Beyond Billables

Alice Fraser is an Australian comedian, writer, podcaster and actress, and perhaps somewhat surprisingly, ex-lawyer. In terms of being a lawyer, there are few careers that are further removed than being a comedian. And that’s exactly why we had to have Alice on Beyond Billables – we had to get to the bottom of her story that started in law school and ended in NYC comedy clubs.

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After resigning from her job, Alice went to the US and began making waves in the New York comedy scene. She returned to Australia and, in 2013, she was nominated as best newcomer at the Sydney Comedy Festival. She went on to start a podcast, give TED talks and appear on the big screen. Our chat got pretty deep in terms of the philosophy of money, being happy and how to navigate some of life’s big questions.

Listen to the full episode to hear all this, plus things like:

• The trials and tribulations of having a personality that doesn’t fit with the law
• The benefits of being raised by Buddhist parents
• How failing at things can be healthy
• The power of comedy to convey ideas and change minds
• The sunk cost fallacy exposed
• Why corporations have many similarities with sociopaths
• The difference between an identity and personhood
• Alice’s take on time vs. money
• How to know you’re in the wrong career or job

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Links

Tea With Alice
Personal website
Facebook
Twitter
Wikipedia

In need of a bit of inspiration? Want to hear a story with a happy ending? In this episode of Beyond Billables, we heard how one lawyer had an accident that changed her course in life forever.

Meet Kate Cliff. Kate was a solicitor with HWL Ebsworth and legal officer with ITC Group. She’d graduated from a good school with top marks and was well launched into her legal career. But there was some underlying dissatisfaction, which was brought to the fore in the fallout that followed being struck by a car. The prognosis after her injury was not good. Severely injured, in chronic pain, and struggling mentally, Kate learned to meditate.

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Although she returned to legal practice after the accident, the dissatisfaction boiled over, leading her to orientate her life and become a meditation teacher. In our conversation, we heard all the details of Kate’s story and talked about meditation at length.

We also covered quite a few other issues, such as:

• How the narrative around what a legal career is and should be must change
• How seemingly terrible things can have wonderful outcomes
• Why dissatisfaction should not be ignored
• How a legal education and skillset have transferrable value into other careers
• The power of Vedic Meditation
• How financial considerations can trap some people in the law and what to do about it
• Why legal industry culture needs to change in terms of empathy

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Links:

LinkedIn
Personal website
Facebook

If you’re interested in starting your own business, and want to know the best way to bill and how to find your ideal niche, then you need to check out this episode of Beyond Billables. Our guest is Demetrio Zema – founder and director of Law Squared, a specialised commercial law and litigation firm focused on working with entrepreneurs and startups. He’s also an accomplished entrepreneur and lawyer, having worked with many corporates, SMEs and ASX listed companies. As the founder of one of Australia’s most innovative firms, Demetrio is focused on relationships, authenticity and getting positive outcomes for his clients.

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In 2017, Demetrio was selected as part of the Australian delegation to the G20 Young Entrepreneurs Alliance (G20 YEA). Law Squared has also been listed on the LexisNexis Legal Innovation Index and Demetrio is active in numerous not-for-profit causes. In our conversation, we heard Demetrio’s story, including his entrepreneurial wins and losses, and how he found his niche in the law.

We also dug into things like:

• How changing the billing model fundamentally alters lawyer-client relations
• Why an entrepreneur who’s driven by money alone will likely fail
• The biggest complaints about lawyers and how Law Squared is addressing these
• Why legal tech should be viewed as empowerment tools, not competition
• How Law Squared fosters an open and cohesive work environment
• Why authenticity is such a key characteristic for a lawyer to have
• How Law Squared is changing the conversations between lawyers and clients

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Links

Law Squared
LinkedIn
Instagram
Twitter
Facebook

Want to hear how one woman has conquered entrepreneurship, disease and motherhood? Need some inspiration? Meet Kara Cook. For someone still relatively early in their career, Kara Cook has seen and done a lot. Kara is the Vice President of Queensland Law Society, has been previously named the Australian Young Lawyer of the Year by the Law Council of Australia, and is the founder of her own practice, CookLegal, which focuses on domestic violence and family law.

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Kara has dealt with entrepreneurial speedbumps, faced a cancer diagnosis and managed her practice as the mother of two kids. It was a pleasure having her on the show – her story was uplifting, to say the least. In this episode, we talked about Kara’s journey and in doing so touched on quite a few other things like…

• Gaps that exist in the legal marketplace (that aren’t covered by legal aid)
• The stress and drama that comes with working on domestic issues
• The importance of a supportive work environment and debriefing
• What cancer can teach you and how it helps focus on what is most important
• How a remote team can provide unexpected benefits
• The value of having a supportive network around you and your business
• Why leaving work at the office is an imperative skill to have
• Why law societies need to be more nimble in adjusting to the changing nature of law practice
• Why the ‘work-life balance’ is kind of a silly distinction

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Links

LinkedIn
CookLegal

Interested in hearing about the evolution of legal education? Keen to know more about the state of legal aid in Australia? Need some inspiring advice from a seasoned professional? Meet Jeff Giddings, a Professor of Law at Monash University and Director of the Monash-Oakleigh Legal Service Clinic.

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Jeff recently joined the Monash University Law Faculty after 22 years at Griffith University in Brisbane, Queensland. He received an Australia National Teaching Fellowship in 2013 for the Effective Law Student Supervision Project. In addition, he served (2013-15) as an International Scholar for the Academic Fellows Program of the Open Society Foundation, working extensively with the American University of Central Asia, Bishkek, Kyrgyzstan.

Jeff’s accolades and achievements are difficult to fit onto one page, and we were lucky to have him on Beyond Billables. Our conversation hit a lot of different notes but focused mainly on legal education, legal aid, lawyer stigma and Jeff’s advice to those just starting out.

We also dug into things like:

• Justice, definitions and how some topics are hard to clearly pin down
• Theory vs practice in terms of both personal experience and educational outcomes
• The value in finding great mentors or supervisors
• The changes in societal attitudes toward legal services and aid
• The benefits of pursuing a career in academia
• The dramatic increase in the number of law schools in Australia and what that means for the future
• The changing look of a law school graduate in the 21st century
• Why you shouldn’t take yourself too seriously sometimes
• How family can be the key to a happy and successful work-life balance

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Links:

LinkedIn
Scholarship Citations
Monash University

Are you looking for insight into leadership approaches? How to foster better relationships? Want to pick up some tips for more effective communication? If you answered yes to any of these questions, you definitely won’t want to miss the latest installment of the Beyond Billables Podcast.

In this episode, we had the pleasure of speaking with the inspiring Claire Bibby. Claire is Senior Vice President Legal & General Counsel for Brookfield Properties. Claire’s considerable strengths lie in running a busy,  award winning, in-house legal team, working at strategic and operational levels for her 4,000+ clients. She also (somehow) manages to find time to put her energy into nonprofit work with Luna Park and Marist 180. She also advocates for workplace wellness and speaks on the topic of women’s leadership.

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Claire has also won numerous awards including the 2016 General Counsel of the Year, Female Executive of the Year in Asia-Australia-New Zealand (a silver Stevie Award) and the Women in Law Excellence Award. She’s a seasoned professional who was kind enough to share with us what she’s learned about team building, being happy in your career, and perhaps most importantly communicating with people.

In our conversation, we also touch on things like:

• How the work-life balance can sometimes be a contradiction
• Claire’s approach to hiring people and building her team
• The pros and cons of being an in-house attorney
• The reason why diversity quotas are a good thing
• How often your success depends on the people around you
• Ways to foster camaraderie and positivity among a team
• Mark Zuckerberg’s take on maternity and paternity leave
• The common factors that make people quit their jobs and how to avoid them
• How you can build a safe and open environment for communication at work
• Claire’s approach to networking and why it’s so important

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Links:

LinkedIn
Marist 180
Opportunity.org
Volunteer Building Cambodia
Soroptimist International
tjmf.org

Meet Fiona Craig, a Scottish-Aussie and former corporate lawyer (with a larger than life personality) who thrives on connecting people in business and inspiring women to build brilliance in their career and life.

We were lucky enough to have her on the Beyond Billables show to pick her brain and be inspired by her stories. Featured in the SMH, Women’s Fitness, Smart Company, Marie Claire, Women’s Agenda and The Huffington Post, Fiona is a professional speaker, trainer and coach with expertise in helping lawyers and other professionals build strong communication, influencing and networking skills to enhance their career success.

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Having moved to Australia knowing no-one, she has built a thriving and valuable network from scratch in three different cities. She is the founder SmartWomen Connect, which is fast becoming the go-to networking and professional development group for career women in Sydney. Fiona is a spark plug with a lot of insight into not only the legal industry but also how to be successful in life.

In our conversation, we dug deep into things like:

• The importance of listening to your heart
• Why moving from law practice to recruitment can be a natural progression
• The skills and characteristics required to be a good recruiter
• How women can succeed in the traditionally alpha-male world of the law
• The critical importance of mindset in all the things you do
• Smartwomen Connect organisation, its genesis, vision and future
• The coming generational changes in the legal industry
• The damaging mindset of ‘up or out’, or hyper competitiveness
• How cancer can teach some of life’s most important lessons
• The incredible power of networks and having strong connections

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Links

LinkedIn
Personal website
Smart Women Connect Events

Email: [email protected]

Have you snuck a peek at your email when you were meant to be away from the office? When you fired up your inbox, did you feel a sense of relief as you were back in control of your work? That used to be classic behaviour for today’s guest, before he learned that level of dependency on his professional life was unhealthy and he shifted to a more positive approach to his work.

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In this episode of the Beyond Billables podcast, we talk with Dave Bushby. He is the managing director of Lexoo Australia, an online legal marketplace that connects top-tier legal experts with clients, without the high price tag. Dave is also the founder of Law Hackers, a weekly newsletter that he puts together that curates the best of legal tech and news of startup happenings in the legal sector. Early on in his career, he gained his experience in law dealing with real estate.

With a significant transition and merging of his interests in law and technology throughout his career, we talked with Dave about law life but also the importance of setting your own boundaries at work to cultivate a happy life.

In our wide-ranging conversation, we also discuss things like:

• Flexibility in work hours in startup careers versus big firm life
• Common theme amongst startups of advocating for unique approaches to working
• Recognising warning signs if you are becoming dependent on work
• Shifting from practicing real estate law to startup tech
• How much easier it is today for senior lawyers to set up their own businesses
• The impact of artificial intelligence technology in the law field
• Spending time to expose yourself to other emerging ideas and tech outside your industry
• The value of exploring all your interests at an early age
• Dave’s two euphoric moments he experienced
• Mindfulness and meditation strategies

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Links

LinkedIn
Twitter

In today’s episode of the Beyond Billables podcast we get to hear some war stories, tales of life on the Sunshine Coast and what a legal career can look like in a military context. The man behind it all? Our good mate and legal expert, Peter De Waard. Peter is currently serving as the counsel assisting the Office of the State Coroner and reservist legal officer with the Royal Australian Air Force.

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Peter served tours of duty in both Iraq and Afghanistan with the RAAF before returning to Australia and taking up his position with the State Coroner’s Office. Do a quick google search and you’ll see him cited by the media in numerous investigations, some quite high-profile and interesting. Despite the intense, stressful and sometimes classified nature of Peter’s work, he’s managed to stay grounded. In our discussion we dug into his past and why titles such as ‘dad’ or ‘surfer’ are more important to him as anything else he achieved professionally.

In our wide-ranging discussion, we also hit on topics such as…

• What the legal counsel for the coroner’s office actually does
• The experiences and benefits Peter received from undergoing military training
• How to segue a legal education into a military career
• What legal officers in the armed forces actually do in practice
• How 9/11 changed Peter’s life and led to deployments in the Middle East
• The value of excitement and passion to overcome highly stressful situations
• The challenges that military personnel face when returning from a war zoom
• Why it’s so important to stay true to yourself and say unpopular things
• There are more important things in life than money, quality of life over salary, etc.
• The critical importance of being happy with where you live
• Why you must be interested or passionate in what you do to be successful

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Links:

LinkedIn

Interested in innovative approaches to legal practice? Want to know what a ‘hybrid’ lawyer is? Keen to hear a new spin on delivering value? Today’s guest on the Beyond Billables Podcast, James Ford, has cleverly utilized information technology to create a cross-disciplinary team, to help lawyers with their business strategy and ultimately, help them to chart new markets. All of these points are touched on (plus much more) as we meander through James’s career.

James is a lawyer, and the founder and CEO of Blue Ocean Law Group. Coming from a background as a developer with experience in property law James cross – germinated some fresh ideas with his business skills and prior experiences to create the Blue Ocean Law Group. In our conversation, we went into depth on the hows and whys of Blue Ocean. But we also saved a bit of time to talk about how James manages work-life balance as the founder of a startup.

Listen to the full podcast to gain insight into more of the above, as well as:

• What is the Blue Ocean Strategy and why was it important to James
• The benefits of approaching the law with other experiences/skill sets
• How Blue Ocean Law Group works, how it provides value, etc
• How Blue Ocean Law Group help their clients and lawyers with their business strategy and ultimately, help them to chart new markets
• Why it’s important for lawyers to work together, even if oftentimes they don’t
• James’ best advice for a law school graduate (or someone early in their career)
• Why positive client feedback is so critical to growing your practice (or any business)
• Why you should not peacock yourself
• Dealing with the skepticism that some people have of new law models
• How to develop client management skills and approach sticky conversations
• The value in knowing and addressing client pain points
• Trying to break the archaic mold of law firms and how they present themselves
• The Blue Ocean’s take on other law firms
• The importance of flexibility and fitness in maintaining a good life

Links:

Blue Ocean HomePage
Blue Ocean LinkedIn
Shift Book Launch
Blue Ocean Strategy Book
Blue Ocean Academy
LawTap
LinkedIn