Exception Seekers

This episode is a heartfelt dive into the world of youth mental health, relationships, and the brain. Dr. Jean Clinton shares about how love, connection, and understanding can shape young minds, way more than we often realize. We talk about practical ways to support kids and teens, from connecting before correcting, to being mindful of relationships and context in teaching and counselling.

Dr. Clinton highlights the importance of relationships, connection and context; it’s not just about behaviour intervention, it’s about listening, empathy, and building meaningful relationships that truly help kids thrive. 

Important Messages

Connect before you correct: Kids respond better when they feel understood and supported first, rather than immediately “fixed.”

Love builds brains: Relationships and emotional safety are just as important for development as academics or therapy techniques.

Context matters: Kids’ behaviours make more sense when you consider their relationships, environment, and past experiences.

Collaborative dialogue is powerful: Sharing experiences and learning together benefits both adults and children.

Practical, small steps count: Simple, consistent acts of connection make a huge difference over time.

This podcast episode features a deep, reflective conversation with Carmen Theobald of Horse Sense North, focusing on the creation and impact of their equine-assisted programs for first responders and public safety personnel. Carmen shares how horses provide a grounded, non-judgmental presence that helps people reconnect with safety, embodiment, and authentic emotion. The discussion touches on the unique design of their five-day intensive program, the importance of community and relational safety, and the program’s growing support—including full funding for OPP members and emerging pathways for others.

Carmen also opens up about her own personal journey: leaving Montreal at 18, following a nontraditional path, struggling to trust her instincts, and finding profound meaning in her relationship with horses. She describes surviving a traumatic event in a classroom, the way that proximity to death reshaped her sense of purpose, and how this informs both her life and her work. The episode closes with a reflection on courage, strength, vulnerability, and living in alignment with one’s deeper truth.

Important Messages

Horses offer a unique pathway to regulation and healing: Horses respond to people as they truly are - not their uniforms, roles, or titles. Their presence helps individuals feel safe, seen, and connected, often without needing to revisit traumatic content.

Community across roles matters” Bringing together different first responders fosters understanding “beyond the uniform;” their shared humanity becomes clearer when hierarchy and labels fade.

Carmen’s personal story informs her work: A life-altering event involving hiding from danger taught her a profound acceptance of mortality. This experience fuels her dedication to living fully and helping others do the same. Her unusual life path guided largely “by the horses,” required courage and trust in unconventional choices.

The heart of the work is strength + vulnerability: Carmen emphasizes the paradox of holding both simultaneously, and how horses model this balance every day, inviting humans to do the same.

In this chat with Kelly Mahler, a leading expert on interoception, we dive into what interoception really means and why it’s such a game-changer. Kelly explains how interoception is about tuning into the signals inside our bodies — like hunger, thirst, heart rate, and emotions — and how understanding these can totally change the way we relate to ourselves and others.

We hear about how this awareness is especially powerful for kids and families, helping them move away from traditional compliance-based approaches that can feel controlling or punitive. Instead, Kelly champions a gentler, collaborative way where kids learn to recognize what their bodies need to manage challenges and build resilience.

The conversation also touches on some of the resistance people face when trying to shift away from old methods, but Kelly reminds us that it’s not about chaos — structure and expectations are still super important, just balanced with empathy and curiosity about what’s really going on beneath the surface.

One exciting highlight is Kelly’s upcoming kids’ book series on interoception, co-written with her daughter, that invites kids to explore their body signals through experiments and stories, making the science of interoception accessible and engaging.

Overall, the interview leaves us with a fresh perspective on how paying attention to our internal experiences can lead to healthier relationships, better emotional regulation, and a more compassionate approach to parenting and teaching.

Key Takeaways

• Interoception = Internal body awareness: It’s the sense of what’s happening inside your body — hunger, temperature, emotions, and more. Interoception-based approaches promote safe, collaborative boundaries, so instead of blaming kids for difficult behavior, by asking “What’s going on inside your body?” we can help open a door to understanding and support.

• Moving beyond compliance: Traditional “follow the rules” approaches can miss what kids really need; listening to their body signals helps build resilience and cooperation. Structure still matters, it’s not about “no rules,” but about flexible expectations that respect a child’s bodily experiences.

This episode features a reflective and deeply engaging conversation with Olivia Scobie. The conversation explores systemic issues in mental health care, particularly related to parenting and perinatal support. Olivia shares insights from her academic research, professional practice, and personal experience, including how her work with incarcerated mothers, her sociological background, and her own journey as a parent shaped her approach to perinatal mental health.

The discussion emphasizes the importance of trauma-informed, community-based care, the power of choice in mental health services, the intergenerational nature of healing, and the societal pressures modern parents face. The episode also highlights creative programming like book clubs and listening circles that foster connection, reflection, and peer support.

Important Messages

Rethinking mental health access: Funding is a major barrier to high-quality, accessible mental health care. Olivia argues that people should have choice (in therapist, modality, frequency, and location of care) rather than being funneled into rigid systems like "6 sessions of CBT". Current policies do not reflect the diverse mental health needs of families and communities.

Community-based supports work: Programs like book clubs and listening circles create space for shared learning and reflection. These supports empower both professionals and community members and help build local capacity for perinatal mental health.

Parenting under pressure: Across diverse populations, including incarcerated mothers, the internal struggle around being a “good mom” is a common theme. Guilt, shame, and societal expectations are pervasive, regardless of background or circumstance.

Intergenerational healing happens in steps: Transformation doesn’t need to be completed in one generation. Healing is a relay where each generation picks up a piece (like from anxiety, food policing, or body image issues) and moves the needle forward. This mindset offers compassion and perspective, especially for parents trying to do better with limited models or resources.

In this episode of Exception Seekers, Jesse shares insights into the start-up of his casting company, highlighting the importance of unconditional support and how it enables risk-taking and growth. The discussion explores themes of privilege, resilience, community connection, and the value of creating safe “landing spaces” for people to experiment and develop. Jesse emphasizes the human side of the industry and the importance of authentic conversations that foster understanding, connection, and support, to deepen representation on the screen.

Important Messages

Creating spaces for authentic expression: Jesse emphasizes the responsibility of casting directors to create opportunities for people to share their feelings and experiences, which helps build resilience, community, and representation.

Human connection over industry: Despite being about casting and the arts, the core of Jesse Griffiths Casting is about human connection, community, and how people get to where they are through relationships and shared experiences.

Starting small: When Jesse began his casting company, the practical needs were simple (like a laptop or a logo) - beginnings often don’t require huge resources, but rather the right support and encouragement. Jesse underscores how having a solid support system—financial or emotional—provides a crucial landing space that allows people to take risks and pursue their passions without the fear of complete failure.

Privilege awareness: Jesse shares his strong awareness that not everyone has the same safety net, and this privilege should not be taken for granted. He furthers this perspective to include the responsibility of casting directors to carefully consider the projects they take part in, and their role in shaping on-screen representation.

Resources Mentioned

• Jesse Griffiths Casting (JGC) - Do Better 

Jesse Griffiths (he/him) 

After over a decade as a film, TV, and theatre actor, Jesse pivoted to a career in casting, founding Jesse Griffiths Casting (JGC). His focus is championing inclusion and diversity in the casting process.Dedicated to nurturing the next generation of artists, Jesse has taught at colleges and universities across Canada as well as countless other private institutions. He leads a monthly workshop for Toronto’s BIPOC community and serves as a mentor at the Canadian Film Centre’s Actors Conservatory.Jesse is a member of the Casting Society of America (CSA) the Casting Directors Society of Canada (CDC) and sits on the professional advisory committees for Seneca College, George Brown College, and Toronto Metropolitan University. He serves on the boards of the CDC, the Toronto Gay Hockey Association (TGHA), and Buddies in Bad Times Theatre—the world’s longest-running queer theatre.A proud recipient of the ACTRA Toronto Sandi Ross Award, Jesse holds a BFA in Theatre Performance from Toronto Metropolitan University.

In this thoughtful conversation, Brendan Madden, a passionate leader in outdoor education and risk management, reflects on his career journey, current work, and evolving perspectives on environmental stewardship, community resilience, and youth engagement. Brendan discusses the transformative power of nature-based experiences—both for mental health and for building stronger communities in the face of climate change and societal disconnection.

Brendan shares insights from his involvement in wilderness programs, youth climate action initiatives, and his master’s research on emergency preparedness. He emphasizes the need for proactive, community-led approaches to disaster response and speaks to the emotional and psychological benefits of being meaningfully engaged during crises. The discussion also touches on Indigenous worldviews, the importance of volunteering, and the quiet but powerful impact of mentors.

With warmth and humility, Brendan describes his own growth, the value of listening to your intuition when systems feel “off,” and how small steps can lead to meaningful change.

Important Messages

Nature as a healing force: Outdoor experiences provide grounding and mental clarity, especially for young people navigating climate anxiety. Reconnecting with nature supports not only personal well-being but also helps reestablish community bonds fractured by events like the pandemic.

Mental health and climate action are deeply linked: Youth experiencing climate grief need spaces to process complex emotions. Programs that combine nature exposure, peer connection, and creative action are powerful tools for building resilience.

Preparedness over panic: Brendan highlights the importance of building local, volunteer-led emergency response teams. He cites successful models like Nova Scotia’s disaster volunteer network and his involvement with his local emergency services group. These networks provide both practical response capacity and mental health benefits through agency and connection.

Mentors don’t have to be Dumbledore: Brendan shares how meaningful mentorship sometimes comes in fleeting but profound interactions. Role models aren’t always formal—they might just be people living bravely in their own skin.

Learning from Indigenous worldviews: Indigenous perspectives frame land as a place of safety and connection, not as something to be “conquered.” This shift in mindset—toward reverence and relationality—has transformed Brendan’s approach to outdoor education.

Change takes time—and a bit of politics: Enacting change isn’t always about big gestures. It’s about consistent small steps, reading the room, and learning how to bring others along with you. Speaking your truth matters but so does knowing how and when to speak it.

Resources mentioned

• Wilderness Climate Action Lab

• Connect with Brendan

Brendan Madden (MA candidate)

Brendan is embarking on a new career in disaster and emergency management. He was active in outdoor adventure education for many years and held leadership positions at Outward Bound Canada and the National Outdoor Leadership School (NOLS-USA). He is an internationally recognized thought leader in outdoor safety and risk management and is a member of the steering committee of the Wilderness Risk Management Conference. Brendan is a founding member of the Wilderness Climate Action Lab, a volunteer organization dedicated to strengthening the resilience of outdoor programs to climate change. Brendan is finishing an MA in Disaster and Emergency Management at Royal Roads University, with a thesis focus on wildfire evacuation communication for outdoor adventure groups.

In this podcast with Jalynn Bosley, founder and director of ALIVE Outdoors, we explore the evolution and impact of ALIVE’s outdoor experiential education programs, particularly how they foster resilience, personal growth, and mental wellness in youth through outdoor experiences.

Jalynn reflects on her personal journey, and how her upbringing, travel, and willingness to follow her inner compass led her to forge a nontraditional path. Jalynn and Colleen dive into deeper topics like the importance of discomfort in personal development, the risks of over-parenting, and how today’s youth can be supported in building self-reliance and inner strength.

Important Messages

“Discomfort means growth is happening:” Jalynn emphasizes that discomfort is a necessary catalyst for growth, not something to avoid or rescue others from. She shares the importance of experiencing struggles, challenges, and even failures help build confidence and resilience.

“We have to stop pathologizing normal life struggles. Not every challenge is trauma:” Jalynn shares her observations that well-intentioned parenting or educational approaches that shield young people from struggle may be doing more harm than good. When adults intervene 

Nature as a Teacher: Jalynn believes that the outdoors offers a transformative environment for learning, far beyond academics.Experiences like being cold, wet, tired, or just outside one’s comfort zone can teach self-reliance, adaptability, and confidence.

Global Learning, Local Integrity: Though ALIVE has grown and sees over 6,000 students a year, Jalynn and her team are intentional about maintaining small, meaningful, high-quality experiences.Jalynn is mindful that scaling impact doesn’t mean compromising depth of connection or nuance.

Listening to Your Inner Compass: Jalynn shares how following her intuition and values, even when the path wasn’t clearly marked, was central to her leadership and vision for ALIVE Outdoors. This trust I have in myself was built early, through personal experiences, travel, and reflection.

“We need to build young people who can nest in a gale:” Inspired by a Margaret Mead story, Jalynn uses the metaphor of “nesting in a gale” to describe building emotional and psychological strength to withstand life’s inevitable storms.

Resources

Jalynn Bosley (BEd)

Jalynn believes that time in nature, guided by strong role models can keep people anchored in the real world, and help maintain balance in today’s digital era. She likes that the smoke of a campfire is embedded into most of her clothes, and even after 25 years, she still finds great joy, purpose, and reward in the work she does through ALIVE Outdoors. She is a caring listener and someone who works diligently to nurture relationships that are rooted in honesty. When she is not leading programs with students, she actively consults with schools on program development, risk management and scope and sequence planning both nationally and internationally. Jalynn has worked as an educator, facilitator, and wilderness guide for the past 30 years. She is a Certified Positive Psychology Practitioner, deeply committed to empowering young people to live with authenticity, confidence, and mindfulness, ideally guiding them toward a grounded, intentional life aligned with their core values.

• ALIVE Outdoors: learn more about Jalynn and the ALIVE Outdoors program.

In this episode of Exception Seekers, Alena Luciani, varsity athlete, strength and conditioning coach, and entrepreneur, shares her journey of celebrating sport and finding confidence in her industry. From her early experiences in sport to the evolution of her approach, Alena emphasizes the importance of relatable communication and building genuine connections. She reflects on how she shifted from trying to sound “smart” to focusing on effective coaching that resonates with individuals at all levels. Through her work with Training 2XL, Alena creates a space where people feel empowered to grow, make mistakes, and be part of a supportive community. She also delves into the importance of nonverbal communication, and the need for coaches to prioritize clear, accessible instruction over technical jargon. This episode is a celebration of the transformative power of connection, both within the gym and beyond.

Important Messages

True wisdom lies in simplifying complex ideas: True wisdom is not just about understanding complex ideas but being able to share them in a way that everyone can grasp, regardless of their experience level. Alena emphasizes that being able to break down complex concepts into simple, relatable language is key to effective coaching, communication, and connection. 

Confidence comes from embracing your strengths: During her time at Ohio University, Alena learned to embrace her natural strengths, like clear communication and intuitive coaching. Rather than focusing solely on academic knowledge, she realized that utilizing her strengths helped her become more effective as a coach, building trust and confidence with athletes.

The community and culture you build is just as important as the program: Training 2XL is more than just about fitness — it’s a space for growth, support, and connection. Alena emphasizes that people aren’t just coming back for the programs; they’re coming for the culture and sense of belonging.

Authentic communication is key: The power of authentic and clear communication is an essential foundation to connection. Alena’s willingness to be vulnerable and open with others

In this episode of Exception Seekers, Shane reflects on his personal and professional journey as an Indigenous leader, rooted in both lived experience and cultural teachings. From the loss of his brother to his time as Chief, Shane’s path has been guided by a deep commitment to healing and service. He contrasts Western clinical models with culturally grounded approaches like Feather Carriers, which emphasize community responsibility, ceremony, and Indigenous knowledge systems. For Shane, leadership is not about power or ego, but about humility, authenticity, and staying true to traditional values.

A central theme throughout our conversation is the importance of uplifting youth—not just in words, but through real opportunities for leadership and voice. Shane emphasizes that young people bring unique and valuable perspectives that must be acknowledged and supported. He draws hope from his culture, daily spiritual practices, and the strength of his community, envisioning a future where youth are genuinely held up and where healing is achieved through reconnection with identity, land, and ceremony.

Important Messages

Indigenous wisdom offers a powerful path to healing: Community-based, relational, and spiritual approaches—like those of Feather Carriers—resonate more deeply for many Indigenous people than Western clinical systems alone.

Youth deserve more than lip service: True youth empowerment goes beyond words. It involves giving space for leadership, listening to their lived realities, and ensuring they see themselves reflected in the community’s direction.

Grief can be a catalyst for transformation: Shane’s story illustrates how personal loss—especially the tragic death of a loved one—can shape a life's mission. His brother’s passing became a source of drive and purpose in suicide prevention and mental health advocacy.

Humility is strength: Leadership doesn’t require self-promotion. Shane demonstrates how actions, humility, authenticity, and relationality are at the heart of Indigenous leadership.

Cultural reconnection is a source of hope: Shane grounds his hope in ceremony, ancestral teachings, and daily practices, which help him stay centered through the challenges of community work and personal healing.

In this episode of Exception Seekers, Clarissa Kennedy, a passionate advocate for harm reduction and neurodivergence, shares her unique journey of personal and professional transformation. Through her work in addiction, especially in the realm of food addiction, Clarissa explores how neurodivergence can influence behaviors like disordered eating, impulsivity, and addiction. She reflects on her own experiences growing up with a different lens on the world and how she now embraces this difference to help others. Clarissa also discusses the importance of compassion and understanding for individuals who struggle with food addiction, and how breaking down the shame and stigma around these issues can lead to greater healing and personal growth.

Throughout the episode, Clarissa emphasizes the importance of self-awareness, setting boundaries, and refusing to accept that limitations define who you are.

Important Messages

Shifting away from traditional approaches: Clarissa highlights that traditional methods in addiction treatment often don’t serve everyone, particularly those who don’t fit the mold. Her approach is to smash stigma and offer new, more inclusive solutions. Her work is a blend of harm reduction and individualized care, including psychedelic-assisted therapy, which she believes offers innovative solutions for recovery.

The role of personal experience in healing: Drawing on her experiences with food addiction, Clarissa acknowledges the complex relationship many people have with food, noting that no two recovery stories are alike. She also emphasizes the importance of setting boundaries to protect oneself from triggering behaviors, using the metaphor of keeping food that acts as a bully out of the house to protect peace of mind.

The power of belief in people and possibilities: Clarissa believes in the power of possibility and self-belief. She encourages others to believe in themselves and to understand that anything is possible, even when faced with challenges or overwhelming circumstances. Her entrepreneurial spirit and focus on individual potential is reflected in her work with clients, helping them find their own paths to healing without shame or judgment.

Neurodiversity in the context of food addiction: Neurodivergent individuals, particularly those with ADD, have a dopamine deficiency, which makes them more vulnerable to addictive behaviors — especially with ultra-processed foods that provide dopamine spikes. Impulsivity, linked to a lack of GABA in the brain, can lead to difficulties with moderation, and this behavior can manifest in addiction-like patterns when it comes to food.

The need for continued research: Clarissa encourages more research into the connection between neurodiversity, dopamine, and addiction — especially around how certain foods may affect neurodivergent individuals differently than the general population. This research can lead to more effective interventions and a greater understanding of how to treat food-related addiction in neurodivergent individuals.

Resources Mentioned:

• Food Junkies Podcast – A podcast that discusses food addiction, including episodes with experts like Dr. Roberto Olivardia, who focuses on ADHD and eating disorders.

Psychedelic-Assisted Therapy – Clarissa's current work and interest in exploring alternative, research-backed therapies to support addiction recovery.