Host Rafael Behr is joined by political scientist Prof. Michael Bang Petersen, whose research challenges the common belief that those who share misinformation are simply uninformed or gullible.

Instead, Petersen suggest that many of these individuals are politically savvy and highly motivated, not by truth, but by the usefulness of information in advancing their political goals.

The conversation also explores the concept of the "need for chaos": a psychological drive found in a significant minority who actively seek to destabilise political systems, not just support one side over another.

Petersen also talks how status anxiety, feeling stuck or left behind in a rigid social hierarchy, fuels this destructive impulse.

This is a Behr and Berman podcast production

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