This week, our guest is Charles Kupchan, Professor of International Affairs at Georgetown University and Senior Fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations. We discuss Charlie’s first visits to China and the Soviet Union, naiveté and NATO expansion in the 1990s, the dangers of the current conflict with Russia and China, the possibility of a new American foreign policy paradigm, global interdependence, and an endgame in Ukraine.

Time Stamps:

• 00:01:06 First trip to China in 1980
• 00:06:45 Trip to the Soviet Union and Poland in the early 80s
• 00:10:13 Naiveté in the 1990s
• 00:15:23 The dangers of current conflict with Russia and China
• 00:19:44 Pivot to Asia?
• 00:32:31 New US foreign policy paradigm?
• 00:43:10 Global interdependence
• 00:50:02 Maintain channels of communication with Russia and China
• 00:52:20 Endgame in Ukraine

*The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM.

**The first twelve episodes of this podcast were published by the Middlebury Institute of International Studies at Monterey.