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Episode 32: Telling the Story With Heart — A Conversation with Dr. Nicole Clark 

In this episode, Jamal and David sit down with Dr. Nicole Clark, Emmy award-winning anchor and reporter for Spectrum News Texas — but before the newsroom, before the camera, there was nearly two decades in psychology.

Nicole opens up about how her background as a Ph.D.-level psychotherapist shapes the way she tells stories today — especially the hard ones. From covering families in crisis to interviewing individuals turning pain into purpose, she shares how empathy, emotional intelligence, and credibility intersect in journalism.

We talk about the stories that stay with you long after the mic is off. How to report on trauma without becoming detached. And what it means to use media not just to inform — but to humanize. Nicole reflects on why she does this work, what continues to inspire her, and how storytelling can create light even in the darkest moments.

This conversation is about purpose, resilience, and the responsibility that comes with holding someone else’s story.

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death is a podcast that explores the raw, unfiltered reality of surviving profound personal loss—and finding a way forward.  The idea for the podcast was born after David and Jamal met in 2023. Both widowers, who had lost their wives to cancer, quickly found a deep connection through multiple conversations about pain, perseverance, and parenthood. They realized that while men often bond over music, sports, or TV, they rarely speak candidly about loss or emotional recovery. Getting Back Up was created to change that narrative—blending the everyday with the existential in a format that’s as relatable as it is real. 

Thank you for your support!

Hosts: David McClain & Jamal Jones

Guest:  Jocelyn Barrera, Executive Director of The Christi Center

Executive Directors: Marlon Jackson & Ted Winners (Like A Gazelle Productions)
Editing: Marlon Jackson
Music: 
Grenada, "Treasure" 
McDonald, Otis, "Phife for Life", otismusic.com

Thank you for listening! Follow us on Instagram/TikTok @getbackuppodcast and on X @GBUpodcast

Send a text

Episode 31: Grief Beyond Death — A Conversation with Jocelyn Barrera of The Christi Center

In this on-location episode in Austin, Jamal and David sit down with Jocelyn Barrera, Executive and Clinical Director of The Christi Center, to explore grief in all its forms — not just death, but displacement, illness, violence, and the quiet losses that reshape families.

Jocelyn shares her journey from bilingual services coordinator to leading one of Austin’s most impactful grief support organizations. The conversation moves beyond textbook definitions of grief and into lived realities — supporting families navigating loss due to sickness, sudden violence, and even the emotional rupture caused by ICE raids and deportation. Together, they unpack how race, racism, culture, and community all shape how grief is experienced and expressed — and why peer-based support can be life-changing.

This episode challenges the idea that grief is only about funerals. Sometimes grief looks like fear. Sometimes it looks like separation. Sometimes it looks like carrying a weight no one else can see. And in every case, connection matters.

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death is a podcast that explores the raw, unfiltered reality of surviving profound personal loss—and finding a way forward.  The idea for the podcast was born after David and Jamal met in 2023. Both widowers, who had lost their wives to cancer, quickly found a deep connection through multiple conversations about pain, perseverance, and parenthood. They realized that while men often bond over music, sports, or TV, they rarely speak candidly about loss or emotional recovery. Getting Back Up was created to change that narrative—blending the everyday with the existential in a format that’s as relatable as it is real. 

Thank you for your support!

Hosts: David McClain & Jamal Jones

Guest:  Jocelyn Barrera, Executive Director of The Christi Center

Executive Directors: Marlon Jackson & Ted Winners (Like A Gazelle Productions)
Editing: Marlon Jackson
Music: 
Grenada, "Treasure" 
McDonald, Otis, "Phife for Life", otismusic.com

Thank you for listening! Follow us on Instagram/TikTok @getbackuppodcast and on X @GBUpodcast

Send a text

Episode 30: “If Only I Had…” — Living With the Loop of Regret (Part 2)

In Part 2 of our conversation on regret, Jamal and David move from awareness to release. Many widowers quietly believe that suffering proves love — that carrying guilt forever somehow honors their wife. But what if that belief is the very thing keeping you stuck? In this episode, we challenge the idea that love requires lifelong punishment and offer a different frame: love asks for remembrance, integrity, and living forward well — not endless self-inflicted pain.

We also share practical, grounded tools to interrupt the regret loop. Naming it out loud. Writing the letter you never got to finish. Separating what was truly in your control from what never was. And asking the anchoring question: If she could see me now, would she want me stuck here — or living? If Part 1 helped you recognize the loop, Part 2 helps you loosen it. You are not broken. You are grieving. And there is a difference.

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death is a podcast that explores the raw, unfiltered reality of surviving profound personal loss—and finding a way forward.  The idea for the podcast was born after David and Jamal met in 2023. Both widowers, who had lost their wives to cancer, quickly found a deep connection through multiple conversations about pain, perseverance, and parenthood. They realized that while men often bond over music, sports, or TV, they rarely speak candidly about loss or emotional recovery. Getting Back Up was created to change that narrative—blending the everyday with the existential in a format that’s as relatable as it is real. 

Thank you for your support!

Hosts: David McClain & Jamal Jones

Executive Directors: Marlon Jackson & Ted Winners (Like A Gazelle Productions)
Editing: Marlon Jackson
Music: 
Grenada, "Treasure" 
McDonald, Otis, "Phife for Life", otismusic.com

Thank you for listening! Follow us on Instagram/TikTok @getbackuppodcast and on X @GBUpodcast

Send a text

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death  (Season 1)

Episode 29: “If Only I Had…” — Living With the Loop of Regret (Part 1)

In Part 1 of this raw and reflective conversation, Jamal and David open up about one of the hardest truths many widowers face: regret. The kind that creeps in with the silence — “If only I had noticed sooner… said more… done it differently…” The kind that loops in your mind at night and whispers that you failed.

They explore why regret feels so personal, how grief distorts memory, and why so many men confuse blame with responsibility. This episode lays the emotional groundwork — tackling the trap of the regret loop, how it disguises itself as virtue, and why forgiveness has to include you too. If you’ve been living with that one decision you replay over and over, this conversation may be the beginning of release. Part 2 continues next episode.

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death is a podcast that explores the raw, unfiltered reality of surviving profound personal loss—and finding a way forward.  The idea for the podcast was born after David and Jamal met in 2023. Both widowers, who had lost their wives to cancer, quickly found a deep connection through multiple conversations about pain, perseverance, and parenthood. They realized that while men often bond over music, sports, or TV, they rarely speak candidly about loss or emotional recovery. Getting Back Up was created to change that narrative—blending the everyday with the existential in a format that’s as relatable as it is real. 

Thank you for your support!

Hosts: David McClain & Jamal Jones

Executive Directors: Marlon Jackson & Ted Winners (Like A Gazelle Productions)
Editing: Marlon Jackson
Music: 
Grenada, "Treasure" 
McDonald, Otis, "Phife for Life", otismusic.com

Thank you for listening! Follow us on Instagram/TikTok @getbackuppodcast and on X @GBUpodcast

Send a text

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death  (Season 1)

Episode 28: What Must Be Carried (Pt. 2 ) w/ Whitney Lyn Allen

In this second half of our conversation with grief coach and author Whitney Lyn Allen, we explore the deep complexities of what it means to truly move forward. Whitney opens up about the delicate balance she now lives — raising two young boys, coaching others through loss, writing, speaking publicly, and creating space for her own healing… all while building a new life after remarrying.

We also dig into the tough questions. How do you open your heart again after a devastating loss? How do you hold space for what was and what is? Whitney shares the truth behind her second chapter — not as a replacement, but as a continuation of courage, connection, and choosing life again.

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death is a podcast that explores the raw, unfiltered reality of surviving profound personal loss—and finding a way forward.  The idea for the podcast was born after David and Jamal met in 2023. Both widowers, who had lost their wives to cancer, quickly found a deep connection through multiple conversations about pain, perseverance, and parenthood. They realized that while men often bond over music, sports, or TV, they rarely speak candidly about loss or emotional recovery. Getting Back Up was created to change that narrative—blending the everyday with the existential in a format that’s as relatable as it is real. 

Thank you for your support!

Hosts: David McClain & Jamal Jones

Guest: Whitney Lyn Allen

Executive Directors: Marlon Jackson & Ted Winners (Like A Gazelle Productions)
Editing: Chris Gazzo
Music: 
Grenada, "Treasure" 
McDonald, Otis, "Phife for Life", otismusic.com

Thank you for listening! Follow us on Instagram/TikTok @getbackuppodcast and on X @GBUpodcast

Send a text

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death  (Season 1)

Episode 27: What Must Be Carried (Pt. 1 ) w/ Whitney Lyn Allen

In this deeply personal conversation, we sit down with Whitney Lyn Allen—grief coach, attorney, author, and widow—to talk about the life she built with her late husband Ryan, and how she’s navigated life after his sudden passing from a rare reaction to a bee sting. In Part 1 of our two-part series, Whitney shares her early life influences, her path into law, and the love story that led to motherhood and devastating loss.

We explore the raw emotional terrain of early grief—numbness, rage, tears—and why she believes you don’t “get over” grief, but learn to carry it differently over time. She offers powerful wisdom on identity, parenting through pain, and why healing is messy, non-linear, and uniquely your own. Whether you’re newly grieving or years down the road, Whitney’s honesty and heart offer hope, not as a destination—but as a companion on the journey.

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death is a podcast that explores the raw, unfiltered reality of surviving profound personal loss—and finding a way forward.  The idea for the podcast was born after David and Jamal met in 2023. Both widowers, who had lost their wives to cancer, quickly found a deep connection through multiple conversations about pain, perseverance, and parenthood. They realized that while men often bond over music, sports, or TV, they rarely speak candidly about loss or emotional recovery. Getting Back Up was created to change that narrative—blending the everyday with the existential in a format that’s as relatable as it is real. 

Thank you for your support!

Hosts: David McClain & Jamal Jones

Guest: Whitney Lyn Allen

Executive Directors: Marlon Jackson & Ted Winners (Like A Gazelle Productions)
Editing: Chris Gazzo
Music: 
Grenada, "Treasure" 
McDonald, Otis, "Phife for Life", otismusic.com

Thank you for listening! Follow us on Instagram/TikTok @getbackuppodcast and on X @GBUpodcast

Send a text

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death  (Season 1)

Episode 26: The Cost of the Craft with Russell Hornsby

In Part 2 of our powerful conversation with actor Russell Hornsby, we move from personal loss to professional sacrifice—and how they’re more connected than people think. Fresh off filming two back-to-back movies in Atlanta, Russell talks with Jamal and Dave about what it means to be away from your family for weeks at a time, over and over again, in the name of art, legacy, and livelihood.

We dive into what he’s gained and lost by choosing this path, how the pressure has shifted from early hustle to seasoned purpose, and how starring in August Wilson’s American Century plays and ultimately the acclaimed movie, Fences, forced him to reckon with deeper questions around grief, identity, and creative mortality. Russell also opens up about the rise of AI in entertainment, what it means for working actors, and why—even now—he’s thinking hard about what legacy he wants to leave behind.

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death is a podcast that explores the raw, unfiltered reality of surviving profound personal loss—and finding a way forward.  The idea for the podcast was born after David and Jamal met in 2023. Both widowers, who had lost their wives to cancer, quickly found a deep connection through multiple conversations about pain, perseverance, and parenthood. They realized that while men often bond over music, sports, or TV, they rarely speak candidly about loss or emotional recovery. Getting Back Up was created to change that narrative—blending the everyday with the existential in a format that’s as relatable as it is real. 

Thank you for your support!

Hosts: David McClain & Jamal Jones
Executive Directors: Marlon Jackson & Ted Winners (Like A Gazelle Productions)
Editing: Steve Senisi (Reel Media)
Music: 
Grenada, "Treasure" 
McDonald, Otis, "Phife for Life", otismusic.com

Thank you for listening! Follow us on Instagram/TikTok @getbackuppodcast and on X @GBUpodcast

Send a text

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death  (Season 1)

Episode 25: Black Men, Cancer, and the Fight for Our Lives

In this special episode, Jamal and David head to Clark Atlanta University to sit down with researchers, doctors, and survivors at the frontlines of cancer care and advocacy. From pioneering lab discoveries to deeply personal stories of survival, this episode connects science with the soul.

We talked to Dr. Jaideep Chaudhary and his team of faculty experts about why Black men face a higher risk for prostate cancer—and what can actually be done about it. They break down research, challenges in community trust, and how survivor voices are shaping the next generation of care. We also speak with survivors—like Dr. Henry Elonge, Mr. Tony Williams, and his wife Cecelia Williams—who share the raw truths of diagnosis, fear, love, advocacy, and brotherhood. If you’re a man, love a man, or know a man…this is an episode for you.

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death is a podcast that explores the raw, unfiltered reality of surviving profound personal loss—and finding a way forward.  The idea for the podcast was born after David and Jamal met in 2023. Both widowers, who had lost their wives to cancer, quickly found a deep connection through multiple conversations about pain, perseverance, and parenthood. They realized that while men often bond over music, sports, or TV, they rarely speak candidly about loss or emotional recovery. Getting Back Up was created to change that narrative—blending the everyday with the existential in a format that’s as relatable as it is real. 

Thank you for your support!

Hosts: David McClain & Jamal Jones
Executive Directors: Marlon Jackson & Ted Winners (Like A Gazelle Productions)
Editing: Steve Senisi (Reel Media)
Music: 
Grenada, "Treasure" 
McDonald, Otis, "Phife for Life", otismusic.com

Thank you for listening! Follow us on Instagram/TikTok @getbackuppodcast and on X @GBUpodcast

Send a text

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death  (Season 1)

Episode 24: A New Year.  A New You.

It’s 2026—and for those of us navigating life after loss, the new year can feel less like a reset and more like a reckoning. In this episode, Jamal and Dave reflect on entering a fresh calendar year while still carrying the weight of grief, change, and growth. Together, they talk about what it really means to move forward, not move on.

They share what’s worked for them: creating small rituals of self-care, staying connected to core community, assessing where healing still needs to happen, and giving yourself permission to grow without guilt. From letting go of traditional resolutions to defining what a good year really means after loss, this episode is a grounding and hopeful way to kick off the year.

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death is a podcast that explores the raw, unfiltered reality of surviving profound personal loss—and finding a way forward.  The idea for the podcast was born after David and Jamal met in 2023. Both widowers, who had lost their wives to cancer, quickly found a deep connection through multiple conversations about pain, perseverance, and parenthood. They realized that while men often bond over music, sports, or TV, they rarely speak candidly about loss or emotional recovery. Getting Back Up was created to change that narrative—blending the everyday with the existential in a format that’s as relatable as it is real. 

Thank you for your support!

Hosts: David McClain & Jamal Jones
Executive Directors: Marlon Jackson & Ted Winner (Like A Gazelle Productions)
Editing: Marlon Jackson
Music: 
- Grenada, "Treasure" 
- McDonald, Otis, "Phife for Life", otismusic.com

Thank you for listening! Follow us on Instagram/TikTok @getbackuppodcast and on X @GBUpodcast

Send a text

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death  (Season 1)

Episode 23: When the Job Is Gone, Who Are You? with Degion Craddock

In this episode, Jamal and David sit down with marketing pro and former Dell colleague Degion Craddock—a talented, driven brother who found himself suddenly laid off and in unfamiliar territory. Degion opens up about what it’s been like to face rejection after rejection, redefine his value outside of a job title, and fight through the quiet mental toll of long-term unemployment.

This isn’t just a conversation about work—it’s about identity, resilience, trust, and rebuilding. From navigating dating during a season of uncertainty, to learning how to let people support him when he’s used to being the strong one, Degion speaks with honesty, humor, and hard-won clarity about what it truly means to get back up when your confidence has been shaken.

Getting Back Up: Finding Life After Death is a podcast that explores the raw, unfiltered reality of surviving profound personal loss—and finding a way forward.  The idea for the podcast was born after David and Jamal met in 2023. Both widowers, who had lost their wives to cancer, quickly found a deep connection through multiple conversations about pain, perseverance, and parenthood. They realized that while men often bond over music, sports, or TV, they rarely speak candidly about loss or emotional recovery. Getting Back Up was created to change that narrative—blending the everyday with the existential in a format that’s as relatable as it is real. 

Thank you for your support!

Hosts: David McClain & Jamal Jones
Executive Directors: Marlon Jackson & Ted Winner (Like A Gazelle Productions)
Editing: Marlon Jackson
Music: 
- Grenada, "Treasure" 
- McDonald, Otis, "Phife for Life", otismusic.com

Thank you for listening! Follow us on Instagram/TikTok @getbackuppodcast and on X @GBUpodcast