My guest for this episode is author Liz Williams, who joined me to talk about her new book Rough Music: Folk Customs, Transgression and Alternative Britain.

 Liz holds a PhD in the History and Philosophy of Science from the University of Cambridge and is a widely published journalist and writer of both fiction and non-fiction.

In Rough Music she examines the influence of themes such as transgression and shame in British folk customs, from ancient times to the present day. The book investigates a variety of ceremonial traditions in Britain such as May Day parades, Bonfire Night and other seasonal events and reveals the roots and roles of violence, mockery, protest and public shaming in some of these.

 In the interview I talk with Liz about her background and interest in this subject matter and the connections between some of the customs detailed in her book and otherworldly folkloric entities such as Woodwoses, the Green Man and Black Shuck. We also discuss the debate around the origins of some of these traditions and how this contrasts and compares with the timeless quality that they possess, which is something that they share with a lot of paranormal phenomena.

You can find out more about Liz and her book Rough Music at https://reaktionbooks.co.uk/work/rough-music and further details on the 2025 Black Shuck festival are available at https://blackshuckfestival.com/.

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The podcast theme music is by The Night Monitor, from his album, ‘Close Encounters of the Pennine Kind’. You can find out more about The Night Monitor's music at https://thenightmonitor.bandcamp.com/.