, customer experience, and business growth!

#AboveTheFoldPodcast #CXStrategy #LifecycleMarketing #CustomerExperience #MarketingAI #BrandGrowth #RetentionMarketing #Attentive #SMSMarketing #MarketingPodcast #AICustomerExperience

This week, I sat down with the brilliant (and brilliantly humble) Jim Lee—President of Crunch Labs—to talk about what it really takes to build a brand that doesn’t just go viral, but sticks.

We cover creator-led growth, product design that drives retention, the future of STEM education, and why customer experience starts way before someone hits “buy.”

Plus, Jim shares how Crunch Labs turns YouTube magic into meaningful learning for kids (think: flywheels, diplomas, and a robot that teaches you to code), what it’s like working with Mark Rober, and why they’re building a free science curriculum that could change classrooms across the country.

If you’re building a subscription brand, running CX, or just trying to connect your content to your customer—this episode is full of takeaways you can actually run with.

🎧 Listen now for tips on retention, product storytelling, and why real brand magic happens after the unboxing

📲 Follow Jim:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jimelee/

Instagram: @jim.e.lee

📲 Follow CrunchLabs:

Website: crunchlabs.com

Instagram: @crunchlabs

👋 Enjoying Above the Fold?

Keep the insights coming by subscribing to my newsletter, Sunday Postcards. Each week, I share tips, stories, and strategies that help you unlock the secrets to brand success. Written from my experience in the marketing world, it’s your go-to source for staying ahead of the curve. Subscribe at www.sundaypostcards.co and join the community!

Connect with Jess on:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jess-cervellon

Twitter: x.com/jesscervellon

Instagram: instagram.com/jess.cervellon

This week, I sat down with two of the sharpest minds in the retention and CX space to talk about what really drives long-term loyalty—especially in the skincare and wellness world.

We get into subscriptions, lifecycle marketing, cancelation logic, and why the prettiest packaging in the world won’t save you from bad UX. AJ shares how U Beauty builds obsession-worthy routines (with zero fluff) and Nikki breaks down why your “other” cancel reason is a goldmine of insight.

If you’re building a brand with high repeat potential, scaling retention ops, or just tired of running in circles with your post-purchase strategy—this one’s a must-listen.

🎧 Listen now on flexible CX, smarter subs, and retention that actually hits.

📲 Follow Nikki:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/nikkitooman/

Instagram: @nikkdoll

📲 Follow AJ:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/aj-patel-ecommerce/

📲 Follow U Beauty:

Website: ubeauty.com

Instagram: @ubeauty 

📲 Follow Sticky Digital:

Website: stickydigital.io

Instagram: @stickydigital

📢 Big shoutout to Recharge for letting us run wild at ChargeX for this episode!

👋 Enjoying Above the Fold?

Keep the insights coming by subscribing to my newsletter, Sunday Postcards. Each week, I share tips, stories, and strategies that help you unlock the secrets to brand success. Written from my experience in the marketing world, it’s your go-to source for staying ahead of the curve. Subscribe at www.sundaypostcards.co and join the community!

Connect with Jess on:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jess-cervellon

Twitter: x.com/jesscervellon

Instagram: instagram.com/jess.cervellon