Cities across America have been trying — and mostly failing — to achieve Vision Zero for more than a decade. But is it really time to trade the goal of ending road deaths and serious injuries for the aim of reducing them 30 percent by 2030? And would we be better positioned to eliminate the other 70 percent of fatalities if we made that strategic shift, or not? Today on the Brake, we sit down with the presdient of the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety, David Harkey, to talk about his organization's pivot to push for a five-year full-court press on traffic violence, and why he doesn't believe that means giving up on ending road deaths overall. And along the way, Kea presses him to examine what strategies would really rise to the surface if we set a tighter time horizon for more modest road safety gains, and why we have to sweat our strategy when it comes to saving lives.