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We have a special treat for you today. Hall of Fame coach Joe Vigil joins us to talk training. If you enjoy the show we would appreciate you heading over to iTunes and taking a minute to rate and review our podcast. Those ratings are important when people are searching for podcast. Coach Vigil won 26 national titles in 33 years at Adams State and has coached several Olympians including Deena Kastor and Brenda Martinez. We discuss everything from VO2 Max and testing, what he learned from watching runners at Leadville to periodization.
Tell us how you got started in the running community and into coaching.
When you took over Adams State you won 26 national titles in 33 years. Adams state when you took over was not exactly a powerhouse so you had to build runners from the ground up. What do you think you were doing differently that other programs were not doing?
Thirst for learning what made you different?
In the book Born to Run you make an appearance. You are mentioned as a coach who thinks differently because you were showing up at 100-mile races to learn from ultra runners when other coaches were not. So what exactly did you learn from watching the athletes at the Leadville 100?
You mentioned running happy, is that something you can teach or is it something you have or not?
One thing you talk about is testing. Having a PhD. in exercise physiology, I know that testing is big for you. Many of our listeners are your are group runners you will see on the weekend in a local 5 or 10k. And we also have a lot of high school coaches. So for them, testing of VO2 or max lactate may not be something they can easily do. What recommendations would you have for them as far as testing and what they should get tested?
VO2 Max… You do the field test and find out what it is, where should they go from there to improve?
I have read that you said that our runners don't run hard enough and long enough. Other coaches I have talked to said the problem with American runners is we run too hard. So what is your current position on this?
In 2001 yourself and Bob Larsen brought Deena Kastor and Meb Keflezighi to Mammoth Lakes to start the Mammoth Track Club, which was one of the most influential post-collegiate clubs in the country. How did that come about with Larsen?
These clubs are a lot more popular now with many new ones popping up and having success. What do you think the future of these clubs are and how have they changed over the last 15 years.
You have had Olympians such as Deena and Meb, and this year you had more mid-distance runners like Brenda and Borris in the Olympics. Obviously, the training for the marathon and 800/1500 are completely different. What is the greatest coaching challenge in working with athletes in such different disciplines?
What about strength work, what type of strength work did you do with your kids at Adam's State and how would it differs from what you do with a marathon runner?
Question from a listener: In your book, you have graphs in the marathon training section for weekly mileage. Your mileage chart looks very much like a roller coaster fluctuating from 60 to 80 to 70 to 100 to 80 to 120… Many training plans are much more steady in their mileage, do you still method or has it changed since you last published the book?
You have been around the running scene for several decades now. When it comes to training and performance, what is something that you think has changed your coaching style the most in the last decade?
Work harder, what does a week look like for a 5k runner
Book road to the top is hard to find, but I understand they can still be had through you, can you tell our listeners how to get a copy of one.
Running Summit Dec 17-18th in Dallas. Can you tell us about the event and What topics will you be discussing?
Tapering is one of the questions I get asked most about. When you were coaching at Adams state, did you find any differences in tapering with your male and female teams?
What advice would you have on tapering for our 5k listeners out there?
At the end of the last season, I asked the kids on my team what their favorite workout of the season is. And the majority of them said their favorite was the acceleration workout from 100 to 200. Can you walk the listeners through how it works, when it should be used and why?
When did you add in that workout to the season?
Resources Method of Belke Field Test for VO2
Road to the Top by Joe Vigil mailing address 292 N Ceder Crest Dr Green Valley AZ 85614
Running Summit
Tapering for endurance athletes by Joe Vigil
This week we have something different for you. This week is less about training and more about talking about one of the better running blogs out there, Salty Running. We will talk to Laura Pizmoht about her running career, why she started salty running and what is an important issue in women's running that should be covered and talked about more. We hope that you enjoy this episode. Feel free to tweet us at Final Surge and let us know what you think and as always, don't forget to rate us on iTunes.
I want to spend some time talking about your site Salty Runner and what you do there, but let's start off getting to know you a little, can you tell is how you got your start in running?
So why did you start it, what was your inspiration?
Who is your avatar? For those who may know what that means, when you start a new blog you are supposed to think about your avatar, that person who you are writing for. What does your avatar look like?
What is one thing that you have learned about yourself or your running since you started the site?
How many writers do you currently have?
The writers all have unique names like cayenne, salty, ginger, where did those names come from?
Your writers have weekly running logs, how do those play?
You are constantly updating, many times there are a couple posts a day. How much time are you actually putting into the site?
You have a variety of posts on many topics, what has been the most popular post? How to poop and pee when there is nowhere to go. Why average runners should care about elites.
Are these races reaching out to you to come cover them?
Here is how great your site is. I have been reading it often for about a year now. It wasn't until I started getting ready for this interview that I noticed it was all about women's running issues. So while you are writing for women, it is a site that most men listening to this podcast should have in their reader list.
What is a women's issue in running that you think more non-elite runners need to be aware of?
Runners World article about women harassed during runs.
For a long time, our sport was very male dominant. And at least in the US, you would turn on the TV and watch a race and it seemed they covered the men's races more than the women. It seems to me over the last couple of years that the US women distance runners are starting to get a little more of that well-earned recognition they deserve. Are you seeing that?
What can we look forward to on your site, anything coming up in the near future?
[email protected] SaltyOne
Rapid Fire... 5 questions in under 1 minute Favorite running book? - The Silance of Great Distance Current trainers you are wearing? - Brooks Ravenna Favorite race? - Johnnycake Jog Favorite recovery meal or recovery drink? - Whatever I can get Your favorite piece of running equipment that is not your shoes? - Running Stroller
Welcome to episode 22 of the final surge podcast where today we talk to Alex Hutchinson, the sweat science writer for Runners World and a go-to resource for the latest in exercise science. We will talk about everything from hydration, training methods. running cadence and beet farms. Please take a minute when you are done and rate us on iTunes.
Let's start out by talking about you, how did you get your start in running and how did it lead you to where you are today.
You did a couple of columns this year on running cadence. We have all heard you want to be at 180 steps per minute, but as you pointed out steps per changes with speed. So for a mid-pack runner who is not elite, is cadence something they should even look at?
Is there anything showing if you do intentionally change your running form it could lead to other injuries, or is there a way that is recommended to work on the change?
Along with cadence is foot placement. Many say land under your body, but I think that video has shown that under your body really is closer to about a foot out in front for professionals. What is the scientific evidence on where your foot should land and how it should land?
Is there anything that can or should be done to change this for age group runners who are not elite runners to help reduce injuries or does actually changing it cause more injuries that not.
What is the latest research show with training? How much research have you read about effective ways to trains? Such as the 80/20 rule or training the extremes more often?
Most coaches have seen a 800-1600 even 5k runners college runner hit a plateau for a while in their career. How much research have you seen about hitting plateaus and what type of activities endurance athletes need to do to break through.
One of your studies you highlighted a while back I read was interesting about strength training. I believe it showed that running economy was definitely enhanced by strength training if it was done consistently. Can you talk about what types of strength training exercises may have the best results for endurance athletes?
Your book cardio or weights, can you tell us why you wrote the book and what endurance athletes could get out of it?
With hydration, is the ere any real science on how much someone should drink during the day, not talking about during a marathon or something, but during the course of a normal day with training?
You mentioned beets in your last answer. You talk about beets and beet juice a lot. Are you an investor in a beet farm? What are the real benefits of beets?
Another topic you have addressed is the 2 hour marathon. We have not seen a lot of progress in the last two years here. On the women's side the world record is 2:15:25 by Paula Radcliffe, but we have only seen 3 women go under 2:21 in 2016, and none break 2:19:40. So what is more likely to happen first a man breaking 2 or a women breaking 2:15?
If you could give one piece of advice to college or high school coaches of distance runners, one thing they may really want to change or look at differently than they may currently be doing, what would it be?
Rapid Fire... 5 questions in under 1 minute Favorite running book? - Once a Runner Current trainers you are wearing? - New Balance 1400 Favorite race? - Bum Run 5k Favorite recovery meal or recovery drink? - Pasta Your favorite piece of running equipment that is not your shoes? - Watch, non-gps
Sweat Science blog AlexHutchingson.net On Twitter Book Cardio or Weights
Episode 21 of Final Surge Podcast with our guest Coach and Dr Richard Hansen of the Roots Running Project. Richie is a chiropractor specializing in sports medicine and more specifically runners, and is a coach of an up and comping post collegiate team who's runners include The Noah Droddy. I think you are going to really enjoy this. We start out talking about his coaching experiences, Noah and then turn to injuries, strength videos and pool walking. If you enjoy this episode please take a moment to rate us on iTunes and send a thank you tweet to Dr Hansen. Now onto the show.
I want to break this up into a couple of parts first talking about your coaching and post collegiate groups and then talking about your other life as a highly respected chiropractor specializing in running related injuries.
First let's' find out how you got here. Can you tell us about how you got your start in running early on?
Was it your goal when you moved to Boulder to get into coaching?
We have seen a resurgence of American distance runners over the last decade. How much do you see the explosion of post collegiate running groups playing a part in that.
When someone is thinking about joining post collegiate group, there are two groups first is the elite runners the first team all Americans in cross and then there are the larger group of very good college runners, but not elite, who want to see how much they can continue to improve. For that second group who should consider continuing on training on their own vs. looking for a group like yours?
Probably your best known runner is Noah Droddy. Of course he is known as that guy with the long hair and mustache in the 10k at the Olympic trials who became an internet sensation but really the thing even more impressive than his hair, I understand he went from a 14:30 5k runner to running 14:10 splits in the 10k. What did you guys do different to see that dramatic improvement?
You know you have made an impact when people are dressing up as you for halloween as we saw on Twitter. Is he as big of a character in real life as he comes across?
Hows his racing been going since the Trials?
Let's switch gears a little…
Now you have coached everything from high school to olympic trials qualifiers, and your primary profession is as a chiropractor at high altitude spine and sports. So let's get into injuries. I want to break this down into segments. Let's start with high school runners. We have a lot of high school coaches who listen to this. In high school, as you know from your coaching days, a team usually has everything from a new runner who does other sports but not track to those who has never run before to those going for state. What are the most common injuries and causes you see high school boys and girls.
With shin splints you will often have a coach send the athlete into the school trainer and the trainer will say ice and roll it out a little. They are obviously treating the symptoms not the cause. What is the most common causes?
When you coached high school athletes, were there any extensive warm up and cool down routines and did you design them around injury prevention?
You showed me a tape job last summer for relieving shin splints for runners. Do you have a video online anywhere so others can see it?
Now this runner, they go off to college, and likely have a more extensive strength routine there than they did in high school. When you get a runner out of college joining your club what are you seeing as deficiencies that are leading to injuries?
There are a lot of videos online and on youtube. are there any hip/strength routines that are maybe online that you recommend? (See resources below)
When one of my runners gets an injury I always send them to two local guys here who I know, know runners. Sometimes they don't take my advice and will go see a Physical therapist who often times honestly don't really help them much. So the question is When someone in our audience, who doesn't live in Boulder has an injury they want checked out, tell us how they can go about finding a someone who should be able to help get them back running.
One thing you got me doing was pool walking after a run. Can you talk about why you are such a fan?
Now someone is out with a running group for a long run, gets back to the car has to drive home for 20 to 25 minutes, and will often stop for a coffee on the way home… is that still a good thing for them to get into the pool 30-40 minutes later after they are done their run?
If someone wanted to reach out to you, you have your roots running podcast they can listen to… how else can they reach you?
Rapid Fire... 5 questions in under 1 minute Favorite running book? - Once a runner and Road to the Top Current trainers you are wearing? - Brooks Launch and Nike Lunar 3 Favorite race? - Half marathon and Payton Jordan Track Festival Favorite recovery meal or recovery drink? - Italian Soda and Fish Tacos Your favorite piece of running equipment that is not your shoes? - Pool or compression sleeves
Resources in this episode Richard Hansen on Core Jay Johnson Videos Gray Cook Mike Young Jim Radcliffe hip mobility
Hansen Links: Roots Running Sessions Podcast Roots Running site Roots Running Twitter Dr Hansen Twitter Dr Hansen High Altitude Clinic
Welcome to episode 20 of the final surge podcast with world record holder Cal Neff. Cal is a Dad, a runner and a coach who this year set the world record for the half-marathon and marathon while pushing a stroller. We talk about what happens on those runs and how he adjusts his training. As we reach episode 20 the Final Surge team would like to thank you. We are over 10,000 downloads and growing. Please take a moment to rate us on iTunes, and send us a message on Twitter or Facebook and let us know what you like most about the show and what you would like to see changed. Now on to our interview with Cal.
So how did you get started running when you were young?
In early February of 2016 you won the Katy Half Marathon in 1:11:27, while pushing a stroller and setting the new Guinness Book of world records for a half marathon. How dod you get started pushing a stroller while running?
How old are your daughters that you push?
So when you set the record in the Katy half marathon what made you think about going for the record?
I was watching some of the video you did from the Katy half, it looked like you were streaming over periscope?
Do you often run with the cameras/phone?
Everyone listening to this with kids has been in that situation where you are stuck in traffic and the baby is in back in the car seat screaming. I know it can wear on you after a while. I noticed at one point with about 5k to go Holly started getting a little fussy… so how do you balance going for a record and hearing your baby cry?
How is running with stroller different, do you need to adjust form or anything?
How about training, do you train any different and how often do you run with a stroller during the week?
Any advice on stroller shopping what to look for?
You just set the world record for marathon pushing a stroller too, can you tell us about that race?
So your daughter is 4-years old now, the age you start running. Is she doing some running now too?
So you have a professional career, you are a husband, a dad, a coach, how do you find the time to do the training needed to run?
So you are coaching now too correct?
What type of athletes are you coaching?
How are you using Final Surge in your coaching?
A couple of questions from Twitter:
With all the miles you log, what supplements do you use for quick recovery?
I would think there is probably some extra strain on the body, What are some of the strength exercises you do for you hips and core to keep them lose to prevent injury
How many miles does he run every month in your training?
Every runner has their self-talk? What about kid talk, what good kid talk stories do you have?
Rapid Fire... 5 questions in under 1 minute Favorite running book? - Lore of Running Current trainers you are wearing? - Altra Torin 2.5 Favorite race? - Toronto Marathon Favorite recovery meal or recovery drink? - Chocolate Milk Your favorite piece of running equipment that is not your shoes? - Stroller Thule Glide.
@calneff Neff.run website
Dathan Ritzenhein is one of the most successful American distance runners of all time with three Olympic appearances. Today we get to talk to Dathan about his recent great run against Mo Farah at the Great North 1/2, his upcoming NYC Marathon appearance and how he has prepared for it. We talk training, nutrition, and fat burning as well as what he is doing differently to stay healthy.
Dathan, thank for joining us today, can you tell our listeners how you got started in running when you were a kid?
You have been training for the NYC Marathon and recently ran the Great North 1/2 Marathon. You ran a 60:12, just 12 seconds off your PR and finishing a very strong second to Mo Farah. It sounds like you are running the best you have in 6-7 years and you must be healthy, how is your training going for NYC?
Can you give us an example of what the week looks like for you leading up to a marathon?
We have a great field coming up for the NYC marathon, they are offering $100,000 in American only price money. How much does that American only price money play in getting such a strong field?
Is there one person, besides yourself obviously that American running fans should really be watching out for?
Some people have been able to excel while being self-coached, while others never were able to find a great long-term groove. How is the self-coaching going for you?
How has your training changed since you left Oregon and started training on your own again?
Do you think less high-end speed stuff has helped you stay healthier?
You are dong some coaching yourself now?
You have literally had some of the best coaches int he world From Wetmore to Brad Hudson and then Salazar. What did you learn from them that you use in your coaching now?
Some questions we got from Twitter: For a podium finish you need a great finish. What did you do differently with the Great North race to ensure a great finish.
Do you do any specific marathon training to work on being more efficient burning fat?
Not that you are old, but as you get older you need to focus more on the process and nutrition than a college kid does. What changes have you made to your nutrition over the years?
Over the years as you run into injuries, what have you done to stay in shape while injured?
How often are you in the gym during the week?
Are we going to see you on track again or do you plan on focusing on the roads from here on out?
Any predictions for NYC?
How about on the women's side of NYC. Molly, Kim and Neely representing America, how do you think they are going to do?
Rapid Fire... 5 questions in under 1 minute
Favorite running book? - Running with the Buffalos Current trainers you are wearing? - Nike Vomero Favorite race? - Marathon Favorite recovery meal or recovery drink? - Burger Your favorite piece of running equipment that is not your shoes? - R-3 Roller from Roll Recovery
Dathan on Twitter
Welcome to Episode 18 of the Final Surge Podcast. Our guest today is Steve Magness. Steve is a former high school prodigy, the author of the well respected book Science of Running and a coach at the University of Houston and to several professional runners. We talk about everything from training the extremes, race strategy, breaking through plateaus, tapering and psychology or racing.
Most of our listeners probably know who you are, but let's give any who may not know your background. Can you tell us about how you got started running?
You made that huge jump your senior year can you tell us about that and what changes you made to have that breakthrough?
What was your training like your first three years of high school?
Your book the Science of Running is one of those books that I think every coach, no matter how experienced should have on their books shelf. But I understand you are working on a new book, what can we expect from that one.
You took over coaching at your alma mater University of Houston a few years ago. As a college coach, who is getting in high school runners, what are you noticing about the high school athletes you get as far as their training and what they may be lacking?
You have a kid who has plateaued, say a 4:30 miler. When he hits a level where he is not improving any longer, this is when you need to change a stress?
When you have a group of 30-50 kids sometimes that balance is hard. What advice would you have for coaches with larger programs on what they should be looking for in each runner to see if they training needs to be changed up for some kids.
There is a debate among some in the high school distance ranks. The old volume vs intensity. One argument is they are young so work on their speed development and the other camp is they should be working on their aerobic capacity and leave the speed for the next level. Of course, the truth as always is probably somewhere in the middle. But I think both camps work on both, the intensity camp may be more of a 35 mile a week program with 2-3 days of really intense work while the volume camp may be more 50-55 miles a week with a lot more tempo work, but what advice would you have for high school runners and coaches?
Let's look at a week for a high school kid, how would you structure a week of workouts?
This is another question from a high school coach. Actually, the same question came in from two coaches. He is getting ready to start prepping for his qualifying and state meet. They would like to know what percentage of volume do you cut back. When do you start that? When does you have your last, hardest workout of the season?
You have a podcast Magness and Marcus, which as a coach is my favorite podcast because there is some talk about training, but a lot of talk about actually coaching. I'm curious, how much time do you guys spend talking coaching outside that podcast?
When you are working with your mid pack cross country runners, you are not talking to them about strategies to win a race, so what coaching advice are you giving them on a race plan, what does that conversation look like?
You have been coaching for a few years now at a very high level. If you could go back and give advice to yourself when you started coaching high school, what advice would you give a younger Steve?
Recommended Reads from Steve
One of your athletes, and one of our favorite Final Surge runners Neely Spence Gracey is going to be running the NYC marathon here shortly, how is her training looking? Episode 9 LINK
A question from twitter, we have a listener who has been putting in great training over the last year with great training runs. But on race day they are having sub-par performances in the 10k-Marathon races. Occasionally will have a good race so their fitness level is there, they are just not racing well. I know it could be a lot of things, but can you give this runner some general areas to look into to racing better?
Another question from twitter, when you are looking at recruits, what are you looking for in an athlete?
scienceofrunning.com/recommended-reads Favorite running book? - Once a runner Current trainers you are wearing? - Asics Favorite race? - 1/2 Marathon Favorite recovery meal or recovery drink? - Chocolate Milk Your favorite piece of running equipment that is not your shoes? - Timex non-GPS watch
Steve's website Steve on Twitter
How did you get your start in running?
What was the main driving force that got you into running as much as you have?
How long was it before you did your first ultra marathon race?
How did you make the transition into charging the first person from giving advice for free?
I watched a video of yours and you made an interesting observation. New tennis players, new golfers etc will often hire a coach to learn good habits early, but new runners tend to now hire coaches.
Are all your clients online?
What type of clients do you take on, what does a typical client of yours look like, how long have they been running, what happened to make them want to look for a coach?
You are doing some interesting stuff online, you are very active, is that where you are doing all your marketing?
What can a client expect and what type of guidance do you provide for strength work?
How often do you have your athletes run?
With newer runners of course, we always face injuries, what are the most common injuries you see with your runners?
You mentioned you use Final Surge. how do you use Final Surge in your coaching
Rapid Fire... 5 questions in under 1 minute Favorite running book? - Current trainers you are wearing? - Favorite race? - Favorite recovery meal or recovery drink? - Your favorite piece of running equipment that is not your shoes? -
KyleKranz.com Kyle on Twitter Kyle on Youtube
We have a great interview for you today. Imagine this story, someone who never ran until after college, ran their first race, a marathon in 4 hours and 37 minutes, then just six years later they run an Olympic qualifier and are headed to Rio to run in the Olympics. This is not a hollywood movie script, this is the story of Ariana Holborn. Now on to the show.
Had a chance to meet you and hear your story can you tell us about your long high school running career?
You just ran in the Rio Olympics, so if you did not run in high school, how did you get your start?
So your very first race ever was a marathon? Which one?
So what did your running career look like after that first marathon, you obviously caught the bug.
2008 you run your first race and run a 4:37 marathon, then one year later you run a BQ? What was your training like?
You went from 0 to 70 miles in a year, did you encounter any injuries?
In 2010 you join John Reich's team, where did you go from there?
Then in 2014 at US Marathon Championships you were 4th?
How did your training change as you were getting ready to run an Olympic qualifier?
What type of mileage are you doing when you prepare for a marathon?
Coming into 2016 what was your thought process when deciding to run for Latvia for the Olympics?
For their marathon team do they select or do trials?
So you headed to Rio for your first Olympics, what was it like walking in the opening ceremonies?
How did the race in Rio go for you?
How long did you end up staying in Rio and did you get a chance to see any other events?
So what was your training like the week down in Brazil?
Your team gives back a lot to the local running community. What advice would you have to young runners just starting out?
So what is next on the agenda for you?
Rapid Fire... 5 questions in under 1 minute Favorite running book? - Running within Current trainers you are wearing? - Brooks Ravena Favorite race? - Valmiera Marathon Favorite recovery meal or recovery drink? - Generation Ucan Chocolate Your favorite piece of running equipment that is not your shoes? - Garmin
Ariana's website
Sonoran Distance Project Team
Ariana on Twitter
Zach is an ultra marathon runner and a coach at Zach Bitter Running. Zach has held the 100 mile American record and the 12 hour work record. In this episode we talk about how a runner can make the jump to ultra distances and find out what it is like running on a track for over 400 laps.
How did you get your start in running, I am guessing your first run wasn't an ultra. So let's start with the really early days. Did you start running in high school, jr high, where does the story begin?
What was your high school career like, what type of 5k times were you doing
So let's start out talking about how someone can make the transition from someone who maybe is not an elite runner, but has a few 1/2's and a few marathons under their belt and wants to make that jump to an ultra. What advice would you have for a runner. Should they start with shorter races like a 50 miler before they jump to a 100 miler?
So if someone is running 40-50 miles a week what can they look up for a build up time and what type of volume do you think they need to get to before they toe a starting line?
You have someone looking to train and do their first 50-miler, what sort of long run do they need to do before you know they are ready to tackle that?
What does a week look like for this person trying to build up for the first time?
Now they are spending almost a full day on their feet running, they probably need to be eating and fueling different than they ever have before. What do you recommend as far as learning to fuel for an ultra?
Where do you follow on the scale, are you more of a Paleo low carb guy or more higher carbs?
You mentioned 150 mile week, is that kind of an average week for you?
To simulate the long runs many ultra runners will do two long runs on back to back days, is this something you implement?
If you have two long runs back to back how much time are you spending running on those two days?
So I am curious, when out running that long, do you listen to anything, music, audiobooks, podcast, anything like that?
So you got the 100 mile American record and 12 hour world record in my back yard running at the Desert Solstice. So just to give our listeners an idea, that is 402 laps on the track. I can imagine some thing like hydration, food, restrooms, medical needs all being right there are great, but at the same time 402 laps. What is that like and how do you enjoy it compared to hills?
What would you rather do, a trail or a track race?
Karl Meltzer is out there on the Appalachian Trail trying to break the record, would you ever have any interest in anything that long?
You have a package of training plans available on Final Surge, can you give listeners an idea of what is included in those plans?
Link to his training plans
How are you using Final Surge in your coaching?
We talk about the Strava and Garmin connect features.
Rapid Fire... 5 questions in under 1 minute Favorite running book? - Born to Run Current trainers you are wearing? - Altra One 2.5 Favorite race? - World 100k Favorite recovery meal or recovery drink? - Eggs and Bacon Your favorite piece of running equipment that is not your shoes? - Drymax ultra thin socks
how can they follow you online or reach you if they are interested in getting coaching info from you
Facebook Athlete Profile Twitter Instagram His website
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