Today I’m talking with Vincent Wanga about the magic of human creative energy. Vincent is an executive creative leader, serial entrepreneur, and author of The Art of Direction: Personal Perspectives on the Path to Creative Leadership. Our conversation begins and ends with a focus on the future. What is our place as creatives in a technological world driven by artificial intelligence? What does leadership look like in an asynchronous, AI-driven creative world? The answers might surprise you, but they’ll definitely challenge you. Throughout this interview, Vincent shares stories and tools any creative can use to adapt to the ever-changing world we live in.

“Don’t be close-minded to opportunity.” – Vincent Wanga

I’m talking to my good friend Kelley Baker about the art of rewriting. Kelley is an accomplished filmmaker, sound designer, and author. We got together to record a couple film-based conversations for my other podcast, Beyond Your Imagination, and before we got down to business talking about Frank Zappa, Sparks, and Werner Herzog, I asked if we could talk about writing and rewriting. I brought the questions, Kelley brought the stories and wisdom.

I want to talk about something that affects every single creative person alive today: why we need to embrace both big dreams and small realities.

Last night, I went to a local meetup for filmmakers. It was a good group, I met some nice people, but as I was reflecting on filmmaking in general, the questions began: Why do independent filmmakers who have little to no money make feature films? I mean Netflix spent an estimated 320 million on The Electric State by the Russo Brothers. What chance does a $15,000 film have against that juggernaut?

So many questions, right? How about some more?

I believe that big dreams are essential to the work of a creator. If we never dream of moving a ship over a mountain like Werner Herzog in Fitzcarraldo, then how we will learn about our capabilities and the consequences of our dreams? But while dreams keep us in the land of hope and belief—”One day, this will happen”—we need small projects that can keep us nimble, learning and growing on a daily basis. We need both to realize our creative dreams.

Note: After releasing the episode, I found the newsletter I mentioned in the section about economics and monetizing serial podcasts: “The harsh economics for serialized podcasts” by Simon Owens.

I’m talking with one of my favorite people in the world about a bunch of interesting topics ranging from old tech, new promises, and platforms of argument and despair to the traits of makers, the search for clarity and ownership in a digital world, and perhaps the biggest question of all: What kind of world do we want to live in? Christopher Butler is the Chief Design Officer at Newfangled and Magnolia. He writes extensively on his website, which I’ve linked to in the show notes at gwtw.co/805, about his desire “to learn, make and improve things, write, discuss ideas, and just observe.” He is an encourager, a challenger, and one hell of a conversationalist.

When we start out doing something, we make mistakes until eventually something works. We build upon the things that work, actively avoiding what didn’t work. We build our skills until they become the foundations for our initial prototypes and plans for our creative work. These plans help us to chart a course away from failure and the beginner’s mind towards experience, excellence, and one day, mastery. Not a bad journey, if you ask me.

“As we gain knowledge about a domain, we become prisoners of our prototypes.” – Originals: How Non-Conformists Move the World by Adam Grant

But what I love about Grant’s quote is that it isn’t about demonizing experience and knowledge, it’s what the prototype represents: the formula we follow every time we make something. Yes, our creativity can become formulaic, and that’s when we became the prisoner. Following the same routine every day, surrounded by the same people, with limited options and no freedom.

As I set out on my woodworking journey, I am far away from any prototypes because I haven’t made enough. But I do want to keep in mind the joy of pushing my limits and abilities. To be free to try new things. But I just don’t have enough knowledge and experience yet.

But with my other creative efforts, like podcasting, filmmaking, and writing, I need to realize that I’m following formulas and patterns and prototypes of what works. That in many ways, my prototypes keep me safe between the bars of my constructed creative reality.

And I need to smash those prototypes. Not because they aren’t working, they are, but there is something missing. The freedom to push my limits, to explore new ideas, and to reinvigorate a sense of play, exploration, and wonder.

I always love when people who are doing something completely different reach out to be on the show. When I started looking into what today’s guest is producing, I knew I wanted to have him on the show. Devin Blair is the creative behind Chemical Rocketeers, “a storytelling podcast that blends themes of exploration, survival, and mystery.” In our conversation, we talk about how he got into podcasting, how his travels inform the show, the creative process, the importance of learning from others, and how curiosity presents itself differently in cultures around the world. He also asks me how I learn, which evolves into a discussion around our creative DNA.

What comes to mind when you think about playing the lottery? All the traveling you’ll be able to afford? The golden beaches and beautiful bodies? The job you can finally quit? The house you can finally buy? The car? Finally! For creatives, the lottery might look differently. We can finally make that film that we’ve been writing for ten years. There will be enough money to justify learning how to podcast or leather craft or play the guitar. That book about penguins we can’t stop researching and obsessing over, it will finally get published. Finally! Whether you play the lottery or not, I believe everyone does, especially in the creative industries. I’m going to explore how the creative lottery presents itself, how our communication systems perpetuate it through influencers and gurus, and how we can begin to opt out of playing the game.

Have you ever thought about what your dog is thinking about at any given moment? Is it thinking about philosophy, the meaning of life, what that treat really signifies? Perhaps it’s something deeper and beyond our comprehension. Today’s guest on Getting Work To Work is the author of a new book, The Word of Dog: What Our Canine Companions Can Teach Us About Living a Good Life, that explores what we can learn about our own lives by examining the lives of our best friends. Mark Rowlands is a philosopher, professor, and chair of the Philosophy Department at the University of Miami. He’s also a prolific author, writing extensively about philosophy, animals, science fiction films, climate, memory, animal rights, and body language. In our conversation, we talk about his creative process and when the best ideas show up, the role memory plays in coming up with creative connections, and what he’s learned about life from dogs.

Have you ever thought what you’re leaving behind for the next generation? Whenever the conversation of legacy comes up, there are often two tracks of conversation: 1) the physical objects we make or the stuff we accumulate, and 2) the impact we have on others (financially, relationally, or emotionally). But last week, during my interview with philosopher Mark Rowlands about his new book, The Word of Dog: What Our Canine Companions Can Teach Us About Living a Good Life, we got on the subject of digital immortality. I haven’t stopped thinking about it and thought, “What a great topic for episode 800 of Getting Work To Work.” Given the staggering amount of data we generate in a lifetime at what point could we be recreated and resurrected into digital form? We probably wouldn’t be conscious ourselves, but to those around us, would they even know? Would they even care? So many questions, so little time. Let’s get into it.

What’s the first thing that comes to mind when you hear the term press release? Irrelevant? Old-fashioned? I know, boring, right? But nothing could be further from the truth. Today’s guest on the show is Mickie Kennedy, Founder and President of eReleases, the small business leader for press release distribution. He is an expert at helping small businesses increase their visibility and credibility. If you’re like me and know little to nothing about press releases, this episode will have you looking at them in a new way. In our conversation, we talk about the different types of press releases, the importance of providing data and context, how to approach writing press releases if you have a small audience or just starting out, and most importantly, how to keep your business fresh by constantly adapting and providing value.