Billy Corgan sits down with musical trailblazer Al Jourgensen for an unvarnished dive into four decades of boundary‑pushing music. Jourgensen walks through Wax Trax’s cash‑on‑the‑table sessions, the house‑mix side hustles at Chicago Trax, he unpacks leaving Arista via bankruptcy, reclaiming control on Twitch, and bringing Paul Barker back for what he insists will be Ministry’s final record and tour; the pair compare production habits and trade stories about Timothy Leary’s psychedelic “experiments,” psilocybin‑fueled hangs with Gary Numan, and the grind of touring versus the lure of studio life; they trace the influence of the Chicago scene on countless other artists, and debate writing politics that outlast news cycles; to wrestle with whether creativity comes from a universal signal or something like a digital matrix.

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