Elixir Wizards

Elixir Wizards

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Elixir Wizards episodes

  • Re-Platforming One of the Original Dot Coms in Elixir with Angel Jose

    Today’s guest is Angel Jose, a Software Engineer Manager at Cars.com with a passion for product and the customer experience. Angel played a key role in completely re-platforming Cars.com via Elixir, Phoenix, and other open source tooling, and his former adventures in the blockchain space include working with ETH, EOS, and general distributed tooling. In today’s episode, we discuss Cars.com's decision to migrate to an entirely Elixir-based system, rebuilding the data model from scratch, redesigning all of the user interfaces, and what that meant for the team that Angel was tasked with leading, as well as how the Elixir system functions at such incredible scale, with Cars.com receiving more than a million visitors daily! We touch on Angel’s approach to onboarding new engineers, how Elixir impacts this process, and the broader impact Elixir has on the community as a whole, as well as what he hopes to see from the community in the future, so make sure not to miss this awesome conversation about adopting Elixir with Angel Jose!

    Key Points From This Episode:

    • Hot takes, rants, and obsessions: Angel’s best and worst taco experiences.
    • Why Angel won’t be at ElixirConf 2021 and the story of how he began programming in Elixir.
    • The process of finding a job in software engineering after completing an online bootcamp.
    • Angel’s experience of navigating the freedom that comes with being an engineer.
    • Find out how Angel got involved in re-platforming Cars.com, one of the original dot coms.
    • Get a glimpse into the make up of the engineering team at Cars.com.
    • How the pandemic impacted not only Angel’s deadlines but the car industry as a whole.
    • The ETL pipeline of different data points that makes up Cars.com and Auto.com.
    • Angel shares his opinion of LiveView and what he has learned about using it at scale.
    • Advice for those adopting new technology: make sure there are enough resources out there.
    • Where Angel believes his team would be without Elixir and what they are looking forward to.
    • Some of the tangible benefits Cars.com has seen from flipping the switch to Elixir.
    • How Angel approaches onboarding new engineers by providing them with resources and integrating learning into their day-to-day.
    • The importance of celebrating small wins and fostering feelings of accomplishment.
    • Angel on how Elixir impacts onboarding and new engineers; more simplicity, less magic.
    • How Elixir has impacted the programming community and what Angel hopes to see in future.
    • Taco happy hour, conference food, making the most of each meal, remote work, and more!
    • What Angel has learned from working remotely, particularly from a social perspective.
    • Angel shares his dream car after working at Cars.com and moving to Colorado.

      • Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:

      Angel Jose on LinkedIn — https://www.linkedin.com/in/ajose01/

      Angel Jose on Twitter — https://twitter.com/ajose01
      Cars.com — https://www.cars.com/
      Cars.com Careers — https://www.cars.com/careers/
      Elixir Conf — https://elixirconf.com/
      Elixir Slack — https://elixir-lang.slack.com/
      General Assembly — https://generalassemb.ly/
      SmartLogic — https://smartlogic.io/

      Special Guest: Angel Jose.

      48 min
    • The Impact of Elixir Launchisode

      As we kick off our new, seventh season of the Elixir Wizards podcast, we wanted to introduce our theme of the impact of Elixir by having a simple chat between our panel and foregoing our usual guest format. As fans of podcasts ourselves, we always like to get to know some of the personalities behind the voices, so we decided to take this opportunity to do just that, with Alex, Sundi, and Eric! So to hear a little about what to expect in the coming weeks of the show, what the teams have been up to recently, both professionally and beyond, and to just enjoy a quick hangout with some friendly voices, make sure you tune into this launchisode!

      Key Points From This Episode:

      • What our team has been up to recently: new projects, the apprentice program, and more.
      • Reflections on this iteration of the apprentice program and differences from 2018.
      • The recent ElixirConf and how our panel was involved in the event.
      • Inside information that is shared at conferences and learning about the world!
      • Avoiding the pressure to always do more while engaging in the community.
      • Noting the impact that Elixir has had on each of us, and how we write code respectively.
      • Proactive learning and career growth; looking forward to the new season exploring these subjects!
      • Staying focused on what's important, getting rest, and pursuing passions.

        • Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:

        SmartLogic — https://smartlogic.io/

        Aino — https://github.com/oestrich/aino
        Aino Read Me — https://ainoweb.dev/readme.html
        King Tooth — https://www.instagram.com/kingtooth_pug/
        SmartLogic Apprenticeship Program — https://smartlogic.io/about/community/apprentice/
        SmartLogic Welcomes Two New Developer Apprentices to the Team! — https://smartlogic.io/blog/2021apprentices/
        Elixir Conf — https://2021.elixirconf.com/
        Culttt — https://www.culttt.com/
        Shrek — https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/shrek
        Kangaroo Jack — https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/kangaroo_jack
        Korn — https://www.kornofficial.com/
        Flutter — https://flutter.dev/docs/resources/books
        Lonestar Elixir — https://lonestarelixir.com/

        59 min
      • Wrapping up BEAM Magic with Amos King

        We have reached the final episode of our season, and as we wrap up our exploration of BEAM magic, we are joined by Amos King, whose tweet was the inspiration behind this season's focus! We've had such a great time this season and hope that our listeners have enjoyed it as much as we have, and gained something in the process. Our conversation with Amos jumps around from exploring his experiences during the last year and a half, to the journey he has been on with his company, Binary Noggin, life as a CEO, and much more! We delve into some thoughts from our guest about the relationship between magic and understanding and also talk a little about this year's upcoming ElixirConf, where Amos will be speaking. Amos also shares how learning a new language can help the coding you do in languages you already know, and tells an interesting story about how he turned a long commute into a superpower! So stay tuned for Season 7, coming to you soon, and thank you for sticking with us this long!

        Key Points From This Episode:

        • Looking forward to this year's ElixirConf and the hope that it will proceed.
        • Amos' return to the office after three months of working from home.
        • A little about Binary Noggin and the different size clients they work with.
        • The inspiration behind the company name and the transition from side work to a full-time gig.
        • Amos' experiences as a CEO during the pandemic and the surprising growth at Binary Noggin.
        • How Amos inspired the BEAM Magic theme for this season and his thoughts on understanding.
        • Amos' experiences of speaking at conferences and the possibility of presenting about magic.
        • Some details on Amos' talk this year at ElixirConf.
        • How Amos was introduced to Elixir through Erlang and the things that made him love it!
        • The impact that learning new languages can have on your work in general.
        • How an extremely long commute early in Amos' career served him in unexpected ways.

          • Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:

          SmartLogic Jobs — https://smartlogic.io/about/jobs

          Amos King on Twitter — https://twitter.com/adkron
          Binary Noggin — https://binarynoggin.com/
          Binary Noggin Careers — https://binarynoggin.com/about-us/#careers
          Binary Noggin Email — [email protected]
          DirtyInformation — http://dirtyinformation.com/
          Elixir Outlaws — https://elixiroutlaws.com/
          Wallaby — https://github.com/elixir-wallaby/wallaby
          Testing Elixir — https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/54156353-testing-elixir

          Special Guest: Amos King.

          58 min
        • Mini-Feature Extravaganza featuring Tyler Clemens, Elom Amouzou, Elise Navarro, and Jeremy Neal

          This episode serves as a round-up of some of the special mini-features we have recorded throughout Season 6, where we'll hear from Tyler Clemens, Elom Amouzou, Elise Navarro, and Jeremy Neal about their work and experiences with Elixir. Our first segment is with Tyler, who is a software developer at Jackpocket, where he explains what he is currently busy with and how the company is offering access to the lottery in more safe and convenient ways. We then move on to Elom, who talks about transitioning from a life in public education, and what prompted him to learn functional programming. Elise, who works at Zingeroo, takes us through her relatively new career, why she is so excited about Elixir, and the interesting work that is being done at her company to educate the public about the stock market. Lastly, Jeremy talks to us about the socially conscious agenda at Clover Food Lab, his personal interests in cooking and baking, and how he came to work with Elixir. All of our guests share helpful resources for learning, and reflections on their time working within Elixir - make sure to join us to catch all this good stuff!

          Key Points From This Episode:

          • Tyler's path into software engineering and the first language he learned.
          • What Jackpocket offers its customers and how Elixir is used within the company.
          • Tyler's thoughts on the perks and challenges associated with engineering with Elixir.
          • The most helpful resources that Tyler uses when in need: Elixir Slack, books, and Elixir School!
          • Onboarding and training in Elixir and the biggest challenges presented in this area.
          • Tyler's passion for photography and imagining an alternative career path in this direction.
          • Elom's first programming language and the subsequent transition into Elixir.
          • How Elom moved into working in programming from his roots in education.
          • Elom's perspective on the positives associated with adopting Elixir early on.
          • Resource recommendations from Elom for early-stage developers.
          • Considering the pros and cons of the small intimate Elixir community and its future.
          • Elom's ideal alternative career path and favorite book!
          • Elise's beginnings in programming and her move from a career in digital media.
          • Comparing Elixir with other languages; Elise weighs in with her experiences.
          • What Zingeroo does and how they use Elixir to make the stock market more accessible through the app.
          • The benefits of using Elixir for a real-time app like Zingeroo.
          • The resources that have been most valuable to Elise since joining the community.
          • Elise's alternative career path, and her passion for teaching Pilates.
          • Jeremy's educational and professional path into software engineering and working with Elixir.
          • How Jeremy has been using LiveView in his work to get a functional UI up and running.
          • What Clover Food Lab does and how Elixir is used at the company and online store.
          • Jeremy's thoughts on a different career and why he would love to be a baker!

            • Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:

            SmartLogic — https://smartlogic.io/

            Tyler Clemens — https://www.linkedin.com/in/tylerclemens
            Jackpocket — https://jackpocket.com/
            Elixir in Action — https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/38732242-elixir-in-action
            Elixir School — https://elixirschool.com/
            Turing School — https://turing.edu/
            Pragmatic Bookshelf — https://pragprog.com/
            Code Flow Thinking Elixir — https://thinkingelixir.com/available-courses/code-flow/
            Frantz Fanon — https://www.britannica.com/biography/Frantz-Fanon
            Peau Noire, Masques Blancs — https://www.amazon.com/Peau-Noire-Masques-Blancs-French/dp/2020006014
            Elise Navarro — https://www.linkedin.com/in/elise-navarro
            Zingeroo — https://zingeroo.com/
            Jeremy Neal — https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeremy-neal-59ba8b82
            Clover Food Lab — https://www.cloverfoodlab.com/

            Special Guests: Elise Navarro, Jeremy Neal, and Tyler Clemens.

            39 min
          • Delving Deeper into Magic with Quinn Wilton

            Joining us on the show today is Quinn Wilton, and we have a wonderful conversation with our guest about her journey with Elixir, unusual path into programming, and her wide appreciation for different languages! We start off looking at the time Quinn spent at Waterloo University and what separates the Canadian ethos around computer science. From there, we turn to Quinn's early work in programming, the first proper job that she stepped into, and the immediate affinity she felt for working in Elixir. We also talk a bit about the interesting research that Quinn has been conducting privately, tracking and plotting the path of Erlang over the decades, while also reflecting on the skill of academic reading. We spend some necessary time hearing from Quinn about the BEAM and what BEAM magic means to her, before hearing about her website, love of Twitter, other languages that currently have her excited, and the avenues she is most lit up about exploring in the future! Listen in to hear it all, as we continue this journey!

            Key Points From This Episode:

            • Quinn's reflections on her education in Canada, and differences to the American approach to computer science.
            • Reasons that Quinn wanted to pursue a career in programming
            • The first jobs that Quinn landed as a programmer; creating a Roblox game and tracking malware.
            • How Quinn was introduced to Elixir and the immediate love she felt for the language.
            • The recent work that Quinn has been busy with researching and tracing the history of Erlang.
            • Experiences of reading academic papers and what sets it apart from other formats.
            • The inspiration behind Quinn's website and her affinity for Twitter's format.
            • Quinn's favorite characteristics of the BEAM: the debugging possibilities.
            • The project that Quinn worked on using Gleam on the BEAM and her enjoyment of its simplicity.
            • Some possible areas, outlined by Joe Armstrong, that Quinn is excited to explore in the near future.
            • Quinn's huge appreciation for different programming languages and her fascination with Strand.
            • Encouragement from Quinn to dive into reading intimidating research papers.

              • Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:

              SmartLogic — https://smartlogic.io/jobs

              Quinn Wilton — https://quinnwilton.com/
              Quinn Wilton on Twitter — https://twitter.com/wilton_quinn
              Quinn Wilton on GitHub — https://github.com/QuinnWilton
              University of Waterloo — https://uwaterloo.ca/
              Roblox — https://www.roblox.com/
              Lookout — https://www.lookout.com/
              Clint Gibler — https://clintgibler.com/
              Gleam — https://gleam.run/
              Joe Armstrong — https://www.theguardian.com/education/2019/may/08/joe-armstrong-obituary
              'Getting Erlang to talk to the outside world' — https://www.researchgate.net/publication/2549678_Getting_Erlang_to_talk_to_the_outside_world
              Universal Binary Format — https://github.com/ubf/ubf
              CLU — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CLU_(programming_language)
              Strand — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strand_(programming_language)

              Special Guest: Quinn Wilton.

              45 min
            • The Bridge Between Elixir and Zig with Isaac Yonemoto

              While NIFs provide a great way to interface with native code in the BEAM machine, the process can also be rather error-prone. Thankfully, since Isaac Yonemoto built Zigler, things have become a lot simpler, and he joins us today to talk about how. Isaac is an Elixir developer with a background in biotech and we kick off the discussion by hearing about his journey into programming and some of the ways that he has combined it with science. From there we hear more about the different languages Isaac has worked in and why he fell in love with Elixir, where he talks about its encouragement of test-driven development and how this has made him a better programmer. We dive right into the contributions Isaac is making to the Elixir community next, and he starts off by talking about Zigler. He explains how Zigler provides a bridge between Zig and Elixir that makes it far easier to build NIFs. We hear a bunch of the other cool possibilities that Zigler offers to Elixir as well, including its ability to make debugging easier by appending the Zig stack trace to the Elixir one. After hearing Isaac’s opinion of magic in Elixir, we close today's show off with a few of the other projects he is working on, contributions that are bound to make the world of Elixir even more exciting!

              Key Points From This Episode:

              • Isaac’s early exposure to programming and how he got started in tech.
              • The education Isaac had in the sciences and his experience in the biotech sphere.
              • Difficulties with installing Ruby and how this led to Isaac learning Elixir.
              • Support for asynchronous testing and the reasons why Isaac finds joy in Elixir.
              • The emphasis on test-driven development in Elixir and how this has made Isaac a better programmer.
              • Isaac’s experiences with Zig and the similarities between it and Elixir.
              • How NIFs allow C code in Elixir and what it is like debugging them.
              • Isaac’s Zigler project and how it provides integration between Elixir and Zig making it easy to build NIFs.
              • Cross-compiling C using Zig and why Isaac built a disassembler.
              • Aspects of the BEAM that make it harder to write NIFs in Elixir than in Julia.
              • Isaac’s opinion of magic in programming and how it should always be comprehensible.
              • Final plugs from Isaac: where to find Zigler, and some upcoming projects.

                • Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:

                SmartLogic — https://smartlogic.io/

                Isaac Yonemoto on Twitter — https://twitter.com/DNAutics
                Isaac Yonemoto on GitHub — https://github.com/ityonemo
                Isaac Yonemoto on YouTube — https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCarZZW7eavljSdGRQx9kkSA
                Selectrix — https://github.com/ityonemo/selectrix
                Mavis — https://github.com/ityonemo/mavis
                Chiaroscuro - https://github.com/ityonemo/chiaroscuro
                Zigler - https://hexdocs.pm/zigler/Zig.html
                Zigler on GitHub — https://github.com/ityonemo/zigler
                Julia — https://julialang.org/
                Testing Elixir with Jeffrey Matthias and Andrea Leopardi — https://smartlogic.io/podcast/elixir-wizards/s6e6-matthias-leopardi/

                Special Guest: Isaac Yonemoto.

                47 min
              • Maxim Fedorov on Building and Scaling WhatsApp with Erlang

                Today we are so excited to share a conversation with Maxim Fedorov, who is the Core Infrastructure Lead at communications giant, WhatsApp! In our chat, Maxim offers such interesting insight and wisdom from a long career in the space, focusing on Erlang and why he views it as such a powerful language for the work at WhatsApp. We also get some backstory from Maxim, looking at his first experiences with computers, his educational background, and some of the work he did leading up to his current position. Our guest does a great job of sharing his thoughts on what he sees as a lack of magic within the Erlang language, why he prefers this, and how the company has managed to scale in such a major way over the past years. We also deal with some more general questions, weighing functional languages against object-oriented ones, useful resource recommendations, and a whole lot more! We finish off this episode with a mini-interview with David Hardwick, who is the current Vice President of Engineering at STORD, so make sure to stay tuned until the end for that!

                Key Points From This Episode:

                • The beginnings of Maxim's interest in computer science and software development.
                • How Maxim transitioned into the network security field.
                • Maxim's experience with timezones and how this is approached for an app like WhatsApp.
                • Thoughts on why WhatsApp is so popular outside of the United States.
                • How Erlang is used at WhatsApp to power messaging.
                • Probable reasons that Erlang was selected as the language for WhatsApp.
                • Outages and downtime; what constitutes a serious issue for WhatsApp user experience.
                • The massive growth that WhatsApp has seen and how their approach to scaling has evolved.
                • Characteristics of Erlang that make it so well suited to WhatsApp's needs; simplicity and reliability.
                • Maxim's perspective on the issues around programmer education and their results.
                • Functional languages versus object-oriented programming; Maxim's thoughts on strengths and weaknesses.
                • Why Maxim views Erlang as not containing or performing anything magical.
                • Maxim's recommendations for resources when getting started in Erlang!
                • Looking back at Maxim's experiences of tertiary education and the thesis he produced.
                • The scaling of the WhatsApp server; the project that Maxim is most proud of!
                • Maxim's love for motorcycles and bicycles and how these grew out of initial conveniences.
                • Today's mini-feature interview with David Hardwick, VP of Engineering at STORD.

                  • Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:

                  SmartLogic — https://smartlogic.io/

                  Maxim Fedorov: https://au.linkedin.com/in/maxim-fedorov-14a570b
                  Electronika MK-61 — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elektronika_MK-52
                  Brian Acton — https://www.forbes.com/profile/brian-acton/
                  Learn You Some Erlang — https://learnyousomeerlang.com/
                  Adopting Erlang — https://github.com/adoptingerlang
                  Joe Armstrong Thesis — https://erlang.org/download/armstrong_thesis_2003.pdf
                  The BEAM Book— https://github.com/happi/theBeamBook
                  ejabberd — https://www.ejabberd.im/
                  Will Cathcart Tweet — https://twitter.com/wcathcart/status/1385253969522413568
                  Clarke's three laws — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clarke%27s_three_laws
                  Lukas Larson — https://twitter.com/garazdawi
                  Erlang OTP — https://github.com/erlang/otp/blob/master/lib/kernel/src/pg.erl
                  David Hardwick — https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidhardwick
                  STORD — https://www.stord.com/
                  BetterCloud — http://www.bettercloud.com/

                  Special Guest: Maxim Fedorov.

                  51 min
                • Chelsea Troy on the Importance of Access and the Impact of Teaching

                  Some of you may recognize Chelsea Troy from her popular blog of the same name or as a keynote speaker for the March 2021 Code BEAM conference. Chelsea is an instructor in the Master's Program in Computer Science at the University of Chicago and currently works as a staff software engineer at Mozilla, where she specializes in machine learning and backend systems. In our conversation with Chelsea, we discuss some of the unique aspects of coding as a career. Chelsea outlines how programming can be more accessible than other careers because it doesn't have the same financial burden when it comes to education. She also emphasizes the importance of allowing a more diverse range of people access to the field and unpacks the type of person the internet was originally built for, explaining how it had favored privileged affluent individuals from the Bay Area. We hear from Chelsea about how she became a programmer out of a desire for job security rather than passion and why she believes it’s so important to have a broader representation of different narratives when it comes to careers in programming and coding. Later Chelsea shares the story of how she became an educator and why she is so passionate about teaching. For all this and much more, join us today!

                  Key Points From This Episode:

                  • Introducing today’s guest Chelsea Troy
                  • Why Chelsea believes it’s important to privilege multiple narratives of why people choose to pursue programming as a career.
                  • There is less of a financial burden with becoming a programmer than other higher-paying professions.
                  • The benefits of a diverse group of people having access to programming as a career.
                  • What first prompted Chelsea to start her blog and how her goals for it have changed over time.
                  • Why Chelsea struggles to give advice on how to market a blog.
                  • How being able to draw parallels between different coding languages has strengthened Chelsea’s teaching and writing pursuits.
                  • Why Chelsea is so enthusiastic about teaching.
                  • How teaching allows Chelsea to have a more meaningful impact in the field of tech.
                  • How Chelsea prioritizes which jobs and clients to pursue as a consultant.
                  • How having two parents who taught for living influenced Chelsea’s passion for teaching.
                  • Chelsea shares how she earned her position at Chicago University, despite expecting not to.
                  • The challenges and benefits of teaching remotely.
                  • The pros and cons of functional languages versus object-oriented languages.
                  • How students tend to react to learning functional languages versus object-oriented languages.
                  • Mini-feature segment: hear from Rosemary about how she became a software engineer.
                  • How Rosemary built websites as a side hustle while studying English.
                  • Rosemary shares how she transitioned from working with Java and Blu-ray discs to doing back-end web development and writing in Elixir.
                  • How RentPath, the company Rosemary is currently working for, is transitioning from Ruby to Elixir.
                  • An outline of RentPath and what they do.
                  • Rosemary’s many hobbies and pursuits, including wildlife photography.

                    • Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:

                    Chelsea Troy on Twitter — https://twitter.com/HeyChelseaTroy

                    Chelsea Troy on LinkedIn — https://www.linkedin.com/in/chelseatroy/
                    Chelsea Troy Blog — https://chelseatroy.com/
                    Upcoming Code BEAM Conferences — https://codesync.global/
                    Chelsea Troy on Youtube — https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIwpdjmSUJmqJ8HwvIGNqig
                    Ruby — https://www.ruby-lang.org/en/
                    Mozilla — mozilla.org/en-US/
                    Pocket — https://getpocket.com/
                    Rosemary Ledesma — https://www.linkedin.com/in/rosemary-ledesma-b6198717/
                    RentPath — https://www.rentpath.com/
                    RedFin — https://www.redfin.com/

                    Special Guest: Chelsea Troy.

                    49 min
                  • Testing Elixir with Jeffrey Matthias and Andrea Leopardi

                    While we can think of many reasons why we love Elixir, the community could always benefit from a more lively conversation around testing. It was with this in mind that Jeffrey Matthias and Andrea Leopardi decided to write Testing Elixir, and today they join us on the show to share some of the insights to be found in their new book. Our guests start by sketching out the main reasons why they decided to write a book of this nature before speaking to the process of writing it collaboratively from their respective homes in Italy and the US. Andrea and Jeffrey speak about the challenges of finding a middle ground between their unique styles to come up with a unified testing method. The conversation then takes a deep dive into the weeds of testing in Elixir and we hear our guests' perspectives on the most appropriate situations to use async true, Mox, Ecto Sandbox, and other techniques. We wrap up our interview with a question about what Andrea and Jeffrey would most like people to take away from their book where they express the hope that it can act as a springboard for further conversation about best practices for testing in Elixir and more. As always, we close the show off with our mini-interview, this time talking to Tracey Onim from Podii.

                    Key Points From This Episode:

                    • Why Jeffrey and Andrea wrote their book and how they pitched it to the publisher.
                    • How the feedback Andrea and Jeffrey got while writing the book shaped its content.
                    • What writing the book was like considering its authors live in different countries.
                    • How our guests came up with a unified testing method when each had their own style.
                    • Stories about testing mistakes and the funny situations they led to.
                    • Discussing the HBO integration test email and how it was responded to and dealt with.
                    • The issue of developers not using async true enough and how to get better at it.
                    • When to use async true, Ecto Sandbox, and Mox.
                    • Why our guests use Mox, when the best times to use it are, and how it shapes your thinking.
                    • Exploring the relationship between test driven development and using the program.
                    • What can go wrong if you rely purely on tests to test out your code.
                    • The main takeaways our guests hope can be found in their book.
                    • Final plugs from Jeffrey and Andrea and where to find them online.
                    • A quick interview where we learn more about Tracey Onim from Podii.

                      • Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:

                      SmartLogic — https://smartlogic.io/

                      Jeffrey Matthias on Twitter — https://twitter.com/idlehands
                      Andrea Leopardi — https://andrealeopardi.com/
                      Andrea Leopardi on Twitter — https://twitter.com/whatyouhide
                      Andrea Leopardi on GitHub — https://github.com/whatyouhide/corsica
                      Testing Elixir — http://testingelixir.com/
                      Testing Elixir — https://pragprog.com/titles/lmelixir/testing-elixir/
                      Testing Elixir — https://www.target.com/p/testing-elixir-by-andrea-leopardi-jeffrey-matthias-paperback/-/A-83072057#lnk=sametab
                      Testing Elixir on Twitter — https://twitter.com/testingelixir
                      Publish with The Pragmatic Bookshelf — https://pragprog.com/become-an-author/
                      Ecto.Adapters.SQL.Sandbox — https://hexdocs.pm/ecto_sql/Ecto.Adapters.SQL.Sandbox.html
                      Mox — https://hexdocs.pm/mox/Mox.html
                      Command Line Options — https://hexdocs.pm/mix/1.12/Mix.Tasks.Test.html#module-command-line-options
                      Mocks and Explicit Contracts — http://blog.plataformatec.com.br/2015/10/mocks-and-explicit-contracts/
                      bypass — https://github.com/PSPDFKit-labs/bypass
                      Test-Driven Development with Phoenix — https://www.tddphoenix.com/
                      Tracey Onim — https://www.linkedin.com/in/tracey-onim-420b3316a?originalSubdomain=ke
                      Podii — https://www.apollo.io/companies/Podii/5c1df0e8f651257261ddc16a?chart=count

                      Special Guests: Andrea Leopardi and Jeffrey Matthias.

                      57 min
                    • From Developer to Director of Engineering with Estelle DeBlois

                      Today we are joined by the Director of Engineering at DockYard, Estelle DeBlois! Estelle speaks to us about the transition she made from an engineer into her current management role, her introduction to Elixir and the BEAM, her background in computer science and so much more. The bulk of this enlightening conversation is spent thinking about what it takes to make the sort of jump that Estelle did, and the skills and infrastructure that can aid team members in successful changes. Estelle speaks on what it was like to give up hands-on coding, the resources that helped her learn about managing a team, and the systems at DockYard that she believes are its biggest strengths. Turning to this season's theme, Estelle shares her thoughts on the BEAM and its so-called magic, explaining why she is reluctant to use that word when talking about things that you may not fully understand yet, and what magic means to her. To round off this episode, we have a mini-interview with Tyler Clemens, who works as a Senior Software Engineer at Jackpocket, and we get to hear a little about his journey with Elixir and how it is used with the app. So for all this and then some, listen in!

                      Key Points From This Episode:

                      • Estelle's history at DockYard and her move from developer to director of engineering!
                      • Thoughts on the most important characteristics and skills for leadership positions.
                      • How to make the steps into higher roles at healthy times and avoid rushing the process.
                      • Estelle's first forays into programming; early interest in computers and studies in computer science.
                      • How to create more rounded education in preparation for a career in programming.
                      • Estelle's first programming job out of college, working with Java as an intern.
                      • Joining DockYard and Estelle's introduction and transition into working in Elixir.
                      • The value of internships; Estelle weighs in on this contentious issue!
                      • The learning curve for Elixir and Estelle's immediate attraction to the elegant strengths of the language.
                      • Support from DockYard for the transition that Estelle made into her role as a director.
                      • Why Estelle recommends The Manager's Path to anyone interested in engineering management.
                      • How the company uses 'DockYard Fridays' to work on other, exciting, internal projects!
                      • Getting deeper under the hood and accessing more of the magic of the BEAM!
                      • Estelle and DockYard's approach to training and mentorship for Elixir education.
                      • Common sticking points for learning Elixir!
                      • The magic of Elixir; Estelle's opinions on whether we should consider the BEAM magical.
                      • The exciting explorations and questions that DockYard is asking about how Elixir is being used by different companies.
                      • Today's mini-feature interview with Tyler Clemens from Jackpocket!
                      • Tyler's education, first programming language, and thoughts on the perks and challenges of working in Elixir.
                      • What Tyler does at Jackpocket and the service that the app offers its users.
                      • Recommendations for Elixir resources, and onboarding and training strategies.
                      • Tyler's passion for photography and the parallel career he could imagine.
                      • Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:

                        SmartLogic — https://smartlogic.io/

                        Elixir Wizards Conference — smr.tl/conf-podcast
                        Estelle DeBlois on Twitter — https://twitter.com/edeblois
                        DockYard — https://dockyard.com/
                        Brian Cardarella — https://www.linkedin.com/in/briancardarella
                        Mount Holyoke College — https://www.mtholyoke.edu/
                        Camille Fournier — https://www.linkedin.com/in/camille-fournier-9011812
                        Lara Hogan — https://larahogan.me/
                        The Manager's Path — https://www.amazon.com/Managers-Path-Leaders-Navigating-Growth/dp/1491973897
                        The BEAM Book — https://github.com/happi/theBeamBook
                        Tyler Clemens — https://www.linkedin.com/in/tylerclemens
                        Jackpocket — https://jackpocket.com/
                        Elixir in Action — https://www.amazon.com/Elixir-Action-Sa%C5%A1a-Juri-cacute/dp/161729201X
                        Elixir School — https://elixirschool.com/en/

                        Special Guest: Estelle DeBlois.

                        53 min

                      About Elixir Wizards

                      From the publisher's feed

                      Elixir Wizards is an interview-style podcast from SmartLogic featuring conversations with developers, engineers, and industry leaders about the Elixir programming language and the broader software…