Confronting The Line

Confronting The Line

By Anne L. PetersonEducationSelf-Improvement
Download on the App Store

Confronting The Line episodes

  • E15 Confronting the Line Between Self-Help & Cults w/ Dr Glenn Patrick Doyle of SEEK Safely

    In this conversation with guest, Dr Glenn Patrick Doyle, licensed psychologist and board president of SEEK Safely, we dive into the complexities of self-help culture, exploring its potential benefits and pitfalls. 

    Check out the SEEKSafely SUMMIT ⁠https://ilumn8.life/op/the-seek-safely-summit/⁠ 

    We discuss the allure of self-help, the psychological dynamics that can lead individuals into high-control groups, and the fine line between genuine transformation and exploitation. The conversation also highlights the importance of critical thinking and awareness in navigating the self-help landscape, as well as the mission of SEEK Safely to create a safer environment for seekers. The discussion culminates in an announcement about the upcoming SEEK Safely Summit, aimed at educating consumers and promoting ethical practices in the self-help industry.


    ABOUT Dr Glenn Patrick Doyle

    Dr. Doyle entered the psychology field because of his interest in self-help and personal growth. He earned his Doctor of Psychology degree in 2008 and has been in private practice since 2011. Dr. Doyle’s clinical work has focused on inpatient and outpatient treatment of complex trauma, particularly adults who were abused or traumatized as children. He has presented multiple times at the International Society for the Study of Trauma and Dissociation and the American Psychological Association. Dr Glenn is passionate about making effective, safe, empowering psychological and behavioral tools available to as many people as possible and uses his social media @drdoylesays to reach a wider audience. He joined the SEEK board in 2019 and became Board President in 2021.  #SEEKSafely 


    RESOURCES & LINKS 

    Get Dr Glenn’s awesome insights by following @DrDoyleSays on your favorite Socials

    You can also read up on his blog site https://useyourdamnskills.com/ 

    Check out https://www.seeksafely.org/ or the SEEKSafely SUMMIT https://ilumn8.life/op/the-seek-safely-summit/ 

    Read Anne’s Book Is This A Cult: Confronting the Line Between Exploitation and Transformation https://a.co/d/7uoGYRs 

    If you or someone you know is wrestling with recovery after being involved in a high-control group, relationship or any organization, check out the Healthy Healing and Recovery Group w/ Rachel Berstein https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-group/ 


    MODERATION NOTE: 

    While healthy debate and discussion regarding the topics being discussed is encouraged, personal (ad hominem) attacks on people, places or things will be deleted. 


    FINALLY 

    Please consider supporting this channel which helps us to offer more and better content and resources such as the healing group w/ Rachel.  Contributing also supports the learning and healing needs of folks, no matter their ability to pay, who are waking up to and leaving high demand and cult(ish) groups. Learn what you can do HERE. 
    https://ilumn8.givingfuel.com/ilumn8giving

    1 hr 13 min
  • E14 Exploring the Notion of Weaponized Empathy with Chris Shelton

    In this episode, we explore the concept of weaponized empathy. We look at how empathy can be manipulated and used as a tool for control with the end justifies the means argument and how this moral theme is common in high-control groups, cults or culty groups and extremist ideologies. And what about the weaponization of empathy in the context of misinformation and narcissism?

    Often these people then become true believers who go to extreme lengths to spread the group's message and defend it, often causing harm to themselves and others in the process.
    We discussed how to recognize and protect oneself from being taken advantage of by weaponized empaths who mean well. In this part of the conversation, Chris discusses the process of deprogramming and deconstructing cult mindsets. He emphasizes the importance of physical safety, resources, and a support network in the early stages of leaving a cult. He also highlights the need for post-cult education and self-work to undo the indoctrination and build resilience.
    LINKS & RESOURCES
    Check out Chris’s Podcast/Show Speaking of Cults
    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCF326xyA0QHI7Z5xAwKQDJg
    Get Anne’s Book
    https://a.co/d/7uoGYRs
    The Heathy Healing and Recovery Group w/ Rachel Berstein
    The purpose is to create a compassionate and supportive space where people can recover, heal, grow and reclaim their lives and autonomy. https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-group/
    MODERATION NOTE:
    While healthy debate and discussion regarding the topics being discussed is encouraged, personal (ad hominem) attacks on people, places or things will be deleted.
    FINALLY
    Please consider supporting this channel and helping me to offer more and better content and resources such as the healing group w/ Rachel. Contributing to supports the learning and healing needs of folks waking up to and leaving high demand and cult(ish) groups.
    https://ilumn8.givingfuel.com/ilumn8giving

    1 hr 21 min
  • E13 Recognizing Signs of Indoctrination w/ Guest Gerette Buglion

    Meet Gerette Buglion, author and educator. In this conversation we delve into the complexities of public discourse, cultural homogeneity, personal insights, and the dynamics of language and communication. We reflect on our similar experiences having spent years involved in different high-control groups and the importance of critical thinking in program design, while also exploring themes of personal growth and identity.

    We took a look at some of the common terms being used a lot these days when discussing exploitation and abuse .. specifically we discuss what is and is not meant by Large Group Awareness Training (LGAT) and Indoctrination.
    We look forward to having Gerette back to discuss more terms in the future!
    About Gerette Buglion:
    Born a middle child of seven, it’s not surprising Gerette Buglion became a lifelong educator. From parent-child programs, to Special Ed and Primary School, she’s played many teacherly roles. She has found her sweet spot as a cult recovery educator and facilitator of her signature Writing to Reckon classes that support survivors to create coherent narratives out of the chaos of coercive control. Her memoir An Everyday Cult details her master’s-level training in undue influence. Her greatest professional achievement to date is being co-founder of igotout.org and co-managing the #igotout movement whose mission of education, healing and prevention makes her heart sing.
    RESOURCES & LINKS
    Check out Gerette’s upcoming Reclaiming Autonomy Through the Written Word
    https://www.gerettebuglion.com/writin...
    A Writing Symposium for survivors of spiritual, religious and cultic abuse. Featuring Sarah Edmondson, Daniel Shw, Shelly Snow Pordea and Esther Friedman
    Get Anne’s Book
    https://a.co/d/7uoGYRs
    Join the Heathy Healing and Recovery Group w/ Rachel Berstein
    https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-...
    The purpose is to create a compassionate and supportive space where people can recover, heal, grow and reclaim their lives and autonomy.
    MODERATION NOTE:
    While healthy debate and discussion regarding the topics being discussed is encouraged, personal (ad hominem) attacks on people, places or things will be deleted.
    FINALLY
    Please consider supporting this channel and helping me to offer more and better content and resources such as the healing group w/ Rachel. Contributing to supports the learning and healing needs of folks waking up to and leaving high demand and cult(ish) groups.
    https://ilumn8.givingfuel.com/ilumn8g...

    1 hr 19 min
  • E12 Squirrels and other connections between Scientology and Landmark with guest Chris Shelton

    Chris Shelton MSc, Scientology survivor and coercive control expert joined us as guest this week. We had fun exploring the similarities between Scientology and Landmark Worldwide, two organizations that are known for their controversial practices and being accused of cult-like behavior.

    Similarities such as the cult-ish personalities around the founders, L. Ron Hubbard and Werner Erhard, and the lack of accountability of such leaders. We also talked about the tactics used like emotional manipulation, the suppression of questioning, the power of social proof and the manipulation of beliefs. PLUS the influence of other cult leaders on Landmark and Scientology is undeniable.
    We compared the practices and beliefs of Landmark and Scientology. Landmark focuses on transformative learning and removing barriers to self-expression, while Scientology believes in the spiritual nature of humans and aims to remove past life trauma. Anything for a tax write off?! The goal of Landmark is to “transform the being of human being” and Scientology is to “clear” the planet. What’s the difference? Still searching.
    We discovered more similarities, such as the concept of recreation where individuals are trained to fully understand and duplicate another person's communication and the control mechanisms used in communication exercises in general. Well, Werner does acknowledge L. Ron in his authorized biography.
    Chris didn’t have any first hand knowledge of the supposed Scientology conspiracy to discredit Werner, beyond his being labeled a squirrel 🐿of course. He did give us some insider history of Scientology's infiltration operations into the IRS and political organizations for the purpose of influencing on a larger scale.
    Finally the conversation concludes with a discussion on the importance of recognizing and educating ourselves about manipulative tactics in order to protect our autonomy and rights.
    LINKS & RESOURCES
    Check out Chris’s Podcast/Show Speaking of Cults
    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCF326xyA0QHI7Z5xAwKQDJg
    Get Anne’s Book
    https://a.co/d/7uoGYRs
    Looking for understanding and support check out the Recovery Group w/ Rachel Bernstein https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-group/
    The purpose is to create a compassionate and supportive space where people can recover, heal, grow and reclaim their lives and autonomy.
    LINKS & RESOURCES
    Check out Chris’s Podcast/Show Speaking of Cults
    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCF326xyA0QHI7Z5xAwKQDJg
    Get Anne’s Book
    https://a.co/d/7uoGYRs
    The Heathy Healing and Recovery Group w/ Rachel Bernstein
    The purpose is to create a compassionate and supportive space where people can recover, heal, grow and reclaim their lives and autonomy. https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-group/
    MODERATION NOTE:
    While healthy debate and discussion regarding the topics being discussed is encouraged, personal (ad hominem) attacks on people, places or things will be deleted.
    FINALLY
    Please consider supporting this channel and helping me to offer more and better content and resources such as the healing group w/ Rachel. Contributing to supports the learning and healing needs of folks waking up to and leaving high demand and cult(ish) groups.
    https://ilumn8.givingfuel.com/ilumn8giving

    1 hr 20 min
  • E11 Directed Sharing: Manipulating Natural Human Tendencies - Ed Gurowitz returns!

    Welcome back Ed!

    In this conversation with our resident transformational technologies expert Ed Gurowitz we cover various topics including cult dynamics, the power of influence, the illusion of scarcity, and the impact of directed sharing. We also touched on the creation of special groups within an organization and the role of scarcity in creating value.
    The absorption of a powerful person's way of being into a group and the competition to be part of that group is covered. AND explore the concept of directed sharing and the manipulation of natural human tendencies. Overall, the conversation highlights the importance of awareness and critical thinking in navigating these dynamics.
    Who is Ed?
    Ed Gurowitz, Ph.D. is a psychologist who has been on the leading edge of personal and organizational transformation for over 40 years. As a management consultant and leadership development specialist, he has worked with top executives all over the world on communication, collaboration, conflict resolution, and removing the barriers that keep people stuck in “good enough,” allowing them to emerge into their full greatness as leaders and as human beings.
    Regarding his human potential (aka Landmark) Ed did the est Training in 1978 and went on to be on staff in Werner Erhard's office, traveling and working directly with Werner, including on the "Project to Recreate the Training," which resulted in the creation of the Forum. He also worked at Tekniko until he left the network in 1991.
    Stay tuned for Ed’s forthcoming book on personal and organizational transformation!
    Ed’s current book: Inclusion, The Role of Leadership: Why We Are Separate, Why We Need to Come Together https://a.co/d/gvlPs35
    RESOURCES:
    Healthy Healing and Recovery with Rachel Bernstein https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-group/
    Safe Practitioners Workshop https://ilumn8.life/op/safe-practitioners-workshop/
    TAKEAWAYS:
    * Cult dynamics can be observed in various contexts, including organizations and societies.
    * The power of influence can lead individuals to absorb the way of being of a powerful person or group.
    * The illusion of scarcity can be used to create value and exclusivity.
    * Directed sharing can manipulate natural human tendencies to promote certain ideas or behaviors.
    * Awareness and critical thinking are essential in navigating these dynamics and avoiding manipulation.


    RESOURCES:

    LGAT / High-Control Recovery https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-group/

    Anne's Book https://a.co/d/7uoGYRs 


    1 hr 26 min
  • E10 PART2 - Exene Paloma: An Anarchist view on collective and inclusive approach to personal development.

    In PART TWO of this conversation with Exene Paloma, we continue the discussion about how certain structures and hierarchies can replicate dominant power dynamics and exclude individuals based on their race, gender, or personality. We also examine the limitations of external interventions in communities and the importance of empowering individuals to develop their own solutions.

    The conversation highlights the need to challenge and dismantle oppressive systems and create inclusive spaces that respect diverse perspectives and experiences. We also examine the idea of self-made success and the role of privilege in achieving it.
    The need for a more collective and inclusive approach to personal development, rather than an individualistic one is highlighted. Again we emphasize the importance of questioning and critically examining the practices and beliefs within the self-help (aka personal development) industry.


    RESOURCES:

    https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-group/

    1 hr 6 min
  • E9 The Role of Power and Privilege in Landmark and the Personal Development Space

    "Dominance hierarchies, structures that are about people having power over other people inherently are to be questioned." ~ Exene Paloma

    In this conversation we question the power and privilege dynamics in the personal development space, with a focus on the Landmark Forum. Our guest, Exene Paloma, shares the experience as a former Landmark staff member and course supervisor.
    The conversation explores the hierarchical structure and power dynamics within Landmark and similar organizations. It discusses the influence of the source (Werner Erhard) and how his personality and ideas shape the culture of the organization. The conversation also delves into the concept of dominance hierarchies and the belief that power structures built on people having power over others are inherently flawed. Exene expresses skepticism towards top-down culture change and emphasizes the importance of empowering individuals and building structures that promote equality.
    In part of the conversation, Exene and Anne explore some of the manipulative tactics used in self-help programs, highlighting how these programs create an artificial environment to elicit emotional responses and then sell products or services. They also discuss the concept of integrity and how it is used as a tool for control and touch on the power dynamics within these programs and the pressure to conform to group norms.
    They also discuss the transferability of the insights gained in these programs to real-life situations and the limitations of self-help in addressing systemic issues. Finally, they draw parallels between self-help and marketing, highlighting the focus on personal improvement and the perpetuation of feelings of inadequacy for the purpose of ongoing sales.


    RESOURCES:

    We are offering group therapy sessions specifically for former Large Group Awareness Training (LGAT) and organizations or High Control Group employees, program leaders, program managers, business consultants, long-time volunteers and people who have participated with them. https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-group/




    1 hr 11 min
  • E8 PT2 Dr John Hunter on Informed Consent and Empirical Research in LGATs

    In part two of this conversation with Dr. John Hunter we discuss the concept of informed consent in the context of Large Group Awareness Trainings (LGATs) and explore the importance of providing participants with accurate information about the potential benefits and risks of these trainings. We also highlight the need for independent research to support the claims made by Landmark Worldwide and the similar groups that put them on.

    Other topics discussed include the role of experience in creating transformation, the influence of group dynamics, and the stigma on mental health care. Overall, the discussion raises important questions about the ethical practices and transparency of LGATs.
    Dr. John and Anne reiterate the importance of critically examining the claims and risks associated with LGATs and highlight the need for transparency and informed consent, as well as the potential for both positive and negative experiences within these programs..
    The conversation emphasizes the importance of open dialogue and the willingness to consider different perspectives.
    RESOURCES & LINKS
    Check out Dr. Johns Hunters work https://johnhunterphd.com/#about-me
    Dr John’s Article explaining LGATS in 1000 words or less https://thoughtleader.co.za/the-first...
    Video: Speaking of Cults...Are LGATs Actually Just Cults? (Chris Shelton & Dr John) -    • Speaking of Cults...Are LGATs Actuall...  
    The Safe Practitioner Workshop https://ilumn8.life/op/safe-practitio...
    Healthy Healing LGAT Recovery Group w/ Rachel Bernstein https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-...

    1 hr 14 min
  • E7 Can I ever trust a group again? - Understanding Research and LGATs w/ Dr. John Hunter

    Meet Dr. John Hunter who teaches undergraduate and postgraduate students in research methods and psychology. Today he shares his background and research on large group awareness trainings (LGATs). He tells us about his personal experience in a seminar where abusive tactics were used by the trainer.

    In this discussion he emphasizes the importance of critically evaluating information from these groups and the challenges of researching and publishing on this topic. The conversation made us aware of the psychology of group identity and the tendency to defend and identify with a group, even when faced with conflicting information.
    Dr. John highlights the euphoria, confidence, and impulsivity that participants often experience after completing a large group awareness training. He draws attention to the common elements found in many of these groups, such as specific exercises, lots of rules, and the pressure to recruit others.
    The discussion raises concerns about the potential exploitation and psychological impact of LGATs, highlighting the similarities between different large group awareness training seminars and the potential risks associated with them. He shares his personal experience with bipolar disorder and how it influenced his interest in studying these seminars.
    CONTENT NOTE
    This video contains some discussion about mental health outcomes of both bi-polar disorder and LGATs. Including suicide rates, depression and incidents of psychosis. We invite you to be sensitive to your needs and reactions, and to pause and take your time, even speak with a trusted person if it is upsetting to you.
    RESOURCES & LINKS
    Check out Dr. Johns Hunters work https://johnhunterphd.com/#about-me
    Dr John’s Article explaining LGATS in 1000 words or less https://thoughtleader.co.za/the-first...
    Video: Large group awareness trainings, peak experiences and dopamine -    • large group awareness trainings, peak...  
    The Safe Practitioner Workshop https://ilumn8.life/op/safe-practitio...
    Healthy Healing LGAT Recovery Group w/ Rachel Bernstein https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-...

    1 hr
  • E6 Our Reflections & Responses About Telling the Truth, Exposing Abuse and Confronting the Line

    Mark and I took some time this weekend to discuss our experience and reactions to the recent revelations and stories that have emerged related to abuse at Landmark and the personal development world. We reflect on the impact of my book, 'Is This a Cult?', and the surprising response of the many #samehere experiences. We continue to emphasize the importance of telling the truth, exposing abuse, and creating healing spaces.

    We also address the contentious discourse that has arisen in the Landmark community as a response to the many revelations being shared. We believe it is important to give space and grace to people who are speaking up, including our guests, even if it gets messy. We remind ourselves and others that anger has a role in the healing process and we recognize the need to hold boundaries while processing emotions. This requires learning how to understand and communicate our needs. Listening to learn is key to the process.
    We wrap up talking about the need for transparency and accountability in organizations and the value of seeking truth and understanding.
    RESOURCES & LINKS
    Marks discussion on “How Did I Get Here” with Brian Nord & Erik Rojas
    Titled Queer Life or Compliance to Landmark Forum... Choose with Mark C. Tafoya https://www.youtube.com/live/Duw-msio...
    To see all the interviews and people talking about this subject both about Landmark and the industry. https://isthisacultbook.com/
    For healing and recovery support JOIN Rachel Bernstein https://ilumn8.life/op/lgat-recovery-...
    For practitioners, facilitators or coaches who wish to learn more about being a SAFE practitioner check out the Safe Practitioner Workshop. https://ilumn8.life/op/safe-practitio...

    1 hr 6 min

About Confronting The Line

From the publisher's feed

We are here to explore the world of personal development, and examine the often blurry line between transformation and exploitation. We are dedicated to finding that line, then looking, listening and…