Finding God in Our Pain

SUMMARY:

Annette’s 4-category spectrum

Dating red flags and protection

If you stay (Category 2 dynamics)

If you’re considering leaving (especially 3–4)

Biblical considerations for divorce

Healing and identity

Church and parenting insights

Programs and resources Annette mentioned

One thing to remember

PODCAST INTRO:

My guest Annette Chesney is a Christian coach, speaker, and seasoned recovery professional  who equips women healing from narcissistic abuse.

Narcissistic dynamics can be hard to spot because they often look like ordinary relationship friction at first. Many people struggle to tell the difference between someone who is simply hurting and occasionally hurtful, and someone who persistently harms others without accountability. 

One useful way to think about it is as a spectrum: not everyone with difficult traits is a narcissist, and not every narcissistic person behaves the same way. Understanding this range can help you decide what you’re seeing—and what to do next.

But before you think that keeps you in the dark….Annette has created a spectrum that consists of 4 categories or types of narcissists including 10 different characteristics. What she shares is very interesting and from my experience very accurate.  Annette’s work is done both one-on-one and in groups. She talks primarily from a women’s point of view with regard to narcissistic abuse but she did say men are subject to women narcs as well. 

Annette talks about common red flags and she says pay attention to patterns over time rather than isolated incidents; that wider view tells the truth.

Annette even shares about how she coaches women who choose to stay in a challenging relationship…she teaches  “management” strategies that focus less on changing the other person and more on stabilizing her client’s environment, protecting her energy, and minimizing chaos. A few of the examples she gave were learning how to reframe requests so they’re seen as mutually beneficial, limiting circular arguments, and building a strong support system outside the relationship. 

She even touches on the subject for when separation or divorce becomes necessary and minor children are involved. She alerted us to the fact that trauma symptoms, including anxiety and PTSD‑like responses, are not uncommon adding that qualified mental health support and targeted coaching can help you recover clarity and confidence.

Even with the reality of living with the effects of narcissistic abuse…the dismantling of who you are, loss of confidence, identity, goals, dreams etc. , Annette says recovery is possible. Many people find that healing involves unpacking earlier hurts, challenging false beliefs, rebuilding identity, and learning durable skills: boundaries, self‑care, emotional regulation, and discernment.  Getting connected with the right help will make all the difference and get you to what she calls…your Kingdom Zone of Impact where you’re living with identity and purpose in Christ. 

Her parting words were for the listener to remember two things that are worth holding onto: you didn’t cause someone else’s narcissistic pattern, and you can’t fix it for them. What you can do is prioritize safety, educate yourself/get informed, surround yourself with wise support, and invest in your own future. Whether you’re staying, preparing to leave, or rebuilding afterward, the next chapters can be healthier—with Christ those next chapters are filled with restoration and redemption, they can bring clarity, strength identity and purpose… and they’re yours to discover with the Lover of Your Soul, the One who never abuses you, never fails you, Jesus.

Live Loved and Thrive!

Connect With Annette:

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/annette-chesney/

SUMMARY:

-Faith roots: Grew up in a large Romanian Christian family (with Syrian Christian heritage); accepted Christ at 7; faith deepened after her aunt’s death from cancer.

-Calling to law: Loved advocacy and public speaking; passed the bar after intense study; landed her dream role as a federal prosecutor in San Francisco.

-Health crisis: Fell acutely ill in week two on the job with a rare, under-researched neurological vertigo disorder; tried ~30–150 therapies and ~38 medications (often worsened symptoms); bedridden for three years on a bedpan; ultimately resigned her post.

-Ongoing illness: Continues to experience constant spinning sensations; multiple tentative diagnoses, no definitive cure; learned to walk again despite worsening symptoms when upright.

-Spiritual wrestle: Initial confusion turned to seasons of bitterness and anger (more than depression); felt misunderstood by some believers when she sensed God calling her to accept ongoing suffering.

-Acceptance and surrender: Believes God spoke that she would not be fully healed on this side of eternity; fasting exposed idols of health, marriage, and career; moved toward surrender and trust.

-Meeting Matt: Church acquaintance (youth leader) who reached out during her bedridden years; he had suffered childhood cancer and was later diagnosed with terminal cancer; they formed a deep bond through shared suffering.

-Marriage and loss: Married despite her illness and his terminal diagnosis; experienced “joy in grief” through ministry and creativity; Matt died a year later; Lara testifies to God’s peace and preparation through the loss.

-Joy amid grief: Practiced finding “sprinkles of joy” (comedy clips, music, niece’s smile, devotionals); launched The Silverman Show (YouTube: comedy, music, theology); organized jazz fundraisers, including $13K raised for Haiti.

-Theology of suffering:

-Identity transformation: Early identity tied to achievement and “gold stars”; illness stripped these; learned identity in Christ, not performance; challenged by Matt’s loving rebukes about pride and usefulness.

-Honest struggles: Jealousy when others receive “basic blessings” (marriage, children, health); wrestled with God’s statement “I know what’s best for you”; learning to believe God’s wisdom without having micro-level reasons.

-Church’s role: Encourage sound theology of suffering, eternal perspective, and the call to “joy in grief”; avoid equating God’s love solely with earthly blessings.

-Memoir: Wrote her memoir from bed over eight months, capturing God’s “receipts” (journaled answers, provisions, and lessons); aims to comfort sufferers with biblical reasons for suffering and stories of God’s nearness.

-Hope redefined: Realistic hope is anchored in eternity (John 11:25); freedom from fear of death empowers purposeful living now.

-Key scriptures referenced:

-Core takeaway: God provides “streams in the desert.” Open your heart to receive and choose joy in the midst of grief; joy and sorrow can coexist, and God will redeem suffering—fully in eternity, and often with foretastes now.

PODCAST INTRO:

Lara spent years pursuing her dream of becoming a federal prosecutor—years of academic discipline, devoted goal setting, and passionate pursuit. After graduating from Stanford, she enters the grueling vetting and elimination process of 1000 hopeful lawyers with the goal of making it to the top 3. When she learns that she made it in the top 3 her dream becomes a reality…she is standing at the pinnacle of a major goal in her life. She was accepted as a federal prosecutor and begin the task of fully stepping into that role.

Until in her second week on the job, she fell violently ill with what would later be discovered as a rare, unresolved neurological condition that keeps her in a constant state of the world spinning around her. She endures that condition to this day…8 years now, 3 of which left her bedridden, on a bedpan, being cared for and nursed by her parents. Thirty-eight medications failed. Careers, plans, family timelines—all stripped away.

In her personal dark valley of multi layered deaths, her testimony is that not only does God meet her there, He has never left her.

True to being a trained lawyer, in her effort to make sense of her spinning, crumbling world she uses the Word/Bible to question God’s goodness and His fairness demanding that He explain Himself. She’s met with firm, steady, unwavering love that consistently engages her pain inviting her from striving to surrender.

Through Lara’s fasting, God exposed hidden idols—health, marriage, career—not to shame her, but to set her free. Because I think we all know that if we build our lives on things that will fade, change, transition, not to mention the fact that we have no guarantees on anything we risk losing ourselves into despair and ruin.

Then came an unlikely gift. As Lara lay in bed, a church acquaintance—Matt Silverman, a brilliant, joy-filled believer battling terminal cancer—began calling to pray and wrestle through theology with her. Friendship became love. They married, held jazz benefit concerts for Haiti, launched a small YouTube channel, and practiced “joy in grief” as a spiritual discipline. Exactly one year later, Matt went home to Jesus.

Lara’s testimony is not tidy. She speaks frankly about anger, bitterness, jealousy, and the ache of unanswered prayers. Yet she clings to promises many avoid: that suffering refines faith (1 Peter 1), forges intimacy with Christ, prepares us for eternity (2 Corinthians 4), and—even here—can be met with streams in the desert (Isaiah 43). She believes God will redeem every loss, whether in the here and now or in eternity—and that the doctrine of reward, often neglected, gives sturdy hope when the nights are long.

Her invitation is simple but not without surrender and therefor difficult:

Look for “sprinkles of joy” each day.

Refuse to waste your pain—serve others through it.

Live now with eternity in view. If you’re not afraid to die, you can truly live.

Sorrowful, yet always rejoicing. That’s Lara’s way through the wilderness—and a lifeline for anyone walking it today. In her memoir, Singing Through the Fire, she chronicles all of that’s happened, how God shows up, the challenges she’s put before Him and vice versa. What does it look like to struggle with God ? Lara provides examples, proof that He doesn’t leave even when our faith is weak and ungodly. He holds us up when our faith falters and He sustains us through the most devastating emotional, mental, physical, battles.

Let’s listen in and find a reason to hope again, to find joy and to be comforted in what can feel like the wilderness.

Live Loved and Thrive!

CONNECT WITH LARA:

BIO:

SUMMARY:

-Dating is harder today due to digital misrepresentation and added life complexities after 40 (widowhood, divorce, family-of-origin issues); real-life community is essential for discernment and support.

-Prioritize meeting and observing potential partners in Christian community and everyday life to see a 360-degree picture (church involvement, service, friendships, parenting).

-Four non-negotiables for compatibility: 1) a disciple of Jesus (vibrant, fruit-bearing faith), 2) adult readiness for marriage (responsibility, job, ownership), 3) humility and teachability, 4) generally aligned direction/calling.

-Avoid “project” dating and rescuer roles; don’t ignore red flags—marry a whole person as you bring your whole self, with ownership and healing underway.

-Therapy can be valuable, but vet carefully; seek biblically grounded counseling and community oversight (e.g., Focus on the Family’s vetted counselor network).

-Lisa’s book, The Dating Manifesto, urges intentional, biblically honoring dating, debunks rom-com myths, and equips singles to live with purpose and hope while navigating grief and unmet expectations.

-Churches often center on families; singles can be part of the solution by serving, leading, and creating community rather than criticizing from the sidelines.

-Treat early dates as exploratory conversations (not instant marital auditions); ask your own questions, keep emotional perspective, and ensure you can remain in community, in a healthy way, if it doesn’t work out.

-Discuss difficult topics (past relationships, addictions, pornography) as the relationship progresses; look for transparency, accountability, and community verification—humble, teachable responses are key.

-Identity in Christ anchors dating and marriage; sexual integrity matters (avoid premarital sex and cohabitation), trust God’s timing, and “wait well” by abiding in Christ, engaging community, and pursuing purpose with open hands.

PODCAST INTRO:

Our conversation is based on a biblical viewpoint of dating. I know many think it too strict but if we’re honest, God’s ways always bring life, peace, joy, protection and that’s a pretty good return on your investment.

Lisa lays out some clear boundaries on dating and even sharing how to reflect on our own personal wholeness (meaning in what mental/emotional condition are we showing up, which can also help us know if we’re even ready to be dating). She talks about how to find a mate who is healthy themselves and what does healthy even mean. Her point being, if you’re dating after 40 then there’s been a lot of life that has happened. That’s a reality that we must fold into the process and so how can we discern between healthy, a hot mess, a fixer upper?

I don’t know about you but at my age the thought of a fixer upper is not appealing but Lisa takes the reality of how life takes it toll on us and she breaks down on exactly how to tell if this is someone who has taken responsibility and is moving forward, vs stagnate or a straight up red flag.

Oh and then there’s the challenges of digital dating. That seems to raise the bar on deception but in all fairness I’ve had friends who have used digital dating and they had good experiences. So don’t be dismayed, Lisa says there’s some good news. You don’t need perfect conditions to move forward, you need community, clarity, and courage. And that’s what Lisa delivers in this conversation.

Real quick, Here are 2 of her dating suggestions that I think are solid:

Start with real community

One of the safer places is to meet someone in an environment where you spend time. Do you have a hobby, do you volunteer, where do you go to church & do you participate/serve at church? Ideally, you’re looking for like minded people and they’re going to be in the same places you are. Lisa says Community is the safest place to meet people and the wisest place to test new relationships. I thought that smart because you have an environment where people know the both of you.

Date with purpose—but keep it simple

I personally feel that dating is for marriage so I think that would put a lof of pressure….so Lisa was saying Think “exploratory conversation,” not instant compatibility quiz. It’s just coffee. Ask good questions. Just relax and Lisa reminds us… Until there’s a ring, you’re a brother and sister in Christ—treat each other that way.

I’ll wrap up after this quick list. Here’s 4 non-negotiables to begin with. In our conversation Lisa breaks these down even more with great insight, examples and wisdom.

A disciple of Jesus: Not just church attendance—active pursuit of Christ, fruit of the Spirit, repentance, and engaged Christian community.

In a position to marry: someone who has done or is doing their homework on their personal healing journey, shows responsibility, forgiveness, financial steadiness, follow-through.

Humble and teachable: Open to counsel, not playing the blame game, and receptive to wise instruction.

Generally headed in the same direction: Lisa looks at personal callings on their life and rhythms that can realistically unite for a stronger bond.

So much good stuff, check the show notes for a link to her book, The Dating Manifesto: A Drama-Free Plan for Pursuing Marriage with Purpose with Author, Lisa Anderson and a link to the Focus on the Family’s counseling network.

Let’s dive in!

Lived Loved and Thrive!

CONNECT WITH LISA:

SUMMARY:

BLOG INTRO:

But J’s life was about to be flipped upside down in a cruel and unpredictable way. God prepared her for the unthinkable when He spoke into her spirit before Hurricane Florence: “Get used to the idea that you don’t get to keep your son.” As the hurricane came near, knocking out power even before it came on land…(and then if you remember anything about Florence, the east coast experienced power loss for 2 weeks, some longer)…J became concerned realizing she hadn’t felt her baby in a few days. When the hospitals were finally up and running accepting appointments, her fears became a reality when they found no heartbeat. 

Forced to deliver her son as though everything were normal, she says, the delivery room was thick with peace. Nurses felt it, the custodian felt it—“like a warm hug.” As J prepared to leave the hospital God gave her a heads up on the battle that would be waiting for her.

When she walked out of the hospital, the warmth lifted. What followed were “angry prayers,” the kind you don’t think you’re allowed to pray. J reminded us that God’s a big boy, and that He can handle our emotions. I agree because He’s been doing that for well over 2000+ years. 

Even though J could not praise the Lord or pray, she still went to church and it became the place where the faith of others washed over her until her own praise could rise again.

Through grief came transformation. J admits that The me before my tragedy, couldn’t be used the same way. Loss softened what feistiness had hardened. It also opened her eyes to the battle she believes many Christians ignore: not just demonic opposition, but the daily front-lines of choice. 

While studying Ephesians 6:12: (“For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.”) t was the word “powers” that stuck out to her. So she dug into the Greek word and the deeper meaning of “powers” and she found it to mean, authority, yes, but also “the power of choice.” In other words: our decisions can be a battlefield and that really resonated with me. Not only from the view point of experiencing that personally but seeing choices as a daily battle that I face and this of course made me see how important it is to understand spiritual warfare.

J’s discovery became a book…. Swords Up: Mastering the Weapons of Spiritual Warfare for Today’s Christian Woman—an eight-week Bible study she says the Holy Spirit downloaded in minutes after she dared Him to use her pen. The study reframes the armor of God as both defense and weapon, threaded by two essentials: surrender and prayer. “Prayer engages every piece of armor,” We’re essentially fighting with one hand tied behind our back if we neglect the Word.

I know prayer and surrender seem very weak but isn’t that just like God to confound the wise with simple things that reveal themselves as having transformational power? 

J’s challenge for us is simple and fierce: dust off your Bible!

Let’s listen in to see how we can be equipped to battle all that this life can throw at us with the intention of destroying us even if it’s only on the inside. Swords UP ladies, the battle is real.

Live Loved and Thrive! @alifeofthrive.com

RESOURCES - Other podcasts on this topic:

CONNECT WITH JANANYA:

Website: https://jpharrington.com/

FB: https://www.facebook.com/jpharringtonauthor

IG: https://www.instagram.com/jananyaharrington/

BIO:

J. Harrington is a dynamic author and ministry leader who brings a unique blend of military spouse experience, academic insight, and spiritual passion to her writing. With a background in anthropology and project management, Harrington serves as the Digital Content Manager for Holy Culture Radio while serving in church ministries. Her work reflects a deep commitment to faith and a knack for applying biblical truths to modern challenges. When not writing or serving her community in Jacksonville, NC, you can find her embracing life's adventures with her family of four.

SUMMARY:

PODCAST INTRO:

Janelle learned this (addiction affects normal people) and countless other things associated with addiction when it came to light that her daughter Regan was using in order to cope with parental heartbreak, trauma and the overwhelm that it brought to her life.

Janelle’s journey through addiction from the parent’s perspective began with fear, grief, and the heavy stigma that so often hushes families. She grew up believing addiction happened to “other people,” until it shattered her own home. What followed was a crash course in letting go, setting hard boundaries, and grieving the loss of shared memories, milestones (specifically her senior year because it all came to a head at that time)—so she didn’t go to the prom, she did not graduate with her class and nor did she get to enjoy all the ways that celebration culminates after 12 years of schooling. Janette found herself missing the simple joy of “normal.”

A turning point came through community. While Reagan entered a long-term adolescent recovery program in Arizona, Janelle found that this recovery program also had a parent group that met weekly—there is such incredible value in finding people who understand without explanation. Encouraged to “work her own recovery,” she got a sponsor and worked the 12 steps, not because Janelle had a substance problem, but her greatest desire was to see her daughter healed so this was how she could meet her daughter where she was. The 12 step process unexpectedly transformed Janelle’s life.

Faith sustained her. She cried out to the Lord, tearfully lamenting in her car. At work she’d be the only one in the office so she would play worship music and she would cry. She’d take long walks with Beth Moore teachings in her earbuds and she would cry—she found strength, provision, and practical help in places only God could have orchestrated.

As an example, she knew nothing about how to address addiction, and she certainly knew nothing about how to begin recovery and yet from a random google search she found the perfect facility and was matched with the right counselor that could work with her daughter in a productive way. Also, being able to afford her daughter’s treatment and the opportunity to travel to see her a few times, funds that were already drained from the divorce and custody battle somehow stretched. Provision met her at every step.

Today, Janelle leads meetings for her group, Parents of Addicted Loved Ones. She offers resources and encouragement to families who feel alone. Her message is simple and liberating: addiction happens to ordinary families. You didn’t cause it. You can’t cure it. But you don’t have to walk it alone.

If addiction has touched your home—or the home of someone you love—there is help and hope for the journey. You’re not alone mainly because Jesus has promised to never leave nor forsake you but He also gives us tangible resources and people who have walked the road we may find ourselves on and they’re ready to lock arms, comfort and lead when possible.

Let’s listen in to discover Janelle’s story and how this has changed not only her life…but because of what she’s been through and the passion she has to help others, she’s changing the lives of countless parents and families.

Live Loved and Thrive!

Connect with Janelle:

BIO:

SUMMARY:

- Guest, Author and speaker Debora Coty shares how to find joy amid pain, drawing from deep personal losses and decades of ministering to women.

- Writing journey: Her Too Blessed to Be Stressed brand unexpectedly grew to 40+ books/products with 2M+ copies sold worldwide; new devotional Bless Your Heart focuses on daily encouragement.

- “Papa God”: She uses the intimate, biblical sense of Abba (Papa/Daddy) to help women experience God’s unconditional love beyond imperfect earthly-father images.

- Faith in crisis: Six miscarriages triggered a two-year spiritual shutdown; daily praying through the Psalms—starting with “angry” psalms—slowly reopened her heart to God’s presence.

- Recent trials: Multiple family deaths, job loss, knee replacements, a spouse’s cancer, and a 5-year legal battle to protect her grandchildren—culminating in unexpected, miraculous breakthrough.

- Joy vs. happiness: Happiness depends on circumstances; joy is a chosen, steady confidence in God’s unchanging character that can coexist with grief.

- Tools for resilience: Gratitude (Philippians 4:6–7), worship/music, nature, Scripture, intentional fun and laughter, and noticing daily “grace notes” (small signs of God’s care).

- “BOGO blessings”: Inspired by 1 Peter 3:9—when you bless others, you “be one, get one,” receiving blessing as you give it.

- Anchoring Scriptures: Philippians 4:6–7 (peace covenant), Psalm 46:1 (ever-present help), Psalm 147:3 (heals the brokenhearted).

- Invitation: Join her BFF (Blessed Friends Forever) community for mutual prayer, encouragement, and practical faith; final charge—keep seeking God’s presence with perseverance.

PODCAST INTRO:

We talk about the difference between happiness and true, resilient joy; how scripture—especially the Psalms and Philippians 4:6–7—anchors us when our faith feels shaken; and the “grace notes” God sprinkles through our days when we learn to look for them. Debora opens up about profound losses—miscarriages, family heartbreak, health challenges, and a long, exhausting court battle—and how waiting on God can still lead to breathtaking redemption.

You’ll hear practical tools to refresh a weary spirit: gratitude that changes the atmosphere, worship that invites God’s presence, nature that whispers His care, and yes—laughter—as a catalyst for joy. Debora also shares about her new devotional, Bless Your Heart, and invites you into her BFF—Blessed Friends Forever—community for prayer, connection, and ongoing encouragement.

Let’s listen in as Debora shares her message of joy, hope and encouragement. As soon as she starts talking you know immediately that’s she’s an encourager at heart maybe it’s because she exudes the joy of the Lord…and because of that joy, I think you’ll be surprising to hear all that she's been through and yet she still keeps leaning on Jesus for His joy and strength.

Live Loved and Thrive @alifeofthrive.com

ADDITIONAL BLOGS AND/OR PODCASTS ON THIS TOPIC:

CONNECT WITH DEBORA:

BIO:

An orthopedic occupational therapist for 36 years and piano teacher for 30, Debora rejoices in life as a diehard tennis addict and choco-athlete (that’s the step beyond chocoholic – she exercises just so she can eat more chocolate). She’s a bodacious women’s Bible study leader, and animated storyteller to anyone who’ll listen. Deb lives, loves, and laughs in central Florida with her long suffering husband of 47 years, two grown children, and five precocious grandbuddies.

Debora, known for her offbeat blend of humor and hope, has a passion for bringing women together to deepen relationships vertically (with their heavenly Father) and horizontally (developing heart-friends). Deb loves hosting a fun-loving community of BFFs (Blessed Friends Forever) from all over the globe at www.DeboraCoty.com.

SUMMARY:

PODCAST INTRO:

Lori Ann shares the journey she entered into when her life hit a major detour, based on an unexpected diagnosis of heart failure. Married to her high school sweetheart and mother to three adult children, Lori's life was bustling with activity and health consciousness. However, a shocking diagnosis challenged her understanding of control, faith, and God's presence in suffering.

Lori Ann candidly discusses the initial disbelief of her diagnosis and the silence from God that she experienced, comparing her questions and search for understanding and the struggle with answered prayer to a spiritual wrestling match. Despite her pristine health metrics, she overlooked minor symptoms, not knowing those symptoms were pointing to her life changing detour.

Throughout the conversation, Lori Ann delves into the duality of grief and gratitude, acknowledging the coexistence of pain and thankfulness. She emphasizes the significance of lament in her faith journey, a practice she initially hesitated to embrace but found crucial for expressing her deepest fears and doubts to God.

I especially loved when our conversation turned to her book, Divine Detour where she explores three pivotal questions inspired by Jesus's temptations in the desert: Is this life all there is? Is God always good? Is God's plan enough? These questions reflect her struggle with worry, doubt, and control, ultimately leading her to a deeper relationship with God.

You’re going to be extravagantly blessed as you listen to this conversation and all that Lori Ann has to share. In every one of her answers she delivers beautiful insight with regard to God’s heart for those who are suffering.

If you are in a season of loss and uncertainty and you wonder where God is, does He care about what is happening in your life….then make time to engage with every bit of Lori Ann’s insight.

The title of her book says it perfectly, Divine Detour because when the unexpected throws a block into the road that were happily headed down, I know that is the exact spot where the enemy wanted to destroy us (with a diagnosis, with that loss, with no end in sight, with grief)…but God….He enters with His love, grace and mercy, and turns our detour into something far more beautiful than what this life has to offer.

If at all possible, get your pen and paper ready because you’re gonna want to capture and reread these distinctions and revelations that Lori Ann has to share.

Live Loved and Thrive @ alifeofthrive.com

PODCASTS AND/OR BLOGS ON SIMILAR TOPICS:

CONNECT WITH LORI ANN:

BIO:

SUMMARY:

PODCAST INTRO:

We talked about guilt and how mom’s and dad’s can find forgiveness vs beating ourselves up over the would’ves, could’ves & should’ves. I’ll put (in the show notes) a quick list of the 3 ways to engage forgiveness but don’t miss out on the message surrounding it because Debra gives much more info in the episode itself.

We looked at shifting the burden that we carry in our heart for our child’s salvation and their entry into heaven because ultimately it’s not our responsibility, it’s God’s job and He is trustworthy to watch over His children. God has a purpose and a plan for your child just like He has one for you.

I beginning to understand that the key is learning how to get behind God to support what God is doing. But I’ll be honest, that is not for the weak hearted because you have to be willing to lay down the illusion we carry with regard to control, we have to address our pride and we have to be willing to cling to God when we see our children struggling through consequences.

We acknowledged that this is spiritual warfare and that Satan is trying his best to not only destroy the family unit but to cut off and destroy generations that belong to our children. Debra shares a strategy for our battle stance to be able to affectively engage and strike down the enemy of our soul.

We may not be responsible for our children’s faith but as Debra says, Love goes to war; so we can certainly stand in the gap and effectively fight the Goliath that is coming after them. Debra’s 5 point battle stance that she shares can also be seen in the show notes but again, she shares much more detail in the episode so don’t miss that bit of gold.

Some of our conversation is based on the belief that if we raise a child in the church and instill biblical values we believe we have a guarantee of their salvation and their pursuit of Christ and heaven’s value system etc. but many of us know that it does not guarantee they will always adhere to those instilled values.

If I had to boil this conversation down to 2 major takeaways, it would be hard but I think I’d side with Debra’s personal battle cry…No one fights alone and also when she said something that I have come to understand more deeply after walking this valley of loosing my husband….”God’s promise isn’t that you’re going to get the perfect outcome. His promise is that He’ll never leave you and that He’s going to walk with you the whole way.” Knowing you’re not alone is a lifeline for the heart.

Near the end of our conversation Debra had me super encouraged as she gave the battle cry for all parents to stand up. For us to fight the lies that culture dictates, and to dismantle the belief that we’re powerless adding that engaging God’s heart in the battle is where our power comes from.

If you’re a parent of a prodigal, Debra offers guidance and hope. You can receive more in-depth instruction in her book, Battle Cry - Waging the Spiritual Battle for Your Prodigal. And you can find encouragement in her support group, Battlecrymoms.com.

Let’s listen in to find hope and understanding on how to engage the power of Christ in order to give God the burden and how we are to stand in agreement with Him.

Live Loved and Thrive!

3 STEPS TO FIND FORGIVENESS:

BATTLE STANCE TO STAND IN THE GAP FOR YOUR CHILD:

MORE PODCASTS AND/OR BLOGS ON SIMILAR TOPICS:

CONNECT WITH DEBRA:

BIO:

She loves photography, working on her photo farm, and sharing life with  Steve, her husband of 33 years, two sweet puppies: Poppy the Berne Doodle and Dodger the Miniature Schnauzer. She is also the faithful feeder of Butters, the neighborhood stray cat.

Debra’s favorite things are Jesus, coffee, cupcakes, and glitter (in that order!). She collects vintage junk, anything sparkly, and more Sharpies than one person needs. She takes pride in learning a new skill each year and gets through life by leaning on God’s Word—and a little humor. She especially loves when the two collide.

Born and raised in Winfield, Kansas, home to Bluegrass and Burger Station, Debra has moved nine times to six different states. Each move brought her closer to God and connected her with lifelong friends.

In Fall 2024, Debra released her first book with CrossRiver Media, sharing her family’s story and how it led to a powerful prayer movement for prodigals. She writes and speaks to encourage parents to keep praying and keep believing—because prodigals are coming home.

SUMMARY:

PODCAST INTRO:

Melissa grew up in a Christian household, surrounded by love and the teachings of the Bible. Her early life experiences, including growing up with a brother who had special needs, and that inspired her to become a teacher. For 28 years, she dedicated her life to educating children, driven by a passion for learning and problem-solving.

However, life threw her a curveball when health issues forced her into an unexpected early retirement. Faced with excruciating physical pain and the loss of a career she loved, Melissa found herself questioning God's plan for her life.

In the midst of physical pain, losing the career that filled her day and becoming dependent on her husband and others, Melissa discovered that her identity was not rooted in her career, accomplishments or abilities but in her relationship with God.

Through prayer and reflection, she realized that God was using her hardships to peel back layers of self-reliance and pride, revealing her true identity as a child of God. This revelation brought about a different type of pain and true to God’s way of healing us, it was also beautifully transformative, leading her to a deeper understanding of her faith and purpose.

As God moves Melissa away from teaching He opens a new door for her to be an author. Her first book, "In Dark of Night, When Words Fail, Voice of Jesus, Pray for Me," was born out of her personal struggle with prayer. Through the power of scripture-based prayers, Melissa found her voice and a new way to connect with God. Her latest book, "The Whole Bible Devotional," offers readers a 66-day reading plan that highlights the presence of Jesus throughout the Bible, from Genesis to Revelation. This devotional is designed to help readers see the Bible as a cohesive narrative and to deepen their relationship with God.

Melissa's story is a powerful reminder that even in our darkest moments, God is at work, using our struggles to draw us closer to Him. Her journey illustrates the importance of clinging to faith and finding solace in the power of scripture. As she shares her experiences, Melissa encourages others to hold on to Jesus, trusting that He can bring beauty from ashes and transform our lives in ways we never imagined.

Let’s listen in and give our heart a beautiful dose of encouragement!

Lived Loved and Thrive! @alifeofthrive.com

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PODCAST INTRO:

Using her personal story of abuse combining that with her education in Marriage and Family Therapy along with her Master of Divinity from San Francisco Theological Seminary, Rev Cheryl talked about understanding abuse, boundaries, identity, righteous anger, and forgiveness as taught in the bible. The discussion on forgiveness alone was worth the conversation because so much about God’s love and forgiveness has been hijacked with a toxic empathy that is used against tender hearted, conscious Christians especially the abused.

We talked about the difference between forgiveness and denial. Reverend Cheryl states that forgiveness requires acknowledging the hurt caused by others and making a conscious decision to forgive, while denial involves minimizing the impact of the abuse or rationalizing it.

One of the tools that Rev Cheryl shares is for the moments when you’re having a flashback, you’ve been triggered or trying to resolve inner, emotional mental conflict in yourself. She shares this exercise, the therapeutic term known as classical conditioning and it involves using your dominate hand to represent yourself as the adult you are and your non-dominate hand as the child you were.

Using your dominant hand you write down something like, I know you’re in pain right now and Using your name, you ask yourself by writing down, what is going on? Then Using your non-dominant hand write down your emotions. There is a point to using your non-dominant hand because it looks like a child’s handwriting.

Then Looking at the emotions that surfaced you use your adult hand (that knows the truth about where you are now) to comfort your child hand (that is bringing forth the emotions that are connected to the pain).

Reframe the emotions with truth whether it be with God’s word/His promises, with facts such as Rev Cheryl said things like, You couldn’t take care of yourself then but you can take care of yourself now and then you’d list truths. If it was about money, it could be, I have a job, I have a bank account, I’m working toward financial independence. If it was about not having control then say, I have control over myself, I’m responsible for myself, I am learning to set boundaries, I have boundaries in place etc Things that speak truth over where you are today.

To me, I thought it was effective using your hands because it gets you outside your head. I think that would be beneficial because sometimes you have so much emotion and overwhelm in your head that if you can make it external, it seems to help you isolate and sort through your emotions in that moment.

It reminds me of the effectiveness of journaling as a way to purge your thoughts on paper, it gets everything you can list out of your mind and you can sort through it that way too.

So in short, us the classical condition exercise to take what you’re believing based on your past and updating it with the truth of where you are today and where you’re headed, toward wholeness and healing. And even if your current answers for today (as the adult) are not in your favor with regard to healing and wholeness it gives you a starting point, it helps you pinpoint the fact you need to take action.

One of the things we didn’t get a chance to talk about is that Rev Cheryl is an author of several books. Her stories are inspired from witnessing God’s redemptive grace in the messy reality of authentic life for Christian’s, including her own. In her stories she’s not afraid to address violent issues that many women find themselves in. Using realistic life situations she reveals the heart of God, His love, care, concern, ability to heal and restore despite the brokenness of this life.

Be prepared to stop this audio along the way so that you can digest what she is sharing; which is practical advice and things you can immediately implement to move from being a victim to becoming victorious!

Let’s listen in!

Live Loved and Thrive! @alifeofthrive.com

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Reverend Cheryl Kincaid is a Presbyterian Minister who studied Marriage and Family Therapy at Bethel Seminary and has a Master of Divinity from San Francisco Theological Seminary. 

Reverend Kincaid is a prolific author of five books, Hearing the Gospel Through Charles Dickens A Christmas Carol (which is the winner of the 2013 Independent Christian Publishers Illumination Reward for bible study), The little Clay Pot, The Little Candle That Was Frightened of the Dark, Karrie's Thorn and A Forgotten Door Called Home. 

Rev. Kincaid seeks to tell the story of God’s comforting redemptive grace in the midst of an imperfect world. Rev. Cheryl Kincaid has twenty years of experience in Christian ministry, and she confesses that many of her stories were inspired from witnessing God’s redemptive grace unfold in wounded Christian’s lives, including her own. 

Visit her website at Pastor Cheryl Kincaid's website to hear her sermons and hear more about her other books at https://revcherylkincaid.com/. To read about Rev. Kincaid's inspiration for writing Hearing the Gospel Through Charles Dickens' A Christmas Carol visit her website http://www.dickensandchristianity.com/ and read about Charles Dickens' faith journey.