A lot of Republicans are defending President Trump’s call with the Ukrainian president because the contents of the whistleblower’s complaint are hearsay. But that’s a weird defense -- we already have independent confirmation of a lot of the events described in the complaint. Ken and Josh discuss hearsay, and whether anything the president said or did in those calls broke the law. Abuse of power? Bribery? Thing of value? Witness tampering? Obstruction of justice? Ken says some might make a better case than others.

Plus, will current and former State Department officials obey congressional subpoenas or obey Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, who doesn’t want them to talk? And did Congressman Adam Schiff commit treason, like President Trump says?