James Underdown has spent over 25 years trying to give away $500,000 to anyone who can prove a paranormal ability under real test conditions, and no one has even come close. In this episode, Gary and John sit down with the executive director of Center for Inquiry West and founder of the Independent Investigations Group to dig into wild claims of telepathy, telekinesis, dowsing, “teleporting” horseflies, and the ghost gadgets that flood paranormal TV, while James explains why he believes science and psychology can fully account for what many people call hauntings.

Rather than arguing about who is “right,” the conversation leans into the tension between John’s work documenting spirits and James’s commitment to skeptical investigation, exploring where brain states, belief, culture, and genuine weird experiences collide. If you are fascinated by ghosts, curious about what is really happening during spirit box sessions, or just want to hear a skeptic and a paranormal creator push each other in real time, this episode will challenge your assumptions without killing the thrill of the unknown.

If you think you have the abilities to win the $500,000 prize, visit the CIF. Link is in the linktree in our bio.