Be The Church with Joel Wayne

Be The Church Podcast — Episode 38

Building the Kingdom Together

Episode Summary

What if the future of the Church isn't built by a few influential leaders—but by thousands of faithful disciples being equipped where they already are?

In this episode, Joel Wayne sits down with Pastor Gary Campbell to discuss the heart behind Be The Church, the Spiritual Leadership Initiative (SLI), and why the local church remains God's primary strategy for developing spiritual leaders. Together they explore how God often brings together people, churches, and opportunities long before we recognize His plan.

Rather than asking, "How can we grow our church?" this conversation challenges us to ask, "How can we faithfully grow God's Kingdom?"

Whether you're a pastor, business leader, volunteer, or simply someone longing to make a greater Kingdom impact, this episode will encourage you to say yes to where God is already at work.

In this episode you'll learn:

• The vision behind Be The Church — Why churches are stronger when they partner together to raise up healthy disciples and leaders.
• Responding to God's movement instead of forcing your own — Learning to recognize where God is already working and joining Him there.
• Growing the Kingdom—not just our church — Why healthy churches look beyond themselves and invest in other churches and leaders.
• The Spiritual Leadership Initiative (SLI) — A new pathway designed to equip pastors, ministry leaders, and everyday believers with rich theological and leadership training inside the local church.
• The power of relationships in spiritual formation — Why disciples are shaped more through faithful people than isolated programs.
• Preparing before opportunity comes — Spiritual leadership isn't built overnight. It's formed through years of faithful obedience.
• The importance of saying "no" — How creating margin allows us to recognize and embrace God's greater invitations.
• Faithfulness before fruitfulness — Why God entrusts greater responsibility to those who remain faithful with what's already in front of them.
• Legacy through discipleship — Understanding the difference between influence and lasting Kingdom impact.

Practical Takeaways:

• Look for where God is already working. Instead of forcing opportunities, ask where God is inviting you to join His work.
• Invest in people, not just programs. Lasting Kingdom impact happens through relationships and discipleship.
• Create margin through wise "no's." Sometimes obedience requires letting go of good opportunities so you can embrace God's best.
• Commit to lifelong preparation. Spiritual leadership is formed through years of faithful study, prayer, and obedience—not overnight success.
• Become both a disciple and a disciple-maker. Ask who is investing in you—and who God is calling you to invest in.
• Raise the theological depth of your life. Whether you're called to ministry, business, or your home, growing in God's Word strengthens every area of influence.
• Measure success by Kingdom impact. Faithfulness isn't about building your platform—it's about advancing Christ's Kingdom.

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How to Study the Bible

Episode Summary

How do you move beyond simply reading the Bible to being transformed by it? In this episode, Joel Wayne sits down for a candid conversation about what it actually looks like to open the Word of God—not to master the text, but to be mastered by it. 

From personal devotional rhythms to the art of sermon preparation, Joel shares the practical habits and biblical convictions that have shaped his walk with Jesus, his leadership, and his preaching.

Whether you've followed Christ for decades or you're just beginning to engage Scripture, this conversation will challenge you to approach God's Word with humility, expectancy, and a desire for genuine transformation.

In this episode, you'll learn:

• Joel's personal Bible study rhythm — Why reading the same passages repeatedly has shaped his heart more deeply than constantly chasing something new.
• Studying the movements of Scripture — How following larger sections of the Bible (like John 3–5 or Matthew 1–7) helps reveal the story God is telling and the character of Jesus.
• The questions Jesus asks — Why Joel pays close attention to Christ's questions and how they expose what's happening in our own hearts.
• People of faith vs. people with answers — A challenging conversation about our tendency to admire certainty more than genuine dependence on God.
• "I want the text to master me." — Joel explains why Scripture should shape us rather than simply becoming something we analyze.
• Personal devotion vs. sermon preparation — Why pastors and ministry leaders must guard their own relationship with Jesus apart from ministry responsibilities.
• Preaching through books of the Bible — Why verse-by-verse exposition remains Joel's favorite and most transformative approach to preaching.
• Casting multiple nets from the pulpit — How Joel prepares messages that engage both the new believer and the lifelong student of Scripture.
• A live walk-through of John 3 — Joel demonstrates how he studies and teaches the conversation between Jesus and Nicodemus, showing how one passage can speak to people in very different places spiritually.

Practical Takeaways:

• Read movements of Scripture, not just isolated verses. Spend a week reading through John 1–5 or Matthew 1–7 and watch how the larger story begins to unfold.
• Memorize passages, not just verses. Consider committing Psalm 1, Psalm 16, Philippians 2:5–11, or James 1:2–8 to memory.
• Pay attention to the questions Jesus asks. His questions often reveal more about us than they do about the people He was speaking to.
• Come to God's Word expecting transformation. The goal of Bible study isn't simply more knowledge—it's becoming more like Christ.
• Protect your personal time with God. If you're in ministry, don't allow sermon preparation or teaching responsibilities to replace your own communion with Jesus.
• Let Scripture shape your worldview. Don't simply look for information or inspiration; allow God's Word to continually reform your heart, mind, and life.

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In this episode of the Be The Church Podcast, Pastor Joel Wayne sits down with Pastor Gary Campbell and Pastor Michael Rubino for an honest and faith-filled conversation about one of the most challenging realities every leader faces — leading people when you're not sure where you're going.

Gary has served his entire life at a 107+ year-old church in Groton, Connecticut, rooted in multi-generational faithfulness. Michael leads a rapidly growing, deeply diverse church on Long Island, New York, where half the congregation has come to faith in the last two years. Together, they unpack the difference between knowing your destination and knowing your strategy, why God rarely gives leaders a GPS but always gives them a direction, and how to lead with confidence when the path ahead isn't fully clear.

They discuss the tension between vision and strategy, why people respect faith from a distance but struggle to follow it up close, how to respond to people in your church who want more clarity than you can give, and why the uncertainty you're walking through right now might be exactly where God is doing His best work.

Whether you're a pastor navigating a major ministry transition, a leader trying to cast vision without a fully formed plan, or simply someone trying to follow Jesus faithfully through an uncertain season of life — this episode will challenge you to keep moving, stay in the Word, and trust that God doesn't need to reveal every step to prove He's working.

In this episode, you'll learn:

• Why you can know your destination but still lack the strategy to get there — and what to do about it
• How to lead with clarity and confidence when you can't give people a GPS route to the future
• What Abraham, Moses, David, Esther, Paul, and Joshua all have in common — and what it means for your leadership today
• Why people respect faith from a distance but struggle to actually follow a leader who operates by it
• How to hear the words behind the words when disgruntled people challenge your vision
• Why uncertainty isn't a leadership failure — it's often where the deepest spiritual growth happens
• How to discern whether lack of clarity is a God-dependency issue or a strategy-building issue
• What it looks like to start moving before you have all the answers — and why a parked car goes nowhere
• How to get above the clouds when the ground-level view is too overwhelming to navigate
• Why the plan God calls you to should always be bigger than what you can accomplish on your own

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Not everyone is called to sit in the lead seat—but every follower of Jesus is called to lead faithfully.

In this episode, Joel Wayne sits down with Luke Bilberry and Zach Stephens to explore the unique challenges, opportunities, and blessings of serving in the "second chair." Whether you're an associate pastor, ministry leader, business executive, team member, or volunteer, this conversation offers practical wisdom on supporting a vision, leading with humility, and leveraging your influence for the Kingdom of God.

Together, they discuss the importance of trust, alignment, communication, calling, and understanding how God has uniquely wired each leader. You'll discover why great leadership is often about serving others well, embracing your role with joy, and helping carry the mission forward—even when you're not the one casting the final vision.

If you've ever wrestled with contentment, influence, authority, or leadership responsibility, this episode will encourage you to lead faithfully where God has placed you.

Key Scriptures

Philippians 2:3-11
Jesus modeled humility and servant leadership by emptying Himself and taking the form of a servant.

Exodus 17:8-13
Aaron and Hur holding up Moses' arms as a picture of supporting leadership.

Acts 6:1-7
The apostles empower others to serve so the mission of God can continue to expand.

Romans 12:3-8
Different gifts, one body, united in purpose.

1 Corinthians 12:12-27
Every member plays a unique and valuable role in God's mission.

In This Episode

• What it means to serve faithfully in the second chair.
• Why every organization needs trusted support leaders.
• The blessing of influence without carrying ultimate responsibility.
• How healthy leaders create space for people to grow and evolve in their roles.
• The dangers of moving faster than the vision allows.
• Learning to submit ideas while maintaining conviction.
• The relationship between trust, humility, and organizational health.
• Why understanding your God-given wiring matters.
• The difference between "I could" and "I should."
• How servant leadership reflects the character of Christ.

Leadership Takeaways

1. Great Leadership Begins with Great Followership

The ability to support, serve, and strengthen another leader is a critical leadership skill. Faithfulness in the second chair prepares leaders for greater responsibility.

2. Trust Is the Foundation of Healthy Teams

Healthy organizations are built on mutual trust. Leaders must trust their teams, and teams must trust the leaders God has placed over them.

3. Good Leadership Requires Humility

Not every idea needs to be implemented immediately. Humility allows leaders to submit preferences for the sake of unity and mission.

4. Know How God Has Wired You

Every leader brings unique strengths to the table. Understanding your gifts helps you serve effectively and avoid unnecessary frustration.

5. Alignment Matters More Than Speed

Healthy change requires communication, trust, and alignment. Moving too quickly can create drift, while moving together creates momentum.

6. Focus on Calling, Not Position

Discontent grows when we focus on what we could do. Joy grows when we focus on what God has called us to do today.

Questions for Reflection

1. How has God uniquely wired me to serve and lead?
2. Am I fully embracing the role God has currently given me?
3. Where do I need to grow in trust toward the leaders around me?
4. Are my preferences creating unity or unnecessary tension?
5. Do I focus more on what I could do or what God is calling me to do?
6. How can I better support and strengthen the people God has placed in leadership around me?

Connect with Be The Church

Be The Church exists to equip leaders to be reinvigorated, renewed, and catalyzed to become who God has called them to be. Through biblical teaching, practical leadership insights, and transformational conversations, our goal is not self-help—but gospel-centered transformation that impacts homes, churches, workplaces, and communities.

Learn more at bethechurch.org

Subscribe & Share

If this conversation encouraged you, share it with a friend, coworker, pastor, business leader, or disciple-maker who desires to lead from a place of deep discipleship and greater spiritual influence.

Because transformed followers of Jesus transform the world around them.

Get each episode to your inbox - https://bethechurch.org/podcast/

• Website: https://bethechurch.org/
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/bethechurchmi/
• YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@BeTheChurchMI

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What does it actually mean to follow Jesus?

For many believers, faith begins with receiving Jesus as Savior. But somewhere along the journey comes the realization that Jesus is not only Savior—He is Lord. In this episode, Joel Wayne and Luke Bilberry sit down with business leader, elder, husband, and disciple-maker Josh Fuller to discuss the difference between simply believing in Jesus and truly following Him.

Josh shares his personal faith journey—from a dramatic gospel presentation at thirteen years old, through years of cultural Christianity, to discovering the life-changing call of discipleship. Together, they explore what it means to count the cost, embrace spiritual leadership, and boldly live out the gospel in the workplace.

Whether you lead in a church, a business, a classroom, or your home, this conversation will challenge you to see your everyday sphere of influence as a mission field and your leadership as a calling from God.

In This Episode

• Josh shares the defining chapters of his spiritual journey.
• Why many Christians know Jesus as Savior but never fully embrace Him as Lord.
• The difference between event-driven Christianity and intentional discipleship.
• Why churches must present the full invitation of Jesus—including the cost.
• How spiritual leadership extends far beyond vocational ministry.
• Practical ways to live unashamed of the gospel in the workplace.
• Understanding your workplace as a mission field.
• How fear often reveals that we are focused on ourselves rather than God's mission.
• Why kindness alone is not enough—and why gospel conversations matter.
• Learning to leverage everyday opportunities to point people toward Christ.

Leadership Takeaways

1. Salvation Is the Beginning, Not the Finish Line

Many believers have experienced a moment of conversion but have never been taught how to follow Jesus as disciples. The invitation of Jesus is not simply to believe in Him but to follow Him.

2. Discipleship Has a Cost

Jesus never hid the cost of following Him. True discipleship requires surrender, obedience, and dying to self—but it also leads to freedom, joy, and transformation.

3. Every Christian Is a Spiritual Leader

Spiritual leadership is not reserved for pastors or church staff. God has strategically placed every believer in unique spheres of influence to represent Christ.

4. Your Workplace Is a Mission Field

The people God has placed around you may never step inside a church building. You may be God's chosen messenger in their life.

5. Fear Shrinks When Christ Becomes the Focus

Many fears around evangelism ultimately center on self-preservation. When Jesus becomes our focus, courage grows and opportunities emerge.

6. Gospel Presence Must Include Gospel Proclamation

Kindness, compassion, and excellence matter. But disciples of Jesus are also called to speak about the hope they have found in Christ.

Memorable Quotes

Key Scriptures

Luke 14:25-33 – The Cost of Discipleship

Romans 1:16-17 – "For I am not ashamed of the gospel..."

Matthew 28:18-20 – The Great Commission

1 Peter 3:15 – Always be prepared to give an answer for the hope within you.

Galatians 5:22-23 – The Fruit of the Spirit

Questions for Reflection

1. Have I embraced Jesus as both Savior and Lord?
2. What costs of discipleship am I currently resisting?
3. Who has God placed in my sphere of influence that needs to experience the love of Christ?
4. Am I living unashamed of the gospel in my workplace, neighborhood, and relationships?
5. What opportunities might God be giving me to "raise the flag" and make my faith visible?
6. How can I intentionally lead spiritually in the places God has already assigned me?

Connect with Be The Church

Be The Church exists to equip leaders to be reinvigorated, renewed, and catalyzed to become who God has called them to be. Through biblical teaching, practical leadership insights, and transformational conversations, our goal is not self-help—but gospel-centered transformation that impacts homes, churches, workplaces, and communities.

Learn more at bethechurch.org

Subscribe & Share

If this conversation encouraged you, share it with a friend, coworker, pastor, business leader, or disciple-maker who desires to lead from a place of deep discipleship and greater spiritual influence.

Because transformed followers of Jesus transform the world around them.

Get each episode to your inbox - https://bethechurch.org/podcast/

• Website: https://bethechurch.org/
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/bethechurchmi/
• YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@BeTheChurchMI

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In this episode of the Be The Church Podcast, Pastor Luke Bilberry sits down with Melissa Wayne for an honest and encouraging conversation about faith, business, marriage, leadership, and raising a family while staying centered on Christ.

Melissa shares her journey from working in marketing and corporate business to becoming a business owner, consultant, COO, and licensed residential builder — all while serving alongside her husband in ministry and raising four kids. Together, they unpack the tension of balancing calling, work, and family life, what it means to lead with humility and servant-heartedness, and how faith shapes the way we navigate pressure, leadership, and success.

They also discuss the importance of intentional living, creating margin for spiritual conversations at home, leading in high-pressure environments without chaos, and why “faithfulness is the reward” in both ministry and the marketplace.

Whether you’re leading a business, serving in ministry, raising a family, or simply trying to follow Jesus faithfully in a busy world, this episode will encourage you to trust God’s plan, steward your gifts well, and live with purpose wherever He has placed you.

In this episode, you’ll learn:

•  How to follow Jesus faithfully in the marketplace 
•  Why servant leadership matters in business and ministry 
•  How Melissa balances leadership, family, and faith 
•  What it looks like to lead with peace instead of chaos 
•  Why intentionality is essential in parenting and marriage 
•  How to trust God when your plans and dreams change 
•  The importance of building margin for spiritual conversations 
•  Why faithfulness matters more than platform or success 
•  How to navigate pressure and responsibility with a biblical perspective 
•  What it means to use your gifts and career for the Kingdom of God

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In this episode of the Be The Church Podcast, Pastor Luke Bilberry sits down with Pastor Joel Wayne and his wife, Melissa Wayne, for an honest, heartfelt conversation about marriage, ministry, sacrifice, and the refining work of God through every season of life.

Together, they unpack the realities of serving in ministry as a married couple—from criticism, unmet expectations, and difficult transitions to the beauty of shared calling, mutual encouragement, and spiritual growth through surrender. Melissa shares candidly about stepping outside her comfort zone, navigating seasons of brokenness, and learning to embrace God’s plan even when it looked far different than what she imagined for her life.

From the challenges of being a pastor’s wife to the importance of speaking life into your spouse, this episode offers practical wisdom and gospel-centered encouragement for couples, parents, ministry leaders, and anyone seeking to faithfully follow Jesus in the everyday moments of life.

What you’ll learn:

•  Why a shared calling is essential for navigating marriage and ministry together 
•  How criticism, preferences, and expectations can challenge ministry families 
•  The importance of prioritizing Christ, marriage, and family in the right order 
•  What it looks like to move from striving for self to fully relying on Christ 
•  How God uses hard seasons, transitions, and brokenness to refine and strengthen us 
•  Why words of encouragement and affirmation deeply matter in marriage 
•  How healthy marriages sharpen, strengthen, and sanctify both spouses 
•  Practical encouragement for young moms and wives navigating exhausting seasons 
•  Why obedience often requires stepping outside your comfort zone 
•  The danger of prioritizing success, ministry, or achievement over serving your spouse 
•  How surrender and faithfulness can lead to lasting spiritual impact and transformation 
•  Why embracing the season God has you in can change everything

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In this episode of the Be The Church Podcast, Pastor Luke Bilberry sits down with Pastor Joel for an honest, Scripture-rooted conversation on what it means to lead through hardship, crisis, and seasons of deep difficulty without losing sight of Jesus.

Together, they unpack how spiritual leaders can navigate suffering with integrity, gratitude, and a deep dependence on God rather than falling into self-reliance, distraction, or the pressure to “fix” everything themselves. Through personal stories, biblical wisdom, and practical leadership insights, they explore how hardship often exposes the true condition of our hearts—and how God uses those moments to shape us into faithful leaders.

From battling cynicism and unhealthy coping mechanisms to learning the difference between building something and simply being with Jesus, this episode challenges listeners to pursue spiritual leadership rooted in abiding with Christ, not performance or control.

What you’ll learn:

•  Why trials and hardship are unavoidable parts of spiritual leadership 
•  How “keeping yourself clean” spiritually prepares you to endure difficult seasons 
•  The danger of treating symptoms instead of addressing root heart issues 
•  Why staying focused on Jesus changes how you navigate crisis and conflict 
•  The connection between gratitude and spiritual health during suffering 
•  How grumbling, bitterness, and cynicism quietly erode spiritual leadership 
•  Why many leaders idolize fixing problems—and how surrender changes everything 
•  The difference between building something for God and simply being with Him 
•  How authentic community and friendship help leaders endure hardship faithfully 
•  Why spiritual leadership was never meant to be carried alone 
•  Practical ways to lead through crisis with integrity, humility, and dependence on Christ 
•  How getting a clearer view of Jesus transforms your perspective in hard seasons

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In this episode of the Be The Church Podcast, Pastor Luke Bilberry sits down with Pastor Tyler Perrott and Pastor Joel for a practical, Scripture-rooted conversation on discipline, distraction, and what it really means to live a spiritually focused life in a distracted world.

Together, they unpack how modern technology and constant urgency are quietly shaping us into spiritually fragmented people, why discipline often drifts from faithfulness into control, and how true discipleship is built through intentional, relational investment with God and others.

From the tension between physical and spiritual discipline to the everyday challenge of leading our families well, this episode calls leaders to move beyond information and into transformation—choosing presence over distraction and surrender over control.

What you’ll learn:

• Why distraction is one of the greatest barriers to spiritual growth today
• How discipline can shift from self-control to unhealthy control—and how to correct it
• Why relationships (with God and others) are at the center of true discipleship
• The connection between distraction, lack of discipline, and feeling like you don’t have enough time
• How to pursue spiritual discipline without falling into perfectionism or performance
• Practical ways to lead your family with intentional, consistent spiritual investment
• Why progress—not perfection—is the goal of a faithful, disciplined life
• How surrender, not control, leads to bold faith and lasting transformation

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In this episode of the Be The Church Podcast, Pastor Luke and Pastor Joel sit down with Eric Palmer for a powerful conversation on identity, resilience, and what it means to lead from a place of being fully known and loved by God.

Eric shares his deeply personal story of loss, redemption, and the defining truth that now anchors his life: “hope in spite of.” From losing both parents at a young age to wrestling with identity, purpose, and calling, his journey reveals how the goodness of God is not found in the absence of hardship—but in His faithful presence through it.

They also explore the heart of the next generation—why young adults are desperate for authenticity, hungry for truth, and longing for spiritual leaders who are both honest and anchored in Scripture. This episode is both a story of God’s redeeming work and a call to lead others from a place of a deep, abiding relationship with Him.

What you’ll learn:

• Why your identity must be rooted in being loved by God—not your past, performance, or pain
• How to reframe your story through the lens of “hope in spite of” and see God’s goodness in every season
• The danger of building your identity around ministry instead of intimacy with Christ
• Why abiding in Jesus (John 15) is essential for lasting fruit and spiritual leadership
• What today’s young adults are looking for: authenticity, truth, and spiritual family
• How to lead others through hardship with both compassion and a clear vision of future hope
• Practical ways to cultivate resilience and a deeper relationship with God in your everyday life

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