Fanthropological

[// Pregenerate link to episode ahead of time: - clicktotweet.com- sharelinkgenerator.com]: #

It turns out... we had a lot to say about Disney theme parks, so enjoy part two (I guess it _isn't_ such a small world after all)!

Next episode, we have our finale, talking about fans of Yuri with Erica Friedman!

## Where can I learn more about Tyler?

Tyler happens to run his own podcast, [Ride Rehab](http://riderehab.com), where he and his co-hosts put themselves in the role of Disney imagineers (i.e. the folks that make rides) and figure out how they would update different attractions at Disney! You can find lots of details about that via [Twitter](http://twitter.com/riderehab) or [Instagram](http://instagram.com/riderehab) both @RideRehab.

And, if you haven't got enough of Tyler, you can check out his personal art (as he _is_ a comic artist and illustrator): [tylermannart.com](http://tylermannart.com) or [@TylerMannArt](https://twitter.com/TylerMannArt) on Twitter.

## Episode outline

### The Verdict

**T is in.** Originally wasn't thinking it would be interesting... but a lot more interested after hearing Tyler talk.

**G is in.** In it for the dole whip.

**Z is in.** Intrigued by the immersiveness on offer.

**Tyler is in.** You can take the experience to as much of a level as you want to.

### This week's spotlight

**[DisneyBound](http://disneybound.co/)**

> DisneyBound is meant to be inspiration for you to pull together your own outfits which work for your body and wallet whether from your closet or local mall.

**[Dreams Take Flight](http://www.dreamstakeflight.ca/)**

> **Dreams Take Flight** is a national volunteer charitable organization dedicated to providing the trip of a lifetime to medically, mentally, physically, socially or emotionally challenged children. With the aid of Air Canada, other national and local organizations and businesses, money is raised to make the dream a reality in Vancouver, Edmonton, Calgary, Winnipeg, Toronto, Ottawa, Montreal and Halifax. Funds not required for its primary purpose can be gifted by Dreams Take Flight to other registered charities that benefit physically, mentally or socially challenged children and are within the policies adopted by Dreams Take Flight Canada.

[// Plugs go here ]: #

[// Race Against Time ]: #

### Famous Last Words

This week's famous last words around *next week's* fandom, Yuri!

**Z**

Is there a Japanese version of Tanya Chalkin's "the Kiss"?

**G**

Who is Yuri for?

**T**

What is the first canonical Yuri manga?

**Tyler**

What is the primary focus of Yuri (since Yaoi seems to be focussed on the seme / uke relationship)?

## Where can you find us online?

We are everywhere! Most notably though, we like to hang out in a few places on social media:

- If you want to be part of our podcast (or just want to check us out), we record our podcast LIVE on [twitch.tv](http://twitch.tv/thenickscast) every Monday at 20:00 Eastern Time!

- For all the latest updates, check us out on [Facebook](https://facebook.com/thenickscast) or [Twitter](https://twitter.com/thenickscast)

- To see the latest hijinx from our conventions or even our daily lives and adventures, check us out on [Instagram](https://instagram.com/thenickscast)

- For our latest convention updates, *Let's Plays*, and other in-real-life video, [check out our YouTube channel](http://youtube.com/thenickscast)

- We're also on [iTunes](https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/fanthropological/id1163621210), and [Google Play](https://play.google.com/music/m/Icmngxz7yhaoivdvivvf6q6c2pu?t=Fanthropological), and would love it if you could leave a review and rating!

- if you want to reach us, and for some reason none of those work for you, try [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected])

- You can check out [our website](http://thenickscast.com); that will mostly bring you back to this stuff.

- Everything is `thenickscast`, so if you can't

[// Pregenerate link to episode ahead of time: - clicktotweet.com- sharelinkgenerator.com]: #

This week, special guest Tyler "Spooky" Mann joins us a special guest friend to dig into the surprisingly large and _obviously_ magical world of Disney... theme parks! How many hidden Mickeys can you find?

Plus, this episode was so long that we broke it into two parts! Be prepared for the second half!

## Where can I learn more about Tyler?

Tyler happens to run his own podcast, [Ride Rehab](http://riderehab.com), where he and his co-hosts put themselves in the role of Disney imagineers (i.e. the folks that make rides) and figure out how they would update different attractions at Disney! You can find lots of details about that via [Twitter](http://twitter.com/riderehab) or [Instagram](http://instagram.com/riderehab) both @RideRehab.

And, if you haven't got enough of Tyler, you can check out his personal art (as he _is_ a comic artist and illustrator): [tylermannart.com](http://tylermannart.com) or [@TylerMannArt](https://twitter.com/TylerMannArt) on Twitter.

## Episode outline

### Fandom Facts

**History and Origins:**

> Walt Disney Parks and Resorts, officially Walt Disney Parks and Resorts Worldwide, Inc. and informally known as Disney Parks, was one of The Walt Disney Company's four major business segments and a subsidiary. The company was responsible for the conception, building, and managing of Disney theme parks and vacation resorts, as well as a variety of family-oriented leisure enterprises. It was founded in 1971, following the opening of Magic Kingdom at Walt Disney World in Florida.

>

> — [Wikipedia - Walt Disney Parks and Resorts](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walt_Disney_Parks_and_Resorts)

[// 11 theme parks]: #

**Search Data:**

Interest in Walt Disney theme parks [hasn't changed much since 2004](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F09b1k,%2Fm%2F02fzs,%2Fm%2F04tkqm); though interest in Walt Disney World is about half the interest as in 2004, Disneyland is about the same as it was. Search data is highly periodic, with spikes occurring regularly every January and interest slowly dropping throughout the year.

There is definitely an east-west divide in the United States, in terms of interest: folks in, or east of Colorado are more likely to search for Walt Disney World than Disneyland, for example.

The top ten countries, by search volume, for Walt Disney World are: United States (by a large margin), Puerto Rico, Canada, United Kingdom, Ireland, Argentina, Australia, Norway, South Africa, and Mexico.

**Size of Fandom:**

Based on the data we have:

- [r/disneyparks](https://www.reddit.com/r/disneyparks/) has almost 10000 subscribers

- The Magic Kingdom receives over 56 000 guests per day (with park capacity around 100 000), and over 20 million visitors per year according to this [quora question](https://www.quora.com/How-many-people-visit-Disney-World-each-day-What-affects-attendance).

- [r/disneybound](https://www.reddit.com/r/disneybound/) has about 2000 subscribers

- [r/WaltDisneyWorld](https://www.reddit.com/r/WaltDisneyWorld/) has almost 60 000 subscribers

That puts a good rough estimate in the _tens of thousands_ (if we're talking about dedicated fans), but its super hard to say given that fans of the parks are often fans of Disney properties in general.

**Fan Demographics:**

We weren't able to find a lot of demographics in terms of fandom, but there are some interesting statements based on data from the park and related sources:

> ... the average visitor has the disposable income. The average annual household income for guests at theme parks was $86,000, according to the study. That’s twice the $43,000 that residents in Greater Orlando bring home and way above the $55,775 median annual household income nationwide, according to the most recent data from the U.S. Census Bureau.

>

>... The report found that 18-29 year olds are the largest group of theme park visitors at 46 percent - a nearly 10 percent increase from 2015. This generation was also the most impressed with technology with 59 percent saying it made them more likely to return and 44 percent say tech gadgets encourage them stay longer.

>

> — [Orlando Rising - Theme park demographics changing: Higher incomes and more millennials](http://orlando-rising.com/theme-park-demographics-changing-higher-incomes-and-more-millennials/)

[// There are over 1000 results for disneyland on archive of our own. Popular destination for characters?? ]: #

### [Last Episode's](http://fanthropological.com/e/#-name) Famous Last Words

**Emily**

How many days does it take to get through Disney world (all of it)?

[// If you're just talking the Magic Kingdom: 3.49km. Add Epcot (4.47km), Hollywood Studios (2.23km), and Animal Kingdom (3.65km): That's 13.69km. At the average walking speed, that's about 2.7 hours if it was all arranged in one path. ]: #

**T**

What are some of the biggest Disney park failures?

[// Alien Encounter: Too scary, changed into Stitch attraction. Defunt land superstar limo]: #

**Z**

Are Disney fans worried that the magic of the theme parks will be diluted by other franchises popping up?

[// Martin's Vids -> YouTube: Documentaries of all the rides and attractions ]: #

**G**

If you are doing a Disney-bound outfit, how close can you get?

## Where can you find us online?

We are everywhere! Most notably though, we like to hang out in a few places on social media:

- If you want to be part of our podcast (or just want to check us out), we record our podcast LIVE on [twitch.tv](http://twitch.tv/thenickscast) every Monday at 20:00 Eastern Time!

- For all the latest updates, check us out on [Facebook](https://facebook.com/thenickscast) or [Twitter](https://twitter.com/thenickscast)

- To see the latest hijinx from our conventions or even our daily lives and adventures, check us out on [Instagram](https://instagram.com/thenickscast)

- For our latest convention updates, *Let's Plays*, and other in-real-life video, [check out our YouTube channel](http://youtube.com/thenickscast)

- We're also on [iTunes](https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/fanthropological/id1163621210), and [Google Play](https://play.google.com/music/m/Icmngxz7yhaoivdvivvf6q6c2pu?t=Fanthropological), and would love it if you could leave a review and rating!

- if you want to reach us, and for some reason none of those work for you, try [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected])

- You can check out [our website](http://thenickscast.com); that will mostly bring you back to this stuff.

- Everything is `thenickscast`, so if you can't find us, go on your social network and search for that!

## What is "Fanthropological"?

How did you read this far without asking this question?!

Fanthropological is an anthropological (ish) podcast where we bring the fan's-eye view to you! Each week, we take a look at a different fandom, dig up interesting background, trivia, and history, and try to get to why it is that people are a fan. We also try to highlight good causes related to that fandom, and find interesting things that fans have created to share those to the world. Each episode is about an hour. Ish.

## Who is "The Nickscast"?

*We* are the Nickscast! Three products of late-80s / early-90s pop culture who love exploring fandom and everything geek ... who also happen to have been best buddies since high school, and all happen to be named Nick. Yes, we are super creative (dare we say, the _most_ creative).

*Ahem*

We are Nick Green, Nick Terwoord, and Nick Zacharewicz: We started the Nickscast as a labour of love, and as a place to entertain and to discuss our love of fans and fandom, and all that is shiny and interesting in that realm. It's what lead us to start our first podcast, our satellite podcasts, Fanthropological, and so much more.

We want to help others learn more about different fandoms, and to create empathy with other fans: We dream of a world where other fans aren't "those Weird-o's", but just folks with different tastes. A world where fandom is full of discourse and analysis, and there are plenty of tools and resources to help. Fans building communities to do good in the world. *Because everyone's a fan.*

## Thanks

Special thanks to Tyler for being patient with us as we sorted out multiple technical difficulties!

## Credits

### Sources

- [Google Trends - Walt Disney World](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F09b1k,%2Fm%2F02fzs,%2Fm%2F04tkqm)

- [Know DW.com - Walking Distance At Disney World](http://knowdw.com/theme-parks/walking-distance-disney-world/)

- [Orlando Rising - Theme park demographics changing: Higher incomes and more millennials](http://orlando-rising.com/theme-park-demographics-changing-higher-incomes-and-more-millennials/)

- [Quora - What are some failed Disney park rides and attractions?](https://www.quora.com/What-are-some-failed-Disney-park-rides-and-attractions)

- [LA Times - This is your brain on Disneyland: A Disney addict's quest to discover why he loves the parks so much](http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/herocomplex/la-et-hc-disneyland-psychology-20170707-htmlstory.html)

- [Quora - How many Disney theme parks exist around the world and, of them, which are the most visitor friendly and why?](https://www.quora.com/How-many-Disney-theme-parks-exist-around-the-world-and-of-them-which-are-the-most-visitor-friendly-and-why)

- [WDW News Today](https://wdwnt.com/)

- [r/WaltDisneyWorld - Analyzing the Pending Fox Acquisition and it's Impact on Walt Disney World](https://www.reddit.com/r/WaltDisneyWorld/comments/7ndhmf/analyzing_the_pending_fox_acquisition_and_its/)

- [r/AskReddit - Redditors Who've Worked (Or Who Are Still Working) at Disney World. What Are Some NSFW Behind the Scenes Stories do You Have?](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/5oqedm/redditors_whove_worked_or_who_are_still_working/)

- [r/WaltDisneyWorld - With Disney Buying Fox, What Sort of New Attractions Do You Think We'll Get?](https://www.reddit.com/r/WaltDisneyWorld/comments/7jrvve/with_disney_buying_fox_what_sort_of_new/)

- [r/WaltDisneyWorld - New Life for Brazil Pavillion with Purchase of Fox's Movie/TV Division?](https://www.reddit.com/r/WaltDisneyWorld/comments/7lwfjb/new_life_for_brazil_pavillion_with_purchase_of/)

- [r/WaltDisneyWorld - I Need Help Convincing My Husband That WDW Is Amazing!](https://www.reddit.com/r/WaltDisneyWorld/comments/7leu29/i_need_help_convincing_my_husband_that_wdw_is/)

- [r/WaltDisneyWorld - What Happened to the Vision?](https://www.reddit.com/r/WaltDisneyWorld/comments/8mvdqt/what_happened_to_the_vision/)

- [r/WaltDisneyWorld - Strangely Unexcited for my First Visit](https://www.reddit.com/r/WaltDisneyWorld/comments/69vqpj/strangely_unexcited_for_my_first_visit/)

- [r/WaltDisneyWorld - First Time Visiting. How is WDW for Those with Mental Illnesses?](https://www.reddit.com/r/WaltDisneyWorld/comments/5yczpi/first_time_visiting_how_is_wdw_for_those_with/)

- [r/WaltDisneyWorld - First Time Back to WDW Since I was 5....Results](https://www.reddit.com/r/WaltDisneyWorld/comments/3vqtby/first_time_back_to_wdw_since_i_was_5results/)

- [Unofficial Walt Disney World Discussion Forums - Is Walt Disney Imagineering Dead?](https://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads/is-walt-disney-imagineering-dead.939095/#post-8128186)

- [Unofficial Walt Disney World Discussion Forums - Guardians of the Galaxy Mission Breakout Announced for Disney California Adventure](https://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads/guardians-of-the-galaxy-mission-breakout-announced-for-disney-california-adventure.915850/page-7#post-7325786)

- [Unofficial Walt Disney World Discussion Forums - Tomorrowland Dance Party](https://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads/tomorrowland-dance-party.899350/page-3#post-6692054)

- [Unofficial Walt Disney World Discussion Forums - Guardians of the Galaxy Attraction Confirmed for Epcot](https://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads/guardians-of-the-galaxy-attraction-confirmed-for-epcot.929265/page-102#post-7858696)

### Music / Sound

- ["A Whole New World with Piano"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqrVEACfuT8) by TeknoAXE

- ["Secret of Tiki Island"](https://incompetech.com/wordpress/2016/07/5-new-pieces/) by Kevin MacLeod and Bryan Teoh

- All other music and sound for this week's episode were provided by Nick Green!

### Artwork

- ["Glasses"](https://thenounproject.com/term/glasses/132894) by [Anton Anuchin](https://thenounproject.com/antonwebium) used under [CC BY 3.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/us/)

[// Pregenerate link to episode ahead of time: - clicktotweet.com- sharelinkgenerator.com]: #

This week, we take a bit more of a convention-al bent, to talk about the wider world of women heroes in media with special guest, Emily Gonsalves (con chair of the [Pretty Heroes convention](https://www.prettyheroes.com/)). We talk about representation of women in comics, tv, anime and manga and a LOT more.

Next week, we continue the magic with a trip to a little place that's a small world after world: that's right, we'll be talking about fans of Disney theme parks!

## Where can I learn more about Emily Gonsalves and the Pretty Heroes convention?

Pretty Heroes is a convention dedicated to showcasing strong female characters and it's the first "girl power" convention in Toronto. It started as the Toronto Sailor Moon Celebration and grew with fan demand to expand into a convention with a new name (but the same heart) featuring a variety of anime, cute items, "girly" items, and plenty of intriguing female characters. The founder and con chair, Emily Gonsalves, is a professional graphic designer and marketing manager by day, but she also used to "moonlight" as a regular reporter for the Sailor Moon focused blog "Moon Chase." You can also find Emily at other conventions running panels about Sailor Moon, art, fandom, and social media marketing. To follow her Sailor Moon related content on social media, check out [Moon Chase on Facebook](https://www.facebook.com/MoonChaseBlog/) and [Twitter](https://twitter.com/MoonChaseblog/) and [SailorMoonCelebration on Instagram](https://www.instagram.com/sailormooncelebration/). For general female character and convention fun, check out Pretty Heroes on [Facebook](https://facebook.com/prettyheroes/), [Twitter](https://twitter.com/prettyheroes/), and [Instagram](http://instagram.com/prettyheroes).

## Episode outline

### Fandom Facts

**Search Data:**

Given the broadness of today's topic, its hard to get data... but we tried! Looking at [Google Trends data](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F03hdkg,girl%20power,%2Fm%2F01cjwd) for _Girl Power (search term)_, _Girl Power (Topic)_, and _Magical Girl (literary genre)_ all reveal interesting results...

- Interest in the _Magical Girl_ literary genre is about twice as high as _girl power_. Interest was on a slow incline from 2004 to December 2010 before spiking dramatically starting in January 2011 (Madoka Magica), then decreasing a bit (still more popular than 2004).

- Interest in _Girl Power (search term)_ has been on a slow increase since 2004, whereas _Girl Power (topic)_ has been on a slow _decline_ in the same period.

The top 5 countries for the various trends, by search volume:

- _Magical Girl (literary genre)_: Japan, Macau, Taiwan, South Korea, Hong Kong

- _Girl Power (search term)_: Philippines, United States, Puerto Rico, Malaysia, Australia

- _Girl Power (topic)_: Italy, Sweden, Australia, Denmark, Norway

### [Last Episode's](http://fanthropological.com/e/boys-love-boys-keep-swinging/) Famous Last Words

**T**

Who was the first pretty hero?

[// Himitsu no Akko-chan (1962) is the earliest magical girl manga... possibly her ]: #

**Z**

Who was the more popular female hero of the 90s? Xena, or Buffy?

**G**

Where does Lina Inverse sit in the roster of pretty heroes?

**Sara**

Given that it is an empowerment fantasy for young girls, how do people feel about magical girls? What are some of the discussions around that?

### This week's spotlight

**[Inspiring Girls](http://www.inspiring-girls.com/)**

> Inspiring Girls International is an organisation dedicated to raising the aspirations of young girls around the world by connecting them with female role models.

>

>Our goals are:

> - Exposing young girls (10-15 years old) to the full variety of careers and options in life; and

> - Inspiring them to aim high

>

> ... We connect female role models and young girls around the world.

>

> — [Inspiring Girls International - About Us](http://www.inspiring-girls.com/about/what-we-do/)

**[Pretty Heroes](https://www.prettyheroes.com/)**

> It’s time for a convention in Toronto that is dedicated to strong female characters.

>

> We first started as the [Toronto Sailor Moon Celebration](http://sailormooncelebration.com/). Now we’re transforming to incorporate even more girl power to meet the demands of fans in Toronto.

>

> We want to encourage young people to pursue their dreams and define what being a hero means for them. If you enjoy narratives featuring strong female characters – you will find a positive, welcoming space at our events.

>

> — [Pretty Heroes](https://www.prettyheroes.com/)

[// Plugs go here ]: #

[// Race Against Time ]: #

### Famous Last Words

This week's famous last words around *next week's* fandom, Disney parks!

**Emily**

How many days does it take to get through Disney world (all of it)?

**T**

What are some of the biggest Disney park failures?

**Z**

Are Disney fans worried that the magic of the theme parks will be diluted by other franchises popping?

**G**

If you are doing a Disney-bound outfit, how close can you get?

## Where can you find us online?

We are everywhere! Most notably though, we like to hang out in a few places on social media:

- If you want to be part of our podcast (or just want to check us out), we record our podcast LIVE on [twitch.tv](http://twitch.tv/thenickscast) every Monday at 20:00 Eastern Time!

- For all the latest updates, check us out on [Facebook](https://facebook.com/thenickscast) or [Twitter](https://twitter.com/thenickscast)

- To see the latest hijinx from our conventions or even our daily lives and adventures, check us out on [Instagram](https://instagram.com/thenickscast)

- For our latest convention updates, *Let's Plays*, and other in-real-life video, [check out our YouTube channel](http://youtube.com/thenickscast)

- We're also on [iTunes](https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/fanthropological/id1163621210), and [Google Play](https://play.google.com/music/m/Icmngxz7yhaoivdvivvf6q6c2pu?t=Fanthropological), and would love it if you could leave a review and rating!

- if you want to reach us, and for some reason none of those work for you, try [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected])

- You can check out [our website](http://thenickscast.com); that will mostly bring you back to this stuff.

- Everything is `thenickscast`, so if you can't find us, go on your social network and search for that!

## What is "Fanthropological"?

How did you read this far without asking this question?!

Fanthropological is an anthropological (ish) podcast where we bring the fan's-eye view to you! Each week, we take a look at a different fandom, dig up interesting background, trivia, and history, and try to get to why it is that people are a fan. We also try to highlight good causes related to that fandom, and find interesting things that fans have created to share those to the world. Each episode is about an hour. Ish.

## Who is "The Nickscast"?

*We* are the Nickscast! Three products of late-80s / early-90s pop culture who love exploring fandom and everything geek ... who also happen to have been best buddies since high school, and all happen to be named Nick. Yes, we are super creative (dare we say, the _most_ creative).

*Ahem*

We are Nick Green, Nick Terwoord, and Nick Zacharewicz: We started the Nickscast as a labour of love, and as a place to entertain and to discuss our love of fans and fandom, and all that is shiny and interesting in that realm. It's what lead us to start our first podcast, our satellite podcasts, Fanthropological, and so much more.

We want to help others learn more about different fandoms, and to create empathy with other fans: We dream of a world where other fans aren't "those Weird-o's", but just folks with different tastes. A world where fandom is full of discourse and analysis, and there are plenty of tools and resources to help. Fans building communities to do good in the world. *Because everyone's a fan.*

## Thanks

Special thanks to Emily for taking the time out of her busy schedule to chat with us!

## Credits

### Sources

- [Google Trends - Girl Power and Magical Girl](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F03hdkg,girl%20power,%2Fm%2F01cjwd)

- [Wikipedia - Magical Girl](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magical_girl)

- [Elle - How To Reboot Girl Power](https://www.elle.com/culture/movies-tv/a14700/cartoon-girl-power-reboots/)

- [Buzzfeed - What Happened to Girl Power Cartoons on Television?](https://www.buzzfeed.com/spartantown/what-happened-to-girl-power-cartoons-on-television-c8u6?utm_term=.wx3WAZkk2#.gwPpm011P)

- [a plus - Here’s Why One Campaign Is Targeting The Gender Imbalance In Cartoons](https://aplus.com/a/inspiring-girls-redraw-the-balance-lets-get-animated?no_monetization=true)

- [Jezebel - Where Are the Girls in Children's Media?](https://jezebel.com/5980085/where-are-the-girls-in-childrens-media)

- [Fanlore - Buffy the Vampire Slayer](https://fanlore.org/wiki/Buffy_the_Vampire_Slayer)

- [Fanlore - Xena: Warrior Princess](https://fanlore.org/wiki/Xena:_Warrior_Princess)

- [Gwern.net - Magical Girls and Atomic Bomb Sperm: Japanese Animation in America](http://www.gwern.net/docs/anime/1995-newitz.pdf)

- [IMDB - Buffy The Vampire Slayer (TV Series 1996-2003)](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0118276/)

- [IMDB - Xena: Warrior Princess (TV Series 1995-2001)](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0112230/)

- [Nika Summers - E-Zines](http://www.nika-summers.com/ezines.php)

- [OpenEdition - “Unreal” Gender Messages in Late 90s Women-Centered Action Dramas](https://journals.openedition.org/tvseries/1205)

- [The Mary Sue - Netflix and Lumberjanes Creator Noelle Stevenson Deliver She-Ra for the Next Generation](https://www.themarysue.com/noelle-stevenson-netflix-she-ra)

- [UVicSpace - Make-Up!: The Mythic Narrative and Transformation as a Mechanism for Personal and Spiritual Growth in Magical Girl (Mahō Shōjo) Anime](https://dspace.library.uvic.ca/bitstream/handle/1828/8496/russell_ndonna_MA_2017.pdf?sequence=1&isAllowed=y)

- [Wikipedia - Buffy The Vampire Slayer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buffy_the_Vampire_Slayer)

- [Wikipedia - Xena: Warrior Princess](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xena:_Warrior_Princess)

- [YouTube - Bigger Than Me: A Documentary About Fandom ► JamesChats](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGDtTRPgfrw)

### Music / Sound

- ["Sheba out on the Town"](http://teknoaxe.com/Link_Code_4.php?q=988&Genre=Downtempo) by TeknoAXE used under [CC BY 4.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/)

- All other music and sound for this week's episode were provided by Nick Green!

### Artwork

- ["Glasses"](https://thenounproject.com/term/glasses/132894) by [Anton Anuchin](https://thenounproject.com/antonwebium) used under [CC BY 3.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/us/)

At the outset of this season, we narrowly missed the chance to have Andy on the show to talk about fans of ReBoot (as he suggested the topic in the first place!) but now, all is right with the world as G and Z dig a bit deeper into ReBoot fandom with him!

All this in... under an hour? Not bad!

## Where can I learn more about Andy?

You can learn more about Andy Spiteri through his work at [Zelda Dungeon](https://www.zeldadungeon.net)! Or, you can listen to the [Champion's Cast](http://pod.zeldadungeon.net/), Zelda Dungeon's podcast that comes out every week.

Haven't got enough Andy?? Check him out on Twitter: [@Spiteri316](http://twitter.com/spiteri316)

**Sources**

- Opening music, ["Diggin' til the Very End"](http://music.djcutman.com/album/volume-iv) by Dj CUTMAN used under [CC BY-NC-SA 3.0](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/3.0/)

- Ending music, ["Bounty Hunter"](http://music.djcutman.com/album/volume-iv) by Dj CUTMAN used under [CC BY-NC-SA 3.0](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/3.0/)

[// Pregenerate link to episode ahead of time: - clicktotweet.com- sharelinkgenerator.com]: #

This week, we need an expert to get to the bottom of the difference between yaoi and shonen-ai, for starters, as we dive into the world of Boys' Love fans (just in time for Anime North)!

## Where can I learn more about Sara (Feminist Fujoshi)?

Sara is the writer and moderator of the blog Feminist Fujoshi on [Tumblr](http://feministfujoshi.tumblr.com/) and [WordPress](https://feministfujoshi.wordpress.com/). Sara's work on Feminist Fujoshi started on Tumblr in 2013 and she has even done some academic research on the subject!

If you want to check out more of her work, you can find her on Twitter [@blusocket](twitter.com/blusocket) and soon on [Anime Feminist](https://www.animefeminist.com/)!

## Episode outline

### Fandom Facts

**History and Origins:**

> In English, often abbreviated BL. Written as BL or ボイズラブ in Japanese. The manga and anime genre of fictional male homosexual romance, created for a female audience. Used interchangeably with yaoi and shounen ai in English (but not in Japanese).

>

> — [Fanlore - Boys' Love](https://fanlore.org/wiki/Boys%27_Love)

**Search Data:**

Based on the search data, interest in the literary genre of ["Yaoi" is, generally, up](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F0f9s9). There was a wave of interest that appears to have started in 2011, peaked in Summer of 2015, then has been on a bit of decline ever since. It appears that Yaoi might be the general term that Google wraps up search terms under.

The top 10 countries, by search volume, for Yaoi, are as follows: Thailand, Phillipines, Chile, Vietnam, Bolivia, El Salvador, Mexico, Peru, Paraguay, Russia.

### [Last Episode's](http://fanthropological.com/e/#-name) Famous Last Words

**Z**

Did this genre emerge simply because folks saw these elements in other stories and wanted to make a quick buck? Or was it about expressing themselves?

**T**

How much BL is sports manga?

[// Kuroko's Basketball #5 related search topic ]: #

**G**

Is there a golden standard for "this is the best BL manga" OR is it getting better as time goes on?

**Dan**

Is there a distinction between Yaoi and Boy's Love? Why has the terminology changed?

**Ari**

I really like Love Live? Where are the boy bands? Are there boy idols?

**Raph**

"hewwo i'm 5 wats yaoi"

### The Verdict

**G is in.** Gravitation struck him like a lightning rod.

**T is in.** Going to check out some of Sara's recommendations. Wants to feel things!

**Z is in.** Standing in front of the door to BL. Wants to open the door to vulnerability.

**Sarah is in.** Complex genre with a really rich history! There's probably something for everyone, but you might have to dig.

### This week's spotlight

[// Yaoi-con ]: #

**[Yaoi North](https://yaoinorth.com/)**

> Yaoi North was originally created in 2004 by Bishounen Hideto and Gryvon, after a discussion in Anime North 2004’s yaoi panel about the need for an East Coast version of Yaoi-Con. A few months later, Hideto and Gryvon approached the Anime North staff with the idea of Yaoi North, a one-room event inside Anime North similar to the J-Rock room. They were given the go, and from there Yaoi North was born. Hideto pulled Chris in as staff to do artwork for us while Gryvon grabbed both Matan and Covarla as her lackeys, originally having Matan run Gay Sex 101 and Covarla check IDs. Yaoi North 2005 was the first run of the con. The majority of the programming was taken over by viewings, but a number of staple panels grew out of this year - namely Crossplay 101, World History of Homosexuality, and the ever-popular Gay Sex 101, which ran over its original one hour timeslot to become the longest running panel in con history.

>

> — [Yaoi North - About Us](https://yaoinorth.com/about-yaoiyuri-north/)

[// Plugs go here ]: #

### Famous Last Words

This week's famous last words around *next week's* fandom, Pretty Heroes!

**T**

Who was the first pretty hero?

**Z**

Who was the more popular female hero of the 90s? Xena, or Buffy?

**G**

Where does Lina Inverse sit in the roster of pretty heroes?

**Sara**

Empowerment fantasy... young girls... How do people feel about magical girls? What are some of the discussions around that?

## Where can you find us online?

We are everywhere! Most notably though, we like to hang out in a few places on social media:

- If you want to be part of our podcast (or just want to check us out), we record our podcast LIVE on [twitch.tv](http://twitch.tv/thenickscast) every Monday at 20:00 Eastern Time!

- For all the latest updates, check us out on [Facebook](https://facebook.com/thenickscast) or [Twitter](https://twitter.com/thenickscast)

- To see the latest hijinx from our conventions or even our daily lives and adventures, check us out on [Instagram](https://instagram.com/thenickscast)

- For our latest convention updates, *Let's Plays*, and other in-real-life video, [check out our YouTube channel](http://youtube.com/thenickscast)

- We're also on [iTunes](https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/fanthropological/id1163621210), and [Google Play](https://play.google.com/music/m/Icmngxz7yhaoivdvivvf6q6c2pu?t=Fanthropological), and would love it if you could leave a review and rating!

- if you want to reach us, and for some reason none of those work for you, try [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected])

- You can check out [our website](http://thenickscast.com); that will mostly bring you back to this stuff.

- Everything is `thenickscast`, so if you can't find us, go on your social network and search for that!

## What is "Fanthropological"?

How did you read this far without asking this question?!

Fanthropological is an anthropological (ish) podcast where we bring the fan's-eye view to you! Each week, we take a look at a different fandom, dig up interesting background, trivia, and history, and try to get to why it is that people are a fan. We also try to highlight good causes related to that fandom, and find interesting things that fans have created to share those to the world. Each episode is about an hour. Ish.

## Who is "The Nickscast"?

*We* are the Nickscast! Three products of late-80s / early-90s pop culture who love exploring fandom and everything geek ... who also happen to have been best buddies since high school, and all happen to be named Nick. Yes, we are super creative (dare we say, the _most_ creative).

*Ahem*

We are Nick Green, Nick Terwoord, and Nick Zacharewicz: We started the Nickscast as a labour of love, and as a place to entertain and to discuss our love of fans and fandom, and all that is shiny and interesting in that realm. It's what lead us to start our first podcast, our satellite podcasts, Fanthropological, and so much more.

We want to help others learn more about different fandoms, and to create empathy with other fans: We dream of a world where other fans aren't "those Weird-o's", but just folks with different tastes. A world where fandom is full of discourse and analysis, and there are plenty of tools and resources to help. Fans building communities to do good in the world. *Because everyone's a fan.*

## Thanks

Special thanks to Sara for taking the time to chat with us!

## Credits

### Sources

- [Google Trends - Yaoi](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F0f9s9)

- [Fanlore - Boys' Love](https://fanlore.org/wiki/Boys%27_Love)

- [Feminist Fujoshi](https://feministfujoshi.wordpress.com/)

- [Comicsverse - Let’s Talk about Boy’s Love: Exoticization or Revolution?](https://comicsverse.com/boys-love-exoticization-revolution/)

- [Dru Pagliassotti - The Mark of Ashen Wings - Qualitative data from research reported in Dru Pagliassotti, Reading Boys’ Love in the West](http://drupagliassotti.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/Dru_Pagliassotti_Qualitative.pdf)

- [Japan Powered - Yaoi: History, Appeal, and Misconceptions](https://www.japanpowered.com/anime-articles/a-brief-history-of-yaoi)

- [JSTOR - Beautiful, Borrowed, and Bent: "Boys' Love" as Girls' Love in Shojo Manga](http://www.jstor.org/stable/pdf/10.1086/498987.pdf?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents)

- [r/Boy’s Love - Boys Love, M/M or Yaoi with Action, Adventure...An Actual Plot](https://www.reddit.com/r/boyslove/comments/6v4tea/boys_love_mm_or_yaoi_with_action_adventurean/#bottom-comments)

- [r/Boy’s Love - Still Don’t Know What To Do](https://www.reddit.com/r/boyslove/comments/84esik/still_dont_know_what_to_do/)

- [University of Wollongong Australia Research Online - The World of Yaoi: The Internet, Censorship and the Global “Boys’ Love” Fandom](http://ro.uow.edu.au/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1152&context=artspapers)

- [YaoiCon - About Us](http://yaoicon.com/index.php/about-us/)

### Music / Sound

- ["Summer Wanders"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWv3hXhdKnU) by TeknoAXE used under [CC BY 4.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/)

- All other music and sound for this week's episode were provided by Nick Green!

### Artwork

- ["Glasses"](https://thenounproject.com/term/glasses/132894) by [Anton Anuchin](https://thenounproject.com/antonwebium) used under [CC BY 3.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/us/)

If elected, T will ensure that all fans, no matter what they believe, will be able to walk around with Dakimakura in public, without being ridiculed. If Z is elected, only the true fans will be allowed to follow their manifest destiny in the world of fandom. G eats a sandwich. Pandemonium ensues? This week, we're talking about how far fandom has (or hasn't) come into the mainstream and what any of that means!

All this in 20 minutes or less!

**Sources**

- Opening music, ["Diggin' til the Very End"](http://music.djcutman.com/album/volume-iv) by Dj CUTMAN used under [CC BY-NC-SA 3.0](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/3.0/)

- Ending music, ["Bounty Hunter"](http://music.djcutman.com/album/volume-iv) by Dj CUTMAN used under [CC BY-NC-SA 3.0](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/3.0/)

[// Pregenerate link to episode ahead of time: - clicktotweet.com- sharelinkgenerator.com]: #

This week, there's no need to use a Phoenix Down because we are ALIVE, and talking about the fans of the Final Fantasy series! The iconic music, characters, stories, costumes... whatever it may be, it has left a lasting mark on the RPG and video game worlds for the decades since its introductions, and we get into all of that with some special guest friends of ours, Dan and Ari!

Next week, just in time for [Anime North](http://animenorth.com/), we're talking about fans of Boys' Love with Sarah of the [Feminist Fujoshi](https://feministfujoshi.wordpress.com/)!

## Where can I learn more about Dan and Ari?

You might remember Dan and Ari from our [super-cut of Super MAGFest 2018](https://youtu.be/DiJt-4m6qKE?t=4m8s) and his panel on [the music of Final Fantasy](https://youtu.be/sEPn75v-L3M). You can check out more of their work online:

_Ari_

- Instagram: [@totallytoastyari](http://instagram.com/totallytoastyari)

- Facebook: [facebook.com/totallytoasty](http://facebook.com/totallytoasty)

- YouTube: [youtube.com/totallytoastyari](https://www.youtube.com/totallytoastyari)

_Dan_

- Instagram: [@musiconthedlo](http://instagram.com/musiconthedlo)

- Twitter: [@musiconthedlo](http://twitter.com/musiconthedlo)

- YouTube: [youtube.com/musiconthedlo](https://www.youtube.com/musiconthedlo)

## Episode outline

### Fandom Facts

**History and Origins:**

Final Fantasy is a science fiction and fantasy media franchise owned by Square Enix. Despite having fifteen numbered games, 135 million copies of the various games sold, and well over 40 different sequels, spin-offs, and other properties, the game acquired its moniker in 1987 due to the game designers' belief that Square was going to go bankrupt ([according to Nobuo Uematsu](https://www.wired.com/2009/07/final-fantasy/), composer of many famous _Final Fantasy_ tracks).

Though most of the numbered games are stand-alone stories in different settings with different characters, there are many recurring plot themes, game mechanics, and character names (e.g. Plots center on a group of heroes battling a great evil while exploring the characters' internal struggles and relationships).

**Search Data:**

The Final Fantasy series has had a dramatic [decrease in interest since 2004](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F02ywx,%2Fm%2F0dvzv). The series is about a tenth as popular as it was back in 2004. There are spikes in interest in September 2005 (The release of _Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children_), March 2010 (_Final Fantasy XIII_), and December 2016 (_Final Fantasy XV_).

[// Why is that? More options for games? ]: #

The top ten countries, by search volume, are as follows: Phillipines, Japan, Puerto Rico, Singapore, Canada, Malaysia, South Korea, United States, New Zealanda, Spain.

[// Also gives us some interesting data on most searched

By topic:

- XIII-2

- Dissidia

- Brave Exvius

- Lightning Returns XIII

- XV

By query:

XIV

XIII-2

Dissidia

A Realm Reborn (XIV)

Type 0

Exvius

]: #

**Fan Demographics:**

We actually managed to find a survey from 2015 with some data! Though it is skewed towards whoever responded on `r/FinalFantasy`, [Tobzzen has us covered with almost 5000 responses](https://www.reddit.com/r/FinalFantasy/comments/4rd7at/results_of_my_survey_from_november_2015/):

- _Age:_ 21 to 30 years old (47%), 18 to 20 years old (42%) — a very narrow age range

- _Gender:_ Male (82%), Female (16%), Other (2%)

- _Location_: >50% North America, >30% Europe

- _Employment Status:_ 60% studying or working

- _Gaming Status:_ 95% had more than 4 years of computer gaming experience; >25% had more than 16 years experience

- _Game Playing Time:_ 53% played on average 3-6 hours per day; >10% played more than 10 hours per day

**Fanac Fast Facts:**

- Archive Of Our Own has [over 28 000 works related to the Final Fantasy Series](https://archiveofourown.org/tags/Final%20Fantasy/works)

- ... most being categorized as M/M (13000+), Gen (7000+), or F/M (6000+)

- ... the most represented game being XV (14000+), VII (6000+), and XIV (1300+)

[// FF VI has about 500 ]: #

- ... the most represented characters being Noctis (9000+), Ignis (8700+), and Prompto (8300+)

[// Cloud is 5th (3700), Sephiroth is 6th (2600) ]: #

### [Last Episode's](http://fanthropological.com/e/nier-lessons-in-applied-nier-ology/) Famous Last Words

**G**

What is it that has endured about FF7 compared to FF6?

**Z**

The people who came into the FF world long after the SNES... do they go back and play the old games (and do they like)?

**T**

Why is it still called Final Fantasy?

[// Couldn't find anything conclusive. Probably because it stuck?

Did find this list of renamed games though:

Ff1- Warriors of Light

Ff2- Red Roses

Ff3- Crystal Darkness

Ff4- Legends of the Moon

Ff5- Crystal Heroes

Ff6- World into Ruin

Ff7- Mako Crisis

Ff8- Balamb Heroes

Ff9- Honor Among Thieves

Ff10- Son of Sin

Ff11- Crystal Heroes Online

Ff12- War of Ivalice

Ff13- Chained Destiny

Ff14- Crystal Heroes Online 2

Ff15- Journey of a Prince

]: #

**Sarah**

What is your all-time favourite Final Fantasy song?

[// Serious answer: I really liked Real Emotion from FF X-2; didn't play a lot off FFs... FF6 - the decisive battle? Mog's theme? ]: #

**EpicFilmGuys**

_At Zanarkand_ is the greatest FF song ever written. Debate.

**tengumaru**

"You son of a submariner" is a good Final Fantasy famous last word... ?

### What did we discuss?

Questions:

~~- What do you wish folks knew about Final Fantasy and its fans?~~

- What do you see as one of the biggest parts of Final Fantasy fandom (e.g. vidding, fic, art, cosplay, etc.)?

~~- What are some of the biggest points of conflict or contention in Final Fantasy fandom?~~

- What are some common myths or misconceptions about Final Fantasy fans that you wish would go away?

- Have you noticed any problematic aspects to the fandom, and if so, what do they tend to be?

- Could you describe a moment where you were participating in the fandom and were just blown away in a positive way?

~~- How did you get into Final Fantasy?~~

- How do you express your fandom?

~~- When did you know you were a fan?~~

- Which is your favourite Final Fantasy game and why?

- If we did an episode on one of your other favourite fandoms… what would that be?

### The Verdict

**G is in.** One of G's favourite games of all time... FF6 worthy of an HBO drama.

**Ari is in.** Definitely a lifelong fan. Would love to play all the games.

**Dan is in.** Final Fantasy has, musically, shaped the way he constructs music.

**T is in.** Will give more Final Fantasy a shot.

**Z is out.** But really interested in playing FF IX and some spin-offs.

### This week's spotlight

**[OverClocked Remix](http://ocremix.org/)**

> Founded in 1999, OverClocked ReMix is a community dedicated to the appreciation and promotion of video game music as an art form. Its primary focus is ocremix.org, a website featuring thousands of free fan arrangements, information on game music and composers, resources for aspiring artists, and a thriving community of video game music fans. In 2016, OC ReMix officially moved under the umbrella and sponsorship of [Game Music Initiative, Inc](http://gamemusic.org), a 501c3 non-profit charitable organization.

>

> — OverClocked Remix - About Us

### Famous Last Words

This week's famous last words around *next week's* fandom, (Fandom name)!

**Z**

Did this genre emerge simply because folks saw these elements in other stories and make a quick buck? Or was it about expressing themselves?

**T**

How much BL is sports manga?

**G**

Is there a golden standard for "this is the best BL manga" OR is it getting better as time goes on?

**Dan**

Is there a distinction between Yaoi and Boy's Love? Why has the terminology changed?

**Ari**

I really like Love Live? Where are the boy bands? Are there boy idols?

**Raph**

"hewwo i'm 5 wats yaoi"

[// Ari: Bioshock! Dan: Also Bioshock... or the Sims]: #

## Where can you find us online?

We are everywhere! Most notably though, we like to hang out in a few places on social media:

- If you want to be part of our podcast (or just want to check us out), we record our podcast LIVE on [twitch.tv](http://twitch.tv/thenickscast) every Monday at 20:00 Eastern Time!

- For all the latest updates, check us out on [Facebook](https://facebook.com/thenickscast) or [Twitter](https://twitter.com/thenickscast)

- To see the latest hijinx from our conventions or even our daily lives and adventures, check us out on [Instagram](https://instagram.com/thenickscast)

- For our latest convention updates, *Let's Plays*, and other in-real-life video, [check out our YouTube channel](http://youtube.com/thenickscast)

- We're also on [iTunes](https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/fanthropological/id1163621210), and [Google Play](https://play.google.com/music/m/Icmngxz7yhaoivdvivvf6q6c2pu?t=Fanthropological), and would love it if you could leave a review and rating!

- if you want to reach us, and for some reason none of those work for you, try [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected])

- You can check out [our website](http://thenickscast.com); that will mostly bring you back to this stuff.

- Everything is `thenickscast`, so if you can't find us, go on your social network and search for that!

## What is "Fanthropological"?

How did you read this far without asking this question?!

Fanthropological is an anthropological (ish) podcast where we bring the fan's-eye view to you! Each week, we take a look at a different fandom, dig up interesting background, trivia, and history, and try to get to why it is that people are a fan. We also try to highlight good causes related to that fandom, and find interesting things that fans have created to share those to the world. Each episode is about an hour. Ish.

## Who is "The Nickscast"?

*We* are the Nickscast! Three products of late-80s / early-90s pop culture who love exploring fandom and everything geek ... who also happen to have been best buddies since high school, and all happen to be named Nick. Yes, we are super creative (dare we say, the _most_ creative).

*Ahem*

We are Nick Green, Nick Terwoord, and Nick Zacharewicz: We started the Nickscast as a labour of love, and as a place to entertain and to discuss our love of fans and fandom, and all that is shiny and interesting in that realm. It's what lead us to start our first podcast, our satellite podcasts, Fanthropological, and so much more.

We want to help others learn more about different fandoms, and to create empathy with other fans: We dream of a world where other fans aren't "those Weird-o's", but just folks with different tastes. A world where fandom is full of discourse and analysis, and there are plenty of tools and resources to help. Fans building communities to do good in the world. *Because everyone's a fan.*

## Thanks

Special thanks to Dan and Ari for being patient with us and flexible as we deal with time zone differences, for joining us on the show, and for in general, just being amazing people!

## Credits

### Sources

- [r/FinalFantasy](https://www.reddit.com/r/FinalFantasy/)

- [Archive Of Our Own - Final Fantasy works](https://archiveofourown.org/tags/Final%20Fantasy/works)

- [Google Trends - Final Fantasy series](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F02ywx,%2Fm%2F0dvzv)

- [r/FinalFantasy - Results of my [SURVEY] from November 2015](https://www.reddit.com/r/FinalFantasy/comments/4rd7at/results_of_my_survey_from_november_2015/)

- [Wikipedia - List of Final Fantasy video games](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Final_Fantasy_video_games)

- [Wired - WHY'S IT CALLED 'FINAL FANTASY'? UEMATSU EXPLAINS](https://www.wired.com/2009/07/final-fantasy/)

- [Wikipedia - Final Fantasy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Final_Fantasy)

- [GameFAQs - Rename the title of every mainline FF game](https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/932981-final-fantasy-xv/73783737)

- [Fanlore - Final Fantasy Press](https://fanlore.org/wiki/Final_Fantasy_Press)

- [Fanlore - Final Fantasy](https://fanlore.org/wiki/Final_Fantasy)

- [Final Fantasy Five Four Job Fiesta - About](http://fourjobfiesta.com/about.php)

- [Kotaku - Final Fantasy VII Retrospective: Great Because It’s Weird](https://kotaku.com/final-fantasy-vii-retrospective-the-weirdest-rpg-ever-1797547869)

- [Quora - I’ve Never Played Final Fantasy, Where Do I Start?](https://www.quora.com/Ive-never-played-Final-Fantasy-Where-do-I-start)

- [YouTube - Final Fantasy X OST : To Zanarkand](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-0G_FI61a8)

- [YouTube - When Do Final Fantasy Games Become Overrated/Underrated? An Extensive Analysis](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VI4x9LuxKJQ)

### Music / Sound

- ["Crystal Caves in the Mountain"](http://teknoaxe.com/Link_Code_4.php?q=580&Genre=Soundscape) by TeknoAXE used under [CC BY 4.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/)

- All other music and sound for this week's episode were provided by Nick Green!

### Artwork

- ["Glasses"](https://thenounproject.com/term/glasses/132894) by [Anton Anuchin](https://thenounproject.com/antonwebium) used under [CC BY 3.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/us/)

[// Pregenerate link to episode ahead of time: - clicktotweet.com- sharelinkgenerator.com]: #

> Everything that lives is designed to end. We are perpetually trapped in a never-ending spiral of life and death. Is this a curse? Or some kind of punishment? I often think about the god who blessed us with this cryptic puzzle...and wonder if we'll ever get the chance to kill him.

>

> — Nier: Automata

Uh... we're talking about Nier this week, and hopefully we don't dive too far down the existentialist rabbithole. Plus, we've got special guest Sarah (aka SMZeldaRules) as our resident Nier-ologist to get us through it all.

Next week, we'll dive into that long-running and epic fandom: Final Fantasy fans (with special guests, Dan and Ari)!

## Where can I learn more about SMZeldaRules?

Do you like Cosplay? Perhaps Video Games? Good news! SMZeldaRules is a huge fan of both! If you want to follow her work, you can find her on...

- Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/smzeldarulesartandcosplay

- Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/smzeldarules/

- Twitter: https://twitter.com/smzeldarules

- Twitch: https://www.twitch.tv/smzeldarules

- YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/smzeldarulescosplay

## Episode outline

### Fandom Facts

**History and Origins:**

Nier... is actually a complicated game series to explain. It is definitely most well-known because of the 2017 entry in the series, _Nier: Automata_, but technically that is a sequel to the less popular _Nier_ (2010), which itself is a sequel to Ending E of _Drakengard / Drag-On Dragoon_ (2003). I think I've got that right.

[// Interject and ask if Sarah can provide some additional detail without a tone of spoilers ]: #

Speaking just about _Nier_ and _Nier: Automata_ (for the moment), the games are set in the far future where Earth has been left in a state of decay. _Nier_ focussed on the character of the same name attempting to find a cure for an illness, the Black Scrawl, and the sequel focusses on a combat android, 2B, in the midst of a proxy war between androids and machines created by otherworldly invaders. Did we mention it gets complicated?

Both _Nier_ and _Nier: Automata_ were written by the eclectic Yoko Taro. And combined have sold over 2.5 million copies worldwide.

[// Someone could easily do a history lesson on how all the games fit together ]: #

**Search Data:**

Given the complicated nature of the series, I looked up _Drakengard_, _Nier_, and _Nier: Automata_. The data is [very spiky](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F013f6zqs,%2Fm%2F09k6px6,%2Fm%2F02glg9), but generally interest has gone up since 2004 (although most interest has been since March 2017 - approximately the release date).

Since _Automata_ has the most data, we used it for looking at interest by region. The top 10 countries, by search data: South Korea, Japan, Taiwan, Singapore, Hong Kong, Philippines, Moldova, Malaysia, Russia, Puerto Rico.

(_Nier_ data is pretty similar in terms of top five, but Canada makes an appearance at 6th and Australia at 10th)

**Size of Fandom:**

Looking at the data we have from a few sources:

- There are almost 31 000 subscribers on [r/nier](https://www.reddit.com/r/nier/)

- [Metacritic has over 2700 user ratings for Automata](http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-4/nier-automata/user-reviews)

- [Nier: Automata has sold over 2 million copies by March 2018](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nier:_Automata)

It's fair to say that there are tens of thousands of dedicate fans of Nier.

**Fanac Fast Facts:**

- Archive Of Our Own has about [400 fics related](https://archiveofourown.org/tags/NieR:%20Automata%20(Video%20Game)/works) to the [Nier series](https://archiveofourown.org/tags/Nier%20Gestalt%20%7C%20Nier/works):

- ... Most of which are F/M (224)

- ... Most of which have no crossover

- ... Most of which involve 2B (296) or 9S (280)

- In a 'best girl' survey on the Nier subreddit, [2B narrowly beat out A2](https://www.reddit.com/r/nier/comments/61qutn/best_girl_survey_results/)

### [Last Episode's](http://fanthropological.com/e/wes-anderson-not-to-scale/) Famous Last Words

**Z**

The popularity of Nier is as small as it is because it came out after Sony had disrupted the Nintendo-based gaming monoculture.

**T**

How did the series go from Dragons (Drakengard) to Robots (Nier)?

[// Complicated as fuck: but from this reddit thread (thanks theblob326): Drakengard's ending E has Caim, Angelus and the queen beast appear in what is essentially our world. They all die and their remains are the source of magic and white chlorination syndrome. WCS causes the apocalypse and magic lets humanity survive it as Gestalts. Then fast forward a LOT more]: #

**G**

Why are there more albums than games?

### What did we discuss?

Questions for Sarah:

- What got you into Nier?

- What is contentious in the fandom?

- Problematic elements of fandom?

- What has been the most touching moment you have seen in the fandom?

Why do folks like Nier?

- Interesting take on New Game +

- Music is great!

- Lots of questions + lore

- Philosophy? Not necessarily deep, but good

- Very Anime-esque

- Great theme ('endless' repetition)

- Self discovery, heartbreak

- genre bending: SHMUP sections, 2d, action RPG

- FUCKING MUSIC

- reminds me of GitS (music, etc.)

- Looks pretty fucking good

### The Verdict

**G is in~terested.** Attracted to the idea of stories that take place over a very long time.

**T is in.** Wants to play through some more, get more endings!

**Z is in?** Would really like to play them all... but that might be a fantasy.

**Sarah is in.** It's great. As someone in the fandom for just three years, still kind of a newbie.

### This week's spotlight

**[Project: C[O]DA](https://nierautomatafanzine.tumblr.com/tagged/faq)**

> _What is this Project, Commander? _

> We have been tasked to analyze and reproduce sound data as images.

These images will then be compiled into a booklet to be distributed to all unmotivated androids. Glory…to mankind.

>

> — Project: C[O]DA FAQ

It's a fanzine for Nier, with proceeds going to the Brain and Behaviour Research Foundation. Unfortunately, looks to be done now, but worth trying to find.

[// Plugs go here ]: #

### Famous Last Words

This week's famous last words around *next week's* fandom, Final Fantasy!

**G**

What is it that has endured about FF7 compared to FF6?

**Z**

The people who came into the FF world long after the SNES... do they go back and play the old games (and do they like)?

**T**

Why is it still called Final Fantasy?

**Sarah**

What is your all-time favourite Final Fantasy song?

**EpicFilmGuys**

At Zanarkand is the greatest FF song ever written. Debate.

**tengumaru**

"You son of a submariner" is a good Final Fantasy famous last word... ?

## Where can you find us online?

We are everywhere! Most notably though, we like to hang out in a few places on social media:

- If you want to be part of our podcast (or just want to check us out), we record our podcast LIVE on [twitch.tv](http://twitch.tv/thenickscast) every Monday at 20:00 Eastern Time!

- For all the latest updates, check us out on [Facebook](https://facebook.com/thenickscast) or [Twitter](https://twitter.com/thenickscast)

- To see the latest hijinx from our conventions or even our daily lives and adventures, check us out on [Instagram](https://instagram.com/thenickscast)

- For our latest convention updates, *Let's Plays*, and other in-real-life video, [check out our YouTube channel](http://youtube.com/thenickscast)

- We're also on [iTunes](https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/fanthropological/id1163621210), and [Google Play](https://play.google.com/music/m/Icmngxz7yhaoivdvivvf6q6c2pu?t=Fanthropological), and would love it if you could leave a review and rating!

- if you want to reach us, and for some reason none of those work for you, try [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected])

- You can check out [our website](http://thenickscast.com); that will mostly bring you back to this stuff.

- Everything is `thenickscast`, so if you can't find us, go on your social network and search for that!

## What is "Fanthropological"?

How did you read this far without asking this question?!

Fanthropological is an anthropological (ish) podcast where we bring the fan's-eye view to you! Each week, we take a look at a different fandom, dig up interesting background, trivia, and history, and try to get to why it is that people are a fan. We also try to highlight good causes related to that fandom, and find interesting things that fans have created to share those to the world. Each episode is about an hour. Ish.

## Who is "The Nickscast"?

*We* are the Nickscast! Three products of late-80s / early-90s pop culture who love exploring fandom and everything geek ... who also happen to have been best buddies since high school, and all happen to be named Nick. Yes, we are super creative (dare we say, the _most_ creative).

*Ahem*

We are Nick Green, Nick Terwoord, and Nick Zacharewicz: We started the Nickscast as a labour of love, and as a place to entertain and to discuss our love of fans and fandom, and all that is shiny and interesting in that realm. It's what lead us to start our first podcast, our satellite podcasts, Fanthropological, and so much more.

We want to help others learn more about different fandoms, and to create empathy with other fans: We dream of a world where other fans aren't "those Weird-o's", but just folks with different tastes. A world where fandom is full of discourse and analysis, and there are plenty of tools and resources to help. Fans building communities to do good in the world. *Because everyone's a fan.*

## Notable quotes from this episode

> "Quote"

>

> —(X)

## Thanks

Special thanks to SMZeldaRules for being able to make time in her schedule to share her wealth of knowledge on the Drakengard / Drag-on Dragoon / Nier series!

## Credits

### Sources

- [Google Trends - Nier: Automata, Nier, Drakengard](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F013f6zqs,%2Fm%2F09k6px6,%2Fm%2F02glg9)

- [MetaCritic - Nier: Automata](http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-4/nier-automata/user-reviews)

- [Reddit - r/nier](https://www.reddit.com/r/nier/)

- [r/nier - Best Girl Survey Results](https://www.reddit.com/r/nier/comments/61qutn/best_girl_survey_results/)

- [Wikipedia - Drakengard](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drakengard)

- [Wikipedia - Nier](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nier_(video_game))

- [Wikipedia - Nier: Automata](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nier:_Automata)

- [Nier2.com - Timeline](http://nier2.com/timeline.html)

- [r/nier - Connection with Nier and Drakengard](https://www.reddit.com/r/nier/comments/5u47qc/connection_with_nier_and_drakengard/)

- [Game Informer - Opinion - Give Me More Weird Masterpieces Like Nier: Automata](http://www.gameinformer.com/b/features/archive/2017/11/23/opinion-give-me-more-weird-masterpieces-like-nier-automata.aspx)

- [YouTube - Lore summary - From Drakengard to Nier: Automata](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JE6n2KGbaZ0)

- [Giant Bomb Forum - NieR: Automata - Be Honest With Me: Why Do You Love NieR: Automata?](https://www.giantbomb.com/nierautomata/3030-49998/forums/be-honest-with-me-why-do-you-love-nier-automata-sp-1816970/)

- [Quora - How Famous is NieR: Automata](https://www.quora.com/How-famous-is-NieR-Automata)

- [Steam Community - NieR:Automata - Curious Why This is So Popular](https://steamcommunity.com/app/524220/discussions/0/135512305396404908/)

- [The Verge - Nier: Automata’s Director Explains Why He Wants to “Continue to Fail”](https://www.theverge.com/2018/3/28/17173244/nier-automata-yoko-taro-interview-gdc-2018)

- [Waypoint - Does the Designer Behind “NieR: Automata” Believe in God?](https://waypoint.vice.com/en_us/article/xw8xzd/does-the-designer-behind-nier-automata-believe-in-god)

- [YouTube - NieR Automata Analysis - Clemps (Part 1)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SuShB-g2eog)

- [YouTube - NieR Automata Analysis - Clemps (Part 2)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_q4sbh4ETMA)

- [YouTube - NieR Automata Analysis - Clemps (Part 3)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lS6d5A-gPVs)

- [YouTube - NieR Automata Review - Clemps](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SYabipradE)

### Music / Sound

- ["Android Aware: Dawn of Sentience"](http://teknoaxe.com/Link_Code_3.php?q=1198) by TeknoAXE used under [CC BY 4.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/)

- All other music and sound for this week's episode were provided by Nick Green!

### Artwork

- ["Glasses"](https://thenounproject.com/term/glasses/132894) by [Anton Anuchin](https://thenounproject.com/antonwebium) used under [CC BY 3.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/us/)

- ["Emil Face"](https://raiduk.deviantart.com/art/HoneyMiel-Honeycomb-Additionnal-Icons-684241948) by [raiduk](https://raiduk.deviantart.com/) used under [CC BY 3.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/us/)

What if you were listening to the latest episode in Dolby Surround 11.1 (that's right, this one goes to 11.1)!? Well, probably nothing, but we're sure someone out there would care. This week, we're talking about ~~the highest~~ super high definition displays, and unearthing why folks care so much about 4k resolution!

All this in 20 minutes or less!

**Sources**

- Opening music, ["Diggin' til the Very End"](http://music.djcutman.com/album/volume-iv) by Dj CUTMAN used under [CC BY-NC-SA](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/3.0/)

- Ending music, ["Bounty Hunter"](http://music.djcutman.com/album/volume-iv) by Dj CUTMAN used under [CC BY-NC-SA](https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/3.0/)

[// Pregenerate link to episode ahead of time: - clicktotweet.com- sharelinkgenerator.com ]: #

This week's episode will be interrupted by a number of spectacular, linear tracking shots, all filmed with a delightful sepia-esque duotone filter. Oh, and Bill Murray will be there... probably? That's right, we're talking about the works of Wes Anderson (and fans of his work)!

Expecting LEGO? There was a bit of a scheduling mixup. Try again later.

Next week, we have special guest, SMZeldaRules to talk about the complex and fascinating world of the _Nier_ games!

## Episode outline

### Fandom Facts

**History and Origins:**

Wes Anderson is an American film director, producer, screen writer and actor known for his peculiar visual and narrative style. His films and himself have been nominated for (and have won) many different awards. He has directed 9 feature length films since 1996.

> Anderson is regarded by many as a modern-day example of the auteur. He has received consistent praise from critics for his work, and three of his films—The Royal Tenenbaums, Moonrise Kingdom, and The Grand Budapest Hotel—appeared in BBC's 2016 poll of the greatest films since 2000.

>

> — [Wikipedia - Wes Anderson](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wes_Anderson)

**Search Data:**

Interest in Wes Anderson is very spiky, but overall [interest in him has been lifted since about January 2012](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F02ld6x). Most notable spikes include October 2007 (_The Darjeeling Limited_), June 2012 (_Moonrise Kingdom_), March 2014 (_The Grand Budapest Hotel_), February 2015 (BAFTA Award for Best Original Screenplay, _Grand Budapest Hotel_), and April 2018 (_Isle of Dogs_).

Top countries, by search volume: United States, Canada, New Zealand, Ireland, Australia, United Kingdom, Sweden, Italy, Norway, Singapore.

**Size of Fandom:**

Based on a few data points:

- There are over 12 000 subscribers on [r/wesanderson](https://www.reddit.com/r/wesanderson/)

- Bottle Rocket has [over 60 000 ratings on IMDb](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0115734/?ref_=nm_flmg_dr_16)

- There are over 220 000 subscribers on [r/AccidentalWesAnderson](https://www.reddit.com/r/AccidentalWesAnderson/)

- Moonrise Kingdom has [over 270 000 ratings on IMDb](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1748122/?ref_=nm_flmg_wr_7)

It's safe to put the number of fans somewhere in _the low hundreds of thousands_

**Fan Demographics:**

We did manage to get some demographic information... in a bit of a roundabout way. [YouGov has a page for Wes Anderson](https://yougov.co.uk/opi/browse/Wes_Anderson), and by reading some of the source code and information on the page, we can get a very rough idea compared to 'competitors':

- _Age:_ A lot younger than competitors

- _Gender:_ A lot more female than competitors

- _Politics:_ A lot more left leaning than competitors

If we look at a bit more general data like the ratings data from IMDb for Moonrise Kingdom, we can get a loose idea of age and gender (admittedly, skewed by general cinema-goers):

- _Gender:_ Predominantly male (63%)

- _Age:_ Largest group is aged 30-44 (37%) followed by 18-29 (35%)

### [Last Episode's](http://fanthropological.com/e/chiptune-sample-mario-brothersm4a/) Famous Last Words

Whoops! Due to a scheduling conflicts, last week's famous last words about Lego don't apply to this week's episode... on Wes Anderson.

### The Verdict

**G is in.** Is his favourite director.

**T is out.** Might watch some of the other movies.

**Z is in.** Not a big a fan as G... not quite.

### This week's spotlight

Not so much a spotlight as an interesting (if ill-thought out) homage to Wes Anderson films.

**[Sammy the Explorer](https://www.vox.com/xpress/2014/12/9/7356099/wes-anderson-charity-video)**

> Charities HurleyH20 and SurfAid Sumba decided to promote their clean-water charity project with a video shot in the style of filmmaker Wes Anderson. The video is narrated by a cheerful young Indonesian boy who discovers, on his home island's beach, some white male surfers, whom he watches in amazement until the surfers come to his village to install clean drinking water.

>

> — [Vox - A charity made a video about a brown child being entranced by magical white men. Um?](https://www.vox.com/xpress/2014/12/9/7356099/wes-anderson-charity-video)

[// Plugs go here ]: #

### Famous Last Words

This week's famous last words around *next week's* fandom, *Nier*!

**Z**

The popularity of Nier is as small as it is because it came out after Sony had disrupted the Nintendo-based gaming monoculture.

**T**

How did the series go from Dragons (Drakengard) to Robots (Nier)?

**G**

Why are there more albums than games?

## Where can you find us online?

We are everywhere! Most notably though, we like to hang out in a few places on social media:

- If you want to be part of our podcast (or just want to check us out), we record our podcast LIVE on [twitch.tv](http://twitch.tv/thenickscast) every Monday at 20:00 Eastern Time!

- For all the latest updates, check us out on [Facebook](https://facebook.com/thenickscast) or [Twitter](https://twitter.com/thenickscast)

- To see the latest hijinx from our conventions or even our daily lives and adventures, check us out on [Instagram](https://instagram.com/thenickscast)

- For our latest convention updates, *Let's Plays*, and other in-real-life video, [check out our YouTube channel](http://youtube.com/thenickscast)

- We're also on [iTunes](https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/fanthropological/id1163621210), and [Google Play](https://play.google.com/music/m/Icmngxz7yhaoivdvivvf6q6c2pu?t=Fanthropological), and would love it if you could leave a review and rating!

- if you want to reach us, and for some reason none of those work for you, try [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected])

- You can check out [our website](http://thenickscast.com); that will mostly bring you back to this stuff.

- Everything is `thenickscast`, so if you can't find us, go on your social network and search for that!

## What is "Fanthropological"?

How did you read this far without asking this question?!

Fanthropological is an anthropological (ish) podcast where we bring the fan's-eye view to you! Each week, we take a look at a different fandom, dig up interesting background, trivia, and history, and try to get to why it is that people are a fan. We also try to highlight good causes related to that fandom, and find interesting things that fans have created to share those to the world. Each episode is about an hour. Ish.

## Who is "The Nickscast"?

*We* are the Nickscast! Three products of late-80s / early-90s pop culture who love exploring fandom and everything geek ... who also happen to have been best buddies since high school, and all happen to be named Nick. Yes, we are super creative (dare we say, the _most_ creative).

*Ahem*

We are Nick Green, Nick Terwoord, and Nick Zacharewicz: We started the Nickscast as a labour of love, and as a place to entertain and to discuss our love of fans and fandom, and all that is shiny and interesting in that realm. It's what lead us to start our first podcast, our satellite podcasts, Fanthropological, and so much more.

We want to help others learn more about different fandoms, and to create empathy with other fans: We dream of a world where other fans aren't "those Weird-o's", but just folks with different tastes. A world where fandom is full of discourse and analysis, and there are plenty of tools and resources to help. Fans building communities to do good in the world. *Because everyone's a fan.*

## Credits

### Sources

- [Wikipedia - Wes Anderson](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wes_Anderson)

- [Google Trends - Wes Anderson](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F02ld6x)

- [IMDb - Moonrise Kingdom](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1748122/?ref_=nm_flmg_wr_7)

- [IMDb - Bottle Rocket](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0115734/?ref_=nm_flmg_dr_16)

- [YouGov - Wes Anderson](https://yougov.co.uk/opi/browse/Wes_Anderson)

- [Vox - A charity made a video about a brown child being entranced by magical white men. Um?](https://www.vox.com/xpress/2014/12/9/7356099/wes-anderson-charity-video)

- [r/unpopuaropinion - I think Wes Anderson's movies are extremely overrated](https://www.reddit.com/r/unpopularopinion/comments/5uofuj/i_think_wes_andersons_movies_are_extremely/)

- [Betty - What’s the Big Deal with Wes Anderson Movies Anyway? Here’s What You Need to Know…](https://www.betty.me/style/wes-anderson-movies/)

- [Catholic Answers Forums - Why Do People Like Wes Anderson and His Films?](https://forums.catholic.com/t/why-do-people-like-wes-anderson-and-his-films/326755/6)

- [Eater - Wes Anderson’s Greatest Meals](https://www.eater.com/2018/3/22/17142016/wes-anderson-best-food-scenes-grand-budapest-hotel-rushmore)

- [Fondazione Prada - Bar Luce](http://www.fondazioneprada.org/barluce-en/?lang=en)

- [Indie Wire - Wes Anderson’s Style: Watch 10 Iconic Movies That Influenced Him](http://www.indiewire.com/2017/04/wes-anderson-style-orson-welles-francois-truffaut-1201809039/)

- [Mic - The Science Behind Why We Love Wes Anderson Movies](https://mic.com/articles/85591/the-science-behind-why-we-love-wes-anderson-movies#.pTk0HQWxl)

- [Quora - Who Are Wes Anderson’s Biggest Influences?](https://www.quora.com/Who-are-Wes-Andersons-biggest-influences)

- [Quora - Why Are Wes Anderson Films Supposedly Brilliant](https://www.quora.com/Why-are-Wes-Anderson-films-supposedly-brilliant)

- [Quora - Why are Wes Anderson's Movies so Important and so Admired?](https://www.quora.com/Why-are-Wes-Andersons-movies-so-important-and-so-admired)

- [Quora - Why Does Wes Anderson Frequently Make Movies about Rich People and their Strange Peculiarities?](https://www.quora.com/Why-does-Wes-Anderson-frequently-make-movies-about-rich-people-and-their-strange-peculiarities)

- [r/movies - People Who Like Wes Anderson: Why Do You Like Wes Anderson?](https://www.reddit.com/r/movies/comments/15ucs2/people_who_like_wes_anderson_why_do_you_like_wes/)

- [The Cinephiliac - Why I Hate Wes Anderson](https://thecinephiliac.com/2011/05/10/why-i-hate-wes-anderson/)

- [YouTube - You Know It’s Wes Anderson If...](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqfRmceGwUs)

### Music / Sound

- ["Black Widow"](http://teknoaxe.com/Link_Code_4.php?q=1232&Genre=Retro) by TeknoAXE used under [CC BY 4.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/)

- All other music and sound for this week's episode were provided by Nick Green!

### Artwork

- ["Glasses"](https://thenounproject.com/term/glasses/132894) by [Anton Anuchin](https://thenounproject.com/antonwebium) used under [CC BY 3.0](http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/us/)