This week on Another Pass, Case and Sam are joined by guest Sean Muir to dissect the late ’90s sci-fi horror flick Virus—a movie where bad wiring meets worse decisions. Together, they explore the film’s potential, its squandered setup, and how it almost became the Event Horizon of killer robot movies.

#AnotherPass #Virus1999 #JamieLeeCurtis #DonaldSutherland #SeanMuir #SciFiHorror #FlawedButFascinating

Another Pass Full Episode

Originally aired: August 22, 2025

Music by Vin Macri and Matt Brogan

Podcast Edited by Sophia Ricciardi

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Overview

• Guests Case Aiken and Sam Alicea introduced Sean Muir from Movie Midness to discuss the 1999 film 'Virus', highlighting its unexpected obscurity despite notable cast members like Jamie Lee Curtis and Donald Sutherland.
• The film was released in January 1999, originally scheduled for late 1998, but was a commercial failure, earning only half of its budget back with critical reviews reflecting its shortcomings.
• Discussion revealed that the movie heavily referenced better films like The Thing and Alien, being described as merely an 'outline of a movie', lacking the depth expected from the genre.
• The technical achievements of Phil Tippett's animatronics were praised, although criticized for being too bright for the intended horror atmosphere, while CGI elements did not hold up well.
• Cultural shifts post-9/11 were noted as a change in audience appetite for sci-fi horror, marking an end to the late 90s creature feature trend seen in films like Independence Day.
• Character development was weak, with the consensus that Billy Baldwin's role could be eliminated without impacting the story; Sherman Augustus's character identified as the most promising but underutilized.
• Proposed a campier direction for the film, featuring humans viewed as 'uncouth' by aliens, which could yield more engaging content and interactions among the crew.
• Suggested removing the opening space scene to enhance suspense, providing a fresher take on alien threat revelation and deepening story engagement.
• Critique noted inconsistencies in character portrayals

 

Notes ️ Episode Introduction & Setup (00:00 - 10:25)

• Case Aiken and Sam Alicea welcome guest Sean Muir (Movie Midness) to discuss the 1999 sci-fi horror film 'Virus'.
• Both Case and Sam were unfamiliar with the film despite it featuring notable actors and being from 1999, highlighting how obscure it became.
• John Bruno left his VFX supervisor position on Titanic to direct this film, but his career trajectory after this movie remains unclear.
• The movie appears made for cyberpunk enthusiasts, sci-fi nerds, and specifically mentioned Billy Idol during his cyberpunk phase after missing the T-1000 role in Terminator 2.

Movie Plot Summary & Analysis (07:40 - 20:48)

• Film opens with Russian space station receiving alien energy that transfers to communication ship; American tugboat crew discovers abandoned vessel during hurricane and faces killer machines.
• Features Jamie Lee Curtis, Donald Sutherland, Billy Baldwin, and Cliff Curtis; Sam expresses confusion about Billy Baldwin's casting choices.
• Film draws heavily from better movies including The Thing, Alien, Event Horizon, and Ghost Ship; described as feeling like an 'outline of a movie'.
• Movie was a commercial bomb, earning only half its budget back and receiving harsh critical reviews.

️ Technical & Production Discussion (20:49 - 40:48)

• Phil Tippett's animatronics work praised as excellent, though perhaps too well-lit for horror atmosphere; practical effects hold up better than CGI elements.
• Late 90s represented end of creature feature era; audiences moving toward CGI spectacle seen in films like Independence Day and Jurassic Park sequels.
• Discussion of how cultural tastes changed dramatically after 9/11, affecting appetite for this type of sci-fi horror content.
• Movie reused ship from The Abyss and other James Cameron productions; originally scheduled for 1998 release but moved to January 1999 'dump month'.

Character & Story Analysis (40:48 - 01:02:22)

• Crew relationships underdeveloped compared to superior ensemble films like Aliens; characters lack memorable personality moments.
• Consensus that Billy Baldwin's character adds nothing to the film and could be completely removed without impact.
• Sherman Augustus's character Richie identified as film's best, showing intelligence and survival instincts that should have made him the protagonist.
• Central concept of humans being the 'virus' poorly executed compared to The Matrix (same year) or later films like Arrival.

Pitch Session - Campy Direction (01:02:23 - 01:12:53)

• Proposes making film campier with Galactic Union of Planets deciding humans are 'uncouth' and sending computer virus to eliminate them efficiently.
• Suggests more scenes of Richie building weapons from robot parts and crew creating makeshift tools for survival.
• Proposes aliens are annoyed by human space transmissions like 'intergalactic Mormons' constantly trying to make contact.
• More creative use of ship's manufacturing equipment turned into weapons.

Technical Improvement Suggestions (01:12:53 - 01:22:35)

• Sean criticizes inconsistent Scottish accent performance, suggests either full commitment or using natural voice.
• Marshall Bell (Woods) needs better pain expression training for nail gun injury scenes.
• Second wall of hurricane not properly represented with appropriate ship movement and chaos during climax.
• Movie lacks clear layout understanding, unlike Die Hard's excellent building geography that aids tension.

Horror Direction Alternative (01:16:55 - 01:22:35)

• Remove opening space station scene, make it flashback told by Nadia; focus on mystery and unknown threat.
• Give Jamie Lee Curtis's Kit Foster more personal stakes and character arc beyond basic competence.
• Build more suspense through delayed revelation of alien threat; explore 'humans as virus' theme more thoroughly.
• Better utilize ship's impressive technical areas and create clearer navigation understanding.

Wrap-up & Social Media (01:22:35 - 01:27:59)

• Sean Muir promotes Movie Midness Instagram, Letterboxd, and YouTube profiles featuring movie analysis and model train scene recreations.
• Thanks to executive producer level supporters including Micah McCaw, Carter Hallett, Sean Muir, and others.
• Highlander 2: The Quickening announced as next film for discussion.
• Shoutouts to Macaw Podcast, We Have Issues comic review show, and Books that Burn literature podcast.

For the 175th episode of Another Pass, we had to talk about a cult classic so cultish and such a classic that it demanded two separate panels! That's right! For a discussion on Starship Troopers, Case and Sam are joined by John Lestrange (The History Wizard), Samantha Perez, Keith Lehtinen, and Mitch Punpayuk! Would you like to know more?

Music by Vin Macri and Matt Brogan

Podcast Edited by Sophia Ricciardi

Overview

• Episode 175 of 'Certain POV's Another Pass' podcast explores Starship Troopers, addressing its satirical elements and impact on audiences, featuring two distinct panels.
• Personal viewing experiences highlight how initial interpretations of the film changed over time, with multiple guests recognizing the underlying satire.
• The film's satirical intent often missed by audiences; Poe's Law indicates difficulty in distinguishing extreme satire from genuine claims without clear indicators.
• Elements of fascism illustrated in the United Citizen Federation's military service requirements and portrayal of authority figures with war injuries.
• Propaganda within the film includes false flag operations, demonstrating dehumanization of 'bugs' and justifying violent military actions.
• Johnny Rico's character illustrates an alt-right pipeline, showing the process of radicalization through military indoctrination and societal pressure.
• Significant differences between the original book and movie adaptation noted, including a shift in character motivations and depictions of technology.
• Production challenges included injuries during boot camp training and instances of disrupted filming, showcasing the difficulties faced by the crew.
• Cultural impact acknowledged, as Starship Troopers influenced franchises like Starcraft and Helldivers, with modern audiences resonating with its themes.
• New adaptations are in development, including a Sony project directed by Neil Blomkamp, indicating ongoing interest in the Starship Troopers franchise.

 

Notes ️ Episode Introduction & Format (00:01 - 02:51)

• Episode 175 of 'Certain POV's Another Pass' podcast discussing Starship Troopers as a movie that overcame adversity.
• Two-panel format with different guest combinations to cover extensive discussion topics.
• First panel features Case Aiken, Sam Alicea, John Lestrange, and Samantha Perez focusing on sociological themes.
• Second panel includes Case Aiken, Sam Alicea, Keith Lehtinen, and Mitch Punpayuk discussing filmmaking aspects.

Personal Experiences with Starship Troopers (04:08 - 16:01)

• Case Aiken saw it at age 13 in 1997, initially missed satirical elements, took it as straightforward action film.
• Sam Alicea watched at 16-17, uncomfortable with bugs but recognized something 'off' about the film.
• John Lestrange first viewing at age 7 when released, watched for first time yesterday with Holocaust studies background.
• Samantha Perez saw chopped TV versions as teenager, recently rewatched with fresh perspective.
• Keith Lehtinen was 14 when released, became aware of actors through this film, Dina Meyer was first crush.
• Mitch Punpayuk saw at 15, bought DVD before owning DVD player, waited two years to watch it.

Satirical Elements & Reception Analysis (20:09 - 29:48)

• Movie functions as fascist propaganda satire but audiences often missed the satirical intent.
• Poe's Law applies - satirical expressions of extremist views indistinguishable from actual extremist views without clear indicators.
• 1997 timing problematic for satire reception - post-Cold War, pre-9/11 context limited audience understanding.
• Director Paul Verhoeven grew up in Nazi-occupied Netherlands, assumed audience familiarity with fascist themes.
• Susan Sontag's 'Fascinating Fascisms' (1975) referenced - Nazi ideal of 'brave, pretty and stupid' Aryan forces.

️ Fascist Society Elements (24:14 - 01:01:13)

• United Citizen Federation requires military service for citizenship and voting rights.
• All adult authority figures shown with missing limbs or severe scarring from military service.
• 14 characteristics of fascism present but modified - notably lacks typical gender hierarchy/sexism.
• Reproduction licensing system makes having children difficult for non-citizens.
• Public flogging and televised executions as standard punishments.

Bug War Propaganda Analysis (30:42 - 40:12)

• Buenos Aires meteor attack potentially false flag operation rather than bug weapon.
• Mormon colony massacre on bug territory used as justification despite humans being invaders.
• 'Would you like to know more?' segments function as in-universe propaganda reels.
• Children encouraged to stomp bugs in disturbing propaganda scene.
• Brain bug capture presented as victory but war clearly being lost.

‍️ Character Development & Military Pipeline (51:47 - 01:00:16)

• Johnny Rico represents alt-right pipeline - young man radicalized through military indoctrination.
• Carmen Ibanez portrayed as ambitious, prioritizing military career over relationships.
• Dizzy Flores changed from male character in book to female love interest.
• Carl Jenkins represents military intelligence, disappears into classified operations.
• Sergeant Zim and Lieutenant Rasczak serve as father figures in military structure.

Book vs Movie Adaptation (23:13 - 28:17)

• Originally titled 'Bug Hunt at Outpost 7' before being adapted to Starship Troopers.
• Director didn't finish reading Heinlein's book, called it 'too boring'.
• Mobile Infantry in book wore powered armor with jump jets, removed due to budget/wire work complexity.
• Bugs more technologically advanced in book, movie presents them as purely biological.
• Buenos Aires not Rico's hometown in book, major plot change for personal motivation.

Production Challenges & Behind-the-Scenes (39:34 - 07:35)

• Cast underwent intensive boot camp training, Casper Van Dien and Dina Meyer sustained injuries during filming.
• Intoxicated crew member mentioned bomb on flight, disrupting production travel.
• Pre-visualization test at Vasquez Rocks convinced TriStar to fund after Waterworld concerns.
• 15-foot practical ship models used alongside CGI for space scenes.
• Starship Trooper armor reused in multiple productions including Power Rangers, Firefly, Planet of the Apes.

Special Effects & Technical Aspects (08:52 - 06:24)

• Mix of practical and CGI effects particularly effective for bug creatures.
• Netflix 4K viewing shows quality variations, some scenes appear grainy especially green screen backgrounds.
• Brain bug close-ups noted as particularly disturbing and well-designed.
• Space scenes generally poor quality except for specific flight sequences.

Cultural Impact & Legacy (14:18 - 17:26)

• Starcraft, Warhammer 40K, and Helldivers directly influenced by Starship Troopers aesthetics.
• Five-movie franchise plus Roughnecks CGI TV series expanded universe.
• Modern resonance with current political climate makes satirical elements more apparent.
• Gif culture frequently references film during political tensions.

Cast & Casting Decisions (17:18 - 21:57)

• Unknown actors cast intentionally to look 'authentically young' but appear older due to training.
• Mark Wahlberg and Matt Damon auditioned for Rico role.
• Dina Meyer originally read for Carmen, chose Dizzy role instead.
• Neil Patrick Harris commentary recorded pre-How I Met Your Mother fame.
• Character actors include Amy Smart, Seth Gilliam, Timothy Omundson in small roles.

Audience Reception & Box Office (15:07 - 20:09)

• Test audiences disliked Carmen character, preferred Dizzy.
• Critical reception missed satirical intent, even thoughtful reviewers uncertain.
• Box office made budget back but not considered major success.
• Cult classic status developed over time as satirical elements became more apparent.

Thematic Analysis (34:39 - 51:47)

• Dehumanization through 'bug' imagery parallels historical genocidal rhetoric.
• Violence as societal foundation explicitly stated in film's philosophy.
• Military-industrial complex critique through endless war presentation.
• Youth radicalization process demonstrated through Rico's character arc.

Future Adaptations (13:51 - 13:51)

• Sony developing new Starship Troopers adaptation directed by Neil Blomkamp.
• Helldivers movie also in development as spiritual successor.

Vanessa Cominsky joins Case and Sam to RAGE against this awkward historical epic!

Overview Podcast hosts Case Aiken and Sam Alicea provide a framework for discussing the 2004 film Troy, highlighting its connection to early 2000s epic films like Gladiator and 300. Vanessa Cominsky, a guest and classics major, notes a 4-year professional bond with Case stemming from shared academic interests. David Benioff, the film's screenwriter, is discussed in relation to his later work on Game of Thrones and identified issues in narrative depth. Whitewashing criticism surfaces regarding the film’s predominantly white cast, despite its story set in a historically diverse region. Analysis reveals a lack of clear passage of time, compressing the depicted 10-year Trojan War into a brief narrative span. Costume design receives praise for historical accuracy while the film’s runtime discrepancies are critiqued, with the director’s cut deemed excessive. Thematic exploration includes Agamemnon's characterization as a villain symbolizing US imperialism, contrasting with sympathetic portrayals of the Trojans. Sean Bean's potential as Odysseus is noted but criticized for underutilization, while Peter O'Toole’s Priam provides limited but impactful performance. Improvement suggestions include altering the title to better reflect Achilles' journey and revising the narrative structure to enhance character development. Upcoming initiatives include a scholarship program for women in wine, launched by Vanessa Cominsky's nonprofit Vin Vitalite in 2025.

@vminsky @womenofwinedc Www.vinVitalité.org (Pronounced vinn vitahlihtay)

Notes ️ Podcast Introduction & Setup (00:00 - 02:45)

• Hosts Case Aiken and Sam Alicea introduce the 'Another Pass' podcast, discussing movie analysis and improvements.
• Guest Vanessa Cominsky introduced as Case's coworker from wine/spirits industry and fellow classics major.
• Discussion of 4-year professional relationship and bonding over classics background.

Movie Context & Background (02:45 - 09:38)

• Analysis of 2004 film Troy as adaptation loosely based on oral tradition.
• Discussion of movie within context of early 2000s epic films including Gladiator, 300, and Lord of the Rings trilogy.
• David Benioff identified as screenwriter, connecting to later Game of Thrones writing style issues.
• Observation that Odysseus character tells audience he's clever but never demonstrates intelligence in actual scenes.
• Political interpretation: movie reflects 2004 centrist liberal perspective on Middle Eastern conflicts with 'support the troops' messaging.

Film Production & Casting Analysis (09:38 - 19:22)

• Vanessa's personal connection: used movie for high school Latin convention project and senior thesis.
• Whitewashing criticism - movie depicts conflict between Greece and Middle East with entirely white cast.
• Brad Pitt as main marketing draw playing Achilles in peak popularity period.
• Case's viewing experience in Rome during classics trip, creating nostalgic connection to material.

Story Structure & Adaptation Choices (19:22 - 28:32)

• Movie covers broader Trojan War story rather than just Iliad, including Trojan Horse sequence not in original epic.
• Brian Cox as Agamemnon praised as perfect casting choice despite whitewashing issues.
• Discussion of movie's approach to gods - humans take credit for actions rather than divine intervention.

️ Character Analysis - Heroes and Villains (28:32 - 38:14)

• Agamemnon positioned as main villain representing US imperialism, while Trojans portrayed sympathetically.
• Hector vs Achilles juxtaposition works well as respective champions of each side.
• Orlando Bloom as Paris criticized as too whiny and lacking roguish charm needed for character.
• Eric Bana as Hector praised as everyone's 'big brother' figure and moral center.

Production Design & Technical Elements (38:14 - 47:42)

• Costume design highly praised for historical accuracy and visual distinction between Greeks and Trojans.
• Director's cut vs theatrical cut - director's cut too long at 3 hours 16 minutes with unnecessary gore.
• Runtime issues - theatrical cut feels rushed while director's cut is excessive.

War Portrayal & Geographic Issues (47:43 - 56:37)

• Time compression problem - 10-year war feels like weeks or months with no passage of time indicated.
• Troy's geography poorly established - unclear city layout and siege logistics.
• Siege warfare portrayed as single-direction battle rather than comprehensive blockade.

Thematic Elements & Religious Context (56:38 - 01:05:46)

• Gods' role minimized to hint at divine influence without direct intervention.
• Moral philosophy embedded in Achilles-Briseis conversations about mortality and divinity.
• Historical accuracy questioned regarding Bronze Age vs Classical Greek terminology and social structures.

Casting and Performance Critique (01:05:46 - 01:15:32)

• Sean Bean as Odysseus underutilized despite perfect casting choice.
• Peter O'Toole as Priam noted as big casting choice but limited screen time.
• James Cosmo casting questioned as underused Trojan general.

Improvement Proposals - Sam's Pitch (01:15:32 - 01:26:16)

• Title change to 'The Wrath of Achilles' to better reflect actual story focus.
• Sean Bean expansion - more scenes showing passage of time and war strategy.
• Runtime reduction - cut Trojan perspective to focus on Greek side and Achilles' journey.
• Narrative structure - use Odysseus as storyteller/narrator rather than voiceover.

Improvement Proposals - Vanessa's Pitch (01:26:16 - 01:36:20)

• Scope change to focus on Achilles from moment Odysseus recruits him.
• Character development - establish Greek power structure and vassal relationships.
• Agamemnon characterization - emphasize him as villain representing imperialism more clearly.

Improvement Proposals - Casey's Pitch (01:36:20 - 01:45:13)

• Geographic clarity - establish Troy's layout and siege positioning with additional CG shots.
• Time passage - visual indicators and dialogue establishing years-long conflict.
• Battle variety - different environments including sea battles and raids on surrounding areas.
• Violence balance - between theatrical cut's sanitization and director's cut's excess.

Final Discussion & Wrap-up (01:45:13 - 02:05:58)

• David Benioff background revealed as Goldman Sachs executive's son, explaining Hollywood access.
• Vanessa's organization - Vin Vitalite, DC women in wine industry nonprofit with 501(c)(3) status.
• Scholarship program launching 2025 for women in wine industry.
• Next episode preview - Highlander 2: The Quickening.

Case and Sam are looking back at the earliest episodes of the show! Check out their thoughts on this classic episode when Case sat down with Geoff Moonen and chatted about Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back!

 

Overview

• Episode dedicated to Kevin Smith's influence following his recent heart attack, underscoring the importance of his work in nerd culture.
• View Askewniverse detailed as an interconnected film universe that began with Mallrats and culminated in Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back.
• Jason Mewes faced significant personal challenges during filming, impacting production due to substance abuse issues.
• Film characterized as having a weak overall plot with awkward transitions, relying on 'and then' storytelling.
• Subplot regarding animal rights deemed problematic and outdated, particularly in post-9/11 context.
• Noted lack of diversity in casting and representation, with a predominantly white male ensemble.
• Humor criticized for not aging well, featuring outdated jokes and problematic themes reminiscent of early 2000s comedy.
• Suggested structural improvements include framing devices and varying visual styles to enrich storytelling.
• Interview with Sam introduced new perspectives while affirming original hosts' critiques of structural flaws in the film.
• Overall legacy reflects a blend of quotability and cultural relevance, highlighting Kevin Smith's early comedy style compared to current film pacing.

 

Notes Episode Context & Background (00:05 - 07:17)

• Another Pass at Another Pass podcast episode featuring hosts discussing a previous episode about Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back.
• Episode prompted by Kevin Smith's recent heart attack, wanting to honor his work and influence on nerd culture.
• 49-minute brisk episode with good audio quality featuring Case Aiken and Jeff Moonan discussing Kevin Smith's filmography.
• Discussion positioned as 'most meta episodes' - an episode about an episode about a movie that references many other movies.

Kevin Smith Universe Analysis (08:40 - 19:26)

• View Askewniverse explained as interconnected reality starting accidentally with Mallrats, tying together story elements from previous films.
• Movie served as intended conclusion to the View Askewniverse with Jay and Silent Bob as main characters after being minor characters in Clerks.
• Jason Mewes struggled with substance issues during filming, drinking heavily while trying to get off drugs, making production difficult.
• Film positioned as 'greatest disc two of some other movie ever made' - ultimate bonus feature content rather than standalone film.

Film Structure & Content Issues (21:58 - 48:37)

• Movie suffers from awkward transitions and 'and then' storytelling rather than consequential plot progression.
• Light plot structure with random elements, particularly weak animal rights terrorist subplot that feels dated post-9/11.
• Racial and gender representation problems - almost exclusively white cast with limited female characters in meaningful roles.
• Film's humor hasn't aged well with numerous gay jokes, misogynistic elements, and dated comedy style reminiscent of Austin Powers era.

Proposed Improvements (24:51 - 42:01)

• Restructure with framing device - open with Jay and Silent Bob at diner with Suzanne the orangutan, telling story in flashback.
• Jay as unreliable narrator would allow for cutting awkward transitions and explaining absurd elements as his perspective.
• Blues Brothers structure suggested - characters piss off everyone along the way, leading to massive chase sequence at climax.
• Different visual styles for Jay's version vs. Bob's version vs. reality to distinguish narrative perspectives.

Kevin Smith's Evolution as Filmmaker (12:18 - 42:01)

• Smith writes about his current life experiences - Clerks while working retail, Mallrats about studio experience, Chasing Amy about creative ownership.
• Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back represents Smith dealing with internet trolls and fan expectations in nascent online era.
• Zack and Miri Make a Porno mentioned as better examination of filmmaking process, with Jason Mewes delivering strong performance.
• Smith's limitation as visual director acknowledged - focuses on dialogue and character interactions over cinematography.

Cultural Context & Legacy (07:17 - 17:45)

• Film represents early 2000s comedy style with extended gags and slower pacing compared to modern rapid-fire editing.
• Miramax studio system comparison made to classic Hollywood, allowing for cross-pollination of actors and characters.
• Movie's quotability exceeds its actual quality as a complete film experience.
• Clerks cartoon praised as superior Kevin Smith work with only six episodes but high quality content.

️ Sam's Perspective (New Co-host) (58:03 - 01:02:25)

• Sam agrees with original hosts' assessment - movie is quotable and fun but structurally flawed.
• Acknowledges problematic elements while noting they're not mean-spirited but reflect era's comedy standards.
• Harold and Kumar comparison resonates - better execution of similar stoner road trip concept.
• Kevin Smith's wife's involvement in diamond thief subplot makes misogynistic elements slightly less problematic but still problematic.

Case and Sam are joined by Nic Woolfe to stomp like a kaiju (stomp stomp stomp)! We're digging into the Monster-verse with "Godzilla: King of the Monsters (2019)"!   Overview In the podcast discussion titled "Another Pass at Godzilla King of the Monsters," the hosts, alongside guest Nic Woolfe, delve into their personal connections to the Godzilla franchise, reflecting on how nostalgia and earlier influences shaped their appreciation for Kaiju films. They analyze the 2019 film's financial performance, placing it within the context of the MonsterVerse, and offer praise for its visual elements, character portrayals, and emotional depth. The conversation touches on the film’s themes, such as the insignificance of personal problems against global threats, and critiques the marketing strategies that may have contributed to its underwhelming box office results. The hosts discuss scientific inaccuracies, potential improvements, and casting alternatives, asserting that while the film has its flaws, it remains enjoyable. They conclude with suggestions for future explorations within the franchise, including their next episode focus on "Highlander 2: The Quickening."

 

Notes Introduction and Personal Connections to Godzilla (00:00 - 10:59)

• Hosts introduce guest Nic Woolfe for their fifth episode together
• Discussion of personal connections to Godzilla franchise
• Nick's love for Kaiju came from Power Rangers, Rugrats' Reptar, and later access to classic Godzilla films
• The hosts establish they all genuinely enjoy the 2019 Godzilla film
• Movie cost between 170-200 million but only made 387 million, falling short of the $400 million target

MonsterVerse Context and Prior Films (10:59 - 21:41)

• Discussion of 2014 Godzilla film directed by Gareth Edwards as the MonsterVerse starting point
• Brief mentions of Kong: Skull Island as part of the MonsterVerse
• Sam shares her family history with Godzilla, particularly her mother's love for monster movies
• Case discusses the 80s-90s Godzilla marketing push in Western media
• MonsterVerse is praised for continuing to improve since the 2014 film

️ Visual Elements and Character Appreciation (21:42 - 32:54)

• Praise for Ghidorah being portrayed as a hurricane with lightning everywhere it goes
• Discussion of the elemental nature of the Titans: Ghidorah (wind), Godzilla (water), Rodan (fire), Mothra (earth)
• Appreciation for the film's use of mythology and inclusion of Mothra's twins
• Strong praise for the cast including Charles Dance, Bradley Whitford, Ken Watanabe
• Discussion of the emotional scene where Serizawa sacrifices himself

Themes and Human Elements (32:54 - 42:52)

• Comparison between Godzilla: King of Monsters and other Godzilla films including Shin Godzilla
• Discussion of the family storyline involving Mark and Emma Russell
• Analysis of the theme that 'it's bigger than you' - problems being insignificant compared to global threats
• Appreciation for the resolution provided for human characters
• Commentary on the film's emotional resonance and how it saved Nick during a difficult time

Critical Analysis of Marketing and Casting (42:52 - 52:52)

• Discussion about why the film didn't perform as well financially as expected
• Analysis of movie title 'King of the Monsters' being reused from the 1950s
• Suggestion that 'Rise of the Titans' might have been a better title
• Critique that the film lacked young, attractive lead characters that might draw wider audiences
• Observation that the film needed more explanation of the various Titans/monsters

Scientific Inaccuracies and Improvement Ideas (52:53 - 01:02:28)

• Criticism of the 'alpha male' science regarding Titans as outdated
• Suggestion that more monster battles would have improved the film
• Discussion of effective scenes showing the scale of monsters compared to humans
• Praise for Ken Watanabe's sacrifice scene and emotional impact
• Analysis of how the film's marketing could have better emphasized human perspective shots

Marketing Critique and Casting Alternatives (01:02:28 - 01:13:52)

• Proposal that more monster explanations would have helped broader audience engagement
• Discussion of how modern trailers often reveal too much compared to effective ones like Independence Day
• Suggestion that Sally Hawkins' character shouldn't have been killed early
• Idea that Charles Dance could have played Tom Hiddleston's character from Skull Island
• Commentary on how the film might have benefited from younger actors in certain roles

Final Suggestions and Conclusions (01:13:52 - 01:24:43)

• Discussion about whether including Kong would have helped the film commercially
• Suggestion to better explain the costs and benefits of Titans to the ecosystem
• Proposal for including anti-Titan lobbyists or weapons manufacturers as antagonists
• Overall conclusion that despite its flaws, the film is still highly enjoyable
• Guest and host contact information shared
• Announcement that next episode will cover Highlander 2: The Quickening

 

Action items Unassigned

• Watch 'Godzilla Minus One' while it's still available on Netflix

Case and Sam are looking back at the earliest episodes of the show! Check out their thoughts on the eighteenth episode when Case sat down with Drew Lewandowski and chatted about Captain America: The First Avenger!

Overview In the latest episode of the 'Another Pass at Another Pass' podcast, hosts Case Aiken and Sam Alicea review 'Captain America: The First Avenger,' reflecting on its role as a unifying film within the Marvel Cinematic Universe (MCU). They discuss the film's strong character setup in the first half but critique a rushed third act and missed opportunities for deeper character development, particularly concerning the Howling Commandos and the relationship between Howard Stark and Steve Rogers. Praise is given to the casting, especially Chris Evans as Captain America and Hugo Weaving as Red Skull, while discussing suggestions for improving narrative flow. The hosts express a continuing appreciation for the film after rewatching it, noting its effective handling of themes and villains, and they highlight its significance within the broader MCU narrative. Additionally, they touch on the impact of real-world events on superhero films and announce upcoming podcast episodes, wrapping up with promotional messages for other network shows.

 

Notes Introduction to the Podcast and Film (00:00 - 10:16)

• Case Aiken and Sam Alicea are hosting 'Another Pass at Another Pass' podcast
• They're reviewing a previous episode about Captain America: The First Avenger
• The original episode featured Case and his friend Drew Lewandowski
• Case apologizes for poor audio quality in the original recording
• They discuss how Captain America serves as a unifying movie in the MCU
• The film connects elements from Iron Man, Thor, and Hulk through the Tesseract

Captain America as a Unifying Element (10:16 - 19:05)

• Captain America movies serve as unifying elements in the MCU
• Winter Soldier launched 'phase two' by introducing more complex themes
• The lines between good and bad become increasingly blurred in later films
• Captain America represents absolute leadership and teamwork
• The film establishes the character's role as someone who brings people together
• Captain America represents the ideals of America, not just super strength

Film Structure Analysis (19:05 - 28:33)

• First half of the film is exceptionally strong, creating a perfect character setup
• The third act feels rushed with some missed opportunities for character development
• The Red Skull (Hugo Weaving) is praised as an excellent villain
• HYDRA's introduction was more significant than initially realized
• HYDRA allowed for the creation of a Marvel-specific villain organization
• The film sets up important elements for Winter Soldier and later MCU films
• ⏱️ Critique of Film Pacing (28:33 - 36:56)
• The Howling Commandos deserved more screen time and character development
• The relationship between Howard Stark and Steve Rogers needed more development
• This relationship becomes important context for Tony/Steve dynamics in later films
• Bucky's 'death' scene could have been positioned differently in the narrative
• The train sequence and finale have some structural issues
• Discussion about how the film could have better bridged its two halves

Casting and Character Highlights (36:56 - 45:25)

• Exceptional casting across the board: Chris Evans, Hugo Weaving, Stanley Tucci
• Red Skull is one of the most enduring Marvel villains, despite limited screen time
• Zola's character design cleverly references his comic book appearance
• Tommy Lee Jones perfectly cast as the military leader
• Chris Evans found his defining role as Captain America
• Strong supporting cast with actors who would later become more famous

Film Analysis and Improvement Ideas (45:26 - 54:02)

• Suggestion to add an 'intermission' between the film's two halves
• Proposal to restructure the third act for better narrative flow
• The kamikaze pilots subplot criticized as lowering the stakes
• Suggested improvements for the final confrontation with Red Skull
• Idea to incorporate Bucky's death as a catalyst for the final mission
• Discussion about improving the transition between propaganda era and real combat

Conclusion of Original Episode (54:02 - 01:02:58)

• Original hosts wrap up their discussion of the film
• The movie is praised as being difficult to critique because it's so well-made
• Recommendation for viewers to rewatch the film with modern context
• Discussion of how the film fits into the larger MCU narrative
• Mention of a 'Phase One drinking game' for MCU marathon viewings
• Final thoughts on the film's significance to the MCU

Modern Perspective on the Film (01:02:58 - 01:13:03)

• Sam and Case discuss their current opinions of the film after rewatching
• Both hosts remain strongly positive about the film years later
• The movie holds up exceptionally well in the context of the full MCU
• Discussion of how the film handles its villain effectively
• Praise for the subtle character moments and attention to detail
• Red Skull's appearance in later MCU films briefly mentioned

Character Design and Props (01:13:03 - 01:24:11)

• Excellent adaptation of comic book costumes to realistic military gear
• Props and set design create an authentic World War II atmosphere
• Captain America's evolution from USO performer to actual hero is well-executed
• Small character arcs for supporting characters are effectively included
• Discussion of how the film works as a family-friendly viewing option
• Only one potentially scary scene (Red Skull face reveal) noted for young viewers

️ Current MCU Discussion and Conclusions (01:24:11 - 01:39:52)

• Brief discussion of the recent 'Captain America: Brave New World' film
• Comparison between the original trilogy and newer Captain America content
• Discussion of how real-world events affect superhero movie production
• The consistent writing team for the Captain America trilogy provided narrative strength
• Announcement of upcoming podcast episodes and network news
• Farewell and promotional messages for other network shows

Case and Sam are joined by DJ Nik to revivify some Xenomorphs!

 

Overview   In the latest episode of the Another Pass podcast, hosts Case Aiken and Sam Alicea, along with guest DJ Nik, delve into the complexities of "Alien Resurrection," the fourth installment of the renowned Alien franchise. They discuss the film's controversial elements, including its scientific plausibility, character dynamics, and Joss Whedon’s unique screenplay style. The conversation highlights the film's shift towards a more campy tone and examines the visual aesthetics brought by director Jean-Pierre Jeunet, particularly the impressive underwater sequences. The hosts critique the character motivations and propose improvements, with Sam suggesting clearer intentions for the scientists and more depth for the space pirates, while Nick proposes focusing primarily on the scientists and Ripley in a more claustrophobic setting. Case adds ideas for restructuring the narrative arc to enhance suspense. The episode concludes with a tease for their next discussion covering "Highlander 2: The Quickening."

 

Notes Introduction to Alien Resurrection Discussion (00:00 - 10:27)

• Case Aiken and Sam Alicea host Another Pass podcast with guest DJ Nik
• They're discussing Alien Resurrection, the fourth film in the Alien franchise
• Nik introduces himself as a host of multiple podcasts including Whiskey and Cigarettes
• Case positions this film as less respected than Alien 3, which he previously defended
• Nick describes his love for the franchise, noting the Xenomorph as 'the greatest creature ever created'
• He appreciates how each film in the franchise has different directors with different visual styles
• Sam admits she only watched the Alien films because of the podcast, as she's 'afraid of everything'

Plot Elements and Science Issues (10:27 - 20:35)

• The group discusses the questionable science of cloning Ripley to harvest the alien inside her
• The movie is set 200 years after Alien 3, with Ripley having died in the previous film
• Sam suggests the genetic material might have been recovered like in Jurassic Park
• Case notes the first three films maintained scientific plausibility while this one stretches credibility
• The movie explores Ripley as a superhuman hybrid, shifting the franchise toward sci-fi adventure
• Nick points out that Sigourney Weaver was brought back as the flagship character
• Case questions the scientists' motives for bringing the aliens to Earth

Characters and Crew Dynamic (20:35 - 30:37)

• The movie features a crew of space pirates rather than soldiers or workers as in previous films
• Sam notes the villain motivations aren't properly established, raising questions about their plans
• The group questions why the aliens are kept together in cells where they can conspire to escape
• Nick suggests this is due to 'human hubris' and scientists wanting to study their interactions
• The movie has a distinct 'Joss Whedon' style, as he wrote the screenplay
• Case appreciates the lived-in world aesthetic consistent with previous Alien films
• Sam praises the film's beautiful visuals and camera work despite her criticisms

Alien Sequences and Visual Elements (30:38 - 39:45)

• The underwater sequence with aliens swimming is praised as visually impressive
• Sam notes the unrealistic breath-holding duration in the underwater scene
• The group appreciates creative kills and set pieces in the film
• They discuss how director Jean-Pierre Jeunet brought a different visual style
• The film is described as more campy than previous entries, closer to a slasher film in space
• The cast is discussed, with Michael Wincott as the captain and Ron Perlman as an abrasive character
• Winona Ryder is described as distractingly famous for her role as the android Call

The Xenomorphs and Newborn Design (39:45 - 49:46)

• The aliens show intelligence when escaping their cells by sacrificing one of their own
• The group discusses the alien queen's live birth ability instead of egg-laying
• Case questions how this is an 'evolutionary upgrade' when it seems painful and inefficient
• The newborn hybrid alien design is praised as appropriately freaky and different
• The theme of motherhood continues from previous films in the franchise
• Nick points out how the newborn looks more human than regular xenomorphs
• Sam simply finds the newborn 'gross' and disturbing

Improving the Film - Sam's Pitch (49:46 - 01:01:06)

• Sam suggests clarifying the scientists' motives early in the film
• She proposes establishing that the main goal is creating super-soldiers like Ripley
• Sam recommends making the pirates more likeable so viewers care when they die
• She suggests giving hints about Winona Ryder's character being an android earlier
• Sam recommends establishing a military base on Earth as the destination for the specimens
• For the underwater scene, she suggests allowing characters to surface for air occasionally
• She would keep the film's ending but focus on fixing the first act and character development

Nick's Alternative Approach (01:01:06 - 01:10:07)

• Nick proposes eliminating the space pirates entirely
• He suggests focusing on scientists, Ripley, and Call (Winona Ryder's character)
• He recommends a more claustrophobic setting with military presence to explore ethics
• Nick suggests adding communication between the space station and Earth
• He proposes showing how Ripley's DNA was extracted to address audience questions
• Nick mentions that Joss Whedon's original script featured Newt instead of Ripley
• He wonders how the film might have been different if directed by Danny Boyle, who was approached first

Case's Restructuring Proposal (01:10:08 - 01:18:51)

• Case suggests making the space pirates the focus of the first act, with Winona Ryder as the viewpoint character
• He proposes revealing Ripley later as a surprise, during the basketball scene
• He recommends establishing that scientists have been successfully cloning aliens already
• Case suggests the aliens should have been in captivity longer to justify their escape methods
• He likes keeping the back half of the movie mostly intact
• The hosts share that Sigourney Weaver actually made the backward basketball shot in one take
• They conclude by mentioning their next episode will cover Highlander 2: The Quickening

Case and Sam are looking back at the earliest episodes of the show! Check out their thoughts on the seventeenth episode when Case sat down with Ben Milton and Addy Thomas and chatted about The Hobbit Trilogy!

Overview   In the latest Podcast Discussion meeting, hosts Case and Sam explored a meta-review of their previous episode on The Hobbit trilogy, originally recorded after their first year of podcasting. The discussion began with an overview of the original episode, highlighting a consensus that three films were excessive for the source material. They praised Martin Freeman’s casting as Bilbo while critiquing Peter Jackson for trying to align the film’s style with The Lord of the Rings, particularly noting that the addition of the villain Azog was unnecessary. They also pointed out issues with character design and narrative structure, suggesting a two-film adaptation could have better captured character arcs and pacing, particularly with scenes involving Smaug. The Battle of Five Armies was identified as the weakest film, marred by excessive padding and a lack of personal stakes compared to earlier battles in the franchise. The hosts expressed the importance of subtlety in fan service and connections to The Lord of the Rings while reflecting on their own views from the initial episode. They concluded by sharing their love for film and announced upcoming episodes focused on Captain America and Alien Resurrection, while encouraging listener engagement through their Discord server.

 

Notes Introduction and Episode Context (00:00 - 09:47)

• Case and Sam introduce this meta-episode reviewing a previous podcast about The Hobbit trilogy
• The original episode featured Case, Ben, and Addie discussing at 'CPOV Studios'
• They note this was recorded after completing the first year of the podcast
• Main critique established immediately: three movies was far too many for The Hobbit source material
• The hosts mention they didn't rewatch the entire trilogy for this meta-review

Initial Critique of The Hobbit Films (09:48 - 19:09)

• The hosts praise Martin Freeman's casting as Bilbo as a perfect choice that connects to Elijah Wood's Frodo
• They criticize Peter Jackson for trying to make The Hobbit fit the style and scale of Lord of the Rings
• The unnecessary villain Azog (the pale orc) is identified as a major problem
• They note Jackson used artificial narrative structures to create three separate arcs where the source material didn't support it
• Discussion of how Lord of the Rings doesn't rely on personified villains, but on evil as a force

‍️ Character and Design Issues (19:09 - 28:25)

• The hosts criticize the framing device that has Bilbo explaining the dwarven kingdom's history
• They argue Bilbo should be an uninformed viewpoint character discovering the world along with the audience
• The dwarves' inconsistent design is highlighted as problematic (either caricatures or just normal people)
• They discuss how the dwarves don't feel cohesive like in Lord of the Rings and lack distinct personalities
• Case praises the Gollum scenes as genuinely excellent despite other issues

️ Proposed Two-Movie Structure (28:25 - 37:07)

• Case suggests ending the first movie at Lake Town as a natural breaking point
• This would create a moment where Bilbo has a true choice to continue or turn back
• They discuss how this cut would make Bilbo's character arc work better for the first film
• The second film could focus on Thorin's character arc
• They criticize how the actual film cuts (especially the Desolation of Smaug ending) feel like TV cliffhangers

Smaug and Pacing Issues (37:07 - 46:35)

• The hosts praise the actual Smaug and Bilbo conversation scenes
• They criticize the extended Smaug chase/forge scenes as unnecessary padding
• Discussion of how Jackson is good at bringing book scenes to life but struggles when expanding material
• They propose that the second movie should open with the dwarves finding the door to the Lonely Mountain
• They critique the narrative weight of many extended sequences that don't actually advance the story

️ Battle of Five Armies Criticisms (46:36 - 55:45)

• The Battle of Five Armies is identified as the weakest film with the most padding
• They argue the battle should have been the third act of a movie, not an entire film
• Discussion of how the battle needed to feel smaller and more personal than Lord of the Rings battles
• They appreciate the decision to make Bilbo more active in the battle than in the book
• The hosts criticize the 'video game' quality of action sequences like the barrel rider scene

‍️ Fan Service and Connections to Lord of the Rings (55:45 - 01:04:58)

• They discuss how Legolas' inclusion made sense for the first film but was forced in later films
• They appreciate seeing Saruman before his fall to evil
• The hosts criticize heavy-handed references to Lord of the Rings (like mentioning Aragorn/Strider)
• They note how forcing connections to the original trilogy hurt the story
• Discussion of the 'video game' quality of action sequences compared to Lord of the Rings

Meta-Discussion of the Episode (01:04:58 - 01:15:51)

• Sam and Case reflect on the original episode, finding it thorough and well-argued
• Sam admits not rewatching the trilogy for this meta-review as it would be too time-consuming
• They reaffirm that the trilogy's main problem is its excessive length
• Sam praises the costumes while Case notes the 48 FPS format made everything look fake
• They discuss how watching the entire Middle-earth saga chronologically would be challenging

Final Thoughts and Upcoming Episodes (01:15:51 - 01:32:34)

• Case reiterates that a good two-movie cut exists within the trilogy's footage
• They agree the first film is the most watchable of the three
• Both hosts express their love for the first Captain America film (their next episode topic)
• Sam mentions she didn't rewatch the Hobbit films as they would take 10+ hours
• They provide information about their Discord server and social media presence
• Upcoming podcast episodes announced: Alien Resurrection and Captain America: The First Avenger

Action items

• Join and participate in the Discord server for further discussion (01:31:00)

Matt aka Stormageddon emerges from a pipe to surprise Case and Sam with the power up of a movie, The Super Mario Bros. Movie! Can they make it through with only three continues?   Music by Vin Macri and Matt Brogan Podcast Edited by Sophia Ricciardi   Overview   In the podcast recording discussion titled "Another Pass at The Super Mario Bros Movie," hosts Case Aiken and Sam Alicea, joined by guest Matt (Stormageddon), delve into their cinematic experiences of the 2023 film, praising its 92-minute runtime and appeal to both children and nostalgic adult fans. They highlight standout performances, notably Jack Black as Bowser and Anya Taylor-Joy as a proactive Princess Peach, while critiquing Chris Pratt's portrayal of Mario as merely average. The hosts discuss the film’s visual splendor and numerous Easter eggs, though they express disappointment over its reliance on pop music rather than classic Mario compositions. Despite some criticisms of the plot's formulaic nature and suggestions for improvement, the overall consensus is positive, deeming the film entertaining while respecting the franchise's legacy; potential sequels and upcoming projects are also touched upon as they conclude the episode.

 

Notes Introduction to The Super Mario Bros Movie Discussion (00:02 - 08:33)

• Matt (Stormageddon) returns as a guest to discuss The Super Mario Bros Movie (2023)
• Case Aiken introduces podcast with co-host Sam Alicea
• The hosts discuss their viewing experiences of the film
• The 92-minute runtime is highlighted as a positive factor that keeps the movie from overstaying its welcome
• Initial thoughts: The film works well for both children and nostalgic adult Nintendo fans

Cast Performance and Character Representation (08:33 - 18:50)

• Jack Black as Bowser receives unanimous praise as a standout performance
• Anya Taylor-Joy as Princess Peach also praised for making the character active rather than a damsel
• Charlie Day as Luigi received positive reviews
• Chris Pratt as Mario described as 'just fine' - not as bad as internet feared but not exceptional
• The group appreciates Charles Martinet's cameo as Mario's father and Giuseppe
• The opening commercial sequence featuring the 'Super Mario Super Show' song noted as a clever homage
• Keegan-Michael Key's performance as Toad highlighted as charming
• The film successfully modernizes Princess Peach as a proactive character rather than a damsel in distress

Music, Visuals and Fan Service (18:50 - 30:01)

• Major criticism: The film relies too heavily on pop music needle drops instead of using iconic Mario game music
• Case and Matt express disappointment that classic Koji Kondo compositions weren't featured more prominently
• The DK rap inclusion was appreciated, though Grant Kirkhope wasn't properly credited initially
• The visual design receives high praise, described as 'one of the most gorgeous animated films' they've seen
• The group appreciates the many Easter eggs and references to various Mario games
• Notable references: Mario Kart customization, power-ups, Rainbow Road, and Luigi's Mansion sequence
• Film balances content for children with nostalgic references for adult fans of the games

️ Plot Structure and Pacing (30:01 - 40:01)

• The basic plot follows Mario Brothers from Brooklyn to the Mushroom Kingdom
• Main criticism: The plot feels 'paint by numbers' and moves from set piece to set piece for fan service
• The hosts appreciate the quick pace preventing the film from becoming boring
• Donkey Kong's substantial role questioned as potentially excessive for this film
• The 'plumbing scene' at the beginning described as feeling too 'illumination-style' and skippable
• The Mario Kart sequence, while visually impressive, doesn't serve the plot significantly
• The movie makes excellent use of character power-ups during action sequences
• Luma (star creature) from Mario Galaxy highlighted as a standout supporting character

Suggested Improvements (40:01 - 50:06)

• Matt suggests removing or reducing the Kong Kingdom sequence to streamline the story
• The hosts discuss using more game music instead of pop songs for needle drops
• Fred Armisen's casting as Cranky Kong questioned; suggestions of other older actors who might have been better
• The group agrees the final act works well in terms of hero's journey storytelling
• Suggestions that Donkey Kong could have been integrated differently - as a mid-boss or obstacle rather than major character
• Discussion of how the film could have better incorporated game mechanics into the storytelling
• The movie's brief runtime (92 minutes) praised as preventing it from overstaying its welcome

Final Thoughts and Future Discussion (50:07 - 01:00:38)

• Overall positive consensus: While not groundbreaking, the film is entertaining and respects the source material
• The film succeeds as a fun, colorful movie for kids while providing nostalgic entertainment for adults
• Comparison to other video game adaptations like Detective Pikachu and Sonic
• Discussion of potential sequels and the upcoming Donkey Kong movie
• The hosts appreciate the film's visual quality while acknowledging its formulaic approach to storytelling
• Matt mentions returning for future episodes to discuss the Venom movies
• Discussion wraps with information about where to find the hosts and their other podcasts

Case and Sam are looking back at the earliest episodes of the show! Check out their thoughts on the sixteenth episode when Case sat down with Geoff Moonen and chatted about X-Men 3: The Last Stand!

Note: The original episode we're discussing was made before Elliot Page transitioned publicly.

Overview   In the Podcast Discussion and Analysis meeting titled "Another Pass at Another Pass at X-Men 3: The Last Stand," hosts Case and Sam explored various aspects of the film "X-Men 3: The Last Stand" through the lens of their podcast format, 'Another Pass at Another Pass.' They discussed audio quality improvements with guest Geoff Moonen, while delving into the film's production limitations and character choices. Key pitches for story improvements included intertwining the Dark Phoenix Saga with Days of Future Past and critiques of character underutilization, particularly Magneto and Storm. The conversation also highlighted the film's inconsistent narrative structure and missed opportunities for deeper character relationships, particularly among female characters. The meeting concluded with plans for future episodes focusing on The Hobbit trilogy and updates on upcoming podcast content and social media engagement. Action items included listening to upcoming episodes and joining community discussions on Discord.

 

Notes ️ Podcast Introduction and Discussion Format (00:06 - 14:20)

• Case and Sam introduce the 'Another Pass at Another Pass' podcast format where they review earlier episodes
• They discuss an episode featuring Geoff Moonen about X-Men 3: The Last Stand
• Case mentions audio quality issues, noting Geoff's voice actor quality sounds good
• They explain how they added ADR (additional dialogue recording) at the end for plugs
• The original episode focused on fixing X-Men 3's issues with a sense of urgency
• Geoff and Case begin discussing production limitations of X-Men 3, including director changes
• Bryan Singer left due to time constraints and Matthew Vaughn declined for similar reasons
• They acknowledge actor limitations including James Marsden asking to be killed off

Story Improvement Pitches (14:20 - 33:45)

• Case proposes combining Dark Phoenix Saga with Days of Future Past storyline
• The pitch includes starting with future timeline showing Phoenix as a psychic 'Hound'
• Suggests Kitty Pryde as time traveler (played by Elliot Page) instead of Wolverine
• Proposes Jean Grey possessing Mystique's body, explaining Rebecca Romijn's limited role
• Geoff suggests frontloading the 'cure' storyline as the main focus with Phoenix as secondary
• They discuss the missed opportunity with Angel/Warren Worthington III character
• Critique of wasted characters including Vinnie Jones as Juggernaut
• Discussion of poor integration between the cure storyline and Dark Phoenix plot

Character Assassination and Film Issues (33:45 - 50:00)

• Both agree Magneto's characterization was inconsistent with previous movies
• Criticism of Magneto's 'the pawns go first' line showing callous disregard for other mutants
• Criticism of the third act's tactical choices as nonsensical
• Discussion of Storm's missed potential as a counterforce to Phoenix
• Critique of the film having good individual scenes but poor overall structure
• Discussion of the Mystique character being abandoned by Magneto as out of character
• Acknowledgment of good casting choices that were underutilized

Post-Episode Analysis (50:01 - 01:06:20)

• Sam states this was one of her favorite episodes featuring Case and Geoff
• Discussion of Bryan Singer controversies not known at the time of original recording
• Case acknowledges being dismissive of X-Men comics at that point in his fandom
• Praise for the creative idea of Phoenix possessing Mystique's body
• Discussion of Geoff's observation about the 'cure' storyline being an inversion of the first film
• Sam praises the urgency and focus of the original discussion
• Analysis of the film trying to be serious but failing to deliver on its stakes

️ Character Relationships and Missed Opportunities (01:06:23 - 01:26:17)

• Sam criticizes Storm's relationship portrayal, particularly with Jean Grey
• Discussion of female characters existing in 'bubbles' only relating to male characters
• Suggestion that Storm should have confronted Dark Phoenix instead of Wolverine
• Critique of the film not properly explaining Phoenix's power and danger level
• Suggestion that the 'cure' storyline could stand alone with Phoenix hints for a sequel
• Discussion of ethical questions that could have been explored more deeply
• Case suggests the Phoenix suppression by the cure could have led to a post-credits setup
• Planning for future podcast episodes including The Hobbit trilogy

Podcast Updates and Social Media (01:26:17 - 01:30:46)

• Decision to skip discussing the 2017 clip show episodes as too meta
• Next Another Pass at Another Pass episode will cover The Hobbit trilogy
• Update on recent and upcoming main podcast episodes including Farragut Forward
• Upcoming Super Mario Bros episode with Matt/DJ Storm
• Information on where to find Sam and Case on social media
• Mention of Discord server at certainpov.com
• Case's social media handle: @Case Aiken on Bluesky

 

Action items Audience

• Listen to the upcoming Another Pass at Another Pass episode on The Hobbit trilogy (01:25:37)
• Check out the upcoming main podcast episode on Super Mario Bros with Matt/DJ Stormageddon (01:26:59)
• Join the Discord server through the link at certainpov.com for community discussion (01:28:05)
• Follow Case on Bluesky at @Case Aiken (01:28:20)