"And I think it's just overall her humanity and her recognition of what other people could accomplish. If you just say the right things, if you create the right chemistry, that really drove me to her. And she does—she has her own chemistry with everyone in the book." That's Bonnie Garmus talking about Elizabeth Zott, the unforgettable center of Bonnie's debut novel, Lessons in Chemistry. Bonnie joins us on the show to talk about her spectacular characters, never giving up (and the writing advice that helped her the most when she was stuck), having empathy for all of her characters (even the evil ones), a most extraordinary dog, The Remains of the Day by Kazuo Ishiguro, rowing, what she's reading now, how writing a novel is scarier than open water swimming, and much more with Poured Over's host, Miwa Messer. And we end the episode with a TBR Topoff featuring book recommendations from Margie and Marc.

Featured Books:

Lessons in Chemistry by Bonnie Garmus

On Animals by Susan Orlean

Rationality by Steven Pinker

The Friend by Sigrid Nunez

The Remains of the Day by Kazuo Ishiguro

The Secret History by Donna Tartt

Moby-Dick by Herman Melville

The Swimmers by Julie Otsuka

Poured Over is produced and hosted by Miwa Messer and mixed by Harry Liang. New episodes land Tuesdays and Thursdays (with occasional bonus episodes on Saturdays) here and on your favorite podcast app.

A full transcript of this episode is available here.