Paul, Jon and Liz continue their conversation looking at the development of faith in Jesus' followers -- this episode looks at the story of Peter rebuking Jesus and at Jesus' words to the Rich Young Ruler.

"What we're thinking about now is the object of our faith. The object of Peter's faith is a traditional first century off-the-shelf messiah who has an army that destroys evil in Israel and throws the Romans into the sea. So it's very concrete. And what Jesus has just told Peter seems like crazy talk."

"The object of Peter's faith is Jesus, but it's the wrong Jesus. It's a Jesus who's going to make his life pain-free. It's not a Jesus who draws you into his death and resurrection."

"There's some beauty to John Mark walking away. He doesn't try to stop being himself immediately. Jesus is separating the wheat from the chaff. You either have to be hot for Jesus or cold. You can't be in the middle or lukewarm. John Mark is coming, in a sense, asking, 'How can I be hotter for Jesus?' Jesus' answer is helping John Mark to see that he's actually cold."