In this episode of “AfterShock to 2030”, Caroline Stokes sits down with Alison Taylor, executive director of Ethical Systems, clinical professor at NYU Stern and author of “Higher Ground”. They examine what’s next for leadership, ethics, and credibility in a world where idealism alone isn’t enough.

Together, they explore:

• Why overpromising on ethics and sustainability sets companies up for failure, and how to rebuild trust through realism, not rhetoric.

• How AI hype is the new distraction, repeating the same leadership mistakes of the dot-com boom.

• The burnout crisis inside ethics and sustainability teams, and what that reveals about leadership’s moral bandwidth.

• The CEOs redefining success by choosing one issue they can lead on credibly, instead of pretending to solve everything.

• Why courageous listening and proximity to impact are now the most underrated strategic skills of the Fifth Industrial Revolution.

More about Alison Taylor:

Alison Taylor is a clinical associate professor at NYU Stern School of Business, and the executive director at Ethical Systems. Her previous work experience includes being a managing director at non-profit business network BSR and a senior managing director at Control Risks. She holds sustainability advisory roles at KKR and Unilever, and advises many other firms on strategic integrity challenges. She has expertise in strategy, sustainability, political and social risk, culture and behavior, human rights, ethics and compliance, stakeholder engagement, anti-corruption and professional responsibility.

Alison’s book, “Higher Ground: How Business Can do the Right Thing in a Turbulent World”, was published by Harvard Business Review Press in February 2024, and won the 2024 Porchlight Award for best leadership and strategy book. She received her Bachelor of Arts in Modern History from Balliol College, Oxford University, her MA in International Relations from the University of Chicago, and MA in Organizational Psychology from Columbia University.

Higher Ground on Substack: https://findhigherground.substack.com/

We are expected to fit our lives into the 9-to-5 structure. But what if our biology was never designed for industrial time?

I speak with Camilla Kring, PhD—chronobiologist, author of “Chronoleadership”, and founder of Super Navigators—about how leaders, teams, and families can thrive when we work with our circadian rhythms instead of against them.

Camilla explains:

 Why “early isn’t discipline, late isn’t laziness”—it’s genetics.

 How the early-riser bias still shapes workplaces, schools, and families.

 The health costs of “social jetlag” and living out of sync with your body clock

 How practical tools can help, such as the Munich Chronotype Questionnaire, team mapping, and chrono-inclusive meetings.

 Why trust and psychological safety are prerequisites for chronoleadership.

 How AI and flexible scheduling could finally align work with real lives and family structures.

 What this means for CEOs, couples, parents, and anyone who’s ever felt shame for their sleep pattern.

I share how Camilla’s work has helped me embrace my own extreme early chronotype—and rethink my relationship with my son, a late chronotype.

More about Camilla Kring, PhD:

Camilla Kring (b. 1977) is a visionary engineer with a passion for transforming how we live and work. With a PhD in work-life balance and expertise in chronobiology, she founded Super Navigators to help individuals and organizations create flexible workplaces that accommodate different chronotypes and family structures. Since 2005, Camilla has consulted with organizations on four continents to create healthier, more productive work environments. Her insights have been featured in The New York Times, the BBC, and The Guardian. Camilla is the author of six books and a TEDx speaker. 

Camilla is a time activist dedicated to creating fairer and more flexible time structures in work and society. In 2006, she founded B-Society, a nonprofit organization advocating for later start times in schools and workplaces. She challenges the cultural bias that favors early risers and pushes night owls to adapt. Her vision is a world where all chronotypes have equal opportunities to thrive—in health, education, and work.

Links:

Super Navigators: https://www.supernavigators.com/

Applied Chronobiology: https://www.appliedchronobiology.com/

Test your chronotype: https://www.appliedchronobiology.com/test

RNA Test: https://www.bodyclock.health/

Chronoleadership: https://a.co/d/jbSv2Q9

In what Edelman has called the “Era of Grievance”, I sit down with organizational psychologist, leadership coach and author Dr. Gena Cox to explore why respect—not just diversity and inclusion—is the true foundation of healthy organizations.

Together, we explore:

• Why DEI has been misunderstood and how leaders can reframe it as an obligation of effective leadership.
• A powerful case study from healthcare, showing how a “respect ethos” improved retention, engagement, and patient outcomes.
• The connection between respect, trust, and organizational resilience in an era of global grievance and distrust.
• How leaders can integrate respect-driven behaviours into culture, strategy, and everyday decision-making.

In this interview, Dr. Cox provides clarity and practical tools to help leaders rebuild trust and drive the outcomes CEOs want most.

This AfterShock conversation is the last in our September series on Creating Healthy Organizations, inspired by the annual conference founded by Dr. Ludmila Praslova at Vanguard University. Together, we’ve been exploring what it really takes to build organizations—and lives—that positively impact people, planet, and profit.

More about Dr. Gena Cox

Dr. Gena Cox is an award-winning organizational psychologist, executive coach, and global thought leader who has spent over 25 years helping leaders elevate their impact and guiding them in building psychologically healthy workplaces. Named to the Thinkers50 Global Top 50 Coaches list, Gena brings a rare blend of psychological expertise, corporate leadership experience, and multicultural insight to her advisory and coaching engagements.

At the heart of Gena’s work is her evidence-based argument that inclusion is a leadership imperative, not an option, which must be built on a foundation of respect. She therefore believes that respect is the foundation of effective leadership. Her proprietary R-E-S-P-E-C-T Ethos TM framework provides leaders with a practical and actionable roadmap for ensuring that every employee feels respected (Seen, Heard, and Valued) at work.

Gena Cox is the author of the multiple award-winning book “Leading Inclusion: Drive Change Your Employees Can See and Feel”, a guide for leaders who want to build truly inclusive organizations from the top down. Her voice is a trusted one in the leadership space: she is a prolific writer and speaker on the intersection of leadership, psychology, and inclusion. She is a contributor to Forbes.com, and her ideas have been featured in Harvard Business Review, Fast Company, Fortune, Bloomberg, The New York Times, and many other prominent business media outlets. She is frequently invited to keynote conferences and advise executive teams worldwide.

Before founding Feels Human LLC, her boutique advisory and coaching firm, Gena held leadership roles in major corporations, gaining an insider’s understanding of the pressures executives face—and the practical realities of leading in high-stakes environments.

Gena serves on the Professional Practice Editorial Board of the Society for Industrial and Organizational Psychology (SIOP) and chairs SIOP’s DEI White Paper Task Force. She is Chair-Elect of the American Psychological Association’s Committee for the Advancement of General and Applied Psychology (CAGAP).

Gena earned her PhD in Industrial-Organizational Psychology from the University of South Florida.

https://www.genacox.com

https://www.linkedin.com/in/genacox

Free e-book, “25 Ways Anyone Can Help Build A Culture of Respect”:

https://genacox.com/respectebook/

Clinical psychologist Laura Devlin joins Caroline Stokes to explore how leaders, parents, and high achievers can navigate today’s overwhelming world.

In this episode of the AfterShock podcast, we cover:

• How macro shocks like AI, climate change, and political instability are now showing up in therapy, counselling and coaching rooms.

• Coping strategies leaders use under pressure and how they can become maladaptive.

• The “window of tolerance” and why it matters for CEOs and parents alike.

• Emotional hygiene: what happens when we neglect our inner lives.

• The role of self-compassion in breaking cycles of reactivity, shame, and burnout.

• Parenting in the AI era: helping kids regulate emotions while facing unprecedented pressures.

• The limits of AI as a therapeutic tool and why human connection remains irreplaceable.

• Why reinvention begins with a deeper understanding of our own story.

This AfterShock conversation is part of our September series on Creating Healthy Organizations, inspired by the annual conference founded by Dr. Ludmila Praslova at Vanguard University. Together, we’re exploring what it really takes to build organizations—and lives—that positively impact people, planet, and profit.

More about Laura Devlin:

Laura Devlin is a registered psychologist and the co-founder of Beaches Therapy Group, a multi-location psychotherapy practice in Toronto, Canada, that serves children, teens, adults, couples, and families. Over the past decade, she has grown the team to more than 50 clinicians and supported thousands of clients in accessing high-quality, trauma-informed care.

With deep roots in clinical practice and a passion for systems-level change, Laura is increasingly focused on how psychology and neuroscience can inform healthier workplaces and leadership cultures. She is particularly interested in mental health innovation, trauma-informed leadership, nervous system science at work, resilience in high-stakes caregiving and entrepreneurship, and scalable approaches to meaningful wellness.

Laura is also the founder of Penny’s Promise, a rare disease charity inspired by her daughter, Penny, which funds groundbreaking research teams at Harvard, Boston Children’s Hospital, and more recently University College Cork in Ireland. She brings both clinical expertise and lived experience to everything she builds, working at the intersection of empathy, strategy, and science to create systems that support whole-human wellness, from the therapy room to the boardroom.

https://www.instagram.com/beachestherapygroup/

https://pennyspromise.ca/

Where do you start to create a healthy organization in our era of climate crisis? One way is to see how your organization runs from the inside out. I discuss this in this episode of AfterShock with Erin Gallup, founder of the Hive Initiative, whose design-led “Mini Summits” are transforming how employees and leaders engage with climate, biodiversity, and wellbeing at work.

In this episode we cover:

1. The small step a CEO can make today: Erin recommends educating yourself and your organization by using Hive’s free Mini Summits, each with an eight-minute science segment

that turns awareness into immediate solutions.

2. Erin’s origin story: How a Silicon Valley designer left the world of shopping apps to build a climate movement rooted in design and community.

3. Why design matters for climate action: Clear, simple design can shift employees from paralysis to purpose.

4. Greenwashing vs. greenhushing: Why silence can be just as risky as over-claiming, and what leaders can do instead.

5. The anatomy of a healthy organization between now and 2030: Resilience, psychological safety, and distributing responsibility across the workforce.

6. The role of employees as climate catalysts: How younger generations are eager to contribute if leaders simply invite them in.

7. The hidden costs of inaction: From fragile supply chains and biodiversity collapse to

weakened social fabric and reputational damage.

8. A hopeful 2030 vision: Employee-led sustainability teams as the new normal inside organizations.

This special series from the AfterShock podcast is in association with the Creating Healthy Organizations Conference hosted by Vanguard University’s Graduate Organizational Psychology program. We explore what it truly takes to build healthy organizations—ones that positively impact people, planet, and profit.

More about Erin Gallup:

Erin Gallup is a digital product designer who spent 20 years working for Silicon Valley’s tech companies, all the while desperately wanting to use her skills to make our planet go in a better direction.

After moving to Norway in 2018, she founded the Hive Initiative as a way to realise this dream, put her skills to work and meet others who wanted to do the same. Together she and her collaborators created free and downloadable Mini Summits as a way to make it easier to include employees in company sustainability efforts.

Download the Mini-Summits for free: https://hiveinitiative.org/mini-summits

Connect with Erin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/egallup/

In this episode, I sit down with John Pabon, author of “The Great Greenwashing”, to expose the critical risks CEOs and leaders will find increasingly hard to avoid without facing them full on.

We break down why greenwashing and greenhushing are liabilities that invite regulatory scrutiny, erode trust, and cost companies market share. We examine the industries in the danger zone—from oil and gas to fast fashion—and why risk ignorance or willful ignorance, not risk avoidance, has become the biggest leadership blind spot.

You’ll come away with more of an understanding on some of the signals to watch out for, awareness of the systemic risks building under the surface, and practical ways to develop greater accountability for long-term growth.

Topics we cover include:

• Extinction and systemic risk: how species loss and ecosystem collapse tie directly to business and consumer decisions

• Greenwashing vs. greenhushing: why both exaggeration and silence erode credibility

• Healthy organizations: how sustainability connects to employee wellbeing, productivity, and resilience

• Global North vs. Global South: theory in boardrooms vs. survival on the ground

• Risk ignorance: the hidden danger of not seeing the systems you operate in

• The cost of silence: how greenhushing stalls momentum and cedes the narrative to bad actors

• Systemic change: why leaders must move beyond compliance and PR

• Pragmatic hope: stories of companies driving large-scale positive change

• Caroline Stokes’ own publishing case study: the overlooked carbon cost of print books

• The 2030 deadline: the narrow window to align organizational and planetary health.

We hope this episode will leave you with pragmatic optimism: proof that companies willing to lead honestly and decisively can reset systems, win trust, and secure long-term resilience. This is the candid, unfiltered conversation leaders need if they want to move beyond compliance, inspire their stakeholders, and act before 2030 closes the window for change.

This special series from the AfterShock podcast is in association with the Creating Healthy Organizations Conference hosted by Vanguard University’s Graduate Organizational Psychology program. We explore what it truly takes to build healthy organizations—ones that positively impact people, planet, and profit.

Listen now to hear why courageous, curious leadership is essential before 2030.

About John Pabon:

John Pabon is a sustainability expert who has worked with the United Nations, McKinsey, AC Nielsen, and as a consultant with BSR, the world’s largest sustainability-focused business network. He is the founder of Fulcrum Strategic Advisors, chair of The Conference Board’s Asia Sustainability Leaders Council, and advises the UN on issues of internet governance and greenwashing.

John is also the author of “Sustainability for the Rest of Us: Your No-Bullshit, Five-Point Plan for Saving the Planet” and “The Great Greenwashing: How Brands, Governments, and Influencers are Lying to You.”

Website: https://www.johnpabon.com

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/johnpabon

What does it really take to build organizations that positively impact people, planet, and profit in the Fifth Industrial Revolution?

In this opening episode of the Creating Healthy Organizations series, in association with the AfterShock podcast, I’m joined by Dr. Ludmila Praslova, Professor of Organizational Psychology at the Patty Arvielo School of Business & Management at Vanguard University of Southern California.

Ludmila is recognized as one of the world’s top management thinkers: a member of the Thinkers50 Radar Class of 2024, recipient of the 2024 PBS Difference Maker Award for her work on neurodiversity, and author of “The Canary Code: A Guide to Neurodiversity, Dignity, and Intersectional Belonging”. She is a globally respected voice in inclusivity and talent strategy, shaping how organizations adapt for resilience, innovation, and human dignity.

Together, we explore:

• Trust beyond wellness theatre—how to tell if your culture is truly healthy

• The Do No Harm Audit™—Ludmila’s framework for identifying hidden organizational risks

• Neurodiversity as strategy—why ignoring 20% of the workforce is a recipe for failure

• Bias and resilience—how leaders can confront their blind spots to unlock collective intelligence

• Psychological safety—what it actually means and why it’s essential for innovation

This is not a frivolous, nice-to-have conversation. We know from the US Surgeon General’s guidance, the World Economic Forum and the Edelman Trust Index that healthy organizations are the backbone of resilience in an age defined by disruption. We hope this series will inspire you.

More about Ludmila Praslova:

Ludmila N. Praslova, Ph.D., is a Professor of Organizational Psychology at the Patty Arvielo School of Business & Management at Vanguard University of Southern California. She is a member of the Thinkers 50 Radar Class of 2024—a global group of management thinkers who are most likely to make an impact on the world—and a recipient of the 2024 PBS Difference Maker Award for her work on neurodiversity. She is also a founder of the Creating Healthy Organizations Conference series.

As a global inclusive talent strategy expert with extensive experience and research expertise in intercultural relations, dignity and civility at work, bullying and moral injury prevention, and neurodiversity, she understands both the dark and the light sides of organizational life. “The Canary Code: A Guide to Neurodiversity, Dignity, and Intersectional Belonging at Work” (Berrett-Koehler, 2024) received multiple literary gold awards and sparked a wave of interest in major organizations and universities. Dr. Praslova has provided training to Amazon, MIT, the Michigan Department of Labor, and many other organizations across sectors.

https://give.vanguard.edu/stories/inspiring-belonging-in-the-workplace-ludmila-praslova-phd/

https://www.linkedin.com/company/creating-healthy-organizations-conference/

https://www.facebook.com/creatinghealthyorganizationsconference/

What does it mean to flourish in an age defined by AI, disruption, and uncertainty?

In this AfterShock episode, philosopher and writer Samuel Loncar explores the cultural forces and hidden assumptions that shape not just technology, but the way we lead. As founding editor of the Marginalia Review of Books and a consultant to scientists and institutions worldwide, Loncar reveals how narratives of progress, salvation, and transcendence quietly drive the boldest ambitions in Silicon Valley — and why they matter for every leader today.

From the “Manhattan Project” mindset in AI labs to the overlooked role of CEOs as meaning-makers, Loncar argues that leadership in this decade cannot rest on profit and strategy alone. It must also cultivate vision, purpose, and human flourishing.

If you want to find out how to thrive in this era, you’ll want to listen to this episode. It’s about the ideas and values steering the future of technology — and why engaging them may be the most essential leadership skill of our time.

Here’s what you’ll learn in our AfterShock conversation:

- Silicon Valley’s hidden belief system that drives AI.

- How tech leaders are chasing a kind of immortality.

- The “Manhattan Project” mindset — and its risks.

- Where capitalism, philosophy, and spirituality collide.

- Why CEOs must become meaning-makers, not just profit-makers.

- The marketing tricks steering AI as much as science.

- Why AI feels like an arms race — and what that means.

- The compassion gap between AI super-users and everyone else.

- What history’s most disruptive tech teaches us (and what we ignore).

- How to stay human amid the most radical transformation in history.

Listen to the full AfterShock episode — and see the tech world in a way you’ve never imagined.

About Samuel Loncar:

Samuel Loncar, PhD (Yale University), is helping heal the divide between mind and matter that has split wisdom and spirituality from science and technology. He practices an ancient art of philosophy, linked to the origins of science and Western spirituality, that promotes the perpetual evolution of human potential. Loncar has applied his practice as a speaker and consultant for clients like the United Nations, Oliver Wyman, and Red Bull Arts. He is the founder and CEO of Olurin Consulting and the editor-in-chief of the Marginalia Review of Books, where he directs the Meanings of Science Project. He brings his work to the public through the Becoming Human Project and through his scholarly and popular writing.

Learn more at www.samuelloncar.com

Yasmine Abdu, CEO and founder of CarbonTrac, is on a mission to cut UK emissions by 5% by 2030. Using machine learning, partnerships with organizations including the United Nations, and a strategy to engage the entire supply chain, she’s driving change through the power of small, measurable shifts in consumer behaviour.

We talk about how everyday grocery store choices can ripple throughout supply chains, why supermarkets are at the heart of this transformation, and how Yasmine combines emotional storytelling, gamification, and financial incentives to drive systemic change.

What we cover:

- Yasmine’s “aha” moment that sparked CarbonTrac.

- Why 34% of global emissions come from food—and how supermarkets can influence the system.

- The surprising maths: small swaps like dairy milk to oat milk for coffee can cut UK emissions by over 1%.

- Bridging the gap between wanting to act sustainably and actually taking action (80% vs. 12%).

- Using emotional incentives (“enough ice for penguins”) alongside financial rewards to shift habits.

- Designing sustainability to be profitable for retailers, suppliers, and consumers.

- Tackling legacy systems and risk-averse corporate cultures.

- How CarbonTrac’s model could be applied to publishing, fashion, and tech.

- Expanding into nutrition: AI-driven insights to address deficiencies and improve health.

- The urgency of 2030 climate targets, and what needs to change now.

More about Yasmine Abdu:

Yasmine is the CEO and founder of CarbonTrac, an AI platform gamifying sustainable grocery shopping to make it easy and rewarding. Her work has attracted recognition from the UN, Samsung, Sage, and Huawei. Yasmine is driven by the belief that millions of small actions, done together, can reshape entire supply chains.

Find out more at carbontrac.io

From DEF CON, Black Hat, and Wired’s Google Gemini warning… to an urgent conversation with Peter Warren on the shareholder insurance every 2025-2030 C-Suite must have and how connected risks can put anyone in your organization in the firing line.

Warren, chair of the Cyber Security Research Institute, breaks down the why and the how: from AI’s self-poisoning problem and database poisoning to protecting critical infrastructure, safeguarding data integrity, and sharpening leadership decision-making in an AI-driven world.

In this episode of AfterShock, we dig into:

- Why 90% of major cyber-attacks have nation-state fingerprints.

- The rise of database poisoning — the tactic set to replace ransomware.

- AI’s self-poisoning problem, hallucinations, and the erosion of truth.

- From Paul McCartney’s bank details to Lockheed Martin missile defence files — all found on discarded hard drives.

- Why IoT devices, autonomous cars, and even robotic farms are the next frontline.

- The "Herod Clause" public Wi-Fi sting that caught users agreeing to give away their eldest child.

- How over-reliance on GPS and apps is quietly rewiring our brains — and dulling our decision-making.

- The best- and worst-case cyber futures for 2030 — and what leaders must do now.

More about Peter Warren:

An award-winning investigative journalist who has worked for the Sunday Times Insight Team and BBC Two, Peter Warren has written about cybersecurity for over 35 years. The New York Times’ John Markoff and Warren wrote the first-ever stories on the subject and have covered it ever since.

https://www.futureintelligence.co.uk/

https://x.com/techtvl